Congressman Foley resigned

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Sudheer Anne
I don't even think aidanjm is Republican. He's gay, and Foley is obviously gay, which is why I believe he is defending his actions.

Yeah, I don't think his position is based on party affiliation. This is a topic near and dear to his heart, and in the past he's gone as far as categorically slamming ALL straight males as being somehow less evolved than gay men. He often makes legitimate points IMO, but he can be an incredibly arrogant, insulting person, which makes his arguments harder to parse at times.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: aidanjm

There is only one person to blame - Foley himself. Then there are a heap of people on both sides of politics milking the situation for all it is worth. IMO these people are little better than Foley.

I actually agree with that.

It may be "business as usual in DC, but unlike the Swift Boat Veterans for the Truth, there concerns are based on the truth, not a pack of lies.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: Craig234
Aidanjn, one of the problems with republican apologists like yourself is the rank partisanship, inconsistency, hypocrisy in how you sing a different tune based on party.

You are out here questioning the harm of underage sex predatory behavior to defend a republican, while you would be here condemning the democrat who did the same thing.

I've long said we have a right-wing cult, not a political party, in this country now. You are showing a fine example with your bias.

It's easy to see - when the democrats do wrong, blame them, and when the republicans do wrong and the democrats blame them, blame the democrats for 'milking the situation'.

You're a pawn, a tool, for a very corrupt, manipulative party which has stolen the name and the principles of our country for their own greed, and you don't know it.

Go watch the Bill Moyers show, 'Moyers on America: Capitol Crimes', and see the facts about the group that has fooled you so.

aidanjm a Republican apologist?
LMAO :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:
There's something I never thought I'd ever see anyone post on this board.

What a n00b!

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: International Machine Consortium

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: DonVito
Jesus - that guy is a completely blackhearted scumbag for releasing the kid's identity. This kid is a young Republican who's obviously very politically active, and certainly doesn't deserve to be outed like this.

no more black hearted than the democrats who decided to turn this thing into a scandal for their own political gain. How difficult would it have been to deal with the situation quietly, forcing Foley to quietly resign and disappear. By hyping this into a huge sex scandal, they practically guaranteed this kid's life would be fvcked up to some extent.

Still blaming the messenger I see, not the a-hole that actually harmed the kid. You're twisted.

I think he is blaming the a-holes that potentially did the most harm to the kid, no? But let's be serious.

No potentially gay youth or straight youth that might be suspected of being gay is worth the potential to destroy a political foe. Politics is about winning, not ethics, no.

Firstly, it doesn't matter if the victim(s) are male or female. It has already been pointed out that this still would have been a scandel if it invloved females instead of males.

I don't think once this became know that there was anyway it wouldn't have become news (admitedly more so since it invloves a homosexual sex) and I think it should have come out. Our leaders have to follow the same laws as the rest of us, so how can someone even remotely blame the Democrats for this scandle?

 

[alien42]

from cnn:

"House Speaker Dennis Hastert will hold a briefing at 1 p.m. ET from his office in Batavia, Illinois, CNN has learned."

they just updated it to:

"The Associated Press reports House Speaker Dennis Hastert intends to remain as speaker now and for the new term of Congress in 2007, according to a GOP aide."

i guess he is not going to fold until he is forced to do so.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Firstly, it doesn't matter if the victim(s) are male or female. It has already been pointed out that this still would have been a scandel if it invloved females instead of males.

I agree, but there's no question IMO that the scandal is far more, well, scandalous because it involves boys and not girls. For better or worse, our country is still highly puritanical and many (perhaps most) Americans think homosexual sexual misconduct is worse than heterosexual conduct.

 

[alien42]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Firstly, it doesn't matter if the victim(s) are male or female. It has already been pointed out that this still would have been a scandel if it invloved females instead of males.

I agree, but there's no question IMO that the scandal is far more, well, scandalous because it involves boys and not girls. For better or worse, our country is still highly puritanical and many (perhaps most) Americans think homosexual sexual misconduct is worse than heterosexual conduct.

it is probably more accurate to say republicans instead of americans and it is that 'gay republican' irony which makes it even more scandalous.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: International Machine Consortium

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: DonVito
Jesus - that guy is a completely blackhearted scumbag for releasing the kid's identity. This kid is a young Republican who's obviously very politically active, and certainly doesn't deserve to be outed like this.

no more black hearted than the democrats who decided to turn this thing into a scandal for their own political gain. How difficult would it have been to deal with the situation quietly, forcing Foley to quietly resign and disappear. By hyping this into a huge sex scandal, they practically guaranteed this kid's life would be fvcked up to some extent.

Still blaming the messenger I see, not the a-hole that actually harmed the kid. You're twisted.

I think he is blaming the a-holes that potentially did the most harm to the kid, no? But let's be serious.

No potentially gay youth or straight youth that might be suspected of being gay is worth the potential to destroy a political foe. Politics is about winning, not ethics, no.

Firstly, it doesn't matter if the victim(s) are male or female. It has already been pointed out that this still would have been a scandel if it invloved females instead of males.

I don't think once this became know that there was anyway it wouldn't have become news (admitedly more so since it invloves a homosexual sex) and I think it should have come out. Our leaders have to follow the same laws as the rest of us, so how can someone even remotely blame the Democrats for this scandle?

I know there was no way it couldn't become news. You think it should have come out. aidanjm expressed the feeling it should have been dealt with without exposing the identity of the youth involved. If the Dems had a hand in that they have dirt on their hands. It matters little how unrealistic such a hope might be, it is ethical, empathetic, and what should be.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: aidanjm
There is only one person to blame - Foley himself. Then there are a heap of people on both sides of politics milking the situation for all it is worth. IMO these people are little better than Foley.

There is only one person to blame for Foley's predatory pedopheliac behavior -- Foley, himself.

If it is proven that Hastert, or even his staff, had any indications or warnings about Foley's behavior six weeks, six months, a year or three years ago, and he did nothing, or worse, acted to cover it up, he is either so negligent that he's unfit to be a leader of anything, or he's criminally involved in attempting to conceal Foley's dispicable behavior for political gain, and he should be removed from office immediately. There is only one person to blame for that -- Hastert, himself.

If it is proven that Hastert acted with others in that attempt, he's also part of a conspiracy to commit the same crime, and he, and anyone else who acted with him should be tried for both the underlying crime and the secondary conspiracy.

Beyond Hastert, if it is proven that anyone else of either party had any indications or warnings about Foley's behavior anytime in the past and did nothing to stop it or acted to cover it up, they have only themselves to blame for the political and criminal consequenses of their failure to protect the underage pages.

Foley is obviously the prime aggressor in this case, and the primary victims are the juvenile pages entrusted to the care of their Congressional representatives. That said, if anyone of either party knew about Foley's behavior and didn't take immediate action to stop him, they further victimize both the pages and the American voters who entrusted them to honor their oaths to uphold the laws of the land and the integrity of the offices to which they were elected, and they cast a long, dark shadow on all the institutions of our democracy.

The same is true for anyone who now tries to distract, dissemble or otherwise shift or diffuse the blame for this sorry mess. They are as guilty as Foley, himself, and anyone who ignored or covered up the initial crimes. :|

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam


I know there was no way it couldn't become news. You think it should have come out. aidanjm expressed the feeling it should have been dealt with without exposing the identity of the youth involved. If the Dems had a hand in that they have dirt on their hands. It matters little how unrealistic such a hope might be, it is ethical, empathetic, and what should be.

I don't believe that the names should have come out either and whoever did that is scum. I have a hard time believing anyone would support the realse of the names of these young people, particularly since in involves homosexuality and the stigma that carries with it in our society.

I do think the matter is of concern to the American people because I think our lawmakers should/need to be held to a higher standard in their conduct and Foley has brought this on himself with his own actions. There also needs to be a full investigation into who knew what when and let the heads roll of anybody involved in a cover-up OR leaking the names to the press.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: International Machine Consortium

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: DonVito
Jesus - that guy is a completely blackhearted scumbag for releasing the kid's identity. This kid is a young Republican who's obviously very politically active, and certainly doesn't deserve to be outed like this.

no more black hearted than the democrats who decided to turn this thing into a scandal for their own political gain. How difficult would it have been to deal with the situation quietly, forcing Foley to quietly resign and disappear. By hyping this into a huge sex scandal, they practically guaranteed this kid's life would be fvcked up to some extent.

Still blaming the messenger I see, not the a-hole that actually harmed the kid. You're twisted.

I think he is blaming the a-holes that potentially did the most harm to the kid, no? But let's be serious.

No potentially gay youth or straight youth that might be suspected of being gay is worth the potential to destroy a political foe. Politics is about winning, not ethics, no.

In short, I see nothing in aidanjm's post that don't represent an ethical stance far superior to your own.

He has cautioned that we distinguish between a pedophile and a homosexual, that we don't allow or perpetrate or fall victim to stereotypes by lumping them together, that we ascertain the actual facts.

Further he has express the desire that the young people involved in this have their identity protected for the sake of privacy and the implications to their lives and mental health, friends, families, and future. I see in his posts a high level of empathy, perhaps one born of much personal pain. I appreciate and support the views he has expressed here.

You find a person defending an adult who took sexual advantage (at least) of youths working for him to be of a superior moral fiber than someone who wants the adult punished for approaching the kids in the first place. You're certainly entitled to your opinion. It's a bizarre opinion, nonetheless.

Go back to the acid-trip induced posts. They were funny at least.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Craig234
Aidanjn, one of the problems with republican apologists like yourself is the rank partisanship, inconsistency, hypocrisy in how you sing a different tune based on party.

You are out here questioning the harm of underage sex predatory behavior to defend a republican, while you would be here condemning the democrat who did the same thing.

I've long said we have a right-wing cult, not a political party, in this country now. You are showing a fine example with your bias.

It's easy to see - when the democrats do wrong, blame them, and when the republicans do wrong and the democrats blame them, blame the democrats for 'milking the situation'.

You're a pawn, a tool, for a very corrupt, manipulative party which has stolen the name and the principles of our country for their own greed, and you don't know it.

Go watch the Bill Moyers show, 'Moyers on America: Capitol Crimes', and see the facts about the group that has fooled you so.

aidanjm a Republican apologist?
LMAO :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:
There's something I never thought I'd ever see anyone post on this board.

What a n00b!

Speaking of noise, there's some right there. Shutit clown. Your smileys are sucking bandwidth.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Firstly, it doesn't matter if the victim(s) are male or female. It has already been pointed out that this still would have been a scandel if it invloved females instead of males.

I agree, but there's no question IMO that the scandal is far more, well, scandalous because it involves boys and not girls. For better or worse, our country is still highly puritanical and many (perhaps most) Americans think homosexual sexual misconduct is worse than heterosexual conduct.

I disagree. I have daughters that age. If he had behaved in that fashion with my kids? Umm, yeah, there would definitely be trouble. The sex of the victims is IRRELEVANT. IMO, mind you.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: International Machine Consortium

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: DonVito
Jesus - that guy is a completely blackhearted scumbag for releasing the kid's identity. This kid is a young Republican who's obviously very politically active, and certainly doesn't deserve to be outed like this.

no more black hearted than the democrats who decided to turn this thing into a scandal for their own political gain. How difficult would it have been to deal with the situation quietly, forcing Foley to quietly resign and disappear. By hyping this into a huge sex scandal, they practically guaranteed this kid's life would be fvcked up to some extent.

Still blaming the messenger I see, not the a-hole that actually harmed the kid. You're twisted.

I think he is blaming the a-holes that potentially did the most harm to the kid, no? But let's be serious.

No potentially gay youth or straight youth that might be suspected of being gay is worth the potential to destroy a political foe. Politics is about winning, not ethics, no.

Firstly, it doesn't matter if the victim(s) are male or female. It has already been pointed out that this still would have been a scandel if it invloved females instead of males.

I don't think once this became know that there was anyway it wouldn't have become news (admitedly more so since it invloves a homosexual sex) and I think it should have come out. Our leaders have to follow the same laws as the rest of us, so how can someone even remotely blame the Democrats for this scandle?

I know there was no way it couldn't become news. You think it should have come out. aidanjm expressed the feeling it should have been dealt with without exposing the identity of the youth involved. If the Dems had a hand in that they have dirt on their hands. It matters little how unrealistic such a hope might be, it is ethical, empathetic, and what should be.

I'm responsible for outing the kids names?

 

[Craig234]

I don't even think aidanjm is Republican. He's gay, and Foley is obviously gay, which is why I believe he is defending his actions.

My comments were about the right-wing cult types generally mostly; I lumped him in the group based on a few posts I saw, such as his minimizing the issue of Foley acting as a predator of minors. Such behavior for most republicans would be the sort of tortuous hypocrisy you see when defending their own, and quite different than they'd comment if it were a democrat.

Thanks for pointing out more info on Aidanjm - the reason for his comments appears other than it would be for the typical republican.

Sorry, Aidanjm, for putting you in the right-wing cult I mentioned - comments stand for others in it - and we can disagree for other reasons.

You may or may not have seen my post elsewhere sympathetic to the situation of pedophiles, not for allowing them to act on their condition at all, but for better options for them to deal with it that are win-win, humane for them and reducing the risk of children being harmed. I can even agree in some small part that some of the anxiety about the harm to near-18 minors is hysterical; for a long time, humans have commonly married at young ages, including in this country. But there is an issue with harm to many minors, there is an issue of predatory sexuality, there is an issue with the violation of trust on everything from the trust of the voters for him to be honest about his views, to the parents of the children on how he would interact with the children, to his party on the political risks he'd expose them to, to the people who trusted him in appointing him to a committee overseeing protection of children from sexual predators.

The man going on tv to say people who do what he did were complete scum is a problem.

So, we mostly disagree about your minimizing comments that he shouldn't have resigned and such.

On a seperate note, one of the sad things about this incident is that most republicans *still* won't learn from it that homosexuality is not something people choose - that Foley would hardly choose to be attracted to his own gender, when the price is so high to him; their bigotry against gays is largely based on the mistaken views that being gay is like being a rapist or a thief, it's just some evil choice the people make and it should be opposed as such. Foley could be a clear example to teach them a lesson.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Hastert will take responsibility

Thinks that he can survive the Conservative backlash as well as the Democrat's onslaught.
Jumps into the crossfire.

 

[ayabe]

Last night, David Shuster claimed that there was no way Hastert would still be speaker by this time next week, according to his high level GOP contacts.

Now today everyone is saying he will stay.


Will he stay or will he go?

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Hastert will take responsibility

Thinks that he can survive the Conservative backlash as well as the Democrat's onslaught.
Jumps into the crossfire.

How can a person take responsibility and then say . . . "Democrats, Clinton, turncoat Republicans, George Soros, the media, Democratic operatives . . . "

I love this one

And he warned that when the GOP "base finds out who's feeding this monster, they're not going to be happy."

Uh, isn't it being fed by people with intimate knowledge ie pages, aides with ties to the GOP? Why would the GOP base be upset with people telling the truth?

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Well, of course, isn't it obvious, it's the people that exposed this scandal that are to blame for it!?

 

[imported_Shivetya]

Originally posted by: Todd33
How come the party of Homophobes is full of closet gays and pedophiles?

They said he would not run for re-election, he did not resign - this was MSNBC abuout 45 minutes ago.

A better question is why is the party that is supposedly "gay friendly" so willing to hang one out to dry? Why are they so willing to link gay and pedeophilia? Huh?

then again it is the same party willing to make unfounded charges of using the N word while all the same supporting the right of an ex-KKK Grand Wizard to maintain a senate seat.

Did Foley do anything illegal? The target of his affection was of legal age.

got to love the implied guilt when nothing is proved.

typical though.

 

[Todd33]

Hastert said "people funded by George Soros," a liberal billionaire who has plowed millions into this and other election campaigns, want to see the scandal blow up. And he warned that when the GOP "base finds out who's feeding this monster, they're not going to be happy."

ABC News, which broke the story last week, has said former Republican-sponsored pages ? not Democratic politicians or operatives ? were the source of revelations about lurid instant messages, after the network reported flirtatious e-mails from Foley to one page.

That's one strange way to take responsibility...

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: aidanjm
There is only one person to blame - Foley himself. Then there are a heap of people on both sides of politics milking the situation for all it is worth. IMO these people are little better than Foley.

There is only one person to blame for Foley's predatory pedopheliac behavior -- Foley, himself.

If it is proven that Hastert, or even his staff, had any indications or warnings about Foley's behavior six weeks, six months, a year or three years ago, and he did nothing, or worse, acted to cover it up, he is either so negligent that he's unfit to be a leader of anything, or he's criminally involved in attempting to conceal Foley's dispicable behavior for political gain, and he should be removed from office immediately. There is only one person to blame for that -- Hastert, himself.

If it is proven that Hastert acted with others in that attempt, he's also part of a conspiracy to commit the same crime, and he, and anyone else who acted with him should be tried for both the underlying crime and the secondary conspiracy.

Beyond Hastert, if it is proven that anyone else of either party had any indications or warnings about Foley's behavior anytime in the past and did nothing to stop it or acted to cover it up, they have only themselves to blame for the political and criminal consequenses of their failure to protect the underage pages.

Foley is obviously the prime aggressor in this case, and the primary victims are the juvenile pages entrusted to the care of their Congressional representatives. That said, if anyone of either party knew about Foley's behavior and didn't take immediate action to stop him, they further victimize both the pages and the American voters who entrusted them to honor their oaths to uphold the laws of the land and the integrity of the offices to which they were elected, and they cast a long, dark shadow on all the institutions of our democracy.

The same is true for anyone who now tries to distract, dissemble or otherwise shift or diffuse the blame for this sorry mess. They are as guilty as Foley, himself, and anyone who ignored or covered up the initial crimes. :|

Quite right, I think, but I want to allow the legal system to investigate, see if crimes were committed, and them apply the law. The conviction, it seems to me is coming before the trial along with some potentially inappropriate outrage. I thought we gave up lynchings.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Yeah, typical Republican. Say one thing out of one side of your mouth and something else out of the other. They're trying to muddy the waters.
He's not taking responsibility at all. It's a sham. He's a liar.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: International Machine Consortium
Well, of course, isn't it obvious, it's the people that exposed this scandal that are to blame for it!?

Please try to think instead of react like a wind-up toy. The blame is not with the exposure. There are questions being raised about any blame that attaches to that exposure, a separate matter entirely.

 

[CaptnKirk]

FOX News poll about Hastert - All Flowers and Roses . . .