Did CNN just grieve for the convicted athletes in Steubenville & copied the ONION?

[highland145]

From GEO's link.

With women this toxic, you need 2 forms of protection.

 

[Geosurface]

This is not really what happened in this case

Yea I literally know nothing about this case, was just using this thread as a convenient launchpad for my pre-existing agenda!

From GEO's link.

With women this toxic, you need 2 forms of protection.

Yea, accompanied by a picture of a condom next to a camera (the implication being these days you'd better have documented proof of consent or the sex act taking place with obvious consent being present)

I believe that was the British dude who made the video's attempt at a bit of levity toward the end.

I've watched several of his videos and frankly I think he's got a bit TOO much of a chip on his shoulder about women, I suspect he must have really been burned at some point. As I said I consider the image at the end of the video with the text you quoted to be an obvious attempt at humor by him, but nonetheless I do think he probably worries far more than is rational about things like false accusations, or alimony disparities, etc.

He's clearly a guy who obsesses about these issues, no doubt. What's also clear, to me anyway, is that he brings a lot of interesting points forward and a lot of interesting data. He may be a bit over-zealous about these issues, but he makes some damn fine points too.

 

[Markbnj]

I feel sorry for all of them. The girl, obviously, because of what happened and what she'll have to live with. The guys, for getting drunk and making disastrously bad choices that will, as the perhaps overly-sympathetic article pointed out, follow them for the rest of their lives. I doubt that, down deep, they're really evil people. Kids, young adults, whatever, they're all exposed to a lot more of the worst the world has to offer via the net these days. I read an article a few months ago that talked about how high school girls, interviewed anonymously, felt that adolescent boys were getting most of their sexuality cues from hardcore porn these days, because it's so ubiquitous. I can't help but wonder whether it all has an effect on them. CNN may have stepped over the line here, but there is plenty of sad on both sides of this case.

 

[Fritzo]

From GEO's link.

With women this toxic, you need 2 forms of protection.

I don't think false accusations are as common as people think, but it only takes a few to question the entire system. The store of The Boy That Cried Wolf is one of the most profound fairy tales.

I feel sorry for all of them. The girl, obviously, because of what happened and what she'll have to live with. The guys, for getting drunk and making disastrously bad choices that will, as the perhaps overly-sympathetic article pointed out, follow them for the rest of their lives. I doubt that, down deep, they're really evil people. Kids, young adults, whatever, they're all exposed to a lot more of the worst the world has to offer via the net these days. I read an article a few months ago that talked about how high school girls, interviewed anonymously, felt that adolescent boys were getting most of their sexuality cues from hardcore porn these days, because it's so ubiquitous. I can't help but wonder whether it all has an effect on them. CNN may have stepped over the line here, but there is plenty of sad on both sides of this case.

I have mixed feelings about the girl. Why did she put her self in that situation? I almost feel like she's the person that leaves their wallet on their car seat and then can't understand why their car got broken into. I have a 16 year old daughter, and every time she goes out with her friends we lecture her about protecting herself: always be on your guard, don't let yourself get into situations where you're not in control, be careful about who you trust, etc.

The rapists are bad- they took advantage of someone when they couldn't defend them self...it's one of the most morally corrupt things a person can do.
However, the girl put herself in a situation, in her own free will, where this kind of thing could happen. Teenagers are horny...teenage boys will stick their dick into nearly anything if they get the chance. It's sad the girl had to learn a life lesson this way, but hopefully her experience will set an example to young women out there to "stay in control or bad things will happen."

 

[waggy]

I feel sorry for all of them. The girl, obviously, because of what happened and what she'll have to live with. The guys, for getting drunk and making disastrously bad choices that will, as the perhaps overly-sympathetic article pointed out, follow them for the rest of their lives. I doubt that, down deep, they're really evil people. Kids, young adults, whatever, they're all exposed to a lot more of the worst the world has to offer via the net these days. I read an article a few months ago that talked about how high school girls, interviewed anonymously, felt that adolescent boys were getting most of their sexuality cues from hardcore porn these days, because it's so ubiquitous. I can't help but wonder whether it all has an effect on them. CNN may have stepped over the line here, but there is plenty of sad on both sides of this case.

except for the fact once sober those boys tried to talk to thier friends into deleting text to agree to back the 2 boys up by claiming she asked to be fucked, oh and lets not forget they laughed about it afterwords.

there is no defence for what they did in any way. they took advantage of a drunk girl then laughed, joked and tried to hide it after the fact.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

1) It's never consensual if she's pass-out drunk.
2) Don't take pics or video.

 

[highland145]

I don't think false accusations are as common as people think, but it only takes a few to question the entire system. The store of The Boy That Cried Wolf is one of the most profound fairy tales.

No idea if it's 40% but the wife, fam/marriage counselor, says it's not uncommon. This includes CDV claims, child abuse claims in bad divorces and step children accusing the step Dad of molestation. It's an easy way to get at the man. And the courts/law enforcement will separate the man from the family.


Hate it for the young men but they did it. They scored a victory by keeping in in juvenile court. Could have gotten many more years in adult court.

 

[waggy]

No idea if it's 40% but the wife, fam/marriage counselor, says it's not uncommon. This includes CDV claims, child abuse claims in bad divorces and step children accusing the step Dad of molestation. It's an easy way to get at the man. And the courts/law enforcement will separate the man from the family.


Hate it for the young men but they did it. They scored a victory by keeping in in juvenile court. Could have gotten many more years in adult court.

Yeah. sadly child molestation is falsely reported often too. I read that a good portion was during divorce proceeding. the mother (usually) tries to use that as a way to get full custody.

Also in Foster care a good portion of accusations are false too.

but that's a different thread.

 

[Pray To Jesus]

Sorry women but you harmed yourself by making too many false allegations of rape. If I'm on a jury about a rape case and it's word vs word with no evidence, I vote not guilty.

 

[highland145]

Sorry women but you harmed yourself by making too many false allegations of rape. If I'm on a jury about a rape case and it's word vs word with no evidence, I vote not guilty.

Isn't that how it's supposed to work?

 

[Pray To Jesus]

Isn't that how it's supposed to work?

That's how it's supposed to work. Not how it really works.

 

[shortylickens]

Sorry women but you harmed yourself by making too many false allegations of rape. If I'm on a jury about a rape case and it's word vs word with no evidence, I vote not guilty.

In the Navy we called it a pendulum.

For years women were harassed and then ignored. Tailhook opened up the barrel of monkeys. After that the service was lynching any male with even one accusation on him. It finally comes out many females were lying to get guys in trouble, the service stops prosecuting. Real cases get ignored, it swings back again.

Where is a pendulum perfectly even?
When its moving the fastest.

 

[_Rick_]

However, the girl put herself in a situation, in her own free will, where this kind of thing could happen.

You could say the same of any guy getting falsely accused of rape.

"You didn't have a notarial approved writ of consent, when you started kissing her? It's really your fault!"

We can all start to mistrust all our fellow humans, or we try and educate, and prosecute those who still turn to criminal behavior.

It's like blaming a guy for getting robbed, after getting some cash from an ATM. Obviously he had money, so he made himself the victim!

Nobody would say "well, it's partly your fault, you got robbed". And nobody should say that about reasonably normal behavior leading to getting raped.

I suppose there is the equivalent to walking through Detroit's poor areas with a wad of cash in your hand, but in this case, that's not what happened, not nearly. These were supposed to be upstanding gentlemen, and not raping animals.

 

[DrunkenSano]

The boys deserved what they got coming for them, taking advantage of a completely passed out girl was definitely wrong. The girl needs to get charged with underage drinking though, not just to punish her but as a lesson to all other underage teens that if you drink and put yourself in situations like that, you can ruin your own life.

 

[shortylickens]

The boys deserved what they got coming for them, taking advantage of a completely passed out girl was definitely wrong. The girl needs to get charged with underage drinking though, not just to punish her but as a lesson to all other underage teens that if you drink and put yourself in situations like that, you can ruin your own life.

That NEVER happens.
The DA is too afraid of the mayor/city council which is too afraid of the feminists.

 

[Fritzo]

You could say the same of any guy getting falsely accused of rape.

It's like blaming a guy for getting robbed, after getting some cash from an ATM. Obviously he had money, so he made himself the victim!

Nobody would say "well, it's partly your fault, you got robbed". And nobody should say that about reasonably normal behavior leading to getting raped.

I suppose there is the equivalent to walking through Detroit's poor areas with a wad of cash in your hand, but in this case, that's not what happened, not nearly. These were supposed to be upstanding gentlemen, and not raping animals.

That's my point. She was 16, got so drunk she passed out, and was surrounded by guys. You might as well cover yourself in blood and jump into shark infested waters. It was bad judgement by the girl, and morally corrupt guys looking for an opportunity.

 

[SSSnail]

The Onion is becoming more and more based in reality each day.

The court jesters are often very correct in telling things as they are, you just have to listen.

 

[sixone]

I feel sorry for all of them. The girl, obviously, because of what happened and what she'll have to live with. The guys, for getting drunk and making disastrously bad choices that will, as the perhaps overly-sympathetic article pointed out, follow them for the rest of their lives. I doubt that, down deep, they're really evil people. Kids, young adults, whatever, they're all exposed to a lot more of the worst the world has to offer via the net these days. I read an article a few months ago that talked about how high school girls, interviewed anonymously, felt that adolescent boys were getting most of their sexuality cues from hardcore porn these days, because it's so ubiquitous. I can't help but wonder whether it all has an effect on them. CNN may have stepped over the line here, but there is plenty of sad on both sides of this case.

I would agree with you IF those boys had taken responsibility for their bad choices and admitted their guilt without putting the public through the expense of a trial. IF they'd spared their families, their communities, and their VICTIM of the drama and trauma of this entire case.

Evil people do just what those boys did after they sobered up. They're supposed to know right from wrong, in spite of what they see on the internet or anywhere else. They're supposed to be man enough to admit what they did wrong, and accept the consequences for doing so.

 

[diesbudt]

I don't know the details of this particular case and I'm not commenting on it, but this seemed like a good opportunity to point out that there are a MASSIVE number of false rape accusations. Here's one study that put it at 41% of rape accusations being false: http://blog.lib.umn.edu/jbs/maysession/KaninFalseRapeAllegations.pdf

I can't attest to the quality of that study's methodology, and I'm not endorsing it. I'm just passing along the link for anyone who's interested. There are other studies which have questioned that one and said that only 2-8% of rape accusations are false.

I personally have no fucking clue whatsoever how many are false. Thankfully I've never had this issue touch my life personally in any way.

My only interest in this is because I have become rather disgusted with how the legal system treats men these days. Accused rapists have their names put out immediately while their accusers have theirs protected, this creates the potential for the man's life to be ruined based on the accusation alone, even if it's later proven false.

There seems to be an automatic assumption of guilt for the man and assumption of truth in the accuser. Some people are put away for years and have their lives ruined based on no evidence except the accusation itself.

There are plenty of documented cases of women admitting that they accused a man of rape because they later regretted a consensual sexual encounter. Or because they want revenge on the man for something. This shit does happen. It happens a lot more often than most people want to accept. Here's an interesting article:

Link



Here are some more little snippets from cases I found with just a quick search:









I'll just encourage anyone who doubts that these are fairly common to do a little Googling of their own.

I'm not a rape apologist or any bullshit like that, if these Steubenville guys did rape some girl, I have zero sympathy for them and I hope they rot for the maximum amount of time. Again, I haven't looked at any details of this case.

I'm just cautioning against this societal default assumption that if a guy is accused of rape, it surely happened! This assumption is what makes false accusations a tempting shortcut to getting attention or getting payback.

The really awful catch 22 is that if they start going after false accusers with harsher penalties, it reduces the chance of them ever coming clean :|

All I'm saying is we, as a society, need to find a healthier balance between protecting and respecting rape victims/punishing rapists... AND not ruining men's lives on nothing but unsubstantiated accusations.

As I said before, I have no clue whatsoever just how common false accusations are... whether it be 2% or 41% or wherever in between... I feel that even if it is on the lower end of that spectrum, it's still higher than most people think, and it's still enough to justify a re-calibration of how rigorous the standard of proof is on this.

Let me leave you with a link to a good 8 minute video on this subject, which I really think anyone whose kneejerk response to this is negative, should take the time to watch:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvBt7Ry16uM

PLEASE take the time to watch this.

I actually followed this case a bit.

There were photos. There were texts about it to guys from other guys, even admitting they are not afriad being caught.

And to top it all off, defense evidence were caught in multiple lies when taking the stand, very bad lies too that the prosecutor was able to over come with a single question.

Yes, a lot of false rape accusations do happen. This one I am fairly certain is not.

 

[sixone]

Sorry women but you harmed yourself by making too many false allegations of rape. If I'm on a jury about a rape case and it's word vs word with no evidence, I vote not guilty.

So you've decided we're all guilty, based on the actions of a few?

I guess that makes you a rapist then, doesn't it?

 

[sixone]

The boys deserved what they got coming for them, taking advantage of a completely passed out girl was definitely wrong. The girl needs to get charged with underage drinking though, not just to punish her but as a lesson to all other underage teens that if you drink and put yourself in situations like that, you can ruin your own life.

So getting raped isn't punishment enough? She didn't even get a trial, first, like her rapists did.

 

[waggy]

So you've decided we're all guilty, based on the actions of a few?

I guess that makes you a rapist then, doesn't it?

again read what he wrote. You are so fond of saying something yet claiming its not exactly what you said.

he never said all women are guilty. He said there needs to be proof. Not just his vs her word.

 

[Printer Bandit]

fingering = raping ?

 

[sixone]

again read what he wrote. You are so fond of saying something yet claiming its not exactly what you said.

he never said all women are guilty. He said there needs to be proof. Not just his vs her word.

He addressed his post to "women", not to women who make false accusations. Please read more carefully before you respond. This has been an ongoing issue with you.

 

[SSSnail]

He addressed his post to "women", not to women who make false accusations. Please read more carefully before you respond. This has been an ongoing issue with you.

Think of how many times a day you tell little white lies, then multiply that by a few billions...