Dead Trigger free on Android due to very high piracy rate

[Zaap]

Two things:
It ranks higher relative to other apps in the Google Play store vs relative to other apps in the App Store, but that doesn't mean it makes more money in the Google Play store vs App Store. That would require secondary evidence.

It would require secondary evidence to show that its higher-grossing on the App Store than Android- WHEN IT DOESN'T EVEN SHOW UP on the App's Store's highest grossing list, yet shows pretty highly on Android's.

The iOS crowd are the ones with some proving to do.

This dev just wanted an excuse to make their latest game that wasn't doing all that hot on Android free with ads rather than $.99.

According to the iOS crowd's own "logic", we can assume this company's poorer showing on the App store charts than on Google Play (top sales, and top grossing) must mean that Android users spend more money and iOS users are a bunch of chiselers. This according to their own 'logic' on the subject.

What's funniest in all of this, is that once more, no one *really* cares. The iOS crowd thought they had some big "ohhhh look at this!" example of Android users not buying something, where iOS users do, and jumped on it without thinking.

The facts show, that for this particular developer, they do perfectly fine on Android, and in fact chart higher on the top grossing lists than on iOS, and piracy hasn't stopped any of this.

In other words, it was a shitty example, and now some are having to eat all their blustering nonsense about it.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

An hour to root a nexus s? LOL stay with your iPhone.

Uhh...

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1007782

That should probably take 10 minutes, but I tried on two computers and the device wouldn't show up in Device Manager at all. In the end I found some workaround and got it to show up.

IIRC this was May 2011, so I'm pretty sure I tried it on a fresh install of Windows 7 (my NAS) and my standard desktop.

I'm not saying these instructions are hard, but every phone is different. Honestly if you want to say I'm retarded, go ahead. I flash ROMs all the time and I do plenty of testing work with the devs on XDA. Sometimes it's just not that simple. You can find 5 different ways to root an HTC Incredible S for example. I watched my gf do it and she messed up. I took the computer from her like "wow couldn't you read instructions?" (what you're doing to me), and I ran into the same error. I forgot how we resolved it, but once again it wasn't just a 15 minute hack job.

It's a 15 minute hack job after you've established this is the way to go because you can find SEVERAL root methods that differ. Some on AndroidForums, some on XDA, etc.

 

[QueBert]

In other words, it was a shitty example, and now some are having to eat all their blustering nonsense about it.

Google it and you'll see the App store brings in SIX TIMES the $$$$ the play store does, that's not exactly a small amount. I'm not a math person by any means, but even the 250th best selling app on the App store would be close to 37x on Play.

 

[TuxDave]

It would require secondary evidence to show that its higher-grossing on the App Store than Android- WHEN IT DOESN'T EVEN SHOW UP on the App's Store's highest grossing list, yet shows pretty highly on Android's.

The iOS crowd are the ones with some proving to do.

I don't know where the iOS crowd comes in but since you're making the claim that it earns more money in the Google Play store and therefore (something something), you should be doing the proving. That is unless you weren't being serious. If you don't get why I say it's a logical fallacy. Imagine the #5 player in the MLB vs the #1 player in Little League. Ranking is relative to others in the same category, but it doesn't indicate anything when comparing across groups.

According to the iOS crowd's own "logic", we can assume this company's poorer showing on the App store charts than on Google Play (top sales, and top grossing) must mean that Android users spend more money and iOS users are a bunch of chiselers. This according to their own 'logic' on the subject.

Hey, point me out to an iOS crowd making the same argument as you with the same premise and I'll go tear apart that argument as well.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

This.

No need for a USB cable, that's old tech. I transfer files through my wireless network using either Wifi File Transfer/Explorer. :hmm:

You can do that certainly. I'm not a fan of installing additional software to have to do all these things. For example, I'd rather Wifi tether than used wired tether and some software attached to it.

I'm sure you'll point to iTunes, but the bare minimum is acceptable. On Mac, I need Android File Transfer, and I'll live with that, but I'll leverage existing protocols such as usb transfer.

But back to the point. I haven't followed Android piracy, but I looked around in early 2011 and it looked like crap. Maybe there are solutions out there, but the fact that Installous has been a good working solution since 2008... puts Android to shame.

 

[Zaap]

Imagine the #5 player in the MLB vs the #1 player in Little League. Ranking is relative to others in the same category, but it doesn't indicate anything when comparing across groups.

You'd have a point if we were talking #1 vs #5 or whatever, not high on chart vs. no-show.

 

[TuxDave]

You'd have a point if we were talking #1 vs #5 or whatever, not high on chart vs. no-show.

#1 in Little League is still probably a lot crappier than #200 in MLB. You're still not helping your argument.

 

[cheezy321]

It would require secondary evidence to show that its higher-grossing on the App Store than Android- WHEN IT DOESN'T EVEN SHOW UP on the App's Store's highest grossing list, yet shows pretty highly on Android's.

The iOS crowd are the ones with some proving to do.

This dev just wanted an excuse to make their latest game that wasn't doing all that hot on Android free with ads rather than $.99.

According to the iOS crowd's own "logic", we can assume this company's poorer showing on the App store charts than on Google Play (top sales, and top grossing) must mean that Android users spend more money and iOS users are a bunch of chiselers. This according to their own 'logic' on the subject.

What's funniest in all of this, is that once more, no one *really* cares. The iOS crowd thought they had some big "ohhhh look at this!" example of Android users not buying something, where iOS users do, and jumped on it without thinking.

The facts show, that for this particular developer, they do perfectly fine on Android, and in fact chart higher on the top grossing lists than on iOS, and piracy hasn't stopped any of this.

In other words, it was a shitty example, and now some are having to eat all their blustering nonsense about it.

Just so your opinion is clear, 80% piracy rate is 'doing perfectly fine'?

I am still trying to figure out how you jumped to the conclusion that they are making more money on the play store than the app store. You clearly have no evidence to back this up whatsoever. You also stated that the play store is larger than the app store. By larger I am assuming you mean it grosses more money overall. Please also point me to something proving this.

You write FACT a lot in your posts, but you cant seem to ever back up these FACTS (except with capital letters )

 

[NikolaeVarius]

Uhh...

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1007782

That should probably take 10 minutes, but I tried on two computers and the device wouldn't show up in Device Manager at all. In the end I found some workaround and got it to show up.

IIRC this was May 2011, so I'm pretty sure I tried it on a fresh install of Windows 7 (my NAS) and my standard desktop.

I'm not saying these instructions are hard, but every phone is different. Honestly if you want to say I'm retarded, go ahead. I flash ROMs all the time and I do plenty of testing work with the devs on XDA. Sometimes it's just not that simple. You can find 5 different ways to root an HTC Incredible S for example. I watched my gf do it and she messed up. I took the computer from her like "wow couldn't you read instructions?" (what you're doing to me), and I ran into the same error. I forgot how we resolved it, but once again it wasn't just a 15 minute hack job.

It's a 15 minute hack job after you've established this is the way to go because you can find SEVERAL root methods that differ. Some on AndroidForums, some on XDA, etc.

In my lifetime, I have rooted about 30 + phones. 2 of mine, and many others of friends and coworkers. ranging from locked bootloaders, open bootloaders and everything in between.

I have not spent more than 10 minutes on each rooting them. Never had an issue. Even a device manager issue is fixed in 15 seconds by installing the necessary driver.

You must have the fortune of being the only person in the entire world who has had every single problem ever on Android, no matter how different the issues are and non-interrelated.

 

[psych2]

You must have the fortune of being the only person in the entire world who has had every single problem ever on Android, no matter how different the issues are and non-interrelated.

That must be like the worst superpower ever lol

 

[basslover1]

It was top selling upon release. Android users can't separate from a dollar. That's more believable than a publicity stunt. Look around, Devs aren't making nearly as much on Android.

If we're so cheap (by "we're" I mean Android users), then explain to me why Final Fantasy III is #14 in the Top Paid category...It's $15.99 FYI.

 

[QueBert]

If we're so cheap (by "we're" I mean Android users), then explain to me why Final Fantasy III is #14 in the Top Paid category...It's $15.99 FYI.

There are exceptions, but overall Android owners are notorious for being cheap. How else do you explain a much larger market share yet Android barely accounts for a bit over 10% of app sales? Exceptions shouldn't be used as a rule, they're exceptions for a reason. I spent a bit over $200 in the Android Market, but the typical user wants app's for free, and if the free app has ads damnit they'll use adfree to insure a free app without annoying ad's.

 

[basslover1]

There are exceptions, but overall Android owners are notorious for being cheap. How else do you explain a much larger market share yet Android barely accounts for a bit over 10% of app sales? Exceptions shouldn't be used as a rule, they're exceptions for a reason. I spent a bit over $200 in the Android Market, but the typical user wants app's for free, and if the free app has ads damnit they'll use adfree to insure a free app without annoying ad's.

Hmmm, so that's why half of the top paid games (20 or lower) are 1.99 or more...

Seriously, knock it off with the crap trying to portray Android users as whiney spoiled brats that want shit handed to them for free. 75% of my friends use Android and not a single one of them has an issue paying for apps, and not a single one uses an ad-blocker either.

 

[TuxDave]

Hmmm, so that's why half of the top paid games (20 or lower) are 1.99 or more...

Seriously, knock it off with the crap trying to portray Android users as whiney spoiled brats that want shit handed to them for free. 75% of my friends use Android and not a single one of them has an issue paying for apps, and not a single one uses an ad-blocker either.

Heh, I have the opposite experience, 100% of my coworker friends use Android (I'm the sole Apple user in my work lunch crew) and they take pride in the fact that they spent $0 on apps. I don't think any of them use ad-blockers though.

 

[basslover1]

Heh, I have the opposite experience, 100% of my coworker friends use Android (I'm the sole Apple user in my work lunch crew) and they take pride in the fact that they spent $0 on apps. I don't think any of them use ad-blockers though.

You should specify, there's a difference between not paying anything for apps, and pirating apps.

A good portion of the apps I have are free, but that does not mean I'm unwilling to pay for the good ones, it just means devs don't charge for the ones I use.

 

[AstroManLuca]

You should specify, there's a difference between not paying anything for apps, and pirating apps.

A good portion of the apps I have are free, but that does not mean I'm unwilling to pay for the good ones, it just means devs don't charge for the ones I use.

Yeah, that's basically me as well. I rarely buy apps because there is almost always a free alternative to whatever I want. I don't block in-app ads nor do I pirate apps. If I really, really want an app, I will buy it. But I don't spend money just to spend it. Why would anyone buy apps when they can use LEGIT free versions anyway? Bragging rights?

Usually in my case, I will use the free version of an app for a while, and if I still like it after a long time I'll buy the full version. In some cases I use the free version for a pretty long time. But if it holds up over time I'll buy it.

Am I being a cheapskate? Maybe. But so far Android developers haven't given me any reason not to be one. If they want to keep giving away their apps, I'll keep saving my money.

 

[TuxDave]

You should specify, there's a difference between not paying anything for apps, and pirating apps.

A good portion of the apps I have are free, but that does not mean I'm unwilling to pay for the good ones, it just means devs don't charge for the ones I use.

I go to lunch regularly with about 5 people. 1 pirates apps to high heaven. The other 4 are too lazy/not technically inclined to pirate and they definitely refuse to fork over $1 for any app no matter how good it is. It's a huge mental barrier for them.

 

[AstroManLuca]

I go to lunch regularly with about 5 people. 1 pirates apps to high heaven. The other 4 are too lazy/not technically inclined to pirate and they definitely refuse to fork over $1 for any app no matter how good it is. It's a huge mental barrier for them.

My dad is the same way. He had an iPhone but never once bought an app. I think I am less resistant to buying apps because I've gotten used to buying other digital goods like games on Steam and Xbox Live.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

In my lifetime, I have rooted about 30 + phones. 2 of mine, and many others of friends and coworkers. ranging from locked bootloaders, open bootloaders and everything in between.

I have not spent more than 10 minutes on each rooting them. Never had an issue. Even a device manager issue is fixed in 15 seconds by installing the necessary driver.

You must have the fortune of being the only person in the entire world who has had every single problem ever on Android, no matter how different the issues are and non-interrelated.

Well you may be a rooting expert. You've probably seen every incident and type of rooting that is done.

The fact is every device I've worked with is different. I wouldn't call any of them overly difficult, but it's not impossible to miss a step or what not. I rooted my SGS2 using the popular ChainFire exploit. I looked for my firmware and I found a 2.3.5 and TWO 2.3.4s. From what I read from the thread all I needed was to look at KI4. I rooted using 2.3.5 first and it failed. Then I tried the 2.3.4 and it failed. The third one finally worked. Believe me, when you root and you get stuck at the splash screen it's not the most happy scene.

Furthermore, this was my first time rooting via Odin. I backed up things per the thread, and I did a battery pull, flashed the STOCK firmware and then tried again TWICE before getting it.

Did I learn something? Yeah. But was it as easy as an iPhone jailbreak? No. Honestly if you look at XDA there's plenty of questions. You may have gotten lucky or you're extremely smart, but there's plenty of people who run into problems, and plenty of threads and posts with more explanations.

The other method I see is the Zerg Rush exploit. I have no freaking clue what that is, but as someone who's just received an SGS2, believe me I would want to read through both and then pick one. I have no idea which root method I should be using.

Of course I also hear about one click root. Does it work wiht my phone? I don't know. I need to google that. It takes research.

Meanwhile, whether I have an iPhone 2G, 3G, 3GS, 4, 4S, etc. I can jailbreak it using one app. It doesn't matter whether I jailbroke in 2008 or 2009 or 2010, or 2011. Nothing's changed. Meanwhile I can buy a new Android phone each year and the process will change.

Regarding the Nexus S USB issue, if you comb the root thread, there's a post (or more) explaining possible issues with the USB drivers and has a workaround. That thread alone has 500+ posts. I could've read it more carefully, but once again it takes time.

You can tell that there are many users, even users here who refuse to bother with rooting. It's just too much work. Maybe not for you or me, but I can bet you if it were easier like jailbreaking, we'd have more people jumping ship.

 

[QueBert]

Hmmm, so that's why half of the top paid games (20 or lower) are 1.99 or more...

Seriously, knock it off with the crap trying to portray Android users as whiney spoiled brats that want shit handed to them for free. 75% of my friends use Android and not a single one of them has an issue paying for apps, and not a single one uses an ad-blocker either.

Yet you're ignoring that Android has twice the smart phone market yet accounts for only around 10% of app money where iOS accounts for almost 90%. This would either mean 1. Android owners are cheap or 2. iOS owners spend 9 times as much money. I never said the Android Market doesn't make money. I just said the majority of the people who use it want apps for free. 90/10 proves this im my eyes, now if you can explain the $$$ difference of 90 to 10% I'm all ears.

And saying "top paid blah blah blah $1.99 or more" means nothing, what is that compared to? Compare the top 20 on each platform and unless somehow 10% can come close to equaling what 90% brings in dollar wise for apps. It's not even going to be close.

Would you say the top 20 Web OS apps sold if they were $4.99 each is impressive? how about WP7.5? Probably not...

 

[Zaap]

#1 in Little League is still probably a lot crappier than #200 in MLB. You're still not helping your argument.

You don't even have an argument, just the usual anecdotal nonsense, exaggerations, and trying to counter everything anyone else says with "Nuh uh!" and thinking that floats.

If what you were trying to float was true, then even the smallest "guy-in-his-basement' dev who has some insignificant app show up anywhere in the app store on iOS, would be outselling the largest developers on Android whose apps are constantly top rated/grossing on the Play store. Anyone with half a brain knows this isn't the case.

 

[stormkroe]

In my lifetime, I have rooted about 30 + phones. 2 of mine, and many others of friends and coworkers. ranging from locked bootloaders, open bootloaders and everything in between.

I have not spent more than 10 minutes on each rooting them. Never had an issue. Even a device manager issue is fixed in 15 seconds by installing the necessary driver.

You must have the fortune of being the only person in the entire world who has had every single problem ever on Android, no matter how different the issues are and non-interrelated.

Where are you trying to go with this? There's already enough pissing matches in this thread, so just call him a liar or an idiot. He's got absolutely NO reason to lie about this, and if you've seen his contributions to discussions, I doubt you could call him an idiot. On the other hand, rooting 30+ phones with no problems is a lot harder to believe than having problems doing it on 2. Then again, if you squint real hard, sometimes 7 or 8 looks like 30 something...

 

[TuxDave]

You don't even have an argument, just the usual anecdotal nonsense, exaggerations, and trying to counter everything anyone else says with "Nuh uh!" and thinking that floats.

If what you were trying to float was true, then even the smallest "guy-in-his-basement' dev who has some insignificant app show up anywhere in the app store on iOS, would be outselling the largest developers on Android whose apps are constantly top rated/grossing on the Play store. Anyone with half a brain knows this isn't the case.

I never presented an argument. I'm just pointing out that your "FACTS" are poorly supported. I'm not making a claim that the crappiest app in iOS makes more money than the best app in the Play store. I'm simply saying that you can't use ranking in each store to conclude the gross income across platforms. That was a "FACT" that you quoted.

 

[ponyo]

Currently #171 top free in apps on Google Play. That's 8 pages back in the listing and it's a free game. They give the game away and still can't get people to download and play. I have zero interest in trying this game. Then again I have zero interest in game like Shadowgun. I didn't buy it when it was 40 cents during the Google Play 40 cents sale. Sometimes game or app isn't even worth free. They would have to pay me to install it.

 

[MrX8503]

Apps that are ranked in their respective app stores cannot be directly compared to another app at a different store on their revenue success.

There isn't a measure or fact to back this up. Opinions don't turn into facts because you say "FACT".