Chicago Mayhem

[smackababy]

I'm curious as to why some cities seem to "specialize" in certain types of crime. So NO is the murder capital of the US, but it's actually low in other types of violent crime. Another weird one is that Ohio cities dominate in burglary being 1rst, 2nd 3rd and 7th in the country. Is a certain type of crime endemic to local cultures? Are the police in different cities better or worse at combating different types of crime?

I think it is a product of both cultural "acceptance" and police being simply ill equipped to handle that type of crime.

The decriminalization of pot has little to do with Obama and more with the general population pushing for it. Illinois, as of a few days ago, had already passed medical pot legalization legislation through and were waiting for the governor to sign it into law. I'd be very surprised if he does not sign it.

And the idea that liberals and Obama are trying to use Chicago's gun violence rate as indication to push gun control is laughable. If indeed they are, anyone can point out that even at 12,000 gun homicides a year, we are less than half of at least one year in the 90's. Gun violence might be slightly on the rise, but it is down compared to the 90's. IIRC, at least one year at over 30,000.

 

[randomrogue]

If anything it's about the ability to fence the goods. Look up car thefts in San Diego for example. They strip the cars or sell them in Mexico.

There's probably an organized crime part of it as well. Maybe Ohio has a really well established crime syndicate that specializes in home burglary.

 

[Zargon]

I think it is a product of both cultural "acceptance" and police being simply ill equipped to handle that type of crime.

The decriminalization of pot has little to do with Obama and more with the general population pushing for it. Illinois, as of a few days ago, had already passed medical pot legalization legislation through and were waiting for the governor to sign it into law. I'd be very surprised if he does not sign it.

And the idea that liberals and Obama are trying to use Chicago's gun violence rate as indication to push gun control is laughable. If indeed they are, anyone can point out that even at 12,000 gun homicides a year, we are less than half of at least one year in the 90's. Gun violence might be slightly on the rise, but it is down compared to the 90's. IIRC, at least one year at over 30,000.

did you just use logic to try and explain political behavior? LOL 🙂


but seriously, are you talking about chicago's decriminalization? I didnt say anything about that relating to Obama


found an article backing what I said

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...pot-possession-pot-ticket-ordinance-marijuana

Several of aldermen spoke about how the black and Hispanic communities are disproportionately affected by the city’s current policy to arrest people who possess small amounts of marijuana.

“If you had been white and privileged, marijuana has already been decriminalized,” said Ald. Howard Brookins, 21st,who spoke in favor of the measure. “The only people arrested for these crimes have been black and brown individuals. . .This is a way to potentially level the playing field.”

 

[woolfe9998]

its because the last mayor and current obama cronie mayor want to ban guns across the whole state and the media is playing right into it.

the wiki date posted is from 2011

2012 was record breaking for murders, and 2013 is on pace with it as well though.


chicago coddles the shit out themselves

they decriminalized possession of small amounts of weed to curb 'racial profiling of young african americans'

seriously

they cited that as a reason for it.

I checked around and there was a homicide spike in Chicago in 2012, but it's still nowhere near the top murder city on a per capita basis. It isn't even half the per capita rate of New Orleans.

As for your ideological conclusions about gun control, it hardly explains why NY's homicide rate continues to decline and is in fact getting to near suburban levels when NY state is one of the most gun controlled states in the U.S. I'm not a fan of gun control and I doubt it reduces gun crime much, particularly as the number of guns in circulation is so high now that it's an exercise in futility. However, I highly doubt the baseless claims of gun control causing higher crime. Crime is affected by at least 10 different variables. Correlation does not equal causation.

I guess there is a new gun control measure in NY now so we'll see what happens with the homicide rate in upcoming years.

 

[woolfe9998]

And the idea that liberals and Obama are trying to use Chicago's gun violence rate as indication to push gun control is laughable. If indeed they are, anyone can point out that even at 12,000 gun homicides a year, we are less than half of at least one year in the 90's. Gun violence might be slightly on the rise, but it is down compared to the 90's. IIRC, at least one year at over 30,000.

I agree. Crime in general is way down from the 90's, almost all forms of it, whether gun related or not. Exceptions may be computer related crimes like identity theft and hacking.

I'm not even sure if there is a spike in gun violence nationally. There was in Chicago last year but that is one city.

 

[smackababy]

did you just use logic to try and explain political behavior? LOL 🙂


but seriously, are you talking about chicago's decriminalization? I didnt say anything about that relating to Obama


found an article backing what I said

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...pot-possession-pot-ticket-ordinance-marijuana

The reality is, the decriminalization of pot (it is not a ticketable offense) isn't so much about black and Latinos being targeted. The nation as a whole is moving towards total decriminalization of pot. The guy who said that is trying to build support for whatever from the minority community.

 

[BigDH01]

I think it is a product of both cultural "acceptance" and police being simply ill equipped to handle that type of crime.

And the idea that liberals and Obama are trying to use Chicago's gun violence rate as indication to push gun control is laughable. If indeed they are, anyone can point out that even at 12,000 gun homicides a year, we are less than half of at least one year in the 90's. Gun violence might be slightly on the rise, but it is down compared to the 90's. IIRC, at least one year at over 30,000.

The dropoff in murders in Chicago started around 1995. I wonder what caused the sudden decrease. It doesn't prove causation, but if I really wanted to reduce violent crime in Chicago I'd probably worry little about guns and be more concerned with access to birth control.

 

[smackababy]

The dropoff in murders in Chicago started around 1995. I wonder what caused the sudden decrease. It doesn't prove causation, but if I really wanted to reduce violent crime in Chicago I'd probably worry little about guns and be more concerned with access to birth control.

I think a lot of the violence associated with poor areas is due to the nature of available improvements in quality of life. If I am from a poor, broken family in an inner city I could work extremely hard in school, get lucky and be able to afford college, and then graduate and make $40k a year OR I can start early in the drug game and make $15k a week by the time I am 21. The problem is drug dealers have to use violence in order to keep territory and keep making money. Violence just breeds more violence.

Until we change our culture to stop idolizing people who are violent, we won't stop youth from thinking it is more honorable to make thousands selling drugs and shooting people than it is to work hard at a minimum wage job, work your way up to head of the company, and make millions.

 

[BigDH01]

I think a lot of the violence associated with poor areas is due to the nature of available improvements in quality of life. If I am from a poor, broken family in an inner city I could work extremely hard in school, get lucky and be able to afford college, and then graduate and make $40k a year OR I can start early in the drug game and make $15k a week by the time I am 21. The problem is drug dealers have to use violence in order to keep territory and keep making money. Violence just breeds more violence.

The vast, vast, majority of drug dealers make less than minimum wage. Either the youth are confused about their life dealing drugs, they literally have no other choice, or are drawn to this lifestyle. I'm not sure how you really correct the last two, but I imagine these problems become more surmountable with fewer people to deal with who belong to these categories.

 

[chucky2]

The youth in these areas just have a clear lack of seriousness about the future of their life. They simply just don't really care. It's fun to F off and 'be thug', so that's what they do. By the time they're 4-5, they're F'd. You can't grow up with a hood mom (dad long gone and/or hood also) and get yourself out of it.

That's why everyone is so happy when they hear a success story: They're so Fing rare it's nice to hear that at least someone got out.

 

[smackababy]

The vast, vast, majority of drug dealers make less than minimum wage. Either the youth are confused about their life dealing drugs, they literally have no other choice, or are drawn to this lifestyle. I'm not sure how you really correct the last two, but I imagine these problems become more surmountable with fewer people to deal with who belong to these categories.

Being from an area not considered the best and being friends with quite a few of these undesirable types (read drug dealers), I understand the culture of starting off not making much but eventually moving up the ladder. The thing is, you can start at 10 being a bag boy and by the time you are in high school, you are a dealer with people under you. You don't just show up and are high level guy, you start from the bottom. I know a few people making over $15k a week who don't deal with the end users at all. They all carry guns because it is a lot easier to move up that ladder when a rung above your is 'removed.'

 

[BigDH01]

Being from an area not considered the best and being friends with quite a few of these undesirable types (read drug dealers), I understand the culture of starting off not making much but eventually moving up the ladder. The thing is, you can start at 10 being a bag boy and by the time you are in high school, you are a dealer with people under you. You don't just show up and are high level guy, you start from the bottom. I know a few people making over $15k a week who don't deal with the end users at all. They all carry guns because it is a lot easier to move up that ladder when a rung above your is 'removed.'

Most of the dealers never get to be at the top. Only about 5% ever make it that far. I'm not sure how this compares to starting out at McDs and ending up as a regional manager or C-level, but I have to imagine it's somewhat comparable.

 

[Zargon]

I checked around and there was a homicide spike in Chicago in 2012, but it's still nowhere near the top murder city on a per capita basis. It isn't even half the per capita rate of New Orleans.

nope, there is something seriously wrong with NOLA. Jesus.

As for your ideological conclusions about gun control, it hardly explains why NY's homicide rate continues to decline and is in fact getting to near suburban levels when NY state is one of the most gun controlled states in the U.S. I'm not a fan of gun control and I doubt it reduces gun crime much, particularly as the number of guns in circulation is so high now that it's an exercise in futility. However, I highly doubt the baseless claims of gun control causing higher crime. Crime is affected by at least 10 different variables. Correlation does not equal causation.

Chicago has the strictest control in the Nation AFAIK. Whatever that ends up meaning, there are obviously cultural issues inside the City causing this.

Most of this is gang warfare. Maybe NYC has a better handle on the gangs

I guess there is a new gun control measure in NY now so we'll see what happens with the homicide rate in upcoming years.

yes and its an awful awful ingnorant POS. IMO of course. It followed almost no logical guidelines and is only going to punish the lawful gun owners in the state. needed special size magazines no one makes is going to cost NY Citizens a fortune

 

[smackababy]

Being anecdotal evidence aside, every drug dealer I've met made more than minimum wage while 'working' far less hours than needed. And these are low level guys, not higher ups.

Drugs are very lucrative, at most levels. There is almost never a point where you are buying and then reselling at a 1:1 ratio as for as quantity. Heroin coming into the states is from Afghanistan is probably around 70-80% pure. The heroin sold on the streets is usually around 5-15% pure. That is a lot of cutting and a lot of stretching. That is also a reason it is extremely easy to overdose. If you get a 'good' score that is 30% pure, your same dosage of drug is effectively doubled without you even knowing.