Dateline?s To catch a predator, Is it going anywhere.

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Don, are you saying he killed himself because he was caught on TV or because he was caught by the police?

I guess it was just a matter of time before someone decided that suicide was a better choice than jail or public humiliation.
The sting operations are good, putting them on TV is just being explotive.

You would not mind being caught in the "sting operation" but would not like it televised? That sounds confessional.

 

[Aimster]

One of us should try to get on the show wearing "Hey ATOT I made it on T.V" shirt.

Edit: 100% not going to be me

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Perverted Justice carries out the operations in cooperation with local law enforcement whether or not Dateline is doing a show. Dateline shows up for the ratings. PJ does it because it needs to be done.

If you've watched nine episodes (you really don't need to see that many) you'll notice that the reaction is almost always the same... "I'm sorry" "I've never done anything like this before" "I was stupid"

The psychology is ineresting when you take into account their reactions when they get caught and how similar they all are. It's amazing that they almost always have the same initial response. Then you contrast their behavior after being caught with their on-line chats... wow. Wolf in sheep's clothing. It's scary how they can turn it on and off like a switch.

 

[Stoneburner]

Hey don, would this be the same in a common law state? It seems as though this falls into that very vague category of error in the fact in that there was nothing to commit a crime with. To be honest i could never quite grasp the distinction and obviously the laws used are based on specific language allowing the prosecutions but I can't help but thinking the common law was a bit more fair in such matters.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Stoneburner
Hey don, would this be the same in a common law state? It seems as though this falls into that very vague category of error in the fact in that there was nothing to commit a crime with. To be honest i could never quite grasp the distinction and obviously the laws used are based on specific language allowing the prosecutions but I can't help but thinking the common law was a bit more fair in such matters.

All states, other than Louisiana, have systems based on the common law. The concept of inchoate crimes like attempt and conspiracy is a newer one, if memory serves (it's been a long time since I took criminal law), but I believe every state in the United States would consider attempting to arrange a sex act with a child a crime, even if the "child" were nonexistent. Actually under the Model Penal Code, attempt and solicitation are punished the same way as if the offender had completed the offense, since the mens rea is the same.

 

[Darwin333]

Originally posted by: Starbuck1975
I find this show disturbing on a number of levels. It is a sad parade of men who should not be prowling the internet for sexual encounters with minors. However, equally disturbing is the exploitive and I believe vigilante justice nature of the show. There is an entrapment element to the manner in which these men are arrested.

Although the law of the land uses age as the dividing line, age is not an accurate measure of sexual maturity. Go to any mall, and you can see under 18 girls parading around, dressed in age inappropriate and often "seductive" attire. This is acceptable behavior, yet the men who will be inevitably drawn to the forbidden fruit are a threat to society?

Sexual predators are the latest media frenzy, and the topic drives up ratings because our society seems to enjoy passing judgment on other people. My perception is that most of the men caught and paraded on Dateline are not dangerous predators, but rather men who need some serious counseling.

Kind of a double standard that our society celebrates young women and minors as sex symbols (Britney Spears, Lindsay Lohan, Girls Gone Wild etc.), and then condemn the monsters that such a culture creates.

A friend of mine is involved in PJ. The majority of the predators they are after and catch are not guys that simply came across a mature 16 year old who is a year under the age of consent in that particular state.

These are scumbags that intentional seek out 12 and 13 year old children. Their tactics are downright disgusting and manipulative. On the other side, the parents of the children should share in some of the blame as well. In this day and age, internet predators are nothing new and parents have the responsibility to know what their children are doing on the internet.

 

[Starbuck1975]

A friend of mine is involved in PJ. The majority of the predators they are after and catch are not guys that simply came across a mature 16 year old who is a year under the age of consent in that particular state. These are scumbags that intentional seek out 12 and 13 year old children. Their tactics are downright disgusting and manipulative. On the other side, the parents of the children should share in some of the blame as well. In this day and age, internet predators are nothing new and parents have the responsibility to know what their children are doing on the internet.

I did not have your insight into the show, so I take back my assertion that some of the men caught simply fell into temptation. If the majority of the culprits are indeed actively seeking liaisons with minors, then those individuals require help and counseling.

That being said, this still doesn't address the fact that our society continues to accept and celebrate sex symbols at increasingly younger ages. Granted, pedophiles have always existed, but the internet, and entertainment media, has perhaps escalated the problem.

Of course, the threat these individuals pose to society could be mitigated if parents took a more active role in monitoring their children's online activity.

 

[eleison]

Originally posted by: Fmr12B
They did one of these just outside San Francisco in Petaluma. They caught quite a few H1B holders who work in the tech industry. Their nationality = Indian.

Also in the same episode they caught quite a few latinos.

All about where they are placing their targets.

These indians probably didn't even know it was illegal here. With all the older men marrying child brides in India... its probably not a big thing there... which is surprisingly weird considering the divorce rate over there is lower...

Unofficial motto of India: Its it has big boobs.. and there is grass on the field.. play on!!!

j/k

 

[steppinthrax]

Originally posted by: eleison

Originally posted by: Fmr12B
They did one of these just outside San Francisco in Petaluma. They caught quite a few H1B holders who work in the tech industry. Their nationality = Indian.

Also in the same episode they caught quite a few latinos.

All about where they are placing their targets.

These indians probably didn't even know it was illegal here. With all the older men marrying child brides in India... its probably not a big thing there... which is surprisingly weird considering the divorce rate over there is lower...

Unofficial motto of India: Its it has big boobs.. and there is grass on the field.. play on!!!

j/k

Another thing about what you said is the fact that it is looked at so bad due to it's taboo. You just said in India for example it's probably legal or not well prosecuted. I mean you don't often see Dateline to catch a John (male seeking prostitute). Where both persons are over the age limit however considering prostitution is illegal just like seeking a child. I'm sure it won't get much rateing like this one right now.

 

[Darwin333]

Originally posted by: Starbuck1975

I did not have your insight into the show, so I take back my assertion that some of the men caught simply fell into temptation. If the majority of the culprits are indeed actively seeking liaisons with minors, then those individuals require help and counseling.

That being said, this still doesn't address the fact that our society continues to accept and celebrate sex symbols at increasingly younger ages. Granted, pedophiles have always existed, but the internet, and entertainment media, has perhaps escalated the problem.

Of course, the threat these individuals pose to society could be mitigated if parents took a more active role in monitoring their children's online activity.

Agreed, but there is still a profound difference between portraying a legal albeit young woman as a sex symbol (whom for the most part is willingly playing the part) and a predator actively seeking pre-teenage children to manipulate and molest. As an example, seeing Britney Spears dance on stage (back in her prime) does not give a normal person the urge to molest an 11 year old.

I invite you to read this link for PJ. Although it is someone working for PJ pretending to be a 13 year old girl just think about what this guy is saying and trying to do to a real girl. The operator (aka 13 year old girl) is displaying a very depressed and vulnerable state and this 34 year old man tries to take advantage of that and turn her into his ?submissive sex slave?.

http://www.perverted-justice.com/?archive=fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe

People like that are dangers to society and their selves. I say their selves because if I caught some sick bastard like that talking to my daughter I would not waste the tax payers dollars on a trial. With the swamp land around here, his body would never be found.

Here is a small snip of his conversation with a ?13 year old girl?.

fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:47:05 PM): Oh? Do you want to be what I am offering?
sadlilgrrl (1:47:27 PM): would you want me to be? i mean if you wanted me to be i would.
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:47:42 PM): Well, I am looking for a younger girl to train to be a slave.
sadlilgrrl (1:47:56 PM): what would i do?
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:48:14 PM): Well, if I did this, considering how illegal it is... I may not. (He knows it's illegal.)
sadlilgrrl (1:48:28 PM): you may not what?
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:48:30 PM): First you would come to the place I keep for writing...
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:48:57 PM): Is this something you want?
sadlilgrrl (1:49:01 PM): youre a writer?
sadlilgrrl (1:49:05 PM): thats really cool
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:49:17 PM): Yes, I am. I tend to write longhand.
sadlilgrrl (1:49:32 PM): thats pretty. im not very good at it because i mostly print.
sadlilgrrl (1:50:07 PM): but i would come to where you write.
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:50:12 PM): Oh? NP... But, if I did this, it would have to be done in secret & you would have to be totally submissive.
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:50:14 PM): Yes, you would.
sadlilgrrl (1:50:37 PM): as long as you keep me safe ill do whatever you say. (All she wants is to be safe for once in her life.)
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:50:42 PM): Good...
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:50:48 PM): Now, are you sure you want to do this?
sadlilgrrl (1:51:01 PM): yes
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:51:13 PM): 100%?
sadlilgrrl (1:51:32 PM): if youll keep me safe, yes
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:51:33 PM): Knowing that you cannot change your mind, if you do. (He gives her no chance to change her mind.)
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:51:35 PM): I will. (He's holding this out like a prize. He'll keep her safe.)
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:52:07 PM): But, let me ask you why you want to do this.
sadlilgrrl (1:52:44 PM): you said youd keep me safe. and youd love me if i was good. and you're the only one whose ever even taken the time to talk to me (She's lonely, depressed, and desperate for love. He follows this with, of course . . .)
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:52:57 PM): Oh? Even knowing it will be a sexual use of you?
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:53:03 PM): Knowing that I may spank you?
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:53:20 PM): Knowing that if you are bad, I may punish you? (What sort of sick man responds to a child this way?)

 

[Craig234]

I think that Pedophilia is a tragic condition affecting these men, and we should take a humane approach as a society by educating people to want to help them deal with the problem, not simply hate them as criminals for having that sexual orientation. That means doing research on treatment and making it available.

Having said that, we need first and foremost to protect children from the people who have it. I'm not going to get into the debate here about the gray areas of where sexuality hurts children, the history of mankind in younger marriages being the norm - that's a seperate issue, and there is some point where it's harmful.

I'm not going to condemn the show now for profiteering from the situation; as things stand, there is benefit to catching these people. But I think the more important thing is to do more to get help for them that's a win-win, helping the people who tragically have the condition of pedophilia and protecting society from them.

It reminds me a bit about the tragedy of when homosexuality had an even larger stigma to it - the difference being homosexuality doesn't have victims.

 

[eleison]

Originally posted by: Craig234
I think that Pedophilia is a tragic condition affecting these men, and we should take a humane approach as a society by educating people to want to help them deal with the problem, not simply hate them as criminals for having that sexual orientation.

It reminds me a bit about the tragedy of when homosexuality had an even larger stigma to it - the difference being homosexuality doesn't have victims.

I agree with this statement. It seem seems that Pedophilia affects a wide range of people with diverse background. Its almost like alcoholism. Not all people affected with alchoholism are "bad people".. Im' sure not all Pedhophilia's are "bad people".. get them help before they hurt other people..

 

[spittledip]

Again, you have to remember that all these men are not pedophiles. Also, they have a choice whether or not they choose to go after a child. Most pedophiles were also sexually abused as children. Unfortunate they choose to continue the trend having gone through it themselves.

 

[thraashman]

Originally posted by: Aimster
One of us should try to get on the show wearing "Hey ATOT I made it on T.V" shirt.

Edit: 100% not going to be me

I was thinking similar idea, but walk in with a poster board. And if you f-up and it's actually NOT Dateline's show but an actual house .... well I guess be the good person and wait around in your car for the girl's parents and let them know what woulda happened if you weren't just some jackass trying to get on tv.

 

[amicold]

Personally, I wouldn't be surprised if someone ended up assuming it was a Dateline sting, and going to the home armed, and ends up taking out Stone Phillips.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: DonVito
I happened to watch it last night, and they did a sting operation on a man who turned out to be an Assistant DA - he committed suicide when confronted by the police (though it is not clear he knew the sting involved the TV show). The show is clearly exploitative, and although I think it arguably provides at least SOME socially redeeming value, there's no question it most exists to humiliate the people involved.

I have no sympathy for the men who are caught...
After all duh...lets put 1 + 1 together....
drive to a home that is not yours...where a young girl is the only one present and mommy and daddy are out working.....
hehehe.....in somebodys mind the words-- Holy Crap Dateline should register......

 

[Zorba]

Originally posted by: Darwin333
Here is a small snip of his conversation with a ?13 year old girl?.

fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:47:05 PM): Oh? Do you want to be what I am offering?
sadlilgrrl (1:47:27 PM): would you want me to be? i mean if you wanted me to be i would.
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:47:42 PM): Well, I am looking for a younger girl to train to be a slave.
sadlilgrrl (1:47:56 PM): what would i do?
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:48:14 PM): Well, if I did this, considering how illegal it is... I may not. (He knows it's illegal.)
sadlilgrrl (1:48:28 PM): you may not what?
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:48:30 PM): First you would come to the place I keep for writing...
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:48:57 PM): Is this something you want?
sadlilgrrl (1:49:01 PM): youre a writer?
sadlilgrrl (1:49:05 PM): thats really cool
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:49:17 PM): Yes, I am. I tend to write longhand.
sadlilgrrl (1:49:32 PM): thats pretty. im not very good at it because i mostly print.
sadlilgrrl (1:50:07 PM): but i would come to where you write.
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:50:12 PM): Oh? NP... But, if I did this, it would have to be done in secret & you would have to be totally submissive.
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:50:14 PM): Yes, you would.
sadlilgrrl (1:50:37 PM): as long as you keep me safe ill do whatever you say. (All she wants is to be safe for once in her life.)
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:50:42 PM): Good...
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:50:48 PM): Now, are you sure you want to do this?
sadlilgrrl (1:51:01 PM): yes
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:51:13 PM): 100%?
sadlilgrrl (1:51:32 PM): if youll keep me safe, yes
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:51:33 PM): Knowing that you cannot change your mind, if you do. (He gives her no chance to change her mind.)
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:51:35 PM): I will. (He's holding this out like a prize. He'll keep her safe.)
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:52:07 PM): But, let me ask you why you want to do this.
sadlilgrrl (1:52:44 PM): you said youd keep me safe. and youd love me if i was good. and you're the only one whose ever even taken the time to talk to me (She's lonely, depressed, and desperate for love. He follows this with, of course . . .)
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:52:57 PM): Oh? Even knowing it will be a sexual use of you?
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:53:03 PM): Knowing that I may spank you?
fleet_captain_jaime_wolfe (1:53:20 PM): Knowing that if you are bad, I may punish you? (What sort of sick man responds to a child this way?)

Some guy actually fell for that? The girl sounds nothing like a 13 year-old! I know because I can remember talking online when I was that age and from being around friend's sisters.

BTW: I agree the guys are really sick, but I think the show is also sick. I hate how the media loves profiting off people's pain.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda

Originally posted by: DonVito
I happened to watch it last night, and they did a sting operation on a man who turned out to be an Assistant DA - he committed suicide when confronted by the police (though it is not clear he knew the sting involved the TV show). The show is clearly exploitative, and although I think it arguably provides at least SOME socially redeeming value, there's no question it most exists to humiliate the people involved.

I have no sympathy for the men who are caught...
After all duh...lets put 1 + 1 together....
drive to a home that is not yours...where a young girl is the only one present and mommy and daddy are out working.....
hehehe.....in somebodys mind the words-- Holy Crap Dateline should register......

No offense but I'm quite sure I have a lot more experience with these kinds of people than you. Actually I have sent a man to prison for life for child molestation. I just don't think there's a lot of redeeming value in a show that exists solely to revel in the pain of these men.

 

[judasmachine]

ratings bro. they don't care much one way or the other whether they put a dent in anything, as long as you keep watching man.

 

[daveymark]

Originally posted by: judasmachine
ratings bro. they don't care much one way or the other whether they put a dent in anything, as long as you keep watching man.

and keep watching I will. I wonder what the political affiliation of these scumbags are?

 

[spittledip]

Originally posted by: daveymark
and keep watching I will. I wonder what the political affiliation of these scumbags are?

who cares? not important

 

[ScottFern]

Anyone else watching tonight?!

 

[Wheezer]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda

Originally posted by: DonVito
I happened to watch it last night, and they did a sting operation on a man who turned out to be an Assistant DA - he committed suicide when confronted by the police (though it is not clear he knew the sting involved the TV show). The show is clearly exploitative, and although I think it arguably provides at least SOME socially redeeming value, there's no question it most exists to humiliate the people involved.

I have no sympathy for the men who are caught...
After all duh...lets put 1 + 1 together....
drive to a home that is not yours...where a young girl is the only one present and mommy and daddy are out working.....
hehehe.....in somebodys mind the words-- Holy Crap Dateline should register......

No offense but I'm quite sure I have a lot more experience with these kinds of people than you. Actually I have sent a man to prison for life for child molestation. I just don't think there's a lot of redeeming value in a show that exists solely to revel in the pain of these men.

so what if it exploits their pain? They are grown men who make conscious choices.

These are not impulse actions like when you are in line at the grocery store and suddenly decide to grab a Coke out of the cooler by register.

Some of these men drive HUNDREDS of miles to get to their prize. That is plenty of time to realize that maybe, just maybe it isn't a good idea. The fact is they are not thinking with their heads, they are thinking with their d*cks and because of that conscious poor decision they deserve everything they get.

Everyone of those sob's says "I'm sorry" they are not sorry for going there, they are not sorry for looking forward to sex with a minor, they are not sorry for the language they use in chat rooms, they are sorry for getting caught period. fvck 'em.

 

[ericlp]

I think this show is a JOKE.... 85% of of the men watching are wanting to see more of the 15 year old in her bathing suit switching on the jacuzzi.

I don't know what to make of it. I guess they sure arn't doing anyone any favors. I don't see the hard core thugs getting caught. I guess things will get real interesting when they invite the wrong dude. Then when John whatever his name is ... The dateline host walks out to ask him questions he is gonna rip out his side arm and blow him away. That ought to get the ratings up...

These are just idiots they are getting off the street. They are just stupid. Most of them have no clue what they are getting into. Just a bunch of sex addicts I guess. They want to do the nation a favor? Go after pimps and ICE dealers. Then I'd say they are doing something good.... Locking up idiot / retarded sex addicts that come with the entire list of items to bring down the beer and condoms .... haha sigh. Get real... These dudes need to get a life and therapy not go to jail...

 

[Wheezer]

Originally posted by: ericlp
I think this show is a JOKE.... 85% of of the men watching are wanting to see more of the 15 year old in her bathing suit switching on the jacuzzi.

I don't know what to make of it. I guess they sure arn't doing anyone any favors. I don't see the hard core thugs getting caught. I guess things will get real interesting when they invite the wrong dude. Then when John whatever his name is ... The dateline host walks out to ask him questions he is gonna rip out his side arm and blow him away. That ought to get the ratings up...

These are just idiots they are getting off the street. They are just stupid. Most of them have no clue what they are getting into. Just a bunch of sex addicts I guess. They want to do the nation a favor? Go after pimps and ICE dealers. Then I'd say they are doing something good.... Locking up idiot / retarded sex addicts that come with the entire list of items to bring down the beer and condoms .... haha sigh. Get real... These dudes need to get a life and therapy not go to jail...

It's one thing to be a sex addict.

It is another to be addicted to sex with a young girl who is 13

Before you assume that this was a one time deal with these guys, how do you know?

Obviously they know where to find these kids in the chat rooms, they know how to talk to them, they are on the prowl for some kid who will volunteer themselves for the sexual gratification that only a child can bring them.

I am sure many guys on this board will self proclaim that they are "sex addicts" but if you ask how many would sleep with a 13 year old, I bet 100% of those so called sex addicts would say "no way"...why do you suppose that is?

Why not search out a parent whose child has been molested by a man 3x her age and tell them that in your opinion, he is not as bad as some drug dealer.