Creatine

[Sixguns]

How much should one take a day? What are the benifits? Where to buy?

Wanted to start using it but dont know much about it. Any help?

 

[TechBoyJK]

Creatine is a nitrogenous organic acid found in muscle tissue. It supplies energy for muscle contraction. It's a compound composed of 3 amino acids (glycine, methionine, and arginine).

It's completely natural. It's produced in the liver, kidneys and pancreas and delivered via your blood stream. It's converted to phosphocreatine in the muscles and is the first compound broken down during anaerobic exercise.

Supplementing creatine in your diet can increase muscle mass in a few eeks. It helps by minimizing protein breakdown in muscles and regenerates ATP which is needed for muscle contraction.

If you are going to supplement creatine, drink more water than usual.

You should 'load' for about 5 days and take about 30 grams per day. Then go for about 6 weeks taking about 5-15 grams per day. Take a 2 week break, then go through the cycle again.

It is 'ok' with water, but better with a nonacidic sugary drink.. Grape Juice is considered the best. don't use orange juice or anything like that.

 

[surfsatwerk]

5grams a day, loading and cycling are all unnecessary.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

5grams a day, loading and cycling are all unnecessary.

This.

The benefits are that it allows you lift a given weight (typically heavy) for a couple more reps. That few more reps is called increasing the volume. Increased volume taxes the muscles more and results in strength gains.

Buying it on the internet is probably the cheapest and simplest way to do it. Get creatine monohydrate - it has the most research backing it. Supplements like creatine esters and such haven't shown to be as effective.

 

[Sixguns]

5grams a day, loading and cycling are all unnecessary.

So this is the way to do it? When should it be taken though?

 

[surfsatwerk]

So this is the way to do it? When should it be taken though?

I usually take mine in the evening when I take my before bed pills and junk. For the average joe I don't think it make a big difference.

 

[Exodist]

5g per day. As far as bulking, I never seen a reall increase to size using creatine, but its always helped me with speeding up muscle recovery. Seems when paired with moderate protein intake it helps recover my muscles in half the time. But thats me, it also dehydrates me quickly also if I dont take in enough fluids.

 

[Sixguns]

Right now I drink about 140-180 oz of water a day. Will I need to increase that at all?

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Right now I drink about 140-180 oz of water a day. Will I need to increase that at all?

No, definitely not.

 

[Exodist]

Right now I drink about 140-180 oz of water a day. Will I need to increase that at all?

Not unless you want to be up all night, take my word for it..

 

[ebow86]

It never ceases to amaze me some of the crap people buy and put into their body's. Not to be funny, but prison inmates are proof positive that you don't need all these supplements to build and maintain muscle. Many of those guys are the biggest, leanest, and strongest bodybuilders you'll ever see, and they don't have access to half the foods we do, let alone expensive dietary supplements. Just eat the right foods in the right proportions, that's all that's required for good results.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

It never ceases to amaze me some of the crap people buy and put into their body's. Not to be funny, but prison inmates are proof positive that you don't need all these supplements to build and maintain muscle. Many of those guys are the biggest, leanest, and strongest bodybuilders you'll ever see, and they don't have access to half the foods we do, let alone expensive dietary supplements. Just eat the right foods in the right proportions, that's all that's required for good results.

Yes, but creatine has shown time and time again in research that it will improve strength gains more in the same amount of time compared to someone who's not utilizing it. Sure, you can get big and strong without it. However, if you're looking to get as big and as strong as you can in the shortest time possible, then you're silly to ignore the aid creatine can provide.

 

[ebow86]

Yes, but creatine has shown time and time again in research that it will improve strength gains more in the same amount of time compared to someone who's not utilizing it. Sure, you can get big and strong without it. However, if you're looking to get as big and as strong as you can in the shortest time possible, then you're silly to ignore the aid creatine can provide.

One could make the same argument about using PED's....

 

[SociallyChallenged]

One could make the same argument about using PED's....

Technically, if you're using the term "drug" loosely, creatine is a PED. The only difference is legality and safety. Creatine is safe in article after article and isn't banned by most major leagues. It doesn't give anybody an unfair advantage, it just allows them to grunt out a little more volume. It doesn't affect recovery, it doesn't effect performance directly. It affects training, which modifies performance. It's not a drug and has little to no risk (unless you have previous kidney damage).

Everyone would be using PED's if it were legal and didn't have health risks. Heck, most high level athletes STILL use them. Creatine gives certain fair benefits, but abides by all ethical and legal standards.

 

[Sixguns]

It never ceases to amaze me some of the crap people buy and put into their body's. Not to be funny, but prison inmates are proof positive that you don't need all these supplements to build and maintain muscle. Many of those guys are the biggest, leanest, and strongest bodybuilders you'll ever see, and they don't have access to half the foods we do, let alone expensive dietary supplements. Just eat the right foods in the right proportions, that's all that's required for good results.

If I didnt have a job and got to workout all day long I would be lean like that to. But I have a job and can only get to the gym for about an hour or two a day. And trust me, I work in a prison and the food they eat might help with that too. Anytime ive had it it runs right through me.

 

[killster1]

exactly funny you compare prisoners to regular people since all they have is time to work out..

 

[ebow86]

exactly funny you compare prisoners to regular people since all they have is time to work out..

That couldn't be farther from the truth. Most of these prisoners, depending on the prison, might only get 30 minutes to an hour a day to work out in the prison yard. Furthermore, the inmates don't have access to 1/4 the equipment your average bodybuilder has at his disposal. These guys are proof that you don't need expensive supplements or equipment to get fantastic results.

 

[marmasatt]

That couldn't be farther from the truth. Most of these prisoners, depending on the prison, might only get 30 minutes to an hour a day to work out in the prison yard. Furthermore, the inmates don't have access to 1/4 the equipment your average bodybuilder has at his disposal. These guys are proof that you don't need expensive supplements or equipment to get fantastic results.

Dude, we get it. You're partially right. You're making a good point by using them as an example. You are just being a bit sanctimonious and closed minded about it.

I also used to work for a Sheriff's office. They may only get a half hour to an hour to work out but you are being a bit thick if you think that's all they do. Allow me to make a contradictory argument. With only a half hour to an hour to lift, you should see the intensity with which these guys work out. To say they "look forward to it" is beyond an understatement. Also to say these guys don't have access to as many machines is totally true. But they do plyometrics type stuff, they work out on the flats/floor while in the blocks or in the yard (my point being not just during gym time), and lastly they do crazy reps. They are also ingenious with discovering methods of working out muscles when they don't have access to tools that work those muscles out. (Examples, using bed sheets and their own body weight, etc). Some of these guys, I'm not kidding you will do like 500 push ups in a day. They have nothing else to do! You can't compare that to a normal 9 - 5 guy who works out for the same hour's time (as the inmate) after work every night. The reality is, they work out for SEVERAL hours a day.

So on it's face, your argument is ok. But it's just not the same. It's kind of apples to oranges to be honest. I had to chime in there, because you just may not really understand what's going on, "behind the walls" lol...:sneaky:

Now, back to our regularly scheduled program. Creatine is just not snake oil. I'll be the first to say, that alot of this crap is. And it's like trial and error. But Creatine is just tried and true. You've clearly never taken it if you don't think it works.

So, if you're just trolling - you got me. I bit. But you are just wrong. Kind of a silly argument to make. Really, on both counts, the inmate thing and the creatine. Yeah, you can get big or strong without creatine - if you work out all the time. So you go quit your job, and work out for a minimum of 4 hours a day - every day. The rest of us, will use creatine. Don't know what else to say. Where's the argument here?

 

[Wyndru]

I was reading the stronglifts report last night, I was surprised that Mehdi doesn't recommend supplements with his SL5x5 program, stating that you should just eat more and supplements are nothing more than "powdered food".

Is there any food that can do what creatine does?

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I was reading the stronglifts report last night, I was surprised that Mehdi doesn't recommend supplements with his SL5x5 program, stating that you should just eat more and supplements are nothing more than "powdered food".

Is there any food that can do what creatine does?

Yeah, creatine is found in red meat. The only issue is that you'd have to eat 20lbs of it to get the same amount. Mehdi is trying to create good habits that rely on self-efficacy. He wants people to know they can make changes without anything extra. However, in this case, creatine can add extra. Creatine doesn't make you strong - you make yourself strong. Creatine just helps slightly.

 

[marmasatt]

I actually DO NOT like it for performance. I've tried it for cycling, running ski slopes, swimming, soccer, etc. It gives you a superficial pump (after taking it for a bit) but it almost inhibits anything with reps IMO - that's for sure. My muscles feel lethargic and I get too much lactic acid. However, for building lean muscle and getting stronger, it can't be beat!

 

[ebow86]

Dude, we get it. You're partially right. You're making a good point by using them as an example. You are just being a bit sanctimonious and closed minded about it.

I also used to work for a Sheriff's office. They may only get a half hour to an hour to work out but you are being a bit thick if you think that's all they do. Allow me to make a contradictory argument. With only a half hour to an hour to lift, you should see the intensity with which these guys work out. To say they "look forward to it" is beyond an understatement. Also to say these guys don't have access to as many machines is totally true. But they do plyometrics type stuff, they work out on the flats/floor while in the blocks or in the yard (my point being not just during gym time), and lastly they do crazy reps. They are also ingenious with discovering methods of working out muscles when they don't have access to tools that work those muscles out. (Examples, using bed sheets and their own body weight, etc). Some of these guys, I'm not kidding you will do like 500 push ups in a day. They have nothing else to do! You can't compare that to a normal 9 - 5 guy who works out for the same hour's time (as the inmate) after work every night. The reality is, they work out for SEVERAL hours a day.

So on it's face, your argument is ok. But it's just not the same. It's kind of apples to oranges to be honest. I had to chime in there, because you just may not really understand what's going on, "behind the walls" lol...:sneaky:

Now, back to our regularly scheduled program. Creatine is just not snake oil. I'll be the first to say, that alot of this crap is. And it's like trial and error. But Creatine is just tried and true. You've clearly never taken it if you don't think it works.

So, if you're just trolling - you got me. I bit. But you are just wrong. Kind of a silly argument to make. Really, on both counts, the inmate thing and the creatine. Yeah, you can get big or strong without creatine - if you work out all the time. So you go quit your job, and work out for a minimum of 4 hours a day - every day. The rest of us, will use creatine. Don't know what else to say. Where's the argument here?

Hello marmasatt, first off I just want to say that my post was in no way shape or form an attempt to "troll", I am sorry you interpreted it as such.

Secondly, you seem to contradict yourself here in your post. You first say "You're partially right" as well as "your argument is ok", but then at the end of your post you claim "But you are just wrong. Kind of a silly argument to make", that's seems contradictory to me, especially considering your previous comments.

The reason I made the "prisoner" argument is for a reason. In the society we live in today, we all are obsessed about heath and fitness. And everyday you see all these expensive supplements that promise to do wonders for your body, when in reality most of the products that's being sold out there are nothing more than a gimmick, and hard working people are wasting their money everyday on this crap.

Creatine may or may not fall under this category, I don't have enough experience with the product to make a definitive determination as to how effect it may be, but there are many products out there that are not effective, yet sales continue to thrive. In any case, if you or anyone else wants to take creatine, that's your choice, and if you experience better results with it, I think that's fantastic, but the only point I wanted to make is there are times when you have to ask yourself, does this stuff really work and do I really need it ?

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

Creatine may or may not fall under this category, I don't have enough experience...

It doesn't, and you don't. Creatine has years of hard science behind it. It's one of the few supps that does. Maybe you should type less and read more about it. And you're being trollish with your "who needs supps and equipment to get ripped when there's prison" rambling.

 

[ebow86]

It doesn't, and you don't. Creatine has years of hard science behind it. It's one of the few supps that does. Maybe you should type less and read more about it. And you're being trollish with your "who needs supps and equipment to get ripped when there's prison" rambling.

What's with the attitude? I see no one hear attempting to troll, though your post most certainly qualifies the most out of this entire thread. I guess when you disagree with the majority you are bound to be accused of trolling, it's inevitable to come from individuals such as yourself.

What brand of creatine supplement are you referring to? As an expert on the matter, I'm sure you're aware that different manufacturers have different standards in regards to quality and potency. Where are these hard scientific results? I'm not saying they don't exist, but I'd like to see the evidence for myself to get a better understanding.

I never claimed to be an expert on creatine supplements, the prisoners argument I made was just one example, I can point out others if you would like, bodybuilders who were ripped and shredded long before any of them even knew what creatine supplements was. The is solid evidence to back up this claim. I wouldn't have brought the prisoner example up again had it not been challenged. FWIW I do think there are supplements that are beneficial, some creatine supplements are probably one, the only argument I wanted to make is there are many out there that are not. I'm sure you would agree that certain brands of creatine supplements are better than others.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

What's with the attitude? I see no one hear attempting to troll, though your post most certainly qualifies the most out of this entire thread. I guess when you disagree with the majority you are bound to be accused of trolling, it's inevitable to come from individuals such as yourself.

What brand of creatine supplement are you referring to? As an expert on the matter, I'm sure you're aware that different manufacturers have different standards in regards to quality and potency. Where are these hard scientific results? I'm not saying they don't exist, but I'd like to see the evidence for myself to get a better understanding.

I never claimed to be an expert on creatine supplements, the prisoners argument I made was just one example, I can point out others if you would like, bodybuilders who were ripped and shredded long before any of them even knew what creatine supplements was. The is solid evidence to back up this claim. I wouldn't have brought the prisoner example up again had it not been challenged. FWIW I do think there are supplements that are beneficial, some creatine supplements are probably one, the only argument I wanted to make is there are many out there that are not. I'm sure you would agree that certain brands of creatine supplements are better than others.

A brief google scholar search resulted in:

http://journals.lww.com/acsm-msse/F...spx?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

http://www.bestfit.com.br/artigos/2009-04-ABR.pdf

Even in neurological patients - http://www.neurology.org/content/52/4/854.short

You're getting called out because you came out with this blatantly incorrect statement, refused to recant, and then admitted you don't know much about the subject. He has an attitude because you tried to mad dog the OP about supplementing something that is reasonable and effective. Before you try to talk about anything like this, do a google scholar search. You'll find some info there preemptively next time.