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Debate of the Century

MartyMcFly3

MartyMcFly3

Lifer
This started out as a conversation on AIM with a friend from home and now its turned into a heated debate.

I was talking to a friend about the movie, and she said that oompa loompas were scary. I replied with "How are they scary? They were slaves... Wonka took them in his care.. gave them jobs and a place to sleep".
She responds with "but they are orange... thats creepy" To which i said "Wonka is like the abraham lincoln of that area... people discriminated against BLACK people because they were a color."

So now i see it as Oompa Loompas represent the end of slavery and trying to become equals but the parents/kids thought they were weird and creepy because they were different... so there's the discrimination... all the oompa loompas want to do is do their jobs. I mean Wonka rescued them from a threat (cant remember the crazy names he used in the story) and he helped them escape... he's like Harriet Tubman+Abraham Lincoln+a Weird Candy Guy who sings.

This is where the debate comes in. A lot of people (Fallenhero and most of the results after googling) see Willy Wonka as a slave owner. This isnt the case... he's providing them employment... look how important his Wonka chocolate is to the world... The oompa loompa's are in charge of making the best chocolate in the world. Also, If they were slaves they wouldnt wear the exact same thing... its called a uniform. Most companies (think retail) require some type of uniform...

And i mean, yeah they sing while working (another slaves reference) but thats because wonka lets them do what they want with the exception of the stuff in their job descriptions. Actually, only the security ones sing, the one's that enforce Wonka's rules. Considering that Wonka is such a private person, they dont really have much security matters at hand, so they have to do something to pass the time. Only employees would be breaking the rules. Besides, the only rules really being enforced are moral rules (don't be a glutton, don't be greedy, don't steal stuff).

If this isnt enough, Wonka has a top-hat like Lincoln. End of story.

Cliffs Notes:
If you dont read the above the cliffs notes wouldnt make sense.
 
You are a moron. Willie Wonka was a slave OWNER. Think of the setting those oompa loompas were in. They carried heavy ass sacks of sugar and various other ingredients around. Willie never mentioned ANYTHING about paying them.

He ?rescued? them from a savage land (I refrence to Africa) which some slave owners I?m sure thought were doing the same thing. He also carried around his cane (whip) in which to beat those around him when they got out of line. The oompa Loompas sang much like the slaves did to make their work go by faster and pass the time.

His top hat was a symbol of authority, much like a head chef or pimp. He commanded respect from those around him not because of his kindness (he rarely showed ANY during the movie) but because he had all the money and shared none of the benefits.
 
Weren't the oompaloompas like midgets or aboriginies in the book or something?

In the movie, he was saving them from some monster or something in exchange for them working for him. Sounds like employment to me.
 
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Weren't the oompaloompas like midgets or aboriginies in the book or something?

In the movie, he was saving them from some monster or something in exchange for them working for him. Sounds like employment to me.
Click to expand...

Back in 1750, some thought we were "saving" the negros of Africa and the Native Americans from their own culture too.
 
The movie doesn't provide enough evidence to settle this argument one way or another. To be what a normal person would consider a slaveowner, Wonka would have to not pay the Loompas and hold them at the factory against their will. No evidence is provided for or against those conclusions anywhere in the movie.
 
Originally posted by: TerryMathews
The movie doesn't provide enough evidence to settle this argument one way or another. To be what a normal person would consider a slaveowner, Wonka would have to not pay the Loompas and hold them at the factory against their will. No evidence is provided for or against those conclusions anywhere in the movie.
Click to expand...

"No one ever leaves, and no one ever enters"

Why would ANYONE want to stay at work 24/7 is beyond me. But willie and his assistant were free to come and go...
 
I thought he was a pretty horrible person. Then again, I've always thought the same of the main character in The Shawshank Redemption.
 
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Weren't the oompaloompas like midgets or aboriginies in the book or something?

In the movie, he was saving them from some monster or something in exchange for them working for him. Sounds like employment to me.
Click to expand...

Back in 1750, some thought we were "saving" the negros of Africa and the Native Americans from their down culture too.
Click to expand...

The oompaloompas didn't look or act too upset there. And if you really want to relate it to slavery, why weren't the oompaloompas bought from other oompaloompas instead of being "saved" from some beast (whose name escapes me).
 
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: TerryMathews
The movie doesn't provide enough evidence to settle this argument one way or another. To be what a normal person would consider a slaveowner, Wonka would have to not pay the Loompas and hold them at the factory against their will. No evidence is provided for or against those conclusions anywhere in the movie.
Click to expand...

"No one ever leaves, and no one ever enters"

Why would ANYONE want to stay at work 24/7 is beyond me. But willie and his assistant were free to come and go...
Click to expand...

Their work = Their home... Many people work from home.
 
Wonka: Oh, well then you know all about it and what a terrible country it is. Nothing but desolate wastes and fierce beasts. And the poor little Oompa Loompas were so small and helpless, they would get gobbled up right and left. A Wangdoodle would eat ten of them for breakfast and
think nothing of it. And so, I said, "Come and live with me in peace and safety, away from all the Wangdoodles and Hornswogglers and Snozzwangers and rotten Vermicious Knids."

MR. SALT: Snozzwangers? Vermicious Knids? What kind of rubbish is that?

WONKA: I'm sorry, but all questions must be submitted in writing. And so, in the greatest of secrecy I transported the entire population of Oompa Loompas to my factory here.


He's a HERO in my eyes.
 
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Weren't the oompaloompas like midgets or aboriginies in the book or something?

In the movie, he was saving them from some monster or something in exchange for them working for him. Sounds like employment to me.
Click to expand...

Back in 1750, some thought we were "saving" the negros of Africa and the Native Americans from their down culture too.
Click to expand...

The oompaloompas didn't look or act too upset there. And if you really want to relate it to slavery, why weren't the oompaloompas bought from other oompaloompas instead of being "saved" from some beast (whose name escapes me).
Click to expand...

Of course they looked happy, guests were there. 5 bucks says Willie Wonka threatened them before anyone entered. And I could simply claim that I saved some poor African from some huge beast (Rhino or Lion) and how could you say that is NOT what I was doing? It is very possible that the African in question COULD have been eatin by a lion or run over by a Rhino.
 
Originally posted by: bootymac
What about that damn chocolate river :|
Click to expand...

It was clean and sanitary until Augustus put his filthy hands in there. Boy that wouldnt be a good day at the factory for the Oompa Loompas. Having to clear out all that infected chocolate. They work hard, and seem to really enjoy working/living for Wonka.
 
Originally posted by: MartyMcFly3
Wonka: Oh, well then you know all about it and what a terrible country it is. Nothing but desolate wastes and fierce beasts. And the poor little Oompa Loompas were so small and helpless, they would get gobbled up right and left. A Wangdoodle would eat ten of them for breakfast and
think nothing of it. And so, I said, "Come and live with me in peace and safety, away from all the Wangdoodles and Hornswogglers and Snozzwangers and rotten Vermicious Knids."

MR. SALT: Snozzwangers? Vermicious Knids? What kind of rubbish is that?

WONKA: I'm sorry, but all questions must be submitted in writing. And so, in the greatest of secrecy I transported the entire population of Oompa Loompas to my factory here.


He's a HERO in my eyes.
Click to expand...

Why the secrecy? Why not say "I have helped all these people!"

Because he did it ILLEAGALLY! He forced them onto ships to be his cheap labor.
 
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Weren't the oompaloompas like midgets or aboriginies in the book or something?

In the movie, he was saving them from some monster or something in exchange for them working for him. Sounds like employment to me.
Click to expand...

Back in 1750, some thought we were "saving" the negros of Africa and the Native Americans from their down culture too.
Click to expand...

The oompaloompas didn't look or act too upset there. And if you really want to relate it to slavery, why weren't the oompaloompas bought from other oompaloompas instead of being "saved" from some beast (whose name escapes me).
Click to expand...

Of course they looked happy, guests were there. 5 bucks says Willie Wonka threatened them before anyone entered. And I could simply claim that I saved some poor African from some huge beast (Rhino or Lion) and how could you say that is NOT what I was doing? It is very possible that the African in question COULD have been eatin by a lion or run over by a Rhino.
Click to expand...

I thought they were australian...
 
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: MartyMcFly3
Wonka: Oh, well then you know all about it and what a terrible country it is. Nothing but desolate wastes and fierce beasts. And the poor little Oompa Loompas were so small and helpless, they would get gobbled up right and left. A Wangdoodle would eat ten of them for breakfast and
think nothing of it. And so, I said, "Come and live with me in peace and safety, away from all the Wangdoodles and Hornswogglers and Snozzwangers and rotten Vermicious Knids."

MR. SALT: Snozzwangers? Vermicious Knids? What kind of rubbish is that?

WONKA: I'm sorry, but all questions must be submitted in writing. And so, in the greatest of secrecy I transported the entire population of Oompa Loompas to my factory here.


He's a HERO in my eyes.
Click to expand...

Why the secrecy? Why not say "I have helped all these people!"

Because he did it ILLEAGALLY! He forced them onto ships to be his cheap labor.
Click to expand...

If anything you can say the Oompa Loompas were illegal immigrants. He kept it a secret so they wouldnt be kicked out of the country. He kept it a secret to PROTECT the Oompa Loompas.
 
Willy Wonka was a good man. As MartyMcFly and n0cmonkey stated he rescued and in turn they worked for him. Just like Morgan Freeman and Kevin Costner in Robin Hood. Costner saved Freeman's life and while Costner didn't make Freeman stick around to "pay back the debt", Freeman did it of his own free will and they were more like friends even though Freeman was "indebted" to Costner. So I think the Oompa Loompas worked for Wonka out of their own free will to "pay" him back for rescueing them.

I also believed the Oompa Loompas realized the impact they made on the world by working for Wonka. Obviously the world loved Wonka chocolate and the Oompas wanted to be part of that. So I think if even he hadn't saved them from their deaths, they would work for him given the opportunity.
 
Originally posted by: MartyMcFly3
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: MartyMcFly3
Wonka: Oh, well then you know all about it and what a terrible country it is. Nothing but desolate wastes and fierce beasts. And the poor little Oompa Loompas were so small and helpless, they would get gobbled up right and left. A Wangdoodle would eat ten of them for breakfast and
think nothing of it. And so, I said, "Come and live with me in peace and safety, away from all the Wangdoodles and Hornswogglers and Snozzwangers and rotten Vermicious Knids."

MR. SALT: Snozzwangers? Vermicious Knids? What kind of rubbish is that?

WONKA: I'm sorry, but all questions must be submitted in writing. And so, in the greatest of secrecy I transported the entire population of Oompa Loompas to my factory here.


He's a HERO in my eyes.
Click to expand...

Why the secrecy? Why not say "I have helped all these people!"

Because he did it ILLEAGALLY! He forced them onto ships to be his cheap labor.
Click to expand...

If anything you can say the Oompa Loompas were illegal immigrants. He kept it a secret so they wouldnt be kicked out of the country. He kept it a secret to PROTECT the Oompa Loompas.
Click to expand...

They could get proper work permits in any number of ways. at the very LEAST, this makes Willie Wonka dishonost. If he is going to lie to the government about his employees to save a quick buck, what would stop him from lying to 10 fat poor sobs from the street?
 
read the book, I'm pretty sure it was more specific.

Besides, books are always, always better than movies.
 
Come with me, And you'll be, In a world of Pure imagination... Take a look, And you'll see, Into your imagination...
We'll begin, With a spin, Traveling in the world of my creation... What we'll see, Will defy Explanation...
If you want to view paradise, Simply look around and view it.... Anything you want to, do it... Wanta change the world? There's nothing to it.

God THAT sounds like a HELL of a place to work... Where can I sign up? The Oompa Loompas had the best jobs in the world.

 
Originally posted by: jtusa4
Willy Wonka was a good man. As MartyMcFly and n0cmonkey stated he rescued and in turn they worked for him. Just like Morgan Freeman and Kevin Costner in Robin Hood. Costner saved Freeman's life and while Costner didn't make Freeman stick around to "pay back the debt", Freeman did it of his own free will and they were more like friends even though Freeman was "indebted" to Costner. So I think the Oompa Loompas worked for Wonka out of their own free will to "pay" him back for rescueing them.

I also believed the Oompa Loompas realized the impact they made on the world by working for Wonka. Obviously the world loved Wonka chocolate and the Oompas wanted to be part of that. So I think if even he hadn't saved them from their deaths, they would work for him given the opportunity.
Click to expand...

They would leave, but they value life more. Why didn't all the slaves just revolt or run at the same time? Probably because they feared for their lives, and it was difficult for them to organize given their situation. The same could be said for oompa loompas.
 
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