China to Ban Sale of Fossil Fuel Cars in Electric Vehicle Push

[mect]

I'm surprised instead they don't plan to stop selling fossil fuel by this date. Note that this would not prevent people from driving ICEs, it would just require the use of biofuels in these engines. There's nothing inherently wrong with gasoline so long as its coming from a renewable source that isn't increasing the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere.

 

[Ajay]

Driving to work is one of the best experiences you have?

I think the 'everyday' part of that sentence is important here, lolol.

 

[Ajay]

If China is making this move - I think it's mainly to lock up domestic and European car sales (the next great Chinese conquest has arrived?).

 

[Puffnstuff]

If China is making this move - I think it's mainly to lock up domestic and European car sales (the next great Chinese conquest has arrived?).

I think of it as more of an environmental move than anything else. They can kill two birds with one stone by going all EV early.

 

[Ajay]

I think of it as more of an environmental move than anything else. They can kill two birds with one stone by going all EV early.

China has two problems, pollution and under-employment. The latter is considered to be the greater problem because unrest quickly causes problems for the pseudo-communist rulers.

 

[local]

Driving to work is one of the best experiences you have?

In the standard Monday through Friday daily routine, yes. I'm not a foodie so eating is just fuel, work is usually not that entertaining and when I get home I have two 3 year olds, an 18 month old and a wife all losing their minds to deal with. So the hour and a half a day I get all to myself with no distractions, listening to whatever I want and getting to drive is great. If I had to drive an Accord or Prius or something I would probably drive off a bridge on purpose.

I just got home after driving 220ish miles mostly on a two lane road that took 30 minutes longer than the quickest route just so I could drive on a more entertaining road. I like to drive and I require my vehicles to be fun to drive as well.

 

[WelshBloke]

In the standard Monday through Friday daily routine, yes. I'm not a foodie so eating is just fuel, work is usually not that entertaining and when I get home I have two 3 year olds, an 18 month old and a wife all losing their minds to deal with. So the hour and a half a day I get all to myself with no distractions, listening to whatever I want and getting to drive is great. If I had to drive an Accord or Prius or something I would probably drive off a bridge on purpose.

I just got home after driving 220ish miles mostly on a two lane road that took 30 minutes longer than the quickest route just so I could drive on a more entertaining road. I like to drive and I require my vehicles to be fun to drive as well.

The time I get with the wife and kids in the week is definitely the best bits of the week for me! Enjoy the kids while they are young, they'll soon be too old to want to play silly games with dad!

 

[local]

The time I get with the wife and kids in the week is definitely the best bits of the week for me! Enjoy the kids while they are young, they'll soon be too old to want to play silly games with dad!

Yeah I keep telling myself that. And honestly I can handle them it is the end of her rope wife that drives me nuts. She has to deal with them all day and is spent by the time I get there.

 

[Bitek]

The switch from ICE to another power source such as electric is inevitable sometime in the next couple decades. The vast majority of people can get by with the reduced ranges that are available now. But people like me will still require the flexibility that is offered by gasoline to drive larger vehicles hundreds of miles a day with refills taking only a couple of minutes for the rest of our lives. So until we get 3/4 ton trucks and larger vehicles with 1,000 mile ranges or near instant recharge they will not go away.

There just isn't anything viable out there that can beat the portability of gasoline/diesel. Look at Houston and Florida, a tanker of fuel can support a lot of rescue and recovery operations in an area where power is simply not available. This is the reason I support hydrogen over electric.

That isn't to say that in 20 years many of the issues couldn't be solved though it would just require great advances in supercapacitors, portable power generation and storage that I am not sure will be ready by then.

I don't think that's really the point, needing to convert heavy duty applications over to EV.

A very large majority of the traffic on the road is short trip commuters, with no need for huge payload capacity and range. ICE is great for this, and will likely be the technology for these HD apps for decades.

Converting the commuters over to EV is the win. Electrics are awesome, provided we get the batteries good enough to power fun ones.

The battle I'm watching is the guys who drive big pickups and only haul groceries and the occasional 2x4. Many of the trucks are underutilized, but will buyers want to stick with them when the rest of the non-commercial vehicles have gone EV?

 

[Bitek]

98% of your real life driving has nothing to do with fun, excitement, or performance. It is abject misery getting from home to shitty place A to shitty place B and back to home, sitting in wretched, deplorable traffic. There is literally zero value to be gained from inefficient RWD vehicles when it comes to the actual use of real cars in the world today--not the fantasies presented to us on TV ads.

Perhaps there is still some place in closed circuits and desolate country roads where your primary obstacle would be a wandering cow, but I can't imagine a worthwhile defense of a design meant for efficiency, general use, and "better shuffling from point to point in steal prisons" that would support RWD.

My daily commute is mostly on empty country roads. No cows, but they are bailing hay right now and the big tractors move slow. Deer are a hazard tho...

Hills, rivers, scenic country roads. Love my commute and love my car to go ripping around on it. The turbo is a blast, but I would gladly take a high output awd EV with ground pounding torque at 0 rpms, all tunable by computer programming.

Will miss the manual shifting tho....

 

[Bitek]

Does not compute...

An oxymoron if I ever read one...

 

[local]

I don't think that's really the point, needing to convert heavy duty applications over to EV.

A very large majority of the traffic on the road is short trip commuters, with no need for huge payload capacity and range. ICE is great for this, and will likely be the technology for these HD apps for decades.

Converting the commuters over to EV is the win. Electrics are awesome, provided we get the batteries good enough to power fun ones.

The battle I'm watching is the guys who drive big pickups and only haul groceries and the occasional 2x4. Many of the trucks are underutilized, but will buyers want to stick with them when the rest of the non-commercial vehicles have gone EV?

I mostly wrote that to counter the people that think gasoline should be banned or that all ICE will be banned, it isn't happening.

The short trip commuters or people like my wife that really only use a vehicle for store runs/kid transport are in a much better position to use electric, I just personally don't like it.

If you were on the road with me during my commute you would probably ask why I need to drive a truck as it is always empty. The answer is I don't need a truck most days but may have to haul several thousand pounds if needed at any given moment. The moment I don't have that capability my employer is going to ask me why they are giving me $800 a month and paying for my fuel to drive my own vehicle if it cannot do what is needed.

 

[Bitek]

I mostly wrote that to counter the people that think gasoline should be banned or that all ICE will be banned, it isn't happening.

The short trip commuters or people like my wife that really only use a vehicle for store runs/kid transport are in a much better position to use electric, I just personally don't like it.

If you were on the road with me during my commute you would probably ask why I need to drive a truck as it is always empty. The answer is I don't need a truck most days but may have to haul several thousand pounds if needed at any given moment. The moment I don't have that capability my employer is going to ask me why they are giving me $800 a month and paying for my fuel to drive my own vehicle if it cannot do what is needed.

I also agree that ICE is not going away anytime soon. I wouldn't be shocked to see them around in some form a century from now for applications where weight, power and range are crucial. Technology is proven, and energy density of burning carbons won't be beat by electron storage.

I do get a laugh out of the dudes driving $60k trucks, only tow once or twice a year, and would never dump a load of rocks in the bed as it would fuck up their paint.

Besides, if you really need say, gravel, a yard or two that fits in a bed is barely anything, shoveling it out of a tall truck bed would suck balls anyway, and you are best off getting the 40,000 lbs you need delivered in a triaxle dump truck like a real work man. The truck commercials are bullshit.

I tell this to my brother who owns a 4dr hemi ram, who tows a 3000lbs camper a few weekends a year, and tries to keep the bed liner cherry.

But he could tow 5 horses if he wanted to. Lol

 

[Ajay]

Yeah I keep telling myself that. And honestly I can handle them it is the end of her rope wife that drives me nuts. She has to deal with them all day and is spent by the time I get there.

Buy here an electric cattle prod for Christmas?