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Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus is awesome

DesiPower

DesiPower

Lifer
Last night I set up computer up to convert a bunch of mkv to smaller size avi, about 60 of them, and I set the computer to monitor the temp. The whole night the computer ran at 100% cpu utilization and the max temp it reached was 57 degrees!!! wow!! CPU - i5 2500k

That is all, just wanted to share, have a good evening
 
DesiPower said:
Last night I set up computer up to convert a bunch of mkv to smaller size avi, about 60 of them, and I set the computer to monitor the temp. The whole night the computer ran at 100% cpu utilization and the max temp it reached was 57 degrees!!! wow!! CPU - i5 2500k

That is all, just wanted to share, have a good evening
Click to expand...

You didn't overclock your Sandy Bridge? Or you did?

No doubt it's a heck of a cooler for the money.
 
No it was not overclocked this time, it was running at stock. I did overclock in the past and ran some tests for short time, the highest temp I remember was 64
 
BonzaiDuck said:
No doubt it's a heck of a cooler for the money.
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It's not a bad cooler for the money... my experience with the 212+ is a little different. I'm not an engineer (and I don't play one on TV...) but the basic, open design of most air coolers isn't very efficient, but for most generic uses they work OK.
 
Charlie98 said:
It's not a bad cooler for the money... my experience with the 212+ is a little different. I'm not an engineer (and I don't play one on TV...) but the basic, open design of most air coolers isn't very efficient, but for most generic uses they work OK.
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Well, air-cooling is less efficient to begin with, and you can only attempt to make it as efficient as you can. I do it with foam-board duct constructions and carefully-selected fan deployment.

But proof of the pudding is the benchmarks done -- with or without any efficiency enhancements. If the same test bed is used for all, the benchmarks give an accurate rank-ordering.

Even in fall of last year (2013), Noctua was announcing the D15 and promoting it at computer expos. We finally get the D15 around mid-summer 2014. According to the benchmarks, it is about 3 to 4C better than the D14 in performance for the standard test thermal wattage used in the comparisons. Even so, it pushes the limit for the top PCI-E slots. I'd seen where buyers noted trimming the fins with a Dremel or other tool to avoid any obstruction. How much cooling was compromised was likely not much, but one has to ask whether it's worth it to lose an x1 slot.

I don't think air-cooling will get much better. We'd seen recent contraptions touted as "ground-breaking" only to find them to be under-performers.
 
BonzaiDuck said:
Well, air-cooling is less efficient to begin with, and you can only attempt to make it as efficient as you can. I do it with foam-board duct constructions and carefully-selected fan deployment.

I don't think air-cooling will get much better. We'd seen recent contraptions touted as "ground-breaking" only to find them to be under-performers.
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It could get much better... if they tried. Like you mentioned, all it would take is a precisely manufactured duct and appropriately sized fan(s.) Noctua is doing it right, all they would have to do is duct the air through the heat exchanger; it would negate making the whole assembly bigger and bigger...
 
Charlie98 said:
It could get much better... if they tried. Like you mentioned, all it would take is a precisely manufactured duct and appropriately sized fan(s.) Noctua is doing it right, all they would have to do is duct the air through the heat exchanger; it would negate making the whole assembly bigger and bigger...
Click to expand...

I will neither agree nor disagree about your assertion there, but offer this.

The only thing case-makers and their various case models have in common is the motherboard tray, which must fit ATX and mATX motherboards, and offer a common mounting for a standard PSU. The rear exhaust ports and fans are never lined up with the processor area in the same way. And mobo makers locate the processor on the motherboard in a general "processor area:" I don't think you can take an ASUS socket-1150 ATX board, hold it above a Gigabyte, MSI or eVGA ATX 1150 board with the corners and ATX screws all aligned, and expect the CPU socket and HSF mounting holes to line up.

So I doubt that HSF makers like Noctua would find it feasible to offer "ducting-kits" with their products.

With air-cooling, ducting the cooler in an airflow strategy is just a large "grain-of-rice" adding on to the smaller improvements of TIM choices, lapping and de-lidding -- with fans, CFM and noise trade-offs.

Essential factors in the cooling effectiveness are the number of heatpipes, the number of fins and the areal size of fins. Maybe the choice of some different heatpipe "coolant" can change the equation: someone suggested to me that use of a different coolant in a water-cooling loop might do the same thing, but the pump-innards, hoses and radiators are designed for water. Again, you might not be able to do "custom" water-cooling unless some different coolant gains universal acceptance in that industry. And what is more universal than distilled water?

I am still "on-track" to execute my Haswell-E building project next year, despite the surprise of my dentist's bill at the end of this month. Before he discovered all my cavities last week, there had never been an urgency to build an E system right away because DDR4 is new, BIOS and X99 are new, and my sig-rig is anything but obsolete -- keeping up with an overclocked i7-4770K (4.4Ghz) in some benchmarks (not all). I think there was one other factor: planning to get my feet wet with custom water-cooling, I also wanted to see what the heatpipe and AiO makers offer as new designs into next spring.

I just doubt that there will be any earthshattering surprises. It is more likely that I'll be ordering two radiators, a dual-pump reservoir and fittings no later than March.
 
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Can we expect build pics, Bonzai? I look forward to seeing your creation.

My extreme-budget rigs would never compare to something like that. Oh well. It's kind of a tradeoff. I get to build more rigs more often, but am probably less satisfied with them than a high-budget rig. I keep my friends in computers too, as you do your family.
 
BonzaiDuck said:
So I doubt that HSF makers like Noctua would find it feasible to offer "ducting-kits" with their products.
Click to expand...

No, you are missing what I'm saying...

I'm not talking about a case duct (that is to say, a snorkel of sorts leading from the CPU cooler to the rear case fan, for example) all I'm saying is close up the open ends of the heat exchanger (the fins) and make the fan direct all the air through the fins of the exchanger. As it is now, air leaks out the gap between the fan and the exchanger, and, further, the open ends of the exchanger fins. If it was closed (ducted,) 100% of the air moved by the 'push' fan would go through the exchanger. Even better would be a push/pull setup (like I have on my 212+, not like Noctua's split exchanger, although it would work, too...)

The way it is now, it would be like a water cooling loop with a bypass... only allowing say 60% of the water to pass through the radiator, the rest just bypassing the radiator and going back down the pipe to the CPU again.... not very efficient.

I have a dream... a fan mount molded with and integral panel that would close off the open ends of the exchanger... all one piece. Clips on the far end that would support a pull fan optionally.

Maybe I just need to buy another 212 and start fabricating... 😕
 
Essence_of_War said:
Thermalright has at least one HSF (the HR-22) that comes with a duct-kit.
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Oh, Gee! I forgot about that! I've GOT one!! Currently deployed on my brother's E-8600 system!! Definitely true and "TRUE"!! But it's rubber-plastic, and flexible. That's why they can do it.

It might be possible to trim that sucker and make it work for a D14. I just don't think it would be quite as effective as my own duct-box. Maybe somebody could "prove" that it would be.

ONe thing I noted about it: You have to really compress it to jam it in between a 120x38mm fan and the cooler. I think they may have anticipated the use of 120x25 exhaust fans.
 
Larry, that's sort of what I'm talking about... except that specific one specs a 92mm fan and is for socket 775 and old AMD chips. I've seen the CM V8, which is absurdly designed.

...so, duct tape to the rescue, again!



...and with fans installed.

 
I wish you could have or would do some before and after temps with say linx or intel burn test from your modding. I really don't see closing off the side of the fins decreasing temps much if at all. Curious though with your results.

If you could post some before and after temps that would be great man. It's a simple thing that we could all start doing if it really helps.

In that last pic is it just one fan or is it a push pull config? I always run push pull configs on my 212 cooler, with scythe ultra kaze's.
 
Charlie98 said:
No, you are missing what I'm saying...

I'm not talking about a case duct (that is to say, a snorkel of sorts leading from the CPU cooler to the rear case fan, for example) all I'm saying is close up the open ends of the heat exchanger (the fins) and make the fan direct all the air through the fins of the exchanger. As it is now, air leaks out the gap between the fan and the exchanger, and, further, the open ends of the exchanger fins. If it was closed (ducted,) 100% of the air moved by the 'push' fan would go through the exchanger. Even better would be a push/pull setup (like I have on my 212+, not like Noctua's split exchanger, although it would work, too...)

The way it is now, it would be like a water cooling loop with a bypass... only allowing say 60% of the water to pass through the radiator, the rest just bypassing the radiator and going back down the pipe to the CPU again.... not very efficient.

I have a dream... a fan mount molded with and integral panel that would close off the open ends of the exchanger... all one piece. Clips on the far end that would support a pull fan optionally.

Maybe I just need to buy another 212 and start fabricating... 😕
Click to expand...

I've traveled through the same territory of thinking. I had completely enclosed a TRUE inside a duct-box: it had a hole cut in the bottom panel so you would drop it down over the cooler, and the bottom panel would mate up with the lowest fin. The only openings were the front and rear: air in, and air out.

But consider . . .

Air rushes in anywhere the pressure is lowest. And if you have three sides of the cooler with only a net inflow, the cooling would be more effective. It would be less effective if air going in the front is partially thrust out the sides before being exhausted from the case. I think this latter possibility is what you're describing.

But with a high-CFM exhaust ducted to the rear of the cooler -- IN COMBINATION with "high airflow" intake that really pressurizes the case -- all air flows in on three sides and out on one side.

The trick is to balance these fans so they all ramp up in unison with temperature, while choosing them so there's always more intake than exhaust, and only one place for the exhaust to go: through the cooler.

I've become a HAF addict, just for stumbling onto this. Sooner or later, I will have to kick the habit.

AFTERTHOUGHT: Another possibility is a mounting of something like a 212 cooler with the narrow side facing the exhaust (IF -- the fins are open on the narrow side!), and really pushing air through one end and out the other. That is, the wide sides of the fins are covered with duct-paneling. I'd tried that, also. At the time, it actually seemed to give a Celsius or two in improvement.
 
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fastamdman said:
I wish you could have or would do some before and after temps with say linx or intel burn test from your modding. I really don't see closing off the side of the fins decreasing temps much if at all. Curious though with your results.

If you could post some before and after temps that would be great man. It's a simple thing that we could all start doing if it really helps.

In that last pic is it just one fan or is it a push pull config? I always run push pull configs on my 212 cooler, with scythe ultra kaze's.
Click to expand...

I had done that before with TRUE's. Got data recorded in HWMonitor and uploaded the results to Excel, so it was reasonably accurate statistical analysis with very large sample sizes. Once I'd proven to myself how ducting effectiveness works, I stopped collecting data for that type of analysis, except to observe normal stress tests.

There's only so many grains of rice you can get with these techniques, just as with lapping and TIM choices. It's cheap and fairly easy -- I use foam-art-board from Michael's Arts & Crafts. It takes more in time and tedium as a "construction project" than slapping duct-tape on the sides of a cooler.

For some reason, I don't like duct-tape for much of anything, even though we stock-piled several rolls when Mom decided the "Terr-o-wists want to kill my poodle Fluffy." Haven't needed to seal off the house against chemical or biological attack. Does that stuff have a shelf life? I wonder . .
 
fastamdman said:
I wish you could have or would do some before and after temps with say linx or intel burn test from your modding. I really don't see closing off the side of the fins decreasing temps much if at all. Curious though with your results.

If you could post some before and after temps that would be great man. It's a simple thing that we could all start doing if it really helps.

In that last pic is it just one fan or is it a push pull config? I always run push pull configs on my 212 cooler, with scythe ultra kaze's.
Click to expand...

I have documented it a little in my old post here, that I may add to with this latest install (I swapped out my old Gigabyte board for the Asus Friday night, completely cleaning everything and reapplying the duct tape.) It is a push/pull setup... when I first got my 2500K I was having some serious heat problems and was doing everything I could to reduce CPU temps in LinX (what I use for stability and temp testing.) In my not very scientific results the CPU temps dropped a few degrees in LinX, that's why I really think a ducted fan/exchanger combo would be a boon to air cooling.

Air rushes in anywhere the pressure is lowest. And if you have three sides of the cooler with only a net inflow, the cooling would be more effective. It would be less effective if air going in the front is partially thrust out the sides before being exhausted from the case. I think this latter possibility is what you're describing.
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Not really. The problem with the air rushing out at the sides of the heat exchanger is the air isn't taking the heat (absorbing the heat) off the aluminum fins of the exchanger, escaping too soon. It's the same thing as my example of a liquid cooling loop with a bypass... part of the water is not there to physically absorb the heat.

The most efficient part of a fan blade is the very tip... it's the part of the actual vane that is travelling fastest... with less and less efficiency as you go toward the hub, and, of course, no help at the hub at all. You are losing the most efficient air flow almost immediately out of the gap between the fan and exchanger, and then, more so, from the open fins of the exchanger. It does take power to drive the air through the exchanger fins, however, and that's where the push/pull setup is more effective.

Here is a better shot of the gap between the fan and exchanger... I'm going to guess you lose upwards of 40% of the air out of those gaps (top and bottom.)




 
Charlie98 said:
I have documented it a little in my old post here, that I may add to with this latest install (I swapped out my old Gigabyte board for the Asus Friday night, completely cleaning everything and reapplying the duct tape.) It is a push/pull setup... when I first got my 2500K I was having some serious heat problems and was doing everything I could to reduce CPU temps in LinX (what I use for stability and temp testing.) In my not very scientific results the CPU temps dropped a few degrees in LinX, that's why I really think a ducted fan/exchanger combo would be a boon to air cooling.

Not really. The problem with the air rushing out at the sides of the heat exchanger is the air isn't taking the heat (absorbing the heat) off the aluminum fins of the exchanger, escaping too soon. It's the same thing as my example of a liquid cooling loop with a bypass... part of the water is not there to physically absorb the heat.

The most efficient part of a fan blade is the very tip... it's the part of the actual vane that is travelling fastest... with less and less efficiency as you go toward the hub, and, of course, no help at the hub at all. You are losing the most efficient air flow almost immediately out of the gap between the fan and exchanger, and then, more so, from the open fins of the exchanger. It does take power to drive the air through the exchanger fins, however, and that's where the push/pull setup is more effective.

Here is a better shot of the gap between the fan and exchanger... I'm going to guess you lose upwards of 40% of the air out of those gaps (top and bottom.)
Click to expand...

True about the fan-hub, but things vary with the design of the cooler. The only fan-hub obstruction I have with my D14 is the Viper 140"R" fan I put between the towers. The case exhaust fan is ducted to the cooler, not flush with the fins.

The exhaust fan is pulling air from three sides of the rear tower, and the 140R is pulling from three sides of the front tower. Any pressurization in the case is going to follow the airflow of the exhaust and 140R fans.

Even so, I could "focus on fly-s***" and further refine the D14 configuration -- more or less consistent with what you suggest. I just don't think it's going to add much. The ducting and AP-30 exhaust gave me another ~5C improvement in load temperatures, and my load temperatures under a common Prime95 test match those of an H110.
 
Just throwing in something I discovered on the 212 + EVO (whatever).

I have one of those in a "strickly-bidnis" machine whose time for retirement has come (LGA_775, GA-EP45-UD3R mobo).

I was going to replace it with a Z77 board and a spare SB processor I have. So I wanted to see about re-using the 212 for that purpose.

Frosty-Tech's comparison for something around 120-to-130W thermal power test has the 212 barely 2C behind the Noctua D14 in performance.

I was thinking about ordering an NH-U14S, but that is far, far from necessary. It is downright spendthrifty.

I'm also wondering how could that be true? 2C difference between a D14 and a 212? I'd better look at some more comparisons. I'd always been able to widen the gap between the cooler I'm using and the review results for it. That's how I got the D14 to match or come close to an H110.
 
My personal experience with the 212 Evo is that it supported a nice OC, it just gets annoyingly loud at full load. I've replaced its fan with an NF-A15 that keeps the CPU cooler, and runs very noticeably quieter under full load.

Your style of ducting might help with the Evo fan, though, BonzaiDuck, if you felt compelled to give it a try, I'd be interested in how it went down for you.
 
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