Creative Nomad Jukebox Zen NX or IPOD?

[addragyn]

Another thing to keep in mind the iPod plays AAC & Audible files. And will support the iTumes Music Store when it comes to Windows later this year.

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I don't know why so many people complain about the Zen's weight and size. Yes, compared to the Ipod it's definately bigger and heavier.. but it's nothing to complain about.

For the same reason cell phones keep getting smaller.


I'm willing to bet the Zen NX has much better sound quality.

I'm willing to bet you'll be listening to compressed music through mediocore headphones on an iPod or Zen. Anyways your analys is useless you have some way to compare the *decoder* used in each player and the quality it provides to the amp - way before any SNR comes into play. It's smart marketing on Creative's part. Who choose a Discman or Walkman based on some paper SNR specs? It simply isn't a factor. This is not HiFi it's portable audio.


By the way...I came across this third-party program that lets you use the Nomad Zen as a normal hard drive...a gripe many people have had with the file transfer.

You know what program Zen needs to mount under Windows for me to consider it a "normal hard drive"? Explorer. It's that simple. I plug the iPod in and it mounts as a drive - this is very useful. I got the best MP3 on the market and a portable HD for the price of one. And if your machine can boot off FireWire you can carry your system around with you on the iPod. Like these super geeks - booting a genomics cluster off an iPod.


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20GB 2nd Gen iPod for $299

Go to the Apple Store and click on Special Deals in the bottom left.

 

[lordkev]

Here's a review of the older Nomad Zen(not the NX):
http://gear.ign.com/articles/383/383119p1.html

What really helps the Zen, and atones for the somewhat annoying control, is the sound quality. Creative has always done right in terms of straight sound and the Zen is no exception. This is probably my biggest beef with the iPod -- it's not loud enough to maintain clear audio throughout its volume range -- and I'd pick a slightly larger portable that sounded superior every day. The headphone amp is extremely powerful and, thanks to a 98dB S/N ratio, the sound stays clean even when the player is running at peak levels.

-tphreak

 

[BaboonGuy]

there's a new iriver hd player coming out that is by far the coolest thing i have ever seen. it's in asia right now, coming to the states soon.

 

[addragyn]

That's volume, not SQ. I have had no issues with iPod volume. I know in the EU portable players are volume limited by law. That same paragraph concludes.

With decent headphones the Zen sounds as good as any portable on the market.

"As good as" not better or worse. As good as. No mention of whether the same phones were used on both players.

You know you could just as easliy pick out a bunch of Zen critical quotes from that review. Some of which I would consider to be big flaws.

When I first unpacked my Zen I installed Creative's army of software. This is perhaps the only frustrating characteristic of the company. They're on solid ground with hardware, but their software is typically bloated and awkward. ... After an afternoon with PlayCenter 3, I moved over to Notmad Explorer for music management. If you haven't used Notmad, then purchase it at once. It will make your Nomad experience much more enjoyable, not to mention faster and better looking.

These buttons are set very low and take a bit of getting used to. I am used to the NJB 3 and iPod, both of which are a little easier to navigate quickly, especially the iPod.

While looking through the Creative specs I learned that, for some reason, they installed only a 16MB cache in the Zen. Both the NJB3 and the iPod have 32MB buffers, and 16MB doesn't seem very "this-gen."

I don't know if it's because of the small buffer, but the Zen is also slow to react to track control. For instance, moving from track to track can take more than a second, even if both tracks are in the current playlist. Further, rapid commands to move to previous or next tracks play hell with the thing.

Creative bundles their own neckphones with the Zen. Throw them out and get decent cans immediately.

However, if you were hoping for something as dainty as the iPod you're going to be disappointed. Take a look at the pictures of the two players back to back and you'll see that the Zen is a good deal bigger. It's also a good deal heavier.

Again, the Zen didn't exactly knock my socks off. It's a very good player that blends portability and a rich feature set. I think that it's better to look at it on its own merits rather than comparing it directly to the iPod or NJB3.

USB 2.0 is also a hair faster than FireWire.

Wrong. USB 2.0 is faster on paper only.

The review concludes "Highly recommended." if you actually read it is seems to be saying it's ok. Again I stand by that the Zen is a good value and the iPod is the absolute best.

 

[addragyn]

About the iPod volume

The 3rd gen iPod has a more powerful headphone amp than predecessors. It's now 60mW RMS. FYI - I've never had a problem with volume on my 2nd gen iPod.

 

[RightHere]

Originally posted by: addragyn
Wrong. USB 2.0 is faster on paper only.

Nothing but lies. I already proved you wrong on this.

 

[Nebor]

I wouldn't buy an Apple computer, I won't buy a mac MP3 player... Simple as that, Apple isn't getting my money... Until they can prove to me they've actually produced 'the worlds fastest personal computer', anyways.

 

[RightHere]

Is the Zen NX available anywhere yet? I can only find it listed at techdepot, but they are OOS.

 

[Remedy]

Originally posted by: Nebor
I wouldn't buy an Apple computer, I won't buy a mac MP3 player... Simple as that, Apple isn't getting my money... Until they can prove to me they've actually produced 'the worlds fastest personal computer', anyways.

? What does the Apple G5 or any Apple computer have to with their World renowned Jukebox MP3 player? To not like their computers is one topic. To not like their Mp3 player and practically the best on the market because you don't like their Desktop computer is just zealotry or idiocy....

Anyway. No the player isn't out but available for preorder from most places for around $250. I tried to order it from creative direct when it was announced in July. I'd be more ap to wait for the review from IGN.com first though. The NX looks like a winner for 299. RCA also has a Lyra Jukebox seen here. And also the Riot I'm going to try ever last one of them out to base my own judgement.

 

[Centura]

Just to add my comments. I travel ALOT on very long flights. Infact neither of these players batts will last even half the flight but anyway. I have a ZEN and would not travel without it anymore. Some of the reasons I chose the Zen.

Uses a regular lappy drive. If I want to upgrade to a 60 gig drive NP.. just pop a new one in and the bios says "humm new drive.. Ok formating for use..." No messing around with hacks to upgrade.

MUST GET software for Zen ----> Notmad

Now the reason I wanted the larger size was not really for a million songs, even though I have a large collection, but most of my music is ripped for Ubernet and is a higher bitrate taking up more space.

I tried to IPOD and was very Impressed with the package and player but think the Zen is a better price to product. Also tried te RIO, don't even ask, in its defence though the interface was rock.

However I don't really see any reason to upgrade to the NX yet. (would get that if I was buying one now). From what i can see. Lighter (always good), Screen backlight went from blue to green (WTF here not sure what they were thinking), removable batts (would like to know if this is a entailed process screws etc or you can just pop a new set in. Would adress my above issue)

Not saying either is a bad product just what I would get and why.

 

[Zucarita9000]

iPod. Much lighter and smaller than the Zen.

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: Centura
Just to add my comments. I travel ALOT on very long flights. Infact neither of these players batts will last even half the flight but anyway. I have a ZEN and would not travel without it anymore. Some of the reasons I chose the Zen.

So how long do the batteries on the Zen last?

Uses a regular lappy drive. If I want to upgrade to a 60 gig drive NP.. just pop a new one in and the bios says "humm new drive.. Ok formating for use..." No messing around with hacks to upgrade.

Your joking right? So to increase the size of the HD in it, i could just take it apart and put any Laptop HD in it? Cool.

I tried to IPOD and was very Impressed with the package and player but think the Zen is a better price to product. Also tried te RIO, don't even ask, in its defence though the interface was rock.

I think that iPod`s, while great products, are vastly overpriced for what they offer.
What do you mean by the interfaces on the Rio`s? Do you like the interfaces? or hate them?
I have, at the moment a Rio600 32mb (i know, small), and am heavily considering using my entire next pay check on a new MP3 player. I would like a HD baced one for two reasons, more songs, and while i`ll probably use no more than gig of space on it, i can use the rest of the space as a place to store backups. Which`ll be handy. But i cant decide wether to get a Zen NX, cos i only have USB1 at the moment, and i can use the firewire on my Audigy for high speed transfers with it, or not bother with a HD player, and get a 256mb MuVo.

 

[addragyn]

Originally posted by: RightHere

Originally posted by: addragyn
Wrong. USB 2.0 is faster on paper only.

Nothing but lies. I already proved you wrong on this.

Really? Where?

Because to the rest of the world that cares about this kind of crap finds this to be true in academic analysis and in specific real world tests. Sometimes it's close but FireWire is the clear winner. And with background knowledge it's perfectly understandable why.

Despite the speed advantage USB 2.0 offers over the old v1.1 standard, FireWire remains the performance king of plug-and-play connections. techtv.com

On our tests, we were surprised that external hard drives took 14 percent longer using USB 2.0 as opposed to FireWire, though USB 2.0 is rated as 80 Mbps faster. This speed difference was evidently related to FireWire's protocol efficiencies for large sequential transfers, as well as better-honed drivers, which have been around much longer than USB 2.0 drivers.
pcmag.com

Mr Raymond Foo, Fujitsu PC Asia-Pacific's associate director for marketing...
"Although USB 2.0 is supposed to be slightly faster than FireWire, the opposite is usually true in actual technical testing. This is because some of the throughput in USB 2.0 cannot be used," said Mr Foo.
asiaone.com

My mama said never trust a Foo!
<End hijack!>

This is not the subject of this thread. So I'll leave it at that.

 

[Erasmus-X]

Now if Apple releases IPOD2, that would be different.

iPod is already on its third generation. I have the 10 GB model. They made it thinner and with touch-sensitive controls rather than mechanical buttons, and added red backlighting to the front controls. It is also compatible with USB 2.0 if you buy the optional dongle.

I've actually owned a Zen USB 2.0 20 GB in the past and I while it was a decent player, it ended up being the second Creative MP3 player that has crapped out on me for the exact same reason (headphone jack). Plus, it had some flaws that aren't present with my new iPod:

1) Confusing software; the installation is way more complicated than any MP3 player should be.
2) You can't just plug a Zen into any PC and use it as an external USB hard disk; you have to install all the proprietary Creative software first.
3) The Zen is incompatible with Macintosh. That became an obvious annoyance when I bought a PowerBook G4.

In fact, the only thing that the Zen really had going for it that my iPod doesn't offer are the EAX listening modes. Those are really neat. My Zen also had slightly better battery life. Other than that, the iPod is a better overall package. The interface is far more intuitive than that of the Zen's.

 

[RightHere]

Originally posted by: addragyn

Originally posted by: RightHere

Originally posted by: addragyn
Wrong. USB 2.0 is faster on paper only.

Nothing but lies. I already proved you wrong on this.

Really? Where?

Here

Because to the rest of the world that cares about this kind of crap finds this to be true in academic analysis and in specific real world tests. Sometimes it's close but FireWire is the clear winner.

Again, not an accurate statement. See other thread. They are close enough that it won't impact someone looking to buy an ipod vs a Zen NX or any other MP3 player (esp. since they are using slower laptop drives).

 

[Nebor]

I won't buy an ATI video card either... Nor would I use any kind of AOL product, AIM or otherwise. Nor realplayer.... And don't even get me STARTED on quicktime.

I guess you could say I'm a zealot. I've got a big Nvidia sticker on my case. :-D

 

[RightHere]

Hmmm. That Karma looks interesting. I don't understand why you'd have dual line outs or an ethernet port on a portable device. And then it's made by a company that's on the brink (or well into the depths) of bankruptcy. Seems iffy.

I've been looking at a lot of reviews of various players over the last week or two. Seems like software is the biggest problem for all of them. I'd prefer to get the iPod over the Zen just because I know that Creative can't write decent software to save their lives (I still need to check out the notmad software linked on this thread). But I was also thinking about the Rio Riot. It was only $140 at compgeeks but appears to be sold out now The software sucks for it too, but you can at least transfer files over in WMP. The form factor of the ipod/zen is better, but I have a Rio SP250 now and the Riot looks like it would be the same size or smaller.

 

[Remedy]

Originally posted by: Nebor
I won't buy an ATI video card either... Nor would I use any kind of AOL product, AIM or otherwise. Nor realplayer.... And don't even get me STARTED on quicktime.

I guess you could say I'm a zealot. I've got a big Nvidia sticker on my case. :-D

Go away. Please.

BTW, Anyone else looking to get an NX. It looks like Creative is already shipping out Monday direct from their HQ. The rest of the places I've seen selling or pre-ordering the NX has a low price of $212 for the 20GB version and $260 for the 30GB version. Buy.com has the 20GB for P/O.

Question: What kind of headphones are you guys using with your jukeboxes?

 

[Remedy]

Also, something to make your mouth water. If not, quinch your thirst atleast.

 

[RightHere]

So is the new iriver device going to be worth $60 MORE than a 10GB iPod + remote? The knock on the iPod's are that they are too expensive. Nothing I'm seeing in that review justifies the difference to me.

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: Nebor
I won't buy an ATI video card either... Nor would I use any kind of AOL product, AIM or otherwise. Nor realplayer.... And don't even get me STARTED on quicktime.

I guess you could say I'm a zealot. I've got a big Nvidia sticker on my case. :-D

No offence, but WTF has that got to do with MP3 players?
I think you`ve posted in the wrong place.

 

[Remedy]

Originally posted by: RightHere
So is the new iriver device going to be worth $60 MORE than a 10GB iPod + remote? The knock on the iPod's are that they are too expensive. Nothing I'm seeing in that review justifies the difference to me.

-I- certainly think it is. The knock on iPod is, 'it's expensive for what it does'. Feature wise. The iRiver HPJB matches all of what the iPod 10GB does and then some more to add to it. So it brings many more features to the table. I happen to enjoy that GUI displayed in the link. However, most of it is unnecessary for majority of the users. But with format expandibility, the iRiver looks to be the winner.

BTW, Here is a review of the Notmad.

 

[RightHere]

What extra features are you talking about on the iriver device?

 

[Huma]

i just picked up a 15gb ipod. the interface is awesome, the physical size is amazing.

I was waiting and hoping for someone to build something as small and as usable for less money, but it's been too long. I had a little trouble getting started, but after installing the included software to initialize the ipod, I've switched over to ephpod to do all the work.

absolutely loving it so far. Only wish I didn't have to spend as much as I did for it.

 

[BoomAM]

If you dont mind me asking;
The iPods are supplied with a Firewire interface, is that interface compatable with the SB1394?(the Firewire on the Audigys).
What are the chances of the old Zens being reduced in price when the ZenNXs are released?