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Deadlift question

B

brad310

Senior member
I hadnt deadlifted until about 6 months ago. I enjoy it now that i do...watched the starting strength video and read the book, and i use the form he teaches.

My question is, is the deadlift AS valuable of an exercise as the squat? The range of motion is less...but it seems like a similar amount of muscle recruitment...and with no stretch reflex, its difficult as well.

There is plenty of material about the importance of the squat in terms of its hormonal effects and how it can help the rest of your body grow...but is the deadlift as beneficial in regards to hormones released, calories, etc?

A side questions...Rippetoe mentions in one of his videos that deadlifts are hard to recover from. I know what this means now. Could that longer recovery time mean extra benefits as well?
 
brad310 said:
I hadnt deadlifted until about 6 months ago. I enjoy it now that i do...watched the starting strength video and read the book, and i use the form he teaches.

My question is, is the deadlift AS valuable of an exercise as the squat? The range of motion is less...but it seems like a similar amount of muscle recruitment...and with no stretch reflex, its difficult as well.

There is plenty of material about the importance of the squat in terms of its hormonal effects and how it can help the rest of your body grow...but is the deadlift as beneficial in regards to hormones released, calories, etc?

A side questions...Rippetoe mentions in one of his videos that deadlifts are hard to recover from. I know what this means now. Could that longer recovery time mean extra benefits as well?
Click to expand...

Most would argue that it is actually more valuable than squat. It's not just a lower body lift, though. You're also recruiting muscles in your shoulders, back, and arms. An ideal workout includes variations of both lifts, of course. If I could do only one, it would be the dead lift.
 
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Yes, the deadlift is an enormously valuable exercise. I can't think of too many exercises that are more practical than learning to pick heavy shit up from the ground. It's relatively easy to learn, lets you move heavier weights than almost any other motion, and will make you strong as hell if you do them consistently.

Of course, there's no reason to really compare the two: just do both and you'll be the stronger for it.
 
As for what Rip means when he says "harder to recover from", he's not just referring to physical recovery but also the tax that deadlifts take on the nervous system.
 
brad310 said:
I hadnt deadlifted until about 6 months ago. I enjoy it now that i do...watched the starting strength video and read the book, and i use the form he teaches.

My question is, is the deadlift AS valuable of an exercise as the squat? The range of motion is less...but it seems like a similar amount of muscle recruitment...and with no stretch reflex, its difficult as well.

There is plenty of material about the importance of the squat in terms of its hormonal effects and how it can help the rest of your body grow...but is the deadlift as beneficial in regards to hormones released, calories, etc?

A side questions...Rippetoe mentions in one of his videos that deadlifts are hard to recover from. I know what this means now. Could that longer recovery time mean extra benefits as well?
Click to expand...


Deadlift is supposed to be the better of the two due to the brute strength it can help you grow becuase it effects more muscle groups. But then this leaves the question in my head about Dumbbell Squats. That excersise seems to be a hybrid of the two. I have been doing both Db Squats and Deadlifts, but seems the same except I have to switch bars. So wouldnt Db Squats work for both? If your trying to eliminate one or the other that is?
 
Add a +1 for deadlifts. As an aside, I believe any hormonal effects from heavy compound lifts to be dramatically overstated. While there are short term increases in androgen levels, most research indicates that long term, nearly all athletes (strength or endurance) have lower androgen levels than sedentary populations-- essentially just gym lore.
 
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If I could only pick one, it would be squats.
I feel squats do more for my quads and core than dead lifts do for my entire body.
After squats, my legs are completely shot. After deadlifts, my entire body is weak, but my legs don't feel shot.

Dead lifts are still a great exercise though.
 
Done properly, they target different major muscles.

For example:
Squat=quad
dead=hammy

Remember,weight on your heals, not your toes for both!
 
IHateMyJob2004 said:
Done properly, they target different major muscles.

For example:
Squat=quad
dead=hammy
Click to expand...

Not quite true. The major movers in a proper squat are the glutes, quads, hamstrings and adductors. The major movers in a proper deadlift are glutes, hamstrings, and quads (with a ton of grip strength to hold the bar). Both exercises make extensive use of almost every muscle in the back/abs/obliques to keep the trunk rigid as it transfers force from the legs to the bar.
 
deadlifts target your back.

squats target your quads.

Both hit on a bunch of common muscles though, including each others target muscles.

Done properly, this distinction is noticeable. Doing only one or the other is going to cause certain muscle groups to be left out in terms of really pushing your limits.
 
Squats hit your posterior chain.

See diagram.

leg presses will hit your quads better than squats. Nothing beats a strong posterior chain.

Posterior&
 
toolbag said:
No. Just saying people were throwing some strange stuff around about squats and wanted to clear it up.
Click to expand...
What about Squat -vs- Deadlift, that was what the real question was about.

I have watched videos on both, but even though from what I have read and heard Deadlifts do slightly more back muscles and forearms (grip) while traditional Squats are more legs. So where the heck does Dumbbell Squats fit in?? During a dumbbell squat your still grabbing weight off the floor and (i may be wrong) lift them the same way you would if you were doing traditional deadlifts, except they are slightly more to the side of your legs. But regardless they are not resting on your back unlike traditional squats.
 
Exodist said:
What about Squat -vs- Deadlift, that was what the real question was about.

I have watched videos on both, but even though from what I have read and heard Deadlifts do slightly more back muscles and forearms (grip) while traditional Squats are more legs. So where the heck does Dumbbell Squats fit in?? During a dumbbell squat your still grabbing weight off the floor and (i may be wrong) lift them the same way you would if you were doing traditional deadlifts, except they are slightly more to the side of your legs. But regardless they are not resting on your back unlike traditional squats.
Click to expand...

Deads are still doing your glutes, hams, and quads like squats. When I do deadlifts I feel more overall muscles being used vs the squat but not by too much. Both are the best exercises you can do. Old saying goes if you could only choose one exercise to do if you were wise it would be the squat.

Dumbbells squats will not require the same stabilizing muscles since the weight will not be on your upper back. Also you won't be able to hang near as much weight from them. PLUS your dumbbells will hit the floor. You really want to go deep into a squat to get the full benefit. So many people do half squats it's not even funny. I see some doing 225 half way where they would struggle to do 135 properly for a set of 6-10.
 
You also need to take into consideration the type of squat you are doing. A traditional high bar squat (with the bar resting on the traps) works the quads much more than the low bar squat that is encouraged in Starting Strength, which splits the load more evenly over the quads and hamstrings.
 
Exodist said:
What about Squat -vs- Deadlift, that was what the real question was about.

I have watched videos on both, but even though from what I have read and heard Deadlifts do slightly more back muscles and forearms (grip) while traditional Squats are more legs. So where the heck does Dumbbell Squats fit in?? During a dumbbell squat your still grabbing weight off the floor and (i may be wrong) lift them the same way you would if you were doing traditional deadlifts, except they are slightly more to the side of your legs. But regardless they are not resting on your back unlike traditional squats.
Click to expand...

Ok, let's clear this up for you then. Typical high bar back squats - you utilize a great deal of glutes, hamstrings, quads, and calfs. In addition to that, you have keep the entirety of your core tight, along with your arm's musculature to keep the bar in the correct position. If you utilize the Valsalva, it's a lot of both back extensors and abs. If you don't, it's more back extensors.

With the conventional deadlift, you utilize much more back extensors and a bit more glutes (if you can actually fire them - a lot of people have issues with coordination). Hamstrings are very important, especially if you know how to tension them well. Quads come in, but the demand is less on the quads due to the reduced range of motion utilize compared to squats. Calf musculature is used, but not nearly as much as the squat. Deadlift also ties in a lot more upper back and arms - traps, rhomboids, rotator cuff, pec, bicep, wrist flexors and extensors (for grip).

Dumbbell squats are more deadlift than squat. The name is just a name. It should moreso be called a suitcase deadlift or something like that.
 
SociallyChallenged said:
Ok, let's clear this up for you then. ................................................................................

Dumbbell squats are more deadlift than squat. The name is just a name. It should moreso be called a suitcase deadlift or something like that.
Click to expand...

Gotcha, I appreciate the clarification. Yea IMHO they should be called DB Deadlifts or something.

I really got to get a squat rack and a new appartment soon.. :\
 
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