Cramping

[Sixguns]

Ive recently switched to running after I lift due to my work schedule changing. Since than, Ive started to get a bad cramp under my ribs on the left side of my body. Some days its not that bad but others it is so bad that I have to stop running. Any ideas what might be causing this so that I can prevent this?

 

[janas19]

Ive recently switched to running after I lift due to my work schedule changing. Any ideas what might be causing this so that I can prevent this?

Doing cardio and weight training on the same day.

 

[IHateMyJob2004]

Overuse?

What are you doing for weights? If you are doing heavy macros, you are heavily taxing your core. Running uses the core.

How many days away do you lift/run? I do these on opposite days with one day off each week.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Well, does it hurt when you breathe in or breathe out? Or possibly both? Could simply be a diaphragmatic cramp or spasm due to the workload you're putting on it with both lifting and running. If that's truly it, it should adapt and alleviate within a few weeks. If not, it could be due to limited rib cage expansion or your specific breathing pattern (for example, many people breathe using a lot of lower rib expansion, but little upper rib expansion). That breathing pattern can lead to acute overuse of things like the internal and external intercostals, obliques, abs, etc.

 

[Joepublic2]

Do you sweat a lot? Don't eat a lot of plants? Eat a ton of table salt? Might be low potassium. Don't bother with a potassium supplement though; salt substitute is potassium chloride and it's much, much cheaper. Or just eat more green stuff or a potato now and then.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Do you sweat a lot? Don't eat a lot of plants? Eat a ton of table salt? Might be low potassium. Don't bother with a potassium supplement though; salt substitute is potassium chloride and it's much, much cheaper. Or just eat more green stuff or a potato now and then.

He's describing a "side stitch," not actual muscle cramping. On your topic though, avocado is also a great source of potassium.

 

[Sixguns]

Well, does it hurt when you breathe in or breathe out? Or possibly both? Could simply be a diaphragmatic cramp or spasm due to the workload you're putting on it with both lifting and running. If that's truly it, it should adapt and alleviate within a few weeks. If not, it could be due to limited rib cage expansion or your specific breathing pattern (for example, many people breathe using a lot of lower rib expansion, but little upper rib expansion). That breathing pattern can lead to acute overuse of things like the internal and external intercostals, obliques, abs, etc.

Usually it is during both. Like a constant pain. Some days its worse than others, but than some days its not a problem at all.

 

[IHateMyJob2004]

Asthema?

Also, I think I read up on sidewtitch a month ago and read that there is no known cause.

 

[Sixguns]

I was always told growing up that it was due to drinking a lot of water before you run. I thought that might be the cause here since I drink about 32 oz of water while at the gym but that is over an hour and I am sweating a ton while lifting.

 

[interchange]

Well, does it hurt when you breathe in or breathe out? Or possibly both? Could simply be a diaphragmatic cramp or spasm due to the workload you're putting on it with both lifting and running. If that's truly it, it should adapt and alleviate within a few weeks. If not, it could be due to limited rib cage expansion or your specific breathing pattern (for example, many people breathe using a lot of lower rib expansion, but little upper rib expansion). That breathing pattern can lead to acute overuse of things like the internal and external intercostals, obliques, abs, etc.

Diaphragm refers pain to the shoulder. Regardless, my bet would be musculoskeletal because you've been working out. Probably costochondritis or an intercostal or serratus anterior muscle strain. Unfortunately the only cure is rest. Of course, being on the left side makes me thing of possible cardiac (e.g. pericarditis), or of course a pulmonary etiology is always possible. Key question is whether or not the pain is reproducible on palpation (i.e. pushing where it hurts). Use the flat of your hand and moderate pressure (you can make anything hurt if you jab it with your fingers hard enough 😛). If not, or if it worsens or changes, definitely seek professional opinion. In fact, if you haven't seen your neighborhood doc recently or never had an EKG before you might want to go for a routine health visit and have it checked out.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Asthema?

Also, I think I read up on sidewtitch a month ago and read that there is no known cause.

It's definitely not asthma. That has completely different symptoms.

And there are hypotheses as to what causes side stitches. The most popular thought has to do with the diaphragm. However, there's quite a bit of stuff in the area that it could be. It can be diagnosed and treated though. It's not some voodoo curse 🙂

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Diaphragm refers pain to the shoulder. Regardless, my bet would be musculoskeletal because you've been working out. Probably costochondritis or an intercostal or serratus anterior muscle strain. Unfortunately the only cure is rest. Of course, being on the left side makes me thing of possible cardiac (e.g. pericarditis), or of course a pulmonary etiology is always possible. Key question is whether or not the pain is reproducible on palpation (i.e. pushing where it hurts). Use the flat of your hand and moderate pressure (you can make anything hurt if you jab it with your fingers hard enough 😛). If not, or if it worsens or changes, definitely seek professional opinion. In fact, if you haven't seen your neighborhood doc recently or never had an EKG before you might want to go for a routine health visit and have it checked out.

The diaphragm also has somatic nerve fibers to itself that give information locally via the phrenic nerve. In addition, if he's overusing his diaphragm due to poor rib expansion, the repeated stretch the diaphragm causes on the structures superficial to it may cause aggravation of those structures themselves.

Serratus anterior is too high for where he's describing pain and costochondritis doesn't typically go away when you stop exercising. Every patient I've met with costochondritis reports serious, maintained pain post-aggravation. I do agree that it could be intercostals, but I think that he's complaining about symptoms below the thoracic cage. That's why I suggested possible internal external obliquus abdominus strain or acute overuse. Gets used during expiration, stretched during inspiration. I could see how it would hurt during exercise, but not at rest.

If it were actually something like like pericarditis, then that pain should be felt higher up in the neck and shoulder area, wouldn't it?

At this stage of the game, I do believe it's a bit excessive to suggest he go get a cardiac check-up. It has only come on when he linked both weightlifting and aerobic activity, which sounds a lot like muscle overuse that he'll adapt to relatively quickly. If it were any of the other serious problems, he would have had the symptoms just while running before he started training both weightlifting and endurance work in the same day.

 

[interchange]

Guess it depends on what you interpret by "under my ribs" as inferior to or deep to or inferior to a specific rib, etc. This is why adequate history and physical is necessary.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Guess it depends on what you interpret by "under my ribs" as inferior to or deep to or inferior to a specific rib, etc. This is why adequate history and physical is necessary.

Good point. In my experience people are pretty good at using behind for deep and under for inferior, but I can see where we could mix things up. Also, welcome to the neighborhood. YGPM.

Btw, I edited my reply post for bitchiness. Sometimes I just write things down as they go on in my head and realize I have to edit later. Sorry about that.

 

[Sixguns]

The pain does stop within a few minutes of slowing down or stopping. As for with it starting. Since I started working out over a year ago, I was doing all my cardio before I would lift so its not like I am new to this much stress on my body. As for where the pain is. It is right at the bottom of the ribs and feels like it is right behind the rib.
As for my breathing, not sure if this will make sense but I was in band growing up so we were taught to breath with our diaphragm so that we could get more air into our lungs. I have kept that going since than.

I actually had a EKG done before I had my back surgery 1 1/2 ago and was told that I had a very strong heart.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

The pain does stop within a few minutes of slowing down or stopping. As for with it starting. Since I started working out over a year ago, I was doing all my cardio before I would lift so its not like I am new to this much stress on my body. As for where the pain is. It is right at the bottom of the ribs and feels like it is right behind the rib.
As for my breathing, not sure if this will make sense but I was in band growing up so we were taught to breath with our diaphragm so that we could get more air into our lungs. I have kept that going since than.

I actually had a EKG done before I had my back surgery 1 1/2 ago and was told that I had a very strong heart.

What works for band is not great for exercise. You need to breathe using upper rib expansion and lower rib expansion. I would probably say this is the reason why you're getting your side stitch. Just try breathing less using your diaphgram. It's an important part of breathing, but rib cage expansion is meant to be used as well.

 

[Sixguns]

What works for band is not great for exercise. You need to breathe using upper rib expansion and lower rib expansion. I would probably say this is the reason why you're getting your side stitch. Just try breathing less using your diaphgram. It's an important part of breathing, but rib cage expansion is meant to be used as well.

I will have to kind of relearn how to do that. Been doing it the other way for about 12 or 13 years now. I did notice that it wasnt nearly as bad to as it was last week.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I will have to kind of relearn how to do that. Been doing it the other way for about 12 or 13 years now. I did notice that it wasnt nearly as bad to as it was last week.

Yeah, you definitely have to re-learn how to breathe while exerting yourself. Luckily, it's easy to practice wherever you are. Keep practicing and see how that helps.