Clinton to hand over email server to FBI

[werepossum]

Context is everything. Hillary & her electronic age predecessors all used private servers one way or another. They all acted as judge, jury & executioner as to what was deleted & what was released from either and/or both as was their right as SoS.

It was a mistake on Hillary's part to use her private server exclusively simply because it allows for this nonsensical sort of attack.

Reference reality.

SoS #1 uses 2 servers. Whatever came through their private server is deemed private & not subject to disclosure whether it was official business or not. They edited their govt account prior to release as was their right.

SoS #2 used a private server for everything, edited the contents prior to release as was their right.

There is no practical difference from a FOIA perspective. Zip. Zero. Nothing. Nada.

Well, other than in the bubble of circular right wing "logic" where any molehill can be made into a mountain to reinforce the beliefs of the faithful.

C;mon, even you can't honestly be this stupid. Hillary could delete anything on a government server, but it still exists in backups at the least and is subject to subpoena. With her hosting her own server, we can't even see what messages were there, much less subpoena specific messages, and subpoenas for specific topic messages (which would still rely on her to produce them, but would at least get her on the record under oath) only resulted in her wiping the server. As we've seen with Lerner, it's much harder (although sadly, still possible) for a powerful progressive to wipe a government server. There is a huge amount of difference.

 

[ivwshane]

C;mon, even you can't honestly be this stupid. Hillary could delete anything on a government server, but it still exists in backups at the least and is subject to subpoena. With her hosting her own server, we can't even see what messages were there, much less subpoena specific messages, and subpoenas for specific topic messages (which would still rely on her to produce them, but would at least get her on the record under oath) only resulted in her wiping the server. As we've seen with Lerner, it's much harder (although sadly, still possible) for a powerful progressive to wipe a government server. There is a huge amount of difference.

The server wasn't wiped so...
And both could be subject to subpoena so...
The DoJ has the Clinton's server and has the same option and difficulty to recover data as if it was on a government server (as you conveniently pointed out) so...

 

[PokerGuy]

The server wasn't wiped so...
And both could be subject to subpoena so...
The DoJ has the Clinton's server and has the same option and difficulty to recover data as if it was on a government server (as you conveniently pointed out) so...

Baloney. Servers are generally backed up (usually off-site). To recover something, you could go to the backed up data. If there is no backup, and the messages have been deleted, then you'd have to try and recover stuff, which is obviously a whole other ballgame. Two very different scenarios. Again, why do you suppose she used her private server to begin with if recovery of the messages was going to work the same??

 

[Jhhnn]

C;mon, even you can't honestly be this stupid. Hillary could delete anything on a government server, but it still exists in backups at the least and is subject to subpoena. With her hosting her own server, we can't even see what messages were there, much less subpoena specific messages, and subpoenas for specific topic messages (which would still rely on her to produce them, but would at least get her on the record under oath) only resulted in her wiping the server. As we've seen with Lerner, it's much harder (although sadly, still possible) for a powerful progressive to wipe a government server. There is a huge amount of difference.

Subpoena served on the basis of what, exactly?

You realize, I'm sure, that no backup is forever, that they're rolled over in both business & govt. Out with the old, in with the new. What sort of original backups do you think there might be 4 years later?

Oh, and all of what you offered is true of the RNC servers that the Bushistas used for "personal" communications as well.

Perhaps you'd care to substantiate the claim about Lerner wiping a govt server?

I don't think so.

 

[Genx87]

Subpoena served on the basis of what, exactly?

You realize, I'm sure, that no backup is forever, that they're rolled over in both business & govt. Out with the old, in with the new. What sort of original backups do you think there might be 4 years later?

Oh, and all of what you offered is true of the RNC servers that the Bushistas used for "personal" communications as well.

Perhaps you'd care to substantiate the claim about Lerner wiping a govt server?

I don't think so.

That depends of course on the retention policy put in place by the department or organization. Retention policies can be extended indefinitely if desired.

 

[ivwshane]

Baloney. Servers are generally backed up (usually off-site). To recover something, you could go to the backed up data. If there is no backup, and the messages have been deleted, then you'd have to try and recover stuff, which is obviously a whole other ballgame. Two very different scenarios. Again, why do you suppose she used her private server to begin with if recovery of the messages was going to work the same??

Because the Clinton's have been using a personal email server since 96. For someone like clinton who doesn't know shit about technology, using what she already has and is used to is the seemingly easier thing to do.

 

[ivwshane]

That depends of course on the retention policy put in place by the department or organization. Retention policies can be extended indefinitely if desired.

Was that the case at the state department? No? Then what could have been done is irrelevant.

 

[Jhhnn]

That depends of course on the retention policy put in place by the department or organization. Retention policies can be extended indefinitely if desired.

So what? Given the budget constraints imposed by Congress the possibility of any govt agency employing such policy are virtually nil.

The whole argument is ridiculous, anyway. Both the DoJ & the State Dept allow that govt employees may delete email. Unless there's some serious criminal charge leveled by the DoJ the govt will not dig through backups from eternity to satisfy FOIA requests. The notion is absurd.

 

[werepossum]

Subpoena served on the basis of what, exactly?

You realize, I'm sure, that no backup is forever, that they're rolled over in both business & govt. Out with the old, in with the new. What sort of original backups do you think there might be 4 years later?

Oh, and all of what you offered is true of the RNC servers that the Bushistas used for "personal" communications as well.

Perhaps you'd care to substantiate the claim about Lerner wiping a govt server?

I don't think so.

That's like saying we should never write anything down because at some point it's just going to cease to exist anyway. And yes, the same is true of the RNC servers, and yes, I would bet money that inappropriate sensitive discussions were moved to the RNC accounts to avoid having a record of them. The difference here is that we can't prove that. Hillary was so blatant that we CAN prove that, because she used no other email system at all. It's like the Hammer - he got busted for doing exactly what everyone else was doing, except he neglected to maintain that legal fiction.

And sorry, I meant to type that Lerner was the victim of a horrible tragedy that was not preventable by anything humanity could do now or in any conceivable point in the future. Pure coincidence that this tragedy happened right after the Republicans inquired about her behavior. Just as how it's pure coincidence that she can't testify about that behavior because she's busy upholding important principles, even though if she did testify we'd all see that she did absolutely nothing wrong and in fact should have been heavily laden with medals.

 

[werepossum]

Because the Clinton's have been using a personal email server since 96. For someone like clinton who doesn't know shit about technology, using what she already has and is used to is the seemingly easier thing to do.

For someone who "doesn't know shit about technology", she sure is good about making sure that nobody gets to see what she has done with it.

 

[cabri]

For someone who "doesn't know shit about technology", she sure is good about making sure that nobody gets to see what she has done with it.

She knows enough to play CYA.

So if she got fingered, she had plausible deniability.

Anyone really think that her 30K "personal" emails were actually wiped permanently or just removed from an actual subpoena reach.

Those emails are needed for memoirs.

 

[ivwshane]

For someone who "doesn't know shit about technology", she sure is good about making sure that nobody gets to see what she has done with it.

Really? Because from what I see the DoJ not only has her server but it also has a server that wasn't wiped!

 

[werepossum]

She knows enough to play CYA.

So if she got fingered, she had plausible deniability.

Anyone really think that her 30K "personal" emails were actually wiped permanently or just removed from an actual subpoena reach.

Those emails are needed for memoirs.

lol Could be.

Really? Because from what I see the DoJ not only has her server but it also has a server that wasn't wiped!

Hadn't seen that. We'll see if it turns out to be true.

 

[Jhhnn]

That's like saying we should never write anything down because at some point it's just going to cease to exist anyway. And yes, the same is true of the RNC servers, and yes, I would bet money that inappropriate sensitive discussions were moved to the RNC accounts to avoid having a record of them. The difference here is that we can't prove that. Hillary was so blatant that we CAN prove that, because she used no other email system at all. It's like the Hammer - he got busted for doing exactly what everyone else was doing, except he neglected to maintain that legal fiction.

And sorry, I meant to type that Lerner was the victim of a horrible tragedy that was not preventable by anything humanity could do now or in any conceivable point in the future. Pure coincidence that this tragedy happened right after the Republicans inquired about her behavior. Just as how it's pure coincidence that she can't testify about that behavior because she's busy upholding important principles, even though if she did testify we'd all see that she did absolutely nothing wrong and in fact should have been heavily laden with medals.

It' not like saying that at all, but nice diversion. The Hammer? He got caught in a peculiarity of Texas law. More of the same.

"Inappropriate sensitive discussions"? WTF does that mean, other than being some rather clever innuendo?

Lerner? Is that a diversionary double down, or what? Of course it is.

 

[Jhhnn]

She knows enough to play CYA.

So if she got fingered, she had plausible deniability.

Anyone really think that her 30K "personal" emails were actually wiped permanently or just removed from an actual subpoena reach.

Those emails are needed for memoirs.

And, uhh, so what? When the DoJ & the State Dept say that the SoS has the right to edit their official email prior to release & that version is what they release for FOIA requests. Perhaps you can explain how any FOIA subpoena can cut through that.

The short answer? No way. We arrive right back at there being no practical difference between Hillary's method and those of her predecessors. You won't get any more or less from Condi's email or from Colin's either.

 

[boomerang]

The FBI has recovered the emails Hillary said were deleted. We should now have a much better picture of just how much classified material passed through her private server. Hopefully the five month email gap, two months of which coincided with the terrorist attack in Benghazi, will now be filled in. She obviously wanted no one to see those emails and we may now find out why.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/23/u...-emails-hillary-clinton-said-were-erased.html

 

[Moonbeam]

Republicans are now starting to hope she gets the nomination. Who saw that coming?

You mean the shit sliming done by Republicans is being widely accepted as fact by pitiful Americans who are exposed to endless claims of corruption by scum bags? The party of hate and fear seeks only to win by any means. Is it any wonder that folk so disgusting can't look at themselves.

 

[PokerGuy]

The FBI has recovered the emails Hillary said were deleted. We should now have a much better picture of just how much classified material passed through her private server. Hopefully the five month email gap, two months of which coincided with the terrorist attack in Benghazi, will now be filled in. She obviously wanted no one to see those emails and we may now find out why.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/23/u...-emails-hillary-clinton-said-were-erased.html

Just because the FBI has access to the emails doesn't mean the public will get to see them. I'm sure anything that might be damaging to hildabeast will be redacted anyway.

 

[boomerang]

Just because the FBI has access to the emails doesn't mean the public will get to see them. I'm sure anything that might be damaging to hildabeast will be redacted anyway.

You may be taking my use of the word "we" a bit too literally but personally, I'm hoping for gobs and gobs of redaction's. They only do that with the secret shit so it would be further proof that classified information was on her server.

What's curious though is why we would need more proof. That's sarcasm because it's not curious at all.

 

[Moonbeam]

Just because the FBI has access to the emails doesn't mean the public will get to see them. I'm sure anything that might be damaging to hildabeast will be redacted anyway.

You lack the courage to live with uncertainty despite the fact that you actually don't know nothing and are just responding to programming. You prefer to be arrogant because you fear that not knowing anything makes you worthless. You believe that not knowing makes you stupid rather than wise. You are afraid to know you feel worthless because you believe that what you feel is real. If you felt it you would know it's a lie.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

You mean the shit sliming done by Republicans is being widely accepted as fact by pitiful Americans who are exposed to endless claims of corruption by scum bags? The party of hate and fear seeks only to win by any means. Is it any wonder that folk so disgusting can't look at themselves.

That's certainly one way to look at it and I would expect no less from you.

 

[fskimospy]

You may be taking my use of the word "we" a bit too literally but personally, I'm hoping for gobs and gobs of redaction's. They only do that with the secret shit so it would be further proof that classified information was on her server.

What's curious though is why we would need more proof. That's sarcasm because it's not curious at all.

They so not only redact secret things. Not sure where you got that latest piece of wrong information.

How much of a psycho do you have to be in order to be hoping for things you consider to be bad just because it hurts your political opponents tbough? Seek therapy.

 

[cabri]

Just because the FBI has access to the emails doesn't mean the public will get to see them. I'm sure anything that might be damaging to hildabeast will be redacted anyway.

Clinton spokesman Nick Merrill, asked about the report, said: "We've cooperated to date and will continue to do so, including answering any questions about this that anyone including the public may have."

cooperated to date: - Then why the foot dragging, the deleted information, the denials.

answering any questions including the public: - Questions may be answered without any information returned.

Notice that the FBI refuses to obey the courts regarding questions.

 

[PokerGuy]

cooperated to date: - Then why the foot dragging, the deleted information, the denials.

Yeah, their idea of "cooperation" is -- we will delete everything and do everything in our power to make sure none of this stuff is made available to anyone. Only when forced legally or by political poll numbers will we grudgingly agree to do anything.

Notice that the FBI refuses to obey the courts regarding questions.

Yep, guess who they get their marching orders from......

 

[Hugo Drax]

All Clinton had to do is turn over the servers untouched right from day one. This would have never festered into the mess it is today for her.