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Cryptocoin Mining?

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thilanliyan said:
Anyone have idea of what could be happening? Clocks and cgminer settings are the same as the other cards but the mining speed stays at ~640kh/s. I even changed the card to a different slot and get the same results. The power limit is also the same on all cards, 30%.
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Before isolating the issue, I would recommend running a GPU benchmark and comparing the scores. If you find a discrepancy in the scores, then you should be able to RMA the card. If it's just mining related then your problem lies elsewhere.
 
thilanliyan said:
Anyone have idea of what could be happening? Clocks and cgminer settings are the same as the other cards but the mining speed stays at ~640kh/s. I even changed the card to a different slot and get the same results. The power limit is also the same on all cards, 30%.
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Did you try unplugging all cards except the suspected one?
 
thilanliyan said:
Anyone have idea of what could be happening? Clocks and cgminer settings are the same as the other cards but the mining speed stays at ~640kh/s. I even changed the card to a different slot and get the same results. The power limit is also the same on all cards, 30%.
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If my memory clocks revert to stock 5040 mhz, (or any other funky number) thats about my hash rate.

But if I adjust them to 5000 I get about 820 kh/s, and 6000 879 kh/s
 
This thread must be one of the most viewed threads in the whole forums. I haven't paid much attention but at around a million views it's a popular topic. I still wish there was a dedicated sub-forum.


Are there any keccak coins worth mining?
 
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With these prices efficiency will be king, or you need to be sucking free power.

I think we killed off anyone paying .30c kwh from bing profitable with gpu mining and this could quickly dip down to .15-20c kwh at the rate of revenue destruction from gpu mining over the past month.

Hope scrypt N takes off. I'm seeing massive shifts of hash power across pools and I think this is large asic farms being used before being released to public.
 
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frowertr said:
Anyone else thinking about getting the KnC Titan? The beast sounds great but who knows when it will arrive. Also, sounds a bit crazy to send $10K worth of BTC to a company in "hopes" they will come through as promised. I know that KnC has a good rep, but damn if that doesn't send alarm bells up in my head.
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If you could get the KnC Titan now, it would almost certainly be a great deal. At this time, 1 MH/sec of Scrypt mining is worth about 0.006 BTC/day on the multipools. The Titan is supposed to do 100 MH/sec (or more), so that's 0.6 BTC/day, or about $360 at current prices. (BTC just dropped under $600 again... not sure what's up with that.) That means it would pay for itself in almost exactly one month, with everything after that being pure profit.

Of course, you can't get it now - you have to wait for it to be finished and released in Q2/Q3. KnC has a far better track record than most other Bitcoin ASIC companies - for the most part, they have delivered approximately what was promised, without being too absurdly late. (Many other ASIC companies are borderline, if not outright, scams.) But this increases the risk substantially. In addition to betting that KnC will deliver, you're also betting that the Scrypt coin market won't collapse in the next couple of months, that no alternative source of mass hashing power will come online before delivery to spike difficulty, and that the number of competing Titans won't be so high that it crashes the market. A small difficulty spike wouldn't really matter - if difficulty doubles or even quadruples between now and then, that pushes out the RoI to 60-120 days, still bearable. But if another ASIC beats it to market, that could cause trouble. (I'm not counting Gridseeds - they're not really competitive with AMD GPUs at this point.)

Incidentally, the Wall Street Journal reports that KnC sold 200 pre-orders in just the first four hours. That means there will be 20+ GH/sec added to the network when these machines come online. Litecoin has a network hashrate of about 150 GH/sec right now; for Dogecoin, it's roughly 70 GH/sec. And this is just for the first four hours of orders. Video card profitability for Scrypt has already taken a beating, and this may drive them out completely. I think I'm going to cancel my plans to build a mining rig, unless another ASIC-proof altcoin starts to take off.
 
GPU based scrypt mining rigs are headed the way of the Dodo. I would doubt that it will be profitably anymore to use them for scrypt based coins by the end of this year. I expect the GPU community will switch to another algo, but I don't think we will see the explosion in profits from any new algo like we did with scrypt.

I'm beginning to switch my farm over to mining LTC only. If we use history as a guide, BTC jumped up in price once ASICs hit the market in full force. I'm hopeful that this will also happen to LTC.

As far as the Titan is concerned, I was going to purchase one, however I just can't bring myself to send $10K worth of BTC to a company for a pre-order based on a website ad. It just makes my bull$shit alarm go crazy. If you read their T&C, they don't have to EVER give you your BTC/money back if you request it. So they can essentially not deliver, deliver late, go out of business, deliver the Titan in different configurations than originally listed, etc... and you are screwed unless you decide to take them to civil court in Sweden and win a judgement against them. Good luck with that!

When did this crowdfunding crap become popular and why do the masses continue to fund into it? I wish I could find suckers to give me money and I not have to promise them anything.
 
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frowertr said:
I'm beginning to switch my farm over to mining LTC only. If we use history as a guide, BTC jumped up in price once ASICs hit the market in full force. I'm hopeful that this will also happen to LTC.
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I've considered this but disagree on the outcome. I think the available profits will go to an alternative of BTC which LTC once was but can't really remain with asics in the picture. Basically LTC can't be the alternative to BTC if LTC gets taken over by powerful asic's, so rather than LTC spiking in price with Asic's, I think it will crash very hard to sub 10 or even sub 5 along a jump in difficulty.

IMO I think alternative profits to BTC will still be available after ASICs hit for scrpyt, but it will go to a coin besides LTC. I think LTC loses it's appeal and value once asics take over it's network hash.

Decentralization is important if not primary for any alt to BTC. Expensive asic's destroy a lot of value of what crypto tries to achieve and what LTC was most notable for. Anyways, scrypt asics look like a trap to me, especially expensive pre orders.

I'm looking to scrypt N and Vertcoin at the moment. Scrypt N achieves today what LTC did yesterday and what LTC has failed to do today.
 
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Attic said:
I've considered this but disagree on the outcome. I think the available profits will go to an alternative of BTC which LTC once was but can't really remain with asics in the picture. Basically LTC can't be the alternative to BTC if LTC gets taken over by powerful asic's, so rather than LTC spiking in price with Asic's, I think it will crash very hard to sub 10 or even sub 5 along a jump in difficulty.
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I don't quite follow. If LTC starts rising heavily, either price would have to rise as well or it wouldn't even be worth bothering investing in LTC ASICs.
 
Attic said:
I've considered this but disagree on the outcome. I think the available profits will go to an alternative of BTC which LTC once was but can't really remain with asics in the picture. Basically LTC can't be the alternative to BTC if LTC gets taken over by powerful asic's, so rather than LTC spiking in price with Asic's, I think it will crash very hard to sub 10 or even sub 5 along a jump in difficulty.

IMO I think alternative profits to BTC will still be available after ASICs hit for scrpyt, but it will go to a coin besides LTC. I think LTC loses it's appeal and value once asics take over it's network hash.

Decentralization is important if not primary for any alt to BTC. Expensive asic's destroy a lot of value of what crypto tries to achieve and what LTC was most notable for. Anyways, scrypt asics look like a trap to me, especially expensive pre orders.
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I fully agree, well put
 
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Mods, how is this thread still open 🙄?

Please route these types of questions to moderator discussions instead of derailing the thread here. Calling out the moderators is not permitted either.

-Moderator Rvenger
 
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Lisathedinosaur said:
Mods, how is this thread still open 🙄?
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Please take such questions to the moderator forums, this contributes nothing to the discussion at hand and is off-topic.

As for the future of LTC after scrypt ASICs come out, maybe they will repeat what happened to BTC and increase in value.

But I just have a feeling that there is an established desire for GPU-based miners to do something with their rigs. So if using GPUs for mining scrypt coins becomes obsolete, then I bet something will come in to take over, so that miners have something to do with their video cards. At least, there would seem to be a built-in market for lots of people eager to use their GPUs for mining, so you can't help but create a vacuum of demand for a new coin to fill that void and give GPU miners something to mine and speculate over.
 
frowertr said:
I don't follow Attic's logic. But I guess we will know by the end of the year who had it pegged and who didn't...
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I'll be happy either way. I already made my profit in hardware and would be tickled to make a bundle on the LTC I have stashed away.

It's all going to go into that black hole of finances known as grad school anyways 😉
 
njdevilsfan87 said:
I don't quite follow. If LTC starts rising heavily, either price would have to rise as well or it wouldn't even be worth bothering investing in LTC ASICs.
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I mean to argue that I beleive LTC gets the majority of it's value by being an alt to BTC. It has to remain meaningfully different from BTC to keep it's value. ASIC's basically destroy what seperated LTC from BTC and without that distinction (GPU vs ASIC's or decentralized vs cerntralized) I think LTC loses it's place as an alt coin to BTC. ASIC's centralize hashing power, the alt coins that I think will win out will effectively avoid the cancer of centralized hashing (ASIC farms run by deep pockets that overtake networks). If LTC succombs to ASICS's my theory is that LTC loses it's battle and so it will lose it's value. One of the biggest benefits of scrypt was being ASIC resistant, losing that benefit IMO doesn't bode well for scrypt coin values.

Scrypt ASIC's basically blur further the difference between BTC and LTC and *if* LTC gets it's value by being distinct in a meaningful way from BTC then there is less value for LTC once ASIC's close the gap between the two coins.

To go along with that I think that alt coins are searching for a way to effectively solve an issue of decentralization. ASIC's destroy, IMO, decentralization because they give massive hash power to those with large amounts of capital. So if Scrypt asic's take off, it will leave an area for another dominant alt coin to seperate itself from BTC as LTC once did but no longer will if it gets overrun by scrypt asic.

FWIW I have a cunning ability to believe strongly in something that is often the exact opposite of the manner in which things play out, so there is that.
 
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Attic said:
I mean to argue that I beleive LTC gets the majority of it's value by being an alt to BTC. It has to remain meaningfully different from BTC to keep it's value. ASIC's basically destroy what seperated LTC from BTC and without that distinction (GPU vs ASIC's or decentralized vs cerntralized) I think LTC loses it's place as an alt coin to BTC. ASIC's centralize hashing power, the alt coins that I think will win out will effectively avoid the cancer of centralized hashing (ASIC farms run by deep pockets that overtake networks). If LTC succombs to ASICS's my theory is that LTC loses it's battle and so it will lose it's value. One of the biggest benefits of scrypt was being ASIC resistant, losing that benefit IMO doesn't bode well for scrypt coin values.

Scrypt ASIC's basically blur further the difference between BTC and LTC and *if* LTC gets it's value by being distinct in a meaningful way from BTC then there is less value for LTC once ASIC's close the gap between the two coins.

To go along with that I think that alt coins are searching for a way to effectively solve an issue of decentralization. ASIC's destroy, IMO, decentralization because they give massive hash power to those with large amounts of capital. So if Scrypt asic's take off, it will leave an area for another dominant alt coin to seperate itself from BTC as LTC once did but no longer will if it gets overrun by scrypt asic.

FWIW I have a cunning ability to believe strongly in something that is often the exact opposite of the manner in which things play out, so there is that.
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This is a good hypothesis and probably has some truth to it. However, in the end, all mineable crypto-currencies are subject to centralization.

1) ASIC-friendly algorithms: Obvious.
2) GPU-friendly algorithms: There are folks out there with hundreds or thousands of GPUs in datacenters. GPU-friendly algorithms are probably the closest to coming close to the original Bitcoin ideal of "one computer, one miner" but still there is considerable centralization of power.
3) CPU-friendly algorithms: Already largely controlled by large botnets and Amazon AWS server farms or other cloud computing services. This is just as centralizaed as the ASIC algorithms.

This problem is why Dan Larimer (the BitShares/ProtoShares guy) decided to go full-on Proof-of-Stake, with no mining, and a "fair" distribution via a convoluted IPO. This is why the Counterparty guys decided on a "fair" distribution via Proof-of-Burn. This is why the NXT and MasterCoin guys decided on a "fair" distribution via IPO, and Ethereum will do the same thing. Who knows what Ripple does/did, they gave some Ripple to investors and some to a distributed scientific computing project "computingforgood.org" that pays contributors in Ripple.

So pretty much ALL of the "Crypto-Currency 2.0" developments have decided on some form of Proof-of-Stake, with no real place for mining. In order to centralize power in those coins, one would have to centralize ownership of a large percentage of those coins, which is something that they have apparently managed to avoid so far (although it is not inconceivable; however, the person trying to own large portions of the coin for devious purposes would, when found out, ruin the value of the coin to other people, and their presumably sizable investment would be lost as people abandoned a vulnerable currency).

In the end, the mining arms-race is simply wasteful. The security of Bitcoin is not in the difficulty, it is in the blockchain and the number of independent mining nodes connected.
 
If ASICs do take over Scrypt mining later this year, I think it will basically put an end to all the Scrypt coins except LTC and DOGE. These are the only ones that have a substantial enough user base. Everything else will be dumped to oblivion via multipools and never have a chance to get off the ground. We're already seeing this start to happen due to the increasing use of multipools, and the advent of powerful ASICs will complete the process.

It's hard to say what it will mean for pricing. On the one hand, LTC and DOGE will become a lot harder for the average user to get, as a result of increasing difficulty. On the other hand, a lot of the ASIC miners are going to want to dump their LTC/DOGE for cash (or at least BTC) immediately. This could result in the price actually dropping, not rising. And don't forget that a lot of people like LTC and DOGE specifically because they are more decentralized and egalitarian than BTC currently is. If you can no longer get into the Scrypt game without $10K of specialized hardware, parts of the community might decide to move on to something else instead, thus depressing demand for the Scrypt coins.

Many of the GPU miners will want to move on to altcoins that use a different algorithm, one that still hasn't been updated for ASIC. Vertcoin, Maxcoin, and Tenfivecoin might see a boost as a result of this. We'll probably see a whole bunch of new knockoff Scrypt-N (or Scrypt-Jane) coins, and then multipools. The question is whether anyone is going to buy. As things currently stand, most of the altcoins are only of interest to miners and day traders. From what I can tell, only BTC, LTC, and DOGE are ever actually used as a medium of exchange. There may be some exceptions, but not many.
 
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