Debt Limitapalooza 2023!

[blackangst1]

You never answered my question a few pages back, who was president when we got rid of the deficit? The name eludes me.

Debt =! deficit.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Debt =! deficit.

Yeah but don't you have to get rid of the deficit for a while to get the debt paid down? Man where is that guy, he could really help us out right about now.

 

[brycejones]

Debt =! deficit.

That’s what you got out of that post?

 

[ivwshane]

So, if you honestly don't know, and you are going off of articles that make the claim the budget is bloated, but have no actual knowledge, do you think it's appropriate to call for cuts with out any knowledge of it? I am willing to bet those articles are all opinion pieces with no real indication of what is spent on what, and had no fact to back them up.. if they had, you wouldn't have to tell us you honestly don't know because you would have some sort of factual knowledge to base a decision on.

How much money do you think it takes to keep our military up and running here at the states? World wide? How much do you think it costs to maintain our bases around the world, pay the military members, R&D, weapons, armament, replacement of equipment, etc? Don't you think you should do some research so you have at least an idea of how that money is spent, rather than going off of people say our military budget is bloated before you make a claim it's budget should be cut? Out of all those articles you read, did anyone even touch what the military budget covers and what it takes to cover those expenses? IF not, don't you think that is an important piece of information needed to make a claim of something being bloated?

I’d be happy with cuts to contractors and bringing more things in house.

In fact, since the military is the largest example of socialism on the planet (as far as I can tell), I see no reason to continue doing what we are doing and instead think we should be directly manufacturing and developing whatever we need. Unless there is a benefit to privatizing the support structure of the military I’m not sure why we are subsidizing private companies at all.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

I’d be happy with cuts to contractors and bringing more things in house.

In fact, since the military is the largest example of socialism on the planet (as far as I can tell), I see no reason to continue doing what we are doing and instead think we should be directly manufacturing and developing whatever we need. Unless there is a benefit to privatizing the support structure of the military I’m not sure why we are subsidizing private companies at all.

Contractors tend to be an anchor for institutional knowledge within the DoD, at least in the realms I operated. Pulling everything in-house will unfortunately result in a poorer military.

It's also a great place for military with exceedingly specific knowledge bases to turn around and work, doubly so if they're technical in nature and the individual would rather do that than supervise.

 

[ivwshane]

Contractors tend to be an anchor for institutional knowledge within the DoD, at least in the realms I operated. Pulling everything in-house will unfortunately result in a poorer military.

It's also a great place for military with exceedingly specific knowledge bases to turn around and work, doubly so if they're technical in nature and the individual would rather do that than supervise.

So the US can’t hire these same people? Seems like an excuse.

 

[blackangst1]

Yeah but don't you have to get rid of the deficit for a while to get the debt paid down? Man where is that guy, he could really help us out right about now.

Yep. That would be Clinton.

 

[blackangst1]

That’s what you got out of that post?

The off topic inaccuracy? Yes.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

So the US can’t hire these same people? Seems like an excuse.

The US? Not sure what you mean, unless you mean foreign contractors, I wasn't specifically talking about them. Maybe miscommunication as to what you meant by 'in-house'.

Yep. That would be Clinton.

Right! Clinton, that's who it was. Shame we don't have more of that guy.

Anywho, if you need a bunch of cash to square the debt, there's always the rich folk!

 

[FelixDeCat]

Debt =! deficit.

Looks like we are the only two men in America brave enough to speak truth to ignorance. This country needs cuts in all forms of spending - defense, welfare, foreign aid, everywhere in all things. Cut, cut, cut!

Some people like being ignorant as if we can just keep increasing spending ad nuaseam. That is just pain dumb and anyone who supports that notion needs to be woken to the cold reality that we simply dont have the money to do it, nor should we be forced to either.

 

[FelixDeCat]

The US? Not sure what you mean, unless you mean foreign contractors, I wasn't specifically talking about them. Maybe miscommunication as to what you meant by 'in-house'.

Right! Clinton, that's who it was. Shame we don't have more of that guy.

Anywho, if you need a bunch of cash to square the debt, there's always the rich folk!

Only because Republicans who controlled both houses forced him to. Todays democrats are not woke to our debt problem and its up to Repbulicans to wake them.

 

[brycejones]

Looks like we are the only two men in America brave enough to speak truth to ignorance. This country needs cuts in all forms of spending - defense, welfare, foreign aid, everywhere in all things. Cut, cut, cut!

Some people like being ignorant as if we can just keep increasing spending ad nuaseam. That is just pain dumb and anyone who supports that notion needs to be woken to the cold reality that we simply dont have the money to do it, nor should we be forced to either.

This is some truly funny shit.

 

[brycejones]

The off topic inaccuracy? Yes.

Since when have you cared about accuracy?

 

[ivwshane]

The US? Not sure what you mean, unless you mean foreign contractors, I wasn't specifically talking about them. Maybe miscommunication as to what you meant by 'in-house'.

Right! Clinton, that's who it was. Shame we don't have more of that guy.

Anywho, if you need a bunch of cash to square the debt, there's always the rich folk!

Contractors as in companies we contract with to do stuff. Anything and everything from plumbing to weapons development.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Only because Republicans who controlled both houses forced him to. Todays democrats are not woke to our debt problem and its up to Repbulicans to wake them.

Right, even when a Democrat does something you approve of, it's only because a Republican made him do it. Sure.

 

[FelixDeCat]

Right, even when a Democrat does something you approve of, it's only because a Republican made him do it. Sure.

Who did what when and where is not as important as staying woke to our debt problem.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Who did what when and where is not as important as staying woke to our debt problem.

Pointing out the obvious lies from the GOP (and you) designed to manipulate voters (you), is certainly important.

 

[UNCjigga]

Since 1980…

Years Democrats have full control of Congress and the executive branch: ~6
(1993-1995; 2009-2011*; 2021-2023)

1. Clinton and Democrats balanced the budget. Republicans try to take credit because the actual surplus occurred largely in 2nd term after Republicans took control of the House—but it was based on first term tax increases on the rich while cutting defense spending and welfare.
Total debt growth: $600 million over 2 years

2. Obama and Democrats inherited a huge debt from Republicans with quantitative easing and fallout from the housing bubble crisis; Obama spent even more on infrastructure to pull out of the recession (remember TIGER signs all over the highways?) but also raised revenues via taxes and growing the economy for 8 straight years
*Kennedy dies and Lieberman goes all Conservative, essentially ending the Dem Senate majority after 10 months.
Total debt growth: $3.6 trillion over 2 years

3. Biden and Democrats inherited a post-pandemic economy and massive budget shortfalls due to Trump tax cuts. Push thru American Rescue Plan, Inflation Reduction Act and student loan debt relief.
Total debt growth: $3.1 trillion over 2 years

Years Republicans have full control of Congress and the executive branch: ~8
(2001*-2007; 2017-2019)

1. GWB starts 2 wars after 9/11–because one war wasn’t enough. Cuts taxes across the board (but mostly for highest earners).
Total debt growth: $3.3 trillion over 6 years (+ another $3 trillion committed before Obama took office!!!)

2. Trump.
Total debt growth: $1.9 trillion over 2 years (+ another $6 TRILLIONbefore Biden in office thanks to COVID, tax cuts, trade wars)

Now that you have the facts—please show me when ANY Republican has cut spending enough to make a meaningful difference????

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Who did what when and where is not as important as staying woke to our debt problem.

Important enough to you to try to correct me by stating that it wasn't actually Bill that did it.

 

[fskimospy]

Looks like we are the only two men in America brave enough to speak truth to ignorance. This country needs cuts in all forms of spending - defense, welfare, foreign aid, everywhere in all things. Cut, cut, cut!

Some people like being ignorant as if we can just keep increasing spending ad nuaseam. That is just pain dumb and anyone who supports that notion needs to be woken to the cold reality that we simply dont have the money to do it, nor should we be forced to either.

Public policy is basically an attempt to improve the standard of living of citizens. How would your plan do this?

Please be as specific as possible.

 

[ElFenix]

Who did what when and where is not as important as staying woke to our debt problem.

since you think woke is crying about something that doesn't exist your subconsciousness is telling on you.

 

[ElFenix]

Since 1980…

Years Democrats have full control of Congress and the executive branch: ~6
(1993-1995; 2009-2011*; 2021-2023)

1. Clinton and Democrats balanced the budget. Republicans try to take credit because the actual surplus occurred largely in 2nd term after Republicans took control of the House—but it was based on first term tax increases on the rich while cutting defense spending and welfare.
Total debt growth: $600 million over 2 years

2. Obama and Democrats inherited a huge debt from Republicans with quantitative easing and fallout from the housing bubble crisis; Obama spent even more on infrastructure to pull out of the recession (remember TIGER signs all over the highways?) but also raised revenues via taxes and growing the economy for 8 straight years
*Kennedy dies and Lieberman goes all Conservative, essentially ending the Dem Senate majority after 10 months.
Total debt growth: $3.6 trillion over 2 years

3. Biden and Democrats inherited a post-pandemic economy and massive budget shortfalls due to Trump tax cuts. Push thru American Rescue Plan, Inflation Reduction Act and student loan debt relief.
Total debt growth: $3.1 trillion over 2 years

Years Republicans have full control of Congress and the executive branch: ~8
(2001*-2007; 2017-2019)

1. GWB starts 2 wars after 9/11–because one war wasn’t enough. Cuts taxes across the board (but mostly for highest earners).
Total debt growth: $3.3 trillion over 6 years (+ another $3 trillion committed before Obama took office!!!)

2. Trump.
Total debt growth: $1.9 trillion over 2 years (+ another $6 TRILLIONbefore Biden in office thanks to COVID, tax cuts, trade wars)

Now that you have the facts—please show me when ANY Republican has cut spending enough to make a meaningful difference????

what's more interesting to me is attributing all the interest that piles up due to new deficit spending principal back to the originator.

 

[NWRMidnight]

You could cut our DoD budget in half and we are still outspending every other nation. A decade ago we spent over 3 times what China spent.

Do you really think $640 toilet seats and $7600 coffee makers aren't a waste of money?

What a Waste: $778 Billion for the Pentagon and Still Counting

2021 was another banner year for the military-industrial complex, as Congress signed off on a near-record $778 billion in spending for the ...

quincyinst.org

First, you can't compare what other's spend on their military.. that's like comparing a ford pinto to a lamborghini as if they are both daily drivers and in the same catagory.

Everything in that article isn't about wasteful spending, it's about corruption and scamming the government. Is Corruption a reason to cut the budget or is the appropriate action is to reprimand, fire the person who is allowing the government to be ripped of, scamming, and inappropriately spending the government's money? The government has had a long history of grossly spending to much on normal every day items (this is an issue thru out the government, and is not specific to the Military).. but that's a different argument, that's about corruption, not over budgeting. Do you think cutting the budget will change that? Nope! That will require people people being held accountable, from the merchant to the government official who approved the order, and jail time. Cutting the budget won't change the over charging until steps are taken to stop the overcharging and corruption, but it will effect areas that matter most to our national and world security because those areas are what will take the hit.

Your reasoning, is like quitting your job because you keep getting scammed by foreigners and they keep cleaning out your checking account.

I am not saying that smarter spending isn't needed, but cutting the budget without fixing the actual problems such as what is listed in your article, will damage our military, and make us weaker.

 

[NWRMidnight]

By a longshot.

That's pointless.. It's like trying to compare a pinto to a lamborghini, and arguing about the price difference. Besides, how many of those countries does the United states military support in some form or another? Every single one of those that are allies expect the US to be their defender if needed. You also have to look at not just the dollar amount, but what it spends in relation to it's GDP and such.. There is a much bigger picture than just the dollar amount spent.

 

[NWRMidnight]

Here is the biggest problem with government spending, or rather their budgeting:. It's the "if you don't use it, you lose it" mantality. So rather than letting the money roll over to the next year, and budgeting the difference. Many government agencies waste it on stupid shit to ensure they get their full budgeted amount. For example of a city has a light winter, instead of saving the chemicals and deicer for the next winter, they go around deicing dry roads to use all the product so they get their full budgeted amount. Because they won't get their full funding, and end up being short when they actually need it because if the use or lose it mantality.

If the use it or lose it mantality went away, and roll over was utilized, we wouldn't have a budget debt issue at all, and cuts wouldn't be needed.