Do you believe Jesus Christ is your lord and savior?

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: Taejin
EDIT: And if I were to examine myself closely, I could not not mock religious people. Honestly, they look like some crazy person chasing after the rainbow, except we have millions of crazy people, and it's not so much funny as sad.. I think you need to understand that I view religious people in the same light I view a kid who believes in the Tooth fairy.


Also, I've always thought it strange that religious people can fundamentally be tolerant of one another (esp really differing religions). I mean, from each other's perspective, isn't the other insane/crazy/blasphemous/stupid/out of their mind? You can't have two religions coexisting ideologically, because there is only one truth, and someone's gotta be wrong (this is if we postulate that one religion is the truth).

Your family is religious, are they crazy?

I think believing in these things is beneficial. Believing in Santa, believing in the Tooth Fairy or something other is a good thing. I don't believe in Santa and probably never did, but I love the kids who do.

On your second point, since I'm not that religious myself, I can tolerate all religions. I want to learn about all the major religions of the world so I can better understand where the people are coming from. Many Christians do believe that they are the only true believers and other religions are not legitimate. They even believe that others who don't believe in Christ will not go to heaven. Thats not one of the more positive points of religion, but I take it for what its worth.

Two religions can coexist, as in live peacefully side by side, as long as the practitioners of the faiths can tolerate each other and not let the more extreme members dictate the way they do things. That has generally been one of the main reasons behind the religious conflicts in the past.

 

[Forsythe]

There is no doubt that believing in something is beneficial for your mood and your lifes length. I still do not condone any belief in anything. That african tribes still believe in things i can understand considering the lack of education and information. That anyone in the western world believes in anything can only be stupidity, or that very human denying facts.

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: Forsythe
There is no doubt that believing in something is beneficial for your mood and your lifes length. I still do not condone any belief in anything. That african tribes still believe in things i can understand considering the lack of education and information. That anyone in the western world believes in anything can only be stupidity, or that very human denying facts.

Well, your wish has come true, the Pope has died. But your other wish, the death of his religion, will never come true.

How tolerant of you, Forsythe. The Africans must be barbaric, ignorant and extremely gullible to believe in such a thing as god when they could believe in Karl Marx or Lenin, eh?

What about the Asians? Many Chinese, Indians, Singaporeans, Malaysians and other people who are educated also have a deep faith in god, what is their reason for that? Are they also uneducated and ignorant?

Denying facts? What facts? The problem is that you don't have any facts.

 

[Taejin]

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: Taejin
EDIT: And if I were to examine myself closely, I could not not mock religious people. Honestly, they look like some crazy person chasing after the rainbow, except we have millions of crazy people, and it's not so much funny as sad.. I think you need to understand that I view religious people in the same light I view a kid who believes in the Tooth fairy.


Also, I've always thought it strange that religious people can fundamentally be tolerant of one another (esp really differing religions). I mean, from each other's perspective, isn't the other insane/crazy/blasphemous/stupid/out of their mind? You can't have two religions coexisting ideologically, because there is only one truth, and someone's gotta be wrong (this is if we postulate that one religion is the truth).

Your family is religious, are they crazy?

I think believing in these things is beneficial. Believing in Santa, believing in the Tooth Fairy or something other is a good thing. I don't believe in Santa and probably never did, but I love the kids who do.

On your second point, since I'm not that religious myself, I can tolerate all religions. I want to learn about all the major religions of the world so I can better understand where the people are coming from. Many Christians do believe that they are the only true believers and other religions are not legitimate. They even believe that others who don't believe in Christ will not go to heaven. Thats not one of the more positive points of religion, but I take it for what its worth.

Two religions can coexist, as in live peacefully side by side, as long as the practitioners of the faiths can tolerate each other and not let the more extreme members dictate the way they do things. That has generally been one of the main reasons behind the religious conflicts in the past.

yeah, my family is crazy . But guess what, I love em anyways. Blood is stronger than religion.

EDIT: Jeez, I do a lot of editing. Anyways, I have a particular interest in the non judeo-christian religions. I really don't like the tone and attitude of judeochristian religions. I particularly enjoy old folk tales of religions (native american, subcontinent india, asian, various stories from the vikings, greeks, romans, etc) and although I do not agree with Buddhism's underlying belief, I do find meditation beneficial to myself .

and just as an aside, nice talking with you raildogg.

 

[Bombastic Flasher]

I think jesus is the man. You guys need to get ur facts straight, he totaly freakin rawcks ur sawks.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

And this thread shows good reason why people may choose to keep their personal beliefs to themselves.


P&N is overwhelmingly about flaming. The question is valid, but so is asking if they dislike black people. Try asking that question as a non black in a black bar in Mobile, AL on a hot Saturday night.

 

[tokyo jesus fist]

I don't know how I should feel about christians. Most christians who use the Internet seem to be militant extremists whose grasp of reality has all but vanished along with their ability to think rationally or remember that their religion is not unique or The Right One.

 

[piasabird]

Yes. It is a matter of Faith. My Brother Jesus Christ died for me and you. That is what I believe.

I have studied the root meaning of the word create and in my bible it says the word create was translated from a term which means "To organize".

How is it so different from what a scientist or biologist does when they study manipulation of DNA and Cloning. The motivation behind this field of study could be said to be the creation of life or the science behind the creation of life. Are scientist trying to become god-like or was God just a very smart scientist? What a Quandry. Faith is not an exclusion of science and fact.

 

[pookguy88]

Yes

 

[judasmachine]

The problem with religion isn't the people, it isn't the heavenly babysitters, it's that all religion with the exception of maybe Buddism, is that they are all authoritarian, and evangelistic. They all believe their way is the only way, and that all people should think as they do. This is why you meet so much resistance, you are knocking on doors and trying to tell us how to think and feel. Most of us wish not to be told what to think and how to feel and how to live. We like our ways, and will not easily give them up without a fight. You go ahead and believe what you want, that's great. But leave me to mine.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith
And this thread shows good reason why people may choose to keep their personal beliefs to themselves.


P&N is overwhelmingly about flaming. The question is valid, but so is asking if they dislike black people. Try asking that question as a non black in a black bar in Mobile, AL on a hot Saturday night.

ATPN does not even remotely resemble reality, or the prevalent opinions of most people. Almost 95% of the world believes in a higher power of some sort, but almost 95% of ATPN is rabidly atheist (to the point of bigotry, as you noted). It does not bother me. They are the ones who have to live with their hatreds, not I.
For myself, my faith rests solely on the fact that I know that there is more to the universe than can be weighed, measured, or observed, therefore science (which only deals with that which can be weighed, measured, or observed) cannot answer all questions.

 

[CptFarlow]

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: Taejin

I think the entirety of religion is BS.

You know what I think is BS? The crap the atheists spew here night and day. Take your beliefs and be happy with them, noone gives a damn about it. Enough with trashing of religion. People are comforted by religion and are happy to know that someone higher up there is looking above them.

Wait a minute...they do not KNOW anything. They believe...that is faith. To me though, faith is not good enough. I have always been interested in the pursuit of what is not easily answered. Is there a God? I will probably never know in this lifetime, but maybe I will. Will we reach warp speed? I dunno, scientifically it is highly improbable. Did Michael Jackson touch those little boys? I have no idea, but he sure does look like somebody from Planet of the Apes.

All joking aside. We are all here to voice our opinion, and just like taejin said, he is not here to opress you. Neither am I. Now, I do stand by his side with what he said. Relax, it's all interpretation.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: judasmachine
The problem with religion isn't the people, it isn't the heavenly babysitters, it's that all religion with the exception of maybe Buddism, is that they are all authoritarian, and evangelistic. They all believe their way is the only way, and that all people should think as they do. This is why you meet so much resistance, you are knocking on doors and trying to tell us how to think and feel. Most of us wish not to be told what to think and how to feel and how to live. We like our ways, and will not easily give them up without a fight. You go ahead and believe what you want, that's great. But leave me to mine.

Wow, trying being a little less defensive and insecure, eh? Personally I think it's good fun when the JW's or the Mormons bang on my door. They can't wave a magic wand over your head and enslave your mind, yaknow.
Not that I care one whit what you believe really, but grow some backbone, eh? Do you get all panicky when telemarketers call? Do you crumble to dust in front of car salesmen?
If you don't believe, then why does it bother you when they say you'll go to hell? If they go so far as to say that, I laugh at them and tell them to get fsck off my porch before I get my shotgun.

 

[phantom309]

I believe in being the best human being I can be, and living a good life. Whether that gets me the approval of an invisible, giant bearded white male in the sky or not is a moot point.

 

[kogase]

Originally posted by: Papaw
I heard someone say once that explaining God to someone who doesn't believe is like trying to explain a toothache, or explain the wind.

You can't see it, but you can feel it, and see the results of it.

Phew, man, are you stuck in the 3rd century or what? Both of these things can be explained, and both can be seen using modern technology. A much better way of saying what you're trying to say can be lifted and paraphrased from the sig of one of the forum members here:

"For those who believe, no explanation is necessary. For those who don't, none will suffice."

 

[CptFarlow]

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: Papaw
I heard someone say once that explaining God to someone who doesn't believe is like trying to explain a toothache, or explain the wind.

You can't see it, but you can feel it, and see the results of it.

Phew, man, are you stuck in the 3rd century or what? Both of these things can be explained, and both can be seen using modern technology. A much better way of saying what you're trying to say can be lifted and paraphrased from the sig of one of the forum members here:

"For those who believe, no explanation is necessary. For those who don't, none will suffice."

Bulls-eye!

 

[judasmachine]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: judasmachine
The problem with religion isn't the people, it isn't the heavenly babysitters, it's that all religion with the exception of maybe Buddism, is that they are all authoritarian, and evangelistic. They all believe their way is the only way, and that all people should think as they do. This is why you meet so much resistance, you are knocking on doors and trying to tell us how to think and feel. Most of us wish not to be told what to think and how to feel and how to live. We like our ways, and will not easily give them up without a fight. You go ahead and believe what you want, that's great. But leave me to mine.

Wow, trying being a little less defensive and insecure, eh? Personally I think it's good fun when the JW's or the Mormons bang on my door. They can't wave a magic wand over your head and enslave your mind, yaknow.
Not that I care one whit what you believe really, but grow some backbone, eh? Do you get all panicky when telemarketers call? Do you crumble to dust in front of car salesmen?
If you don't believe, then why does it bother you when they say you'll go to hell? If they go so far as to say that, I laugh at them and tell them to get fsck off my porch before I get my shotgun.

Wow that apparently wasn't understood how I meant it. I have been writing this morning so I guess some of the charactor spilled over into this. I'm not paranoid at all and the knocking on doors comment was more hyperbole. I just meant that they see evangelising as something good, something nessecary. This in my book is immoral. It doesn't bother me that some people have made up an eternal punishment for those who don't follow thier way. I think it's humorous. Honestly it is a sensitive issue with me. My peole have no history as christians. We were diluted and deluded with this by missionaries who sought out to destroy our way of life. But in modern terms it's humorous...

Oh and the JWs don't knock on my door anymore. They found out my g/f is an excommunicated JW.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: judasmachine
Wow that apparently wasn't understood how I meant it. I have been writing this morning so I guess some of the charactor spilled over into this. I'm not paranoid at all and the knocking on doors comment was more hyperbole. I just meant that they see evangelising as something good, something nessecary. This in my book is immoral. It doesn't bother me that some people have made up an eternal punishment for those who don't follow thier way. I think it's humorous. Honestly it is a sensitive issue with me. My peole have no history as christians. We were diluted and deluded with this by missionaries who sought out to destroy our way of life. But in modern terms it's humorous...

Oh and the JWs don't knock on my door anymore. They found out my g/f is an excommunicated JW.

Well, the concept of a Hell is by no means unique to Christianity, but you are IMO correct about its immorality. See classy's earlier post in this thread when he boasts that he will be going to Heaven with the laughing implication that the rest of us are going to Hell. That to me is the absolute worst form of blasphemy.

btw, if by your people you are referring to Native Americans, they have their own profound history of religious belief. Very diverse though, from human sacrificing sun worshipping Aztecs to North American tribes who believed in a Great Spirit not too similar to the God that Abraham of the Bible believed in. Fascinating stuff as long as you don't fall for the myth that they were all pipe smokin' hippies.

 

[shira]

I'm agnostic and culturally Jewish. Organized religion plays no part in my life.

I hope God exists, but I don't believe in God (by "agnostic" I mean, "It's unknowable", not, "I don't have a belief.")

Edit: Oops. Didn't answer your specific question about JC:

No, absolutely not.

I believe JC was a firebrand Jew, who was one of the leaders of the "Kingdom of God" movement, which claimed that God would create an earthly dominion if humans fulfilled certain preconditions. I assert there is no historical evidence that Jesus ever claimed to be the messiah, the son of God, or anything else of that ilk. Finally, I believe Christianity arose, as a distortion of Jesus's objectives and messages, for the simple reason that Judaism is a very hard religion to follow if one wishes to be devout, and Jesus was first, last, and forever a Jew.

 

[Spamela]

Catholics in my experience don't commonly use the
phrase "believe Jesus Christ is your lord and savior,"
since it has all sorts of other connotations,
but i suppose strictly speaking we do.

 

[judasmachine]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: judasmachine
Wow that apparently wasn't understood how I meant it. I have been writing this morning so I guess some of the charactor spilled over into this. I'm not paranoid at all and the knocking on doors comment was more hyperbole. I just meant that they see evangelising as something good, something nessecary. This in my book is immoral. It doesn't bother me that some people have made up an eternal punishment for those who don't follow thier way. I think it's humorous. Honestly it is a sensitive issue with me. My peole have no history as christians. We were diluted and deluded with this by missionaries who sought out to destroy our way of life. But in modern terms it's humorous...

Oh and the JWs don't knock on my door anymore. They found out my g/f is an excommunicated JW.

Well, the concept of a Hell is by no means unique to Christianity, but you are IMO correct about its immorality. See classy's earlier post in this thread when he boasts that he will be going to Heaven with the laughing implication that the rest of us are going to Hell. That to me is the absolute worst form of blasphemy.

btw, if by your people you are referring to Native Americans, they have their own profound history of religious belief. Very diverse though, from human sacrificing sun worshipping Aztecs to North American tribes who believed in a Great Spirit not too similar to the God that Abraham of the Bible believed in. Fascinating stuff as long as you don't fall for the myth that they were all pipe smokin' hippies.

Yeah, I don't fall for any religion, even those of the Oglala/Lakota/Sioux from which I came. It's just I'm sick of hearing that my ancestors were dirty savages who needed "saving." And in a parallel to a lot of what is going on now, you do not provide salvation at the point of a gun.

We were, and are perfectly fine. And the missionaries that still go to the reservation are only spreading salt on a still open wound.

 

[Dave332]

I believe there is a god and I believe there is a metaphysical plane of existance. I believe that as humans we sinned and were cut off from God as a result. I believe that Jesus was crucified and as a result of his defeat of death was able to rise three days later. I believe that only through faith in Him are we able to overcome death (not physical, but metaphysical). I also, however, believe that current organized religion has some fundamental flaws. I don't think that most churches provide an adequate explanation of many concepts that should be commonplace in the church. Faith: Many churches say "just believe in Jesus and your saved" This ususally comes off as 'choose to believe that some historical events took place' or 'trust jesus for your salvation, ticket in to heaven, etc.' While I believe that the latter is a valid interpretation, I also believe it is incomplete. I believe that "faith in Christ" is supposed to be placing trust in Christ for every single aspect of your life. Only in this way will we overcome sin. Sin: many churches define this simply as breaking God's rules. I believe that sin is not so much a breaking of any sort of rule, but choosing something over God. This means that sin is not simply defined by the 'rules' set up in the old testament (not that the old testament is just rules, it was written to point to Christ as the messiah), but rather sin is not choosing God. This makes much more sense with regard to the whole separation from God issue. My friend made the point one night while talking about salvation that it isn't very fair for God to set up a bunch of rules He knows we'll break, and then punish us for breaking them. I agree. If sin is choosing something else over God, then it's all about your motive. Jesus often ridiculed the religious leaders of the time for strictly following rules for the sake of following rules. sorry for the rant. I believe a lot of other things about God, but the preceding is the basis for everything else I believe. I also believe that the way churches are currently set up is not the way it was originally intented, and I don't like the idea of large churches, preachers, etc. The church was originally intended to be small groups of people that gathered frequently, not necessarily on a given day. They would pray, share a meal, worship, and share prophecy. This sounds more like a group of friends than a cathedral to me. That aside, I've seen multiple posts saying something like 'I don't like christians because they're always trying to force their religion down my throat' Damn straight. Not that I 've read it cover to cover, but I've never seen anything in the Bible that suggests that anyone should be going door to door trying to shove religion down anyone's throat. Rather, everything I've read suggests that evangelism should happen as a result of chrisians living transparent lives, letting people know about their imperfections, fvck ups, and how Christ is working in them. So, let me apologize if anyone here ever thinks I'm trying to cram anything down their throats. That is not my intent, but anyway, I think that answers the OP's question.

 

[TBone48]

I am Born-Again Christian. I don't get the "shoving their beliefs down my throat" complaint, I've never done that to anyone and don't know of any of my Christian friends and acquaintances doing it either. Unless by saying "I am a Christian" you consider that to be forcing something on you. I only really have to do that as an explanation for why I don't do certain things(like watch porn, or go to strip clubs, or make sexual comments about women, etc.) It's no more prosyletizing than someone who isn't a believer saying "I don't believe in that crap because..."

Some people just really seem to get set off by the idea that someone else believes something different from them. I say this meaning some Christians get really fired up at people who disagree with their beliefs- maybe these are the people whom you feel are shoving religion down your throat?

 

[GreatBarracuda]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith
And this thread shows good reason why people may choose to keep their personal beliefs to themselves.


P&N is overwhelmingly about flaming. The question is valid, but so is asking if they dislike black people. Try asking that question as a non black in a black bar in Mobile, AL on a hot Saturday night.

ATPN does not even remotely resemble reality, or the prevalent opinions of most people. Almost 95% of the world believes in a higher power of some sort, but almost 95% of ATPN is rabidly atheist (to the point of bigotry, as you noted). It does not bother me. They are the ones who have to live with their hatreds, not I.
For myself, my faith rests solely on the fact that I know that there is more to the universe than can be weighed, measured, or observed, therefore science (which only deals with that which can be weighed, measured, or observed) cannot answer all questions.

I concur wholeheartedly.

 

[KK]

No, I am my own lord and savior. I don't like to place blame or credit onto someone, something where credit is not due. If someone does believe Jesus Christ is their lord and savior, then I guess I view them the same as gays.