Correcting Racism

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: n yusef
Don't you think it's ridiculous that blacks, the people negatively effected by racism, must give up the few programs that attempt to correct for racism, but whites, the people who benefit from racism, must do nothing?

Your position is racist. Equality will come over time, but it will never come if justice is not blind.

I don't know about justice, but employers aren't blind, cops aren't blind, teachers aren't blind, etc.

Why do you insist on pretending that racism (and sexism, homophobia, transphobia, ableism) does not exist? You are not fooling anyone but yourself.

 

[compuwiz1]

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: n yusef
Don't you think it's ridiculous that blacks, the people negatively effected by racism, must give up the few programs that attempt to correct for racism, but whites, the people who benefit from racism, must do nothing?

Your position is racist. Equality will come over time, but it will never come if justice is not blind.

I don't know about justice, but employers aren't blind, cops aren't blind, teachers aren't blind, etc.

Why do you insist on pretending that racism (and sexism, homophobia, transphobia, ableism) does not exist? You are not fooling anyone but yourself.

It does exist, but we are talking about ways to make it not exist. The victim attitude only helps perpetuate the problem. The Japanese and the USA are friends, even though we nuked Japan. Why? Because everyone moved on and got over it.

 

[txrandom]

We should give all minorities benefits since it's my fault that my great, great, great grandparents owned slaves.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: n yusef

I don't know about justice, but employers aren't blind, cops aren't blind, teachers aren't blind, etc.

Why do you insist on pretending that racism (and sexism, homophobia, transphobia, ableism) does not exist? You are not fooling anyone but yourself.

Right after we eliminate AA we can eliminate the victim mentality. That would pretty much end it all right there.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

Originally posted by: n yusef

That you weigh the resentment of whites, men, heterosexuals, oppressors, over the rights of the oppressed is a testament to your privilege and narcissism.

I'm saying it's that kind of attitude right there creates resentment among people who like me are otherwise just fine with you having your rights and equality. I may be white, male, and hetero, but I'm sure as hell not an oppressor, nor do I have the persecution complex that you seem to think is necessary to understand social injustices.

I don't have a persecution complex. I have a humanity complex. That you're against civil rights because I am offending you speaks volumes about your character, and questions the strength of your convictions for social justice.

You value your personal "resentment" over the rights of others. Think about that.

The fact that you insist I am against civil rights despite what I've said says you do have a persecution complex. There's not much I put a higher value on than people's rights. But don't expect pissing people off or gaining privilege at other's expense just because you are black, gay, whatever won't piss people off and work against any goal of true equality.

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: n yusef

I don't know about justice, but employers aren't blind, cops aren't blind, teachers aren't blind, etc.

Why do you insist on pretending that racism (and sexism, homophobia, transphobia, ableism) does not exist? You are not fooling anyone but yourself.

Right after we eliminate AA we can eliminate the victim mentality. That would pretty much end it all right there.

Wouldn't the victim mentality end when the victimization ends?

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: compuwiz1

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: compuwiz1

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: compuwiz1
Eliminate the protected class bullshit
End the minority label - I'm white and depending on what part of what city I happen to be in, I'm a minority sometimes.
Silence Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton
Do not cater to or acknowlege, when the race card is played
Get rid of social programs that target minorities
Eliminate affirmative action programs
Eliminate white supremacist groups
Eliminate black supremacist groups
Stop enabling people to do the same things they've always done and get the same results they've always gotten - 4 generations of welfare come to mind. Being poor is something many people just do.
Let more whites become pimps
Let more whites become baptist preachers
Do away with BET
Eliminate the Negro College fund and just call it the "College Fund"
Eliminate the NAACP

See why we have what we have? We are still segregating ourselves, thru various programs. We should all be treated equally; same programs, same opportunities.

The handholding of certain ethnicity only weakens them, not making them stronger.

Don't you think it's ridiculous that blacks, the people negatively effected by racism, must give up the few programs that attempt to correct for racism, but whites, the people who benefit from racism, must do nothing? Actually, you are saying that whites need more rights: we must remove the discrimination that prevents them from being pimps and baptist preachers. (If you didn't get it, that's sarcasm. Whites have no trouble being pimps or baptist preachers, and there are thousands if not millions of whites in those positions.)

Your post cannot be any more wrong.

No, sir, you have missed the whole point. Remove the things that keep us from being equals and maybe we can be. Some of my post was in Jest, but in all seriousness, take a good look at it. We are on equal footing. We live in the same free society and we all have access to education and jobs. If that were not the case, why are there so many immigrants that come to this country who do work hard and do achieve the American Dream, but yet so many who are born in this country fail to find this American Dream?
It's a mindset and social conditioning brought on by, you guessed it...race.

Equal footing my ass:

Text
Text
Text

Seek and you shall find. Someone wrote that life is only 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond or act about it.

I like how you can read those articles and be so indifferent to the built in racism against blacks in employment. How on earth could a white ex-con have a higher hiring rate than a black person with a clean record?

That's why i say republicans are the scum of the earth. Do away with the GOP and do away with much of the racism in this country..

 

[Schadenfroh]

Gonad the Barbarian and n yusef

End the massive nested quoting

Thanks

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian
The fact that you insist I am against civil rights despite what I've said says you do have a persecution complex. There's not much I put a higher value on than people's rights. But don't expect pissing people off or gaining privilege at other's expense just because you are black, gay, whatever won't piss people off and work against any goal of true equality.

Your contention is that those who are disenfranchised need to watch their tone. I cannot disagree with this enough. This blog post describes my feelings better than I can myself: Text

For clarification: social justice is not about putting some people (in your example, blacks and gays) above others. It is not about giving privilege, but eradicating it. This is why it is very offensive for you, a privileged body, to tell me that you would agree with me...but I'm too angry, I'm too much of an activist. For some reason, you feel that my rights in society are dictated by how much you like me, by how nice I am to you. You assume that I care about how my anger makes you resent me, like your resentment is so important. It is simply narcissistic to assume that the goal of civil rights is to make you feel good, or even that your support of it should be predicated on your opinion of me.

 

[compuwiz1]

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: n yusef

I don't know about justice, but employers aren't blind, cops aren't blind, teachers aren't blind, etc.

Why do you insist on pretending that racism (and sexism, homophobia, transphobia, ableism) does not exist? You are not fooling anyone but yourself.

Right after we eliminate AA we can eliminate the victim mentality. That would pretty much end it all right there.

Wouldn't the victim mentality end when the victimization ends?

The beginning of the end of the victimization

So, that was in 1865, when slavery began to get abolished. By the late 1960's we have equal civil rights. We are now 40 years down the road. Victimization has ended. It will still exist only to those who won't let it go.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: txrandom
We should give all minorities benefits since it's my fault that my great, great, great grandparents owned slaves.

Blacks have no ill effects from their families being discriminated against in where they can live, education, emloyment for a century.

You should take the advantages you gained by their century of discrimination and then insult them. Good idea. Idiot.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: JS80
I wouldn't correct it. People should be free to be racist.

The question isn't if people are free to be racist or not, it's that racism is viewed as a negative thing that we should fix if we can. People are free to be literate or illiterate but it doesn't mean that we as a society shouldn't teach people how to read.

The only way your argument would hold up is if you think racism isn't a negative thing. I assume that's not what you meant.

Not every negative thing needs to be "corrected." Society is going to have faults that it will either learn from and largely grow out of or it won't. Trying to "fix" these problems just exacerbates the problem or makes more problems.

That we might only exacerbate the issue is most certainly a reasonable argument against taking action on racism. That basically says 'racism is bad, but we don't have the means by which to correct it'. If that's what JS80 meant, that's fine. (although I doubt it) If you recognize it as something bad and you think we can do something about it, then to just leave it be seems awfully silly to me.

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: compuwiz1

Originally posted by: n yusef
Wouldn't the victim mentality end when the victimization ends?

The beginning of the end of the victimization

So, that was in 1865, when slavery began to get abolished. By the late 1960's we have equal civil rights. We are now 40 years down the road. Victimization has ended. It will still exist only to those who won't let it go.

Did you see my links? White male ex-cons are more easily employed than non-criminal black men. If that is not an example of systemic racism in American society, I do not know what is.

 

[Moonbeam]

Racism is the need of people who hate themselves to have somebody onto whom they can project their self hate. They project how worthless they themselves feel onto somebody else being that worthless so that the hate they have for themselves for mistakenly believing they are that worthless themselves can be directed elsewhere than against themselves. It can only be cured by tremendous honesty and profound personal insight, the recognition that one is, in ones feelings the hideous think that they hate. This almost never happens because the self hate is so tremendous that it is like dying to bring to the surface, to relive and remember how it was falsely placed on us as children. One can, of course, redirect the hate to say, unpatriotic traitors or Republicans, or some equally popular object of public derision.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: spidey07
We can start by making any form of affirmative action a federal crime. That would be a good start.

Yep and not have "race" on applications to things.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: spidey07
We can start by making any form of affirmative action a federal crime. That would be a good start.

I hope you realize that women are the greatest beneficiaries of AA.

Women wanted equal rights, let them have equal rights. They should compete on a level playing field with everyone else, just like Blacks, Browns, Yellows, and Whites should.
A lot of the problems with AA are that an unqualified person will apply for the job and get it because they are the right race, Then people that were passed up or that now have to work with the unqualified person are pissed that AA screwed everyone.

Yes, everyone should compete on a level playing field. Too bad our current playing field is nowhere even remotely close to level. I mean not even close.

Funny, it was never called affirmative action when blacks were barred from FHA loans, where the government disbursed $120 odd billion dollars to whites. Funny it's never called affirmative action when people with white names are 50% more likely to get interviews than people with black names, and how being white is equal to two years of experience. The institutional advantages that whites enjoy are never called affirmative action, and they are infrequently agitated against, even though they are far more powerful.

 

[Kirby]

Originally posted by: Phokus
Do away with the GOP and do away with much of the racism in this country..

Were you born retarded, or did your mother throw you down a flight of stairs?

 

[compuwiz1]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: spidey07
We can start by making any form of affirmative action a federal crime. That would be a good start.

I hope you realize that women are the greatest beneficiaries of AA.

Women wanted equal rights, let them have equal rights. They should compete on a level playing field with everyone else, just like Blacks, Browns, Yellows, and Whites should.
A lot of the problems with AA are that an unqualified person will apply for the job and get it because they are the right race, Then people that were passed up or that now have to work with the unqualified person are pissed that AA screwed everyone.

Yes, everyone should compete on a level playing field. Too bad our current playing field is nowhere even remotely close to level. I mean not even close.

Funny, it was never called affirmative action when blacks were barred from FHA loans, where the government disbursed $120 odd billion dollars to whites. Funny it's never called affirmative action when people with white names are 50% more likely to get interviews than people with black names, and how being white is equal to two years of experience. The institutional advantages that whites enjoy are never called affirmative action, and they are infrequently agitated against, even though they are far more powerful.

How does one identify a black name? I know black people with the name of smith, williams, wilson, johnson, etc. You're so full of shit. Maybe some people won't get up and go to those interviews. Maybe some people won't bother to look for a job, further than the first NO. If this is a problem with being black, why are there so many black people that do have success right beside whites? Because they didn't make excuses for themselves based on the color of their skin or what someone else told them they could or couldn't do. It's exasperating that some people just don't get it and want to place blame. Look in the fucking mirror! That's where the biggest enemy is. That's where the true holdback is.

 

[Phokus]

Just going to repost this because this is basically the society the republicans in here want but on a much larger scale:

http://findarticles.com/p/arti...is_2_108/ai_n15681393/
http://findarticles.com/p/arti...5/is_2_48/ai_97873146/

And you wonder why the GOP doesn't attract many blacks? I think any black person understands republicans want to go back to the 'good ol days' (meaning pre-civil rights era).

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: compuwiz1

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: spidey07
We can start by making any form of affirmative action a federal crime. That would be a good start.

I hope you realize that women are the greatest beneficiaries of AA.

Women wanted equal rights, let them have equal rights. They should compete on a level playing field with everyone else, just like Blacks, Browns, Yellows, and Whites should.
A lot of the problems with AA are that an unqualified person will apply for the job and get it because they are the right race, Then people that were passed up or that now have to work with the unqualified person are pissed that AA screwed everyone.

Yes, everyone should compete on a level playing field. Too bad our current playing field is nowhere even remotely close to level. I mean not even close.

Funny, it was never called affirmative action when blacks were barred from FHA loans, where the government disbursed $120 odd billion dollars to whites. Funny it's never called affirmative action when people with white names are 50% more likely to get interviews than people with black names, and how being white is equal to two years of experience. The institutional advantages that whites enjoy are never called affirmative action, and they are infrequently agitated against, even though they are far more powerful.

How does one identify a black name? I know black people with the name of smith, williams, wilson, johnson, etc. You're so full of shit. Maybe some people won't get up and go to those interviews. Maybe some people won't bother to look for a job, further than the first NO. If this is a problem with being black, why are there so many black people that do have success right beside whites? Because they didn't make excuses for themselves based on the color of their skin or what someone else told them they could or couldn't do. It's exasperating that some people just don't get it and want to place blame. Look in the fucking mirror! That's where the biggest enemy is. That's where the true holdback is.

A "black-sounding name" is something like Keisha, LeBron, Ebony...like porn, you know it when you see it.

In regards to what I bolded: Sure, there are some black people in positions of power. But as a group, we are underrepresented. So are other people of color, women, non-Christians, homosexuals, trans people, and people with disabilities.

Look at these graphs: Text

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: compuwiz1

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Yes, everyone should compete on a level playing field. Too bad our current playing field is nowhere even remotely close to level. I mean not even close.

Funny, it was never called affirmative action when blacks were barred from FHA loans, where the government disbursed $120 odd billion dollars to whites. Funny it's never called affirmative action when people with white names are 50% more likely to get interviews than people with black names, and how being white is equal to two years of experience. The institutional advantages that whites enjoy are never called affirmative action, and they are infrequently agitated against, even though they are far more powerful.

How does one identify a black name? I know black people with the name of smith, williams, wilson, johnson, etc. You're so full of shit. Maybe some people won't get up and go to those interviews. Maybe some people won't bother to look for a job, further than the first NO. If this is a problem with being black, why are there so many black people that do have success right beside whites? Because they didn't make excuses for themselves based on the color of their skin or what someone else told them they could or couldn't do. It's exasperating that some people just don't get it and want to place blame. Look in the fucking mirror! That's where the biggest enemy is. That's where the true holdback is.

Well you better go tell the University of Chicago that they are full of shit too. Are you serious that you don't know how to identify a black name? What are the odds of someone named Lakisha Washington being black? Speaking of being full of shit. The study had nothing to do with if people were 'bothering to look for a job', as they were fictitious people with equivalent credentials and the variable was whether they were called for an interview or not. You would have already known this if you read my post more carefully.

Your post was just some stream of consciousness angry white guy rant.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian
The fact that you insist I am against civil rights despite what I've said says you do have a persecution complex. There's not much I put a higher value on than people's rights. But don't expect pissing people off or gaining privilege at other's expense just because you are black, gay, whatever won't piss people off and work against any goal of true equality.

Your contention is that those who are disenfranchised need to watch their tone. I cannot disagree with this enough. This blog post describes my feelings better than I can myself: Text

For clarification: social justice is not about putting some people (in your example, blacks and gays) above others. It is not about giving privilege, but eradicating it. This is why it is very offensive for you, a privileged body, to tell me that you would agree with me...but I'm too angry, I'm too much of an activist. For some reason, you feel that my rights in society are dictated by how much you like me, by how nice I am to you. You assume that I care about how my anger makes you resent me, like your resentment is so important. It is simply narcissistic to assume that the goal of civil rights is to make you feel good, or even that your support of it should be predicated on your opinion of me.

You have demonstrated two things consistently in this thread:

1. You don't want equality, you want the privilege that the straight white man has historically had given to everybody else. And since privilege comes at the expense of another, you think it's the white man's turn for a while to even things out.

2. You fail to see I'm continually stating that I support your rights despite any personal opinion I may or may not have towards you personally. All you see is the "straight white guy," angry and resentful that those "negroes and queers are being all uppity." Like I said before, persecution complex.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian
The fact that you insist I am against civil rights despite what I've said says you do have a persecution complex. There's not much I put a higher value on than people's rights. But don't expect pissing people off or gaining privilege at other's expense just because you are black, gay, whatever won't piss people off and work against any goal of true equality.

Your contention is that those who are disenfranchised need to watch their tone. I cannot disagree with this enough. This blog post describes my feelings better than I can myself: Text

For clarification: social justice is not about putting some people (in your example, blacks and gays) above others. It is not about giving privilege, but eradicating it. This is why it is very offensive for you, a privileged body, to tell me that you would agree with me...but I'm too angry, I'm too much of an activist. For some reason, you feel that my rights in society are dictated by how much you like me, by how nice I am to you. You assume that I care about how my anger makes you resent me, like your resentment is so important. It is simply narcissistic to assume that the goal of civil rights is to make you feel good, or even that your support of it should be predicated on your opinion of me.

You have demonstrated two things consistently in this thread:

1. You don't want equality, you want the privilege that the straight white man has historically had given to everybody else. And since privilege comes at the expense of another, you think it's the white man's turn for a while to even things out.

2. You fail to see I'm continually stating that I support your rights despite any personal opinion I may or may not have towards you personally. All you see is the "straight white guy," angry and resentful that those "negroes and queers are being all uppity." Like I said before, persecution complex.

You yourself support the free market's right to keep blacks in poverty

http://findarticles.com/p/arti...is_2_108/ai_n15681393/
http://findarticles.com/p/arti...5/is_2_48/ai_97873146/

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

Originally posted by: Phokus

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian
The fact that you insist I am against civil rights despite what I've said says you do have a persecution complex. There's not much I put a higher value on than people's rights. But don't expect pissing people off or gaining privilege at other's expense just because you are black, gay, whatever won't piss people off and work against any goal of true equality.

Your contention is that those who are disenfranchised need to watch their tone. I cannot disagree with this enough. This blog post describes my feelings better than I can myself: Text

For clarification: social justice is not about putting some people (in your example, blacks and gays) above others. It is not about giving privilege, but eradicating it. This is why it is very offensive for you, a privileged body, to tell me that you would agree with me...but I'm too angry, I'm too much of an activist. For some reason, you feel that my rights in society are dictated by how much you like me, by how nice I am to you. You assume that I care about how my anger makes you resent me, like your resentment is so important. It is simply narcissistic to assume that the goal of civil rights is to make you feel good, or even that your support of it should be predicated on your opinion of me.

You have demonstrated two things consistently in this thread:

1. You don't want equality, you want the privilege that the straight white man has historically had given to everybody else. And since privilege comes at the expense of another, you think it's the white man's turn for a while to even things out.

2. You fail to see I'm continually stating that I support your rights despite any personal opinion I may or may not have towards you personally. All you see is the "straight white guy," angry and resentful that those "negroes and queers are being all uppity." Like I said before, persecution complex.

You yourself support the free market's right to keep blacks in poverty

http://findarticles.com/p/arti...is_2_108/ai_n15681393/
http://findarticles.com/p/arti...5/is_2_48/ai_97873146/

Obviously being against racism and being against attempting to legislate it away means I want to keep black people in poverty.

I don't know how more plainly I can state this. I don't believe government can successfully legislate away societal problems. I believe trying to makes the situation worse.

 

[MotF Bane]

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

Originally posted by: Phokus

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian
The fact that you insist I am against civil rights despite what I've said says you do have a persecution complex. There's not much I put a higher value on than people's rights. But don't expect pissing people off or gaining privilege at other's expense just because you are black, gay, whatever won't piss people off and work against any goal of true equality.

Your contention is that those who are disenfranchised need to watch their tone. I cannot disagree with this enough. This blog post describes my feelings better than I can myself: Text

For clarification: social justice is not about putting some people (in your example, blacks and gays) above others. It is not about giving privilege, but eradicating it. This is why it is very offensive for you, a privileged body, to tell me that you would agree with me...but I'm too angry, I'm too much of an activist. For some reason, you feel that my rights in society are dictated by how much you like me, by how nice I am to you. You assume that I care about how my anger makes you resent me, like your resentment is so important. It is simply narcissistic to assume that the goal of civil rights is to make you feel good, or even that your support of it should be predicated on your opinion of me.

You have demonstrated two things consistently in this thread:

1. You don't want equality, you want the privilege that the straight white man has historically had given to everybody else. And since privilege comes at the expense of another, you think it's the white man's turn for a while to even things out.

2. You fail to see I'm continually stating that I support your rights despite any personal opinion I may or may not have towards you personally. All you see is the "straight white guy," angry and resentful that those "negroes and queers are being all uppity." Like I said before, persecution complex.

You yourself support the free market's right to keep blacks in poverty

http://findarticles.com/p/arti...is_2_108/ai_n15681393/
http://findarticles.com/p/arti...5/is_2_48/ai_97873146/

Obviously being against racism and being against attempting to legislate it away means I want to keep black people in poverty.

I don't know how more plainly I can state this. I don't believe government can successfully legislate away societal problems. I believe trying to makes the situation worse.

Dude, just stop feeding the trolls.