BurnItDwn
Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 26,355
- 1,867
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Do I believe that they are flying around in spaceships at faster the speed of light and navigating all around the universe, Not likely
I do think that probably on some other planets ... there is some form of like ... Things like Bacterias and maybe even some simple plant life ...
I do think that probably on some other planets ... there is some form of like ... Things like Bacterias and maybe even some simple plant life ...
Pliablemoose
Lifer
- Oct 11, 1999
- 25,195
- 0
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@li3n5 @R3 R3@dInG 7Hi5 N0W & 7h3 0nLy W@Y 70 f00L 7h3m iz 70 U53 H4X0R 50 7H3Y c@n'7 r3@D 0Ur m355@g35.
7ru57 m3, I7'$ R3@l.
@Li3n$ Iz $uCk
Haxor Translator
7ru57 m3, I7'$ R3@l.
@Li3n$ Iz $uCk
Haxor Translator
For those who believe the Universe has plenty of room for aliens: Remember that we are basing ALL of our scientific theories about the universe on a Sample Population of ONE. What I mean by that is, we have only had experience with one solar system. Any scientist/statistician would laugh at you if you told them you were basing a theory on a single example.
I think only one of our space probes (Pioneer 1?) has actually ever made it out of the solar system...and it has since stopped transmitting (granted, it was supposed to fail long before then).
My question is simple: what if the laws of physics CHANGE in other parts of the galaxy/universe? Remember, all our scientific data comes from what we observe from one tiny little planet in our solar system. What if conditions outside our solar system change to the point that intelligent life is impossible?
This is just an idea I thought of after reading the SF novel, "A Fire Upon the Deep" by Vernor Vinge. Great book.
Anyway, I don't believe that intelligent aliens exist. I believe in the possibility that intelligent aliens exist.
I think only one of our space probes (Pioneer 1?) has actually ever made it out of the solar system...and it has since stopped transmitting (granted, it was supposed to fail long before then).
My question is simple: what if the laws of physics CHANGE in other parts of the galaxy/universe? Remember, all our scientific data comes from what we observe from one tiny little planet in our solar system. What if conditions outside our solar system change to the point that intelligent life is impossible?
This is just an idea I thought of after reading the SF novel, "A Fire Upon the Deep" by Vernor Vinge. Great book.
Anyway, I don't believe that intelligent aliens exist. I believe in the possibility that intelligent aliens exist.
CPA
Elite Member
- Nov 19, 2001
- 30,322
- 4
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Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
@li3n5 @R3 R3@dInG 7Hi5 N0W & 7h3 0nLy W@Y 70 f00L 7h3m iz 70 U53 H4X0R 50 7H3Y c@n'7 r3@D 0Ur m355@g35.
7ru57 m3, I7'$ R3@l.
@Li3n$ Iz $uCk
Haxor Translator
Man, I'm getting good at this haxor lingo thingy, I didn't even need the translator to read it.
Science *used* to think that atoms were elementary particles that were the basic building blocks of the universe. Then they found protons, neutrons, and electrons and thought that they were the real elementary particles. But as further discoveries occurred, they have found that even those particles are made of smaller particles, and there is no evidence leading us to believe that we have found particles that cannot be broken down.
And unlike the models that you see in a classroom, the scale of the size and distances between those particles is nothing like you see in a diagram. Atoms are more empty space than our solar system is. The relative distance from an electron to the nucleus is much greater than the relatice distance from the sun to pluto.
Yes, on those scales different forces are dominant than at our scale. On our level, gravity is the main force, while at subatomic levels electrical charges are dominant.
What science has taught us is that we still have quite a bit to learn. We realize that we have more unanswered questions now than we did when the Church proclaimed that the Earth was the center of the universe.
Not true.
We have discovered solar systems on distant starts. Our telescopes allow us to see outside of our own solar system and view distant objects. We can measure the relationship of those objects have towards other objects near them, and we can see that the same laws of physics apply to them, such as mass, gravity, the gravitation pull on that mass, the red shift from the light emitted, etc.
Just because we haven't travelled there doesn't mean we can't witness what's happening.
I haven't seen an alien but I saw a ship that was certainly not an Earthbound or Man made craft.
South shore Long Island Oct 29, 1975 7:50 pm
Well documented sighting.
How can you say "with certainty" that it was not a man made craft? Unless they have the craft and studied it, I don't think you can make any "certain" conclusions about it.
Yes, I do. Extraterrestrial life. There has to be. And it/them was/were created by the same God that created us (if that is your belief.)
You're missing the point.
1. Just because we can SEE/detect them through instruments on earth, does NOT mean that what we see is what is actually there. We see/detect light/radio/EM originating from outside the solar system. Based on our experience, here on Earth, we interpret the results accordingly. But our interpretation of the data is based on assumptions we make assuming that the laws of physics are the same everywhere in the universe. For example, we see a planet near another star. We see the planet circle the star regularly. We believe that the planet is orbiting the star because of gravity because that's how things work in our solar system. How do we know FOR SURE that gravity is the cause of the orbit? If the laws of physics were different there, the planet could be orbiting the sun just because it likes to.
2. My question is: If the laws of physics are different outside our solar system, how do you think that would affect what we see here on Earth?
For example, let's just say that the speed of light changes according to distance from the light source (i.e. stars)?. What does that do to our assumptions regarding red shift?
I haven't the theoretical physics knowledge to argue on this point. I'm just saying that until we actually send somebody up there to see things in person, there is no way of knowing for sure that our scientific models are right, and that physical laws remain constant throughout the galaxy/universe. Are our theories probably correct? Yes. Do we know for sure? No.
3. Even if the other solar systems that we have data on DO have the same laws of physics, we still only have a sample population of what? 5 nearby star systems? Compared to a real population of 50 GoogleZillion?
BTW, in Vinge's novel, EM traveled faster at the Galactic fringe, and slower at the Galactic core. Just think of how that would screw up physics models.
Of course, that's the difference between a priori and a posteriori knowledge. Without being there, we can only use deductive reasoning and hence only have a priori knowledge.
zephyrprime
Diamond Member
- Feb 18, 2001
- 7,512
- 2
- 81
The problem with seti at home is that space is too big. If an alien on the nearest star, alpha centauri, were transmitting with a 1Gigawatt onidirectional transmitter at 2.4GHz (the frequency of cordless phones ), we on earth would only receive one photon per square meter once every five hours! The picture totally changes if the alien uses a directional transmitter. Then we could get a fairly strong signal. What this means is that we can only realistically expect to receive a message from aliens if they intentionally sent one to us. We couldn't expect to pick up random TV signals from them.
), we on earth would only receive one photon per square meter once every five hours! The picture totally changes if the alien uses a directional transmitter. Then we could get a fairly strong signal. What this means is that we can only realistically expect to receive a message from aliens if they intentionally sent one to us. We couldn't expect to pick up random TV signals from them.
So
Lifer
- Jul 2, 2001
- 25,923
- 17
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I think we can all agree on that.
I was just saying that I think baseless idle speculation is silly, however, I realize that is exactly what this topic really is, and I find it interesting, so I suppose I should have the balls to retract my statement. I do think that it is one of the more unlikely possibilites though (Although one of the most interesting to speculate on).
So
Lifer
- Jul 2, 2001
- 25,923
- 17
- 81
*cough* Black government project/ Russian Project (remember, there were major defense contractors on Long Island, and the Russians certainly likes to spy on them).
My father lived there (Montauk) in the late sixties and tells me he recalls seeing Soviet survelliance ships just in international waters more than once.
I beleive in aliens, and more advanced aliens, and that they have visited us. Why do i say this, because we, humans, study animals as small as ants to study their social behaviors. Who's to say that some space fareing civilization isn't going to look at lower life forms in space?
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