'Clicking' style KB and FPS gaming....
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Unless you are taking part in large tournaments and getting through to the final rounds I don't see how you would even notice the difference.
JamesV
Platinum Member
- Jul 9, 2011
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I have the BlackWidow Ultimate mechanical keyboard from Razer, and it actually improves my play, but it is a keyboard made for gaming. If you are actually using a 1995ish IBM mechanical keyboard, then yes, it probably is gimping you, but not because it is mechanical (issues that affect play like multiple keypresses, etc, with older keyboards).
With the Blackwidow, the keys register faster then a traditional keyboard, due to needing less travel to register. This is easily seen in typing, where my wpm went up by about 15 simply by using it over my G15.
With the Blackwidow, the keys register faster then a traditional keyboard, due to needing less travel to register. This is easily seen in typing, where my wpm went up by about 15 simply by using it over my G15.
wheresmybacon
Diamond Member
- Sep 10, 2004
- 3,899
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- Oct 22, 1999
- 1,655
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Yup, the wife hates the clanging/clicking/bell-ringing... 
Wow, that Razr KB sounds sweet... is it black in color ( the DAS is black).... maybe she won't notice the new one on my desktop...
All I do is buy stuff since I've been retired, sitting on my butt on the computer...
Wow, that Razr KB sounds sweet... is it black in color ( the DAS is black).... maybe she won't notice the new one on my desktop...
All I do is buy stuff since I've been retired, sitting on my butt on the computer...
The Boston Dangler
Lifer
- Mar 10, 2005
- 14,647
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good point. a native ps2 keyboard has a nearly zero latency, n-key rollover connection straight to the middle of the cpu.
- Oct 22, 1999
- 1,655
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Yup, the wife hates the clanging/clicking/bell-ringing...
Wow, that Razr KB sounds sweet... is it black in color ( the DAS is black).... maybe she won't notice the new one on my desktop... All I do is buy stuff since I've been retired, sitting on my butt on the computer...
Quite concerned with several reviews of this KB...
http://www.amazon.com/Razer-BlackWid.../dp/B003ZJ5B4I
Wow, that Razr KB sounds sweet... is it black in color ( the DAS is black).... maybe she won't notice the new one on my desktop... All I do is buy stuff since I've been retired, sitting on my butt on the computer...
Quite concerned with several reviews of this KB...
http://www.amazon.com/Razer-BlackWid.../dp/B003ZJ5B4I
The Boston Dangler
Lifer
- Mar 10, 2005
- 14,647
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i had the blackwidow ultimate and returned it in less than 24 hours. i thought it was poorly made and poorly designed.
Yup, the wife hates the clanging/clicking/bell-ringing...
Wow, that Razr KB sounds sweet... is it black in color ( the DAS is black).... maybe she won't notice the new one on my desktop... All I do is buy stuff since I've been retired, sitting on my butt on the computer...
Quite concerned with several reviews of this KB...
http://www.amazon.com/Razer-BlackWid.../dp/B003ZJ5B4I
You wouldn't want to sidegrade (or downgrade because of Razer build quality) from your current DAS to that Razer. They both use Cherry MX Blue switches (clickclick), so the noise you get with the DAS will still be there with the Razer.
Do you appreciate the tactile feedback with the MX Blues? I type (code) a ton, so the tactile feedback is quite helpful to me. As such I have a DAS Silent (MX Browns) at work and a Filco (MX Browns) at home. If you're typing correctly (not pressing the key all the way down) they are fairly quiet (but still more noisy than your regular rubber dome keyboard).
ELITEKBs is selling a Leopold 10key with MX Reds (light/linear switch; ie- not much force to press and no tactile bump like your Blues) for $89 that I'm looking at. Maybe that would interest you?
gorcorps
aka Brandon
- Jul 18, 2004
- 30,738
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All depends on what keys your keyboard has. All mechanical keys are not made the same and are made for different purposes. Some register with very little travel, and some require getting past a "halfway" mark. You probably have a typing type of keyboard which has a small travel distance before activation, which could be a brown, blue, or clear MX style switch. Ones with very quick activation are black and red switches and are usually the best for gaming because it's quick. Typing is okay but you can double enter a key at times (happens to me with black keys).
When I moved from a Dell keyboard to a logitech G15 I immediately noticed that the keystrokes registered more quickly. G15 is a really good keyboard. It's really nice to type on.
- Oct 22, 1999
- 1,655
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Thanks for great replies, folks...
I only care about the fastest KB registering my input...the Razer has had many bad reviews.
When I tried to use my USB/PS2 adaptor for the DAS KB...it didn't feel like it connected into the PS2 port, and the KB then would not work.
I didn't think of that Logitech Gamer KB... sounds like better quality than the Razer...
I only care about the fastest KB registering my input...the Razer has had many bad reviews.
When I tried to use my USB/PS2 adaptor for the DAS KB...it didn't feel like it connected into the PS2 port, and the KB then would not work.
I didn't think of that Logitech Gamer KB... sounds like better quality than the Razer...
The Boston Dangler
Lifer
- Mar 10, 2005
- 14,647
- 2
- 0
nothing yet. i'm still beating on my razer lycosa until either i or the keyboard finally give up. this was another expensive piece of razer junk.
edit:
i might get this
http://www.daskeyboard.com/model-s-professional-silent/
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destrekor
Lifer
- Nov 18, 2005
- 28,799
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I played with the regular Razer BlackWidow Ultimate (Cherry MX Blue switches), and I felt I had a greater tendency to hit a key multiple times in a row too fast, where a few presses got missed.
It's not entirely all about the travel distance required, it's also about how the actuation occurs. Pressing past half way, but not releasing past the halfway mark, can make it very challenging if not impossible to have a repeat key strike register.
The BlackWidow Ultimate Stealth Edition, on the other hand (w/MX Browns), does not have this problem. Actually, it's highly improved in every way over the other versions. No mirror finish, brown keys, bottoming out isn't nearly as loud (better materials/construction I'd wager), and it appears the longer keys are more stable too. I think the other versions had stabilizers of some sort, but Razer did a much better job with them on the Stealth models.
I don't feel a need at all to import a keyboard now, as this one is definitely everything I wanted in a keyboard.
The Boston Dangler, I feel ya... I had the Logitech G110, and then, in the journey of finding exactly what style of keyboard I'd really prefer, I bought the Lycosa.
Ugh, not for me.
Razer has always been hit and miss for me. Some products are a perfect fit, some are terrible. Shoddy materials have plagued a few devices as well.
I wasn't set entirely on Razer for a mechanical keyboard, but I could make use of Best Buy's easy return/exchange policies and handle everything locally, at least at first.
I liked the idea of a mechanical board, but the glossy finish and noise of the BW Ultimate (non-stealth) drove me nuts. I could actually handle it, but I knew the browns would be better, and Razer notified me that the Stealths were back in stock on their website.
Like I said, the Ultimate Stealth Edition I'm finding to feel really good, and feels like it will last.
Only worried about the finish holding up over time. Instead of a mirror finish, I was hoping for just matte plastic. Well it IS just that, but it also seems like it's a coating (same as the keycaps), so it all could wear down eventually.
Regardless, it is slim pickings for a backlit Cherry Brown keyboard. Only a few manufacturers offer such a model, and half of them I'd put at or below Razer in the long-term. Ducky has a comparable model, but that requires importing, and the import sites were still waiting for more product from Ducky.
It's not entirely all about the travel distance required, it's also about how the actuation occurs. Pressing past half way, but not releasing past the halfway mark, can make it very challenging if not impossible to have a repeat key strike register.
The BlackWidow Ultimate Stealth Edition, on the other hand (w/MX Browns), does not have this problem. Actually, it's highly improved in every way over the other versions. No mirror finish, brown keys, bottoming out isn't nearly as loud (better materials/construction I'd wager), and it appears the longer keys are more stable too. I think the other versions had stabilizers of some sort, but Razer did a much better job with them on the Stealth models.
I don't feel a need at all to import a keyboard now, as this one is definitely everything I wanted in a keyboard.
The Boston Dangler, I feel ya... I had the Logitech G110, and then, in the journey of finding exactly what style of keyboard I'd really prefer, I bought the Lycosa.
Ugh, not for me.
Razer has always been hit and miss for me. Some products are a perfect fit, some are terrible. Shoddy materials have plagued a few devices as well.
I wasn't set entirely on Razer for a mechanical keyboard, but I could make use of Best Buy's easy return/exchange policies and handle everything locally, at least at first.
I liked the idea of a mechanical board, but the glossy finish and noise of the BW Ultimate (non-stealth) drove me nuts. I could actually handle it, but I knew the browns would be better, and Razer notified me that the Stealths were back in stock on their website.
Like I said, the Ultimate Stealth Edition I'm finding to feel really good, and feels like it will last.
Only worried about the finish holding up over time. Instead of a mirror finish, I was hoping for just matte plastic. Well it IS just that, but it also seems like it's a coating (same as the keycaps), so it all could wear down eventually.
Regardless, it is slim pickings for a backlit Cherry Brown keyboard. Only a few manufacturers offer such a model, and half of them I'd put at or below Razer in the long-term. Ducky has a comparable model, but that requires importing, and the import sites were still waiting for more product from Ducky.
Gaming usually wants a brown, black or red switch, where actuation point is the same as the deactivation point.
The blue has an activation point that is further into the keypress than the deactivation point (key needs to rise about 1/4 of the way up before it deactivates and can register a new keypress). If you are quickly repeat pressing the same key, you can have unregistered key presses with this style of switch.
If you fully depress and fully let up on a key every press, there will be little to no difference in response. However, the brown, red and black switches allow you to "hover" a keypress near the actuation point and just shuttle back and forth across the actuation point without releasing the key for quick repeats.
That is the main difference in terms of gaming between the DAS (MX blue) and the DAS "silent" (MX brown). If you do not experience issues with repeat keypresses, then there is not really anything to gain by switching keyboards... unless you change your keypress style to take advantage of the features of a red/black/brown switch. I doubt you will see any change in response by switching to a different keyboard that also uses CherryMX switches. The main difference is in how they actuate, with blue having the tactile click and deactivation point higher, brown having a bump that can be felt but does not "click", and black and red being smooth and linear (with black having slightly higher spring force than red). AFAIK, none of this should affect keypress latencies.
The blue has an activation point that is further into the keypress than the deactivation point (key needs to rise about 1/4 of the way up before it deactivates and can register a new keypress). If you are quickly repeat pressing the same key, you can have unregistered key presses with this style of switch.
If you fully depress and fully let up on a key every press, there will be little to no difference in response. However, the brown, red and black switches allow you to "hover" a keypress near the actuation point and just shuttle back and forth across the actuation point without releasing the key for quick repeats.
That is the main difference in terms of gaming between the DAS (MX blue) and the DAS "silent" (MX brown). If you do not experience issues with repeat keypresses, then there is not really anything to gain by switching keyboards... unless you change your keypress style to take advantage of the features of a red/black/brown switch. I doubt you will see any change in response by switching to a different keyboard that also uses CherryMX switches. The main difference is in how they actuate, with blue having the tactile click and deactivation point higher, brown having a bump that can be felt but does not "click", and black and red being smooth and linear (with black having slightly higher spring force than red). AFAIK, none of this should affect keypress latencies.
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The Boston Dangler
Lifer
- Mar 10, 2005
- 14,647
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- 0
yeah, i went to best buy. something that requires a personal approval usually gets purchased in person. returning online purchases = not my cup of tea
destrekor
Lifer
- Nov 18, 2005
- 28,799
- 359
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Exactly.
Which is definitely why I was hesitant to even import a mechanical keyboard in the first place. If it's not right for me, or something goes wrong in a few months, I don't desire that headache. I'd handle it if it's the best damn board ever made, but first I had to see what styles I might or might not want, hopefully ones here. It happened to work out for me too.
I'll say this: even if it retained the faults of the basic BlackWidow (and Ultimate), I would still have ordered the Stealth direct from Razer, just so I could at least sample the Browns. And I probably would have settled, but I am glad Razer upped their game some with the features of the Ultimate Stealth Edition.
It's got true 6KRO (plus modifiers), and I confirmed it with a key utility.
No PS/2 option at the start, but a generic adapter might make it possible for true NKRO; not sure if there's anything special about a native PS/2 connector option...
But the keys feel better (subtle in some ways, superior by far on space and shift keys, at least compared to the Ultimate model I tried at first), the switches are better for gaming, it retains the better features of the original, and feels like they tried to really max their efforts on this release.
Like all Razer products, I'll get back to you in a year and see how it's doing then. If it survives that long, it should last the long-haul (except for wearing and keyshine, which is typical of almost any keycap in the long-term anyhow).
yes they are a tad slower, its a problem commonly known amongst keyboard enthusiast as hysteresis. Its when the actuation point is below the deactivation point and can commonly cause problems when double clicking as you'll need to let the key come up further than you normally would rather than ride the actuation point for some ultra fast multiple presses of a particular key
clicky boards are popular for games where assurance in single distinct and purposeful key presses are favored over a flowing dynamic range of key presses, typically your RTS/RPG vs action oriented situations
videogames101
Diamond Member
- Aug 24, 2005
- 6,777
- 19
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Keyboard response is a non-issue compared to your mouse.
(I could see it having an impact in Quake, maybe, but that's about it.)
(I could see it having an impact in Quake, maybe, but that's about it.)
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