China to Ban Sale of Fossil Fuel Cars in Electric Vehicle Push

[sdifox]

Claims of revolutionary developments should be treated carefully given how many before were not commercially viable, have been exaggerated, or were outright frauds. The secrecy surrounding the technology doesn't give much room for analysis.

Like I said, remains to be seen. I just hope it's more Volta than Rossi.

I like what Daniel Nocera is doing, from sunlight and water direct to fuel.

http://sustainableskies.org/daniel-nocera-returns-to-the-artificial-leaf/

 

[cytg111]

Like I said, remains to be seen. I just hope it's more Volta than Rossi.

I like what Daniel Nocera is doing, from sunlight and water direct to fuel.

http://sustainableskies.org/daniel-nocera-returns-to-the-artificial-leaf/

I am thinking climate control right off the bat... wonder if that would be feasable/scaleable...

 

[fskimospy]

Remember when a common climate change denier argument was that even if climate change were real China and India wouldn't do anything to curb their emissions so we shouldn't either? Strange how none of them ever came back to admit they were wrong.

Just kidding, it's not strange. They just moved on to new excuses.

 

[1prophet]

only downside is what the hell do you do in the event of a power cut? can't come to work. the cars dead due to a power cut?

anyway i wouldn't be surprised if china talks about these plans with EU countries who are doing the same thing and possibly california too,

You mean like during Hurricane Sandy when people had to travel very far in order to gas up because lack of power means lack of gas.

After Sandy, gas lines stretch for miles
Motorists in New York and New Jersey are lining up for gas in queues that are miles long in the wake of Superstorm Sandy.

One year after Superstorm Sandy wreaked havoc on East Coast power supplies and immobilized countless gas stations, many consumers are wondering whether they'll be able to fuel up if another storm of Sandy's magnitude hits again.

In parts of New York and New Jersey, where Sandy packed the most punch, motorists recall how difficult it was to find open gas stations—and how to survive their lines even if they did. In New Jersey, drivers were asked to comply with alternate license plate fueling, an emergency provision put into place by Gov. Chris Christie to help ration limited gasoline supplies.

The problems at the pump were many: Power outages across the East left stations without backup power generators unable to operate to dispense the supplies that they had on hand; power issues and flooding at major refineries crimped supply from getting to stations at all. Even further complicating matters, the Colonial Pipeline system, the region's main conduit for the transport of fuel supplies, couldn't pump from its Linden, N.J., fueling station.

 

[Denly]

I would assume EV range will be greatly improve in the next 10yrs, not only by improved battery but also the way car regen electricity. Isn't Audi working on capturing energy thus suspension movement? Also solar roof?

As for where the electricity come from, NA have millions and millions of flat roof plaza, box store, warehouse and offices. Just put some on top of them. No engineer but it shouldn't be too hard, I am seeing more and more on top of 30-40 years old building.

 

[brycejones]

The car doesn't sell?

Chevy Bolt EV outsells the Volt plug-in for two months straight

"The gap is likely to grow now that the Bolt EV is available nationwide.


2016 was the Chevrolet Volt's best year ever, thanks to a brand-new design and improved performance. It's on track for another good year, but a newcomer has quickly surpassed it.

For the last two months, the Chevrolet Bolt EV has outsold the Chevrolet Volt. Chevy sold 1,971 Bolts in July and 2,107 in August. By comparison, Chevy pushed just 1,518 and 1,445 Volts out the door in July and August, respectively.

As The Truth About Cars points out, the Bolt EV sold better in August than the Mercedes-Benz CLA-Class, Mazda CX-9, Jaguar F-Pace, Audi A3 and plenty more."

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/chevy-bolt-ev-outsells-the-volt-plug-in-for-two-months-straight/


Chevy Bolt may outsell every other EV short of the Tesla Model S
And the car has only been available nationwide for a short time.

"The Chevy Bolt EV has only been on sale nationwide for a short while, but it's already on pace to outsell every other electric car on the market, save for the Tesla Model S."

https://www.autoblog.com/2017/09/08...ll-every-other-ev-short-of-the-tesla-model-s/


Chevrolet Bolt EV Leads All in August Plug-in Electrified Car Sales

"Just in time for Chevrolet’s announcement that it’s available nationwide, the Bolt EV has finished a sales month ahead of every other plug-in electrified vehicle sold in the U.S.

At least, it probably did assuming Tesla Model S sales estimated just 7 units less than the Bolt’s 2,107 August sales is accurate."

http://www.hybridcars.com/chevrolet-bolt-ev-leads-all-in-august-plug-in-electrified-car-sales/

Obviously this car is a failure and it's all thanks to the bloody "ilk".

I am shocked that Underoos was once again was played by some guy pushing an agenda in a you-tube video.

 

[local]

You mean like during Hurricane Sandy when people had to travel very far in order to gas up because lack of power means lack of gas.

Everyone is screwed in that case I'm thinking more along the line of localized power outages like when my town lost power for a week due to a tornado several years ago. In that instance we could drive to the next town 10 miles away and fill up then bring the fuel back to our town for the generators. The lack of electricity had zero effect on our ability to travel.

But even in a disaster scenario it is much easier to truck in liquid fuel to resupply the responders, and eventually civilians, than to truck in generators and the fuel for them to recharge the vehicles or to bring in fresh batteries. The main advantage of our current fuels over electricity is its portability. Power to weight ratio is greatly in favor of liquid fuels as an 85kwh Tesla battery is something like 1,200 lbs for under 300 mile range in a tiny Model S. I can get the same range out of only 150 lbs of diesel in my 15mpg F250.

 

[Ajay]

Like I said, remains to be seen. I just hope it's more Volta than Rossi.

I like what Daniel Nocera is doing, from sunlight and water direct to fuel.

http://sustainableskies.org/daniel-nocera-returns-to-the-artificial-leaf/

This guy is brilliant and eccentric (based on his TEDx talk). There are interesting discoveries occurring, broadly, in the energy field. This issues are always the same, scalability (engineering problem) and the economics & politics of deployment (which are coupled). The 'artificial leaf' poses and additional question of the side effects of setting a designer bacteria 'free' into the environment and the potential unintended consequences that may occur (meaning long term studies are necessary).

In any case, thanks for the link - like this and the saline 'fuel' link from earlier - let us hope that we will have productive alternatives to choose from. I doubt a single solution is going to solve all our our energy issues and needs.

 

[Genx87]

I'll buy an electric vehicle when it can:
go 400 miles between charges
be the equivalent of a 1/2 ton pickup
tow 7500 pounds (boat)
refuel (recharge) in 5 minutes
cost the same as a Silverado 1500 LTZ/F150 Raptor without government tax credits

FCEV would work for you. Hope govt doesnt get in the way of this technology and force\incentivize battery only vehicles upon us. But lobby money is money well spent.

 

[Zorba]

Current fast charging like Tesla's can get 80% in 30 min. Future standards will be even faster.

I used to do a 850 mile trip multiple times a year, with one 30 minute stop to fuel, piss and eat. In a Tesla, I'd have to have 4 to 5 30 minute stops. That would've increased my travel time by 20%, screw that.

Ever time I drive anywhere, I generally only make one stop every ~450 miles and it is generally for 30 minutes or less. Who wants to stop every two hours for 30 minutes to refuel their car?

 

[Commodus]

FCEV would work for you. Hope govt doesnt get in the way of this technology and force\incentivize battery only vehicles upon us. But lobby money is money well spent.

I believe hydrogen vehicles still get an incentive. As it is, I don't think we have to worry about the government playing favorites, because hydrogen and similar fuel-based tech still has an uphill battle. To me, fuel cells and hybrids are really just stopgap solutions for many people -- the ultimate goal is pure electric driving. It's just a question of how long it takes before EVs meet the range and recharging speed requirements of long-distance drivers.

 

[sdifox]

This guy is brilliant and eccentric (based on his TEDx talk). There are interesting discoveries occurring, broadly, in the energy field. This issues are always the same, scalability (engineering problem) and the economics & politics of deployment (which are coupled). The 'artificial leaf' poses and additional question of the side effects of setting a designer bacteria 'free' into the environment and the potential unintended consequences that may occur (meaning long term studies are necessary).

In any case, thanks for the link - like this and the saline 'fuel' link from earlier - let us hope that we will have productive alternatives to choose from. I doubt a single solution is going to solve all our our energy issues and needs.

I would guess the reaction chamber is sealed. Add a ring of uv led if you want extra safety

 

[Thebobo]

I believe hydrogen vehicles still get an incentive. As it is, I don't think we have to worry about the government playing favorites, because hydrogen and similar fuel-based tech still has an uphill battle. To me, fuel cells and hybrids are really just stopgap solutions for many people -- the ultimate goal is pure electric driving. It's just a question of how long it takes before EVs meet the range and recharging speed requirements of long-distance drivers.

Yea for now a $8,000 federal tax credit and in california a $5,000 rebate. And for now a H vehicle is only really viable in parts of the country, with california taking the lead. According to the Energy department website there are only 4 stations on the east. Fleet vehicles would work well UPS USPS Fedex and there are a ton of Govt Vehicles in the DC area. Of course the same could be said with electrics. Infact all our new fleet vehicles are hybrid/flexible fuel vehicles.

https://www.afdc.energy.gov/fuels/hydrogen_locations.html

Also check out this.

Home Hydrogen Fueling Stations http://www.hydrogencarsnow.com/index.php/home-hydrogen-fueling-stations/

 

[Puffnstuff]

It looks like VW will be the first automaker to market mainstream EV's with rear wheel drive to the masses.
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4055979-volkswagen-launch-30-new-electric-cars-yes-30

 

[1sikbITCH]

I can't imagine that my beloved 'Vette that I've owned since 1978, my nice and nasty Z28 and my wife's custom turbo'd G35 will be perma banned from the streets any time in the future.

That's pretty much sacrilegious in our nation full of car enthusiasts, if not the free world.

Can't see that happening. Ever. (wishful thinking?)

The prophesy foretells of this:

My uncle has a country place, that no-one knows about
He says it used to be a farm, before the Motor Law
Sundays I elude the ‘Eyes’, and hop the Turbine Freight
To far outside the Wire, where my white-haired uncle waits

Jump to the ground
As the Turbo slows to cross the borderline
Run like the wind
As excitement shivers up and down my spine
Down in his barn
My uncle preserved for me an old machine –
For fifty-odd years
To keep it as new has been his dearest dream

I strip away the old debris, that hides a shining car
A brilliant red Barchetta, from a better, vanished time
Fire up the willing engine, responding with a roar!
Tires spitting gravel, I commit my weekly crime…

Wind in my hair –
Shifting and drifting –
Mechanical music
Adrenalin surge –

Well-weathered leather
Hot metal and oil
The scented country air
Sunlight on chrome
The blur of the landscape
Every nerve aware

Suddenly ahead of me, across the mountainside
A gleaming alloy air-car shoots towards me, two lanes wide
I spin around with shrieking tires, to run the deadly race
Go screaming through the valley as another joins the chase

Drive like the wind
Straining the limits of machine and man
Laughing out loud
With fear and hope, I’ve got a desperate plan
At the one-lane bridge
I leave the giants stranded
At the riverside
Race back to the farm
To dream with my uncle
At the fireside…

 

[K1052]

I used to do a 850 mile trip multiple times a year, with one 30 minute stop to fuel, piss and eat. In a Tesla, I'd have to have 4 to 5 30 minute stops. That would've increased my travel time by 20%, screw that.

Ever time I drive anywhere, I generally only make one stop every ~450 miles and it is generally for 30 minutes or less. Who wants to stop every two hours for 30 minutes to refuel their car?

Personally I like to get out and stretch my legs every three hours or so (plus take a piss, grab a snack/drink, check email) if I'm driving long distance. I'm not a long haul trucker trying to get a load somewhere on a schedule. As battery density/capacity increases and fast charging rates climb this will be less and less of an issue.

 

[Ajay]

I would guess the reaction chamber is sealed. Add a ring of uv led if you want extra safety

Well, no matter what is done, it will get out if large scale use occurs.

 

[1sikbITCH]

Personally I like to get out and stretch my legs every three hours or so (plus take a piss, grab a snack/drink, check email) if I'm driving long distance. I'm not a long haul trucker trying to get a load somewhere on a schedule. As battery density/capacity increases and fast charging rates climb this will be less and less of an issue.

Agreed and at some point cars will likely be charged over the air from towers or from materials incorporated into our building materials or any number of new and exciting ways. Everywhere you go your car, phone, and everything else will just be charging all the time.
As long as you don't drive off the grid you should be able to drive non-stop.

 

[kage69]

It looks like VW will be the first automaker to market mainstream EV's with rear wheel drive to the masses.
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4055979-volkswagen-launch-30-new-electric-cars-yes-30

I don't understand the fascination with rear wheel drive. Sounds like something you develop not having to deal with real winters. In states with boring topographies.

 

[local]

I don't understand the fascination with rear wheel drive. Sounds like something you develop not having to deal with real winters. In states with boring topographies.

RWD came first. The benefits of RWD add fun, excitement and performance. The benefits of FWD add utility. There is a reason pretty much every performance and exotic car is RWD or AWD with a rear wheel bias. Electric RWD adds the benefits of FWD to RWD while sacrificing nothing.

 

[Puffnstuff]

The prophesy foretells of this:

My uncle has a country place, that no-one knows about
He says it used to be a farm, before the Motor Law
Sundays I elude the ‘Eyes’, and hop the Turbine Freight
To far outside the Wire, where my white-haired uncle waits

Jump to the ground
As the Turbo slows to cross the borderline
Run like the wind
As excitement shivers up and down my spine
Down in his barn
My uncle preserved for me an old machine –
For fifty-odd years
To keep it as new has been his dearest dream

I strip away the old debris, that hides a shining car
A brilliant red Barchetta, from a better, vanished time
Fire up the willing engine, responding with a roar!
Tires spitting gravel, I commit my weekly crime…

Wind in my hair –
Shifting and drifting –
Mechanical music
Adrenalin surge –

Well-weathered leather
Hot metal and oil
The scented country air
Sunlight on chrome
The blur of the landscape
Every nerve aware

Suddenly ahead of me, across the mountainside
A gleaming alloy air-car shoots towards me, two lanes wide
I spin around with shrieking tires, to run the deadly race
Go screaming through the valley as another joins the chase

Drive like the wind
Straining the limits of machine and man
Laughing out loud
With fear and hope, I’ve got a desperate plan
At the one-lane bridge
I leave the giants stranded
At the riverside
Race back to the farm
To dream with my uncle
At the fireside…

I still remember the very first time I listened to Red Barchetta and how it made me think of the future and I made the link easier to access.

 

[zinfamous]

RWD came first. The benefits of RWD add fun, excitement and performance. The benefits of FWD add utility. There is a reason pretty much every performance and exotic car is RWD or AWD with a rear wheel bias. Electric RWD adds the benefits of FWD to RWD while sacrificing nothing.

98% of your real life driving has nothing to do with fun, excitement, or performance. It is abject misery getting from home to shitty place A to shitty place B and back to home, sitting in wretched, deplorable traffic. There is literally zero value to be gained from inefficient RWD vehicles when it comes to the actual use of real cars in the world today--not the fantasies presented to us on TV ads.

Perhaps there is still some place in closed circuits and desolate country roads where your primary obstacle would be a wandering cow, but I can't imagine a worthwhile defense of a design meant for efficiency, general use, and "better shuffling from point to point in steal prisons" that would support RWD.

 

[Ajay]

98% of your real life driving has nothing to do with fun, excitement, or performance. It is abject misery getting from home to shitty place A to shitty place B and back to home, sitting in wretched, deplorable traffic. There is literally zero value to be gained from inefficient RWD vehicles when it comes to the actual use of real cars in the world today--not the fantasies presented to us on TV ads.

Perhaps there is still some place in closed circuits and desolate country roads where your primary obstacle would be a wandering cow, but I can't imagine a worthwhile defense of a design meant for efficiency, general use, and "better shuffling from point to point in steal prisons" that would support RWD.

Uh, off your meds? Do we need to provide numbers for suicide hotlines?

 

[zinfamous]

Uh, off your meds? Do we need to provide numbers for suicide hotlines?

what are you talking about? have you ever crossed the Bay Bridge in empty traffic or seen miles of empty road ahead of you on I 95 during rush hour? Do you actually drive, or not? Is it painful reminding people that the actual experience of daily driving is a chore that everyone hates?

 

[R0H1T]

98% of your real life driving has nothing to do with fun, excitement, or performance. It is abject misery getting from home to shitty place A to shitty place B and back to home, sitting in wretched, deplorable traffic. There is literally zero value to be gained from inefficient RWD vehicles when it comes to the actual use of real cars in the world today--not the fantasies presented to us on TV ads.

Perhaps there is still some place in closed circuits and desolate country roads where your primary obstacle would be a wandering cow, but I can't imagine a worthwhile defense of a design meant for efficiency, general use, and "better shuffling from point to point in steal prisons" that would support RWD.

Tbf there's more than just a stray cow or two that we have to deal with, over here.
Apart from that I'd argue the magic number should be 99% for most people who drive cars, in cities or towns, an effin nightmare all over the world!