Did anyone see the mythbusters one about the ice bullet

[narcotic]

I didn't get to see the end of it...
to me it looks sort of impossible, since the velocity of the bullet will generate so much heat through friction with the air, even if it was possible for the bullet head not to melt completly while flying through the barrel. Even then, you'd have to shot from point-blank... That's just mho though.
so is it a myth or possible?


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[Ronstang]

myth

 

[waggy]

yeah they said it was busted. they also tried a bunch of other bullets too heh

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

myth...it disintegrates on impact

 

[glugglug]

Mythbusters says busted due to melting from heat generated by the gunpowder explosion before bullet exits the barrel.

However, they really didn't try hard enough, either time (its been a revisited myth). They haven't tried dry ice yet, which takes 3 times the energy per unit mass to sublime it that regular ice takes to melt. Also, dry ice is a better insulator, so it's harder for that heat to transfer into it. They also didn't try with air rifles, where there wouldn't be a gunpowder explosion generating heat.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

They busted it, but I question their testing methods. The ice bullet was too fragile and did not cause any damage. I think that they didn't adequately explore adding certain chemicals to the bullet to make it more durable. I'm not saying that will definitely make a difference, but it's pretty easy to make ice far stronger and still allow it to melt.

 

[narcotic]

Originally posted by: MikeyIs4Dcats
myth...it disintegrates on impact

That means the bullet head did fly a little?
looks wierd to me, I'd figure it'll melt.

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

Originally posted by: narcotic

Originally posted by: MikeyIs4Dcats
myth...it disintegrates on impact

That means the bullet head did fly a little?
looks wierd to me, I'd figure it'll melt.

there is not enough time for enough heat transfer to melt it completely. The remaining piece impacted the target, but exploded immediately, with very little damage. It is akin to shooting a bullet of compressed powder like they use in some paintball games....it complete destroys itsself and does not penetrate.

 

[narcotic]

Originally posted by: glugglug
Mythbusters says busted due to melting from heat generated by the gunpowder explosion before bullet exits the barrel.

However, they really didn't try hard enough, either time (its been a revisited myth). They haven't tried dry ice yet, which takes 3 times the energy per unit mass to sublime it that regular ice takes to melt. Also, dry ice is a better insulator, so it's harder for that heat to transfer into it. They also didn't try with air rifles, where there wouldn't be a gunpowder explosion generating heat.

I agree, there are for sure ways to make a "disappearing" bullets, not necessarily by using ice, perhaps you can use weak plastic which will burn off, or maybe some sort of a strong gel, stuff like that...

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

Originally posted by: narcotic

Originally posted by: glugglug
Mythbusters says busted due to melting from heat generated by the gunpowder explosion before bullet exits the barrel.

However, they really didn't try hard enough, either time (its been a revisited myth). They haven't tried dry ice yet, which takes 3 times the energy per unit mass to sublime it that regular ice takes to melt. Also, dry ice is a better insulator, so it's harder for that heat to transfer into it. They also didn't try with air rifles, where there wouldn't be a gunpowder explosion generating heat.

I agree, there are for sure ways to make a "disappearing" bullets, not necessarily by using ice, perhaps you can use weak plastic which will burn off, or maybe some sort of a strong gel, stuff like that...

you're not a physics or engineering major are you? you must have mass. Lighweight plastic or gel will not penetrate enough to do any harm.

 

[CrackRabbit]

Or make ice balls and shoot them with a paintball gun, no penetration but serious injury will result.

 

[bootymac]

Originally posted by: GagHalfrunt
They busted it, but I question their testing methods. The ice bullet was too fragile and did not cause any damage. I think that they didn't adequately explore adding certain chemicals to the bullet to make it more durable. I'm not saying that will definitely make a difference, but it's pretty easy to make ice far stronger and still allow it to melt.

Yeah, some of the stuff they do is really questionable. I would take their experiments with a grain of salt. It's hella fun to watch tho

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Originally posted by: narcotic

Originally posted by: glugglug
Mythbusters says busted due to melting from heat generated by the gunpowder explosion before bullet exits the barrel.

However, they really didn't try hard enough, either time (its been a revisited myth). They haven't tried dry ice yet, which takes 3 times the energy per unit mass to sublime it that regular ice takes to melt. Also, dry ice is a better insulator, so it's harder for that heat to transfer into it. They also didn't try with air rifles, where there wouldn't be a gunpowder explosion generating heat.

I agree, there are for sure ways to make a "disappearing" bullets, not necessarily by using ice, perhaps you can use weak plastic which will burn off, or maybe some sort of a strong gel, stuff like that...

Exactly. A pure ice bullet was busted, but there are a lot of things that could melt and be untracable. There are also better delivery methods than a standard cartridge that would not trasmit as much heat to the projectile. That would allow it to melt less (or not at all) and retain much more mass when it reached the target. An air/CO2 delivery system would be a possibility as would a blackpowder gun with some sort of insulating sabot behind the bullet. That's what drives me crazy about the show, they have pretty impressive skills in building and practical science, but very poor skills in common sense. They leave a lot of avenues unexplored simply because they fail to see other options. They fixate on a single path wayyyyy too often.

 

[Modeps]

A bit unrelated, but I hate the fact that the original mythbusters have a crew now. They're just irritating.

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

Originally posted by: GagHalfrunt

Originally posted by: narcotic

Originally posted by: glugglug
Mythbusters says busted due to melting from heat generated by the gunpowder explosion before bullet exits the barrel.

However, they really didn't try hard enough, either time (its been a revisited myth). They haven't tried dry ice yet, which takes 3 times the energy per unit mass to sublime it that regular ice takes to melt. Also, dry ice is a better insulator, so it's harder for that heat to transfer into it. They also didn't try with air rifles, where there wouldn't be a gunpowder explosion generating heat.

I agree, there are for sure ways to make a "disappearing" bullets, not necessarily by using ice, perhaps you can use weak plastic which will burn off, or maybe some sort of a strong gel, stuff like that...

Exactly. A pure ice bullet was busted, but there are a lot of things that could melt and be untracable. There are also better delivery methods than a standard cartridge that would not trasmit as much heat to the projectile. That would allow it to melt less (or not at all) and retain much more mass when it reached the target. An air/CO2 delivery system would be a possibility as would a blackpowder gun with some sort of insulating sabot behind the bullet. That's what drives me crazy about the show, they have pretty impressive skills in building and practical science, but very poor skills in common sense. They leave a lot of avenues unexplored simply because they fail to see other options. They fixate on a single path wayyyyy too often.

both you mentioned have very low muzzlwe velocities, and therfore are unlikely to propel any lighweight projectile suffucuently enough to cause serious injury.

it's not that they fixate on a single method, it's that they do the research and present the most likely method(s) due to limited time.

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

Originally posted by: Modeps
A bit unrelated, but I hate the fact that the original mythbusters have a crew now. They're just irritating.

blasphemer! Kari's hawt.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Originally posted by: MikeyIs4Dcats

Originally posted by: narcotic

Originally posted by: glugglug
Mythbusters says busted due to melting from heat generated by the gunpowder explosion before bullet exits the barrel.

However, they really didn't try hard enough, either time (its been a revisited myth). They haven't tried dry ice yet, which takes 3 times the energy per unit mass to sublime it that regular ice takes to melt. Also, dry ice is a better insulator, so it's harder for that heat to transfer into it. They also didn't try with air rifles, where there wouldn't be a gunpowder explosion generating heat.

I agree, there are for sure ways to make a "disappearing" bullets, not necessarily by using ice, perhaps you can use weak plastic which will burn off, or maybe some sort of a strong gel, stuff like that...

you're not a physics or engineering major are you? you must have mass. Lighweight plastic or gel will not penetrate enough to do any harm.

You'd be amazed how little mass you need when it's moving at a high speed. A .22 caliber bullet can kill under ideal circumstance and that's typically in the neighborhood of 40 grains or less. That's less than 3 grams. A better "killer" like a 9mm can weight around 6 grams or so. Remember that you're talking not just about bullet mass, but muzzle energy. Using the same charge a lighter bullet is delivered with more velocity than a heavier one. It would be easy to come up with a heavier ice bullet that would maintain enough mass to penetrate, I think the trick would be making it strong enough to penetrate without fragmenting.

 

[tyler811]

no

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Originally posted by: MikeyIs4Dcats

Originally posted by: GagHalfrunt

Originally posted by: narcotic

Originally posted by: glugglug
Mythbusters says busted due to melting from heat generated by the gunpowder explosion before bullet exits the barrel.

However, they really didn't try hard enough, either time (its been a revisited myth). They haven't tried dry ice yet, which takes 3 times the energy per unit mass to sublime it that regular ice takes to melt. Also, dry ice is a better insulator, so it's harder for that heat to transfer into it. They also didn't try with air rifles, where there wouldn't be a gunpowder explosion generating heat.

I agree, there are for sure ways to make a "disappearing" bullets, not necessarily by using ice, perhaps you can use weak plastic which will burn off, or maybe some sort of a strong gel, stuff like that...

Exactly. A pure ice bullet was busted, but there are a lot of things that could melt and be untracable. There are also better delivery methods than a standard cartridge that would not trasmit as much heat to the projectile. That would allow it to melt less (or not at all) and retain much more mass when it reached the target. An air/CO2 delivery system would be a possibility as would a blackpowder gun with some sort of insulating sabot behind the bullet. That's what drives me crazy about the show, they have pretty impressive skills in building and practical science, but very poor skills in common sense. They leave a lot of avenues unexplored simply because they fail to see other options. They fixate on a single path wayyyyy too often.

both you mentioned have very low muzzlwe velocities, and therfore are unlikely to propel any lighweight projectile suffucuently enough to cause serious injury.

it's not that they fixate on a single method, it's that they do the research and present the most likely method(s) due to limited time.

Wrong-o. Commercial air/CO2 systems don't have the muzzle energy necessary to do the job, but it's all just a matter of pressures. Build your own system and you can get them up to snuff. And black powder rifles are able to achieve muzzle speeds rivaling modern hunting guns. A WW2 era carbine might shoot at 1900fps depending on caliber and a .22LR is about half of that. Black powder guns can get beyond 2,000fps firing some fairly heavy projectiles. That's way more than is needed to propel a mass capable of killing with ease.

 

[TallBill]

what about a frozen meat bullet?

 

[daveymark]

what about a frozen blood bullet?

 

[TallBill]

Originally posted by: daveymark
what about a frozen blood bullet?

nawh, i was thinking something solid, cuz it'd hold up a bit more.

 

[Atomicus]

how about I take an icicle the size of a screwdriver and jam it through your throat? I think that works

 

[TallBill]

Originally posted by: Atomicus
how about I take an icicle the size of a screwdriver and jam it through your throat? I think that works

bwuahahha

 

[Pathogen03]

ice flechettes? Sharpens while in the air en route to its target through friction