Challenger price gouging has officially begun

[Viper GTS]

http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/car/501056591.html

The sad thing is I know they'll get it. Sticker on the SRT-8 was what, $36K or so?

This is going to end up nothing but a nostalgia mobile for middle aged men, the only ones who will care enough to pay double sticker price for one.

Viper GTS

 

[zerocool84]

In a couple months they will go down in price. They will definitely go down in price next year which happens to coincide with when they actually release it with a manual tranny.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/car/501056591.html

The sad thing is I know they'll get it. Sticker on the SRT-8 was what, $36K or so?

This is going to end up nothing but a nostalgia mobile for middle aged men, the only ones who will care enough to pay double sticker price for one.

Viper GTS

Was there ever any doubt that this would happen? This car isn't worth any markup...hell, it's not really even worth the MSRP they're asking.

In two years they'll be selling for MSRP or less...if they're still making them by then.

 

[franksta]

It's not really "gouging" as much as it is the free market at work.

 

[exdeath]

Free market is the supplier selling it at whatever price it wants and people buying or not buying it at that price. Middle men buying up lots and marking them up double for resale, especially for a "spot in line" when they don't even have the car, is just gay.

I believe in free markets and no government intervention, so a good way to avoid this is do what Nissan is doing with the GT-R to discourage this kind of middle man activity; make the warranty valid only for the initial purchaser who buys the car from the dealer at MSRP.

Really wish it would be like the PS3 where lame ass "investors" buy 15 of them and lock up the supply and try to sell them on Ebay for double or triple MSRP and nobody bites, and they end up with 15 cars they can't afford to keep. I'll never forget that dumb ass trying to return 3 PS3 at a local Gamestop, because he bought them online and couldn't resale them. They refused to take them back. ROFL.

 

[zoiks]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/car/501056591.html

The sad thing is I know they'll get it. Sticker on the SRT-8 was what, $36K or so?

This is going to end up nothing but a nostalgia mobile for middle aged men, the only ones who will care enough to pay double sticker price for one.

Viper GTS

Was there ever any doubt that this would happen? This car isn't worth any markup...hell, it's not really even worth the MSRP they're asking.

In two years they'll be selling for MSRP or less...if they're still making them by then.

It's pretty much worth the 36k.

 

[exdeath]

BTW GT500s which were impossible to find at a dealer which were being resold on Ebay for over $60,000 ???

They are averaging in the $50s now and starting to dip into the upper $40s. MSRP is $42,000.

The GT500 was unique because there was no alternative if you couldn't get one, so people could buy them up and stick them on Ebay for weeks at double MRSP and wait until someone caved. With the Challenger, Camaro, etc. all coming out now, it will be almost impossible for these middleman slime balls to keep them horded up and marked up forever.

 

[PricklyPete]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/car/501056591.html

The sad thing is I know they'll get it. Sticker on the SRT-8 was what, $36K or so?

This is going to end up nothing but a nostalgia mobile for middle aged men, the only ones who will care enough to pay double sticker price for one.

Viper GTS

Was there ever any doubt that this would happen? This car isn't worth any markup...hell, it's not really even worth the MSRP they're asking.

In two years they'll be selling for MSRP or less...if they're still making them by then.

What if we put a Lotus sticker on it...will you like it then?

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: zoiks

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/car/501056591.html

The sad thing is I know they'll get it. Sticker on the SRT-8 was what, $36K or so?

This is going to end up nothing but a nostalgia mobile for middle aged men, the only ones who will care enough to pay double sticker price for one.

Viper GTS

Was there ever any doubt that this would happen? This car isn't worth any markup...hell, it's not really even worth the MSRP they're asking.

In two years they'll be selling for MSRP or less...if they're still making them by then.

It's pretty much worth the 36k.

Is that the starting price for the top of the line SRT-8? I'm betting that those things sticker for over $40k easily when you add a couple commonly equipped options and include the gas guzzler tax. Hell, you could buy a nicely equipped brand new Corvette for $44k.

I maintain that the Challenger is a bit overpriced. Certainly not worth any markup.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: PricklyPete

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/car/501056591.html

The sad thing is I know they'll get it. Sticker on the SRT-8 was what, $36K or so?

This is going to end up nothing but a nostalgia mobile for middle aged men, the only ones who will care enough to pay double sticker price for one.

Viper GTS

Was there ever any doubt that this would happen? This car isn't worth any markup...hell, it's not really even worth the MSRP they're asking.

In two years they'll be selling for MSRP or less...if they're still making them by then.

What if we put a Lotus sticker on it...will you like it then?

Where did I say I didn't like it? Personally, I think it looks fantastic...but yeah, I'd rather have a Lotus. :heart:

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: zoiks

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/car/501056591.html

The sad thing is I know they'll get it. Sticker on the SRT-8 was what, $36K or so?

This is going to end up nothing but a nostalgia mobile for middle aged men, the only ones who will care enough to pay double sticker price for one.

Viper GTS

Was there ever any doubt that this would happen? This car isn't worth any markup...hell, it's not really even worth the MSRP they're asking.

In two years they'll be selling for MSRP or less...if they're still making them by then.

It's pretty much worth the 36k.

Is that the starting price for the top of the line SRT-8? I'm betting that those things sticker for over $40k easily when you add a couple commonly equipped options and include the gas guzzler tax. Hell, you could buy a nicely equipped brand new Corvette for $44k.

I maintain that the Challenger is a bit overpriced. Certainly not worth any markup.

i would honestly expect them to MSRP around $40k. the 300-SRT8 is $42k, the charger SRT8 is $36k.

they're pretty badass cars, believe it or not - and they're full size sedans, to boot.

 

[dgevert]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Where did I say I didn't like it? Personally, I think it looks fantastic...but yeah, I'd rather have a Lotus. :heart:

And the first time one of these overweight Challengers tries to keep up with a tiny Lotus in the corners, they'll see why your choice makes more sense.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: dgevert

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Where did I say I didn't like it? Personally, I think it looks fantastic...but yeah, I'd rather have a Lotus. :heart:

And the first time one of these overweight Challengers tries to keep up with a tiny Lotus in the corners, they'll see why your choice makes more sense.

:thumbsup:

 

[exdeath]

Originally posted by: dgevert

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Where did I say I didn't like it? Personally, I think it looks fantastic...but yeah, I'd rather have a Lotus. :heart:

And the first time one of these overweight Challengers tries to keep up with a tiny Lotus in the corners, they'll see why your choice makes more sense.

More likely, in a typical city in America, lacking any twisties to play on, the Lotus driver will just change lanes and weave in and out of traffic, wanting to flex it's agility and handling despite there being nothing around but 2 or 3 straight lanes running North to South or East to West, separated by intersections...

And when that Lotus gets stopped by a yellow light, he's not going to be feeling too good when the minivan in front of that SRT-8 Charger he cut off and pretended to dust in the next lane decides to jump in the left turn lane leaving that Challenger rolling up next to the Lotus as the light changes to red... or better yet when the Challenger is at the line and the car 'protecting' the Lotus makes a right turn at the last minute, forcing the Lotus to step up.

There may be a twisty up after the merge half a mile past the light, but what does it matter, the Lotus is going to be stuck behind the Challenger and have no choice but to get behind it long before that twisty comes up, at which point he may choose to flash his brights or honk or ride the ass of the challenger in a show of defiance of not getting his way and being in front. Nothing says 'owned' like someone who starts it and floors their engine past red line in vain, only to have to swallow their pride and merge behind you because they couldn't muster the power to get around you before the 2 to 1 merge.

Straight line acceleration is FAR more useful in day to day driving than handling. Every single "challenge" I have ever had has been someone trying to blow by me on a straight freeway or revving at me at a light, or pulling up next to me, matching my speed, and egging me on in a contest of acceleration. I have never EVER had someone blow past me going 100 mph in the left hand turn lane... and never will.

Not that I don't like the Lotus, I'm merely using the examples of real cars discussed here to illustrate why handling is overrated and why straight line power is almost always more important in a daily driver street car. I admire better handling cars in my rear view mirror, if only they could catch up to me by the time I have to slow down for the twisty.

Even still my car (03 Cobra) doesn't handle half bad either, though it's no Lotus or Porsche. It's quite fun merging onto the freeway going 75 on the banked 90 degree onramp that has a yellow sign suggesting 35, while hugging the inside guardrail and feeling the seat belt dig into my collar bone. Not bad for a 3700 lb 'straight line only' car if I do say so myself.

 

[dgevert]

There's a twisty mountain road not 30 minutes away from where I live. I go up there on weekends to let off some steam. No amount of pure acceleration will ever match the level of excitement that comes from letting a fast car do its thing on a twisty backroad.

But either way, the Lotus isn't a car that's meant to show off on public streets - it's a purebred track car.

Oh and when that Challenger ends up next to the Lotus at a stoplight, the Elise's 0-60 time of 5.8 seconds - stock - will hardly embarass it. And if it's an Exige, well, it'll be the Challenger who slinks away embarassed.

But hey, I guess when a dumbass musclehead like yourself decides he wants to be an asshole on public streets, I guess a Lotus might not be as fast in some of those situations.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: exdeath

Originally posted by: dgevert

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Where did I say I didn't like it? Personally, I think it looks fantastic...but yeah, I'd rather have a Lotus. :heart:

And the first time one of these overweight Challengers tries to keep up with a tiny Lotus in the corners, they'll see why your choice makes more sense.

More likely, in a typical city in America, lacking any twisties to play on, the Lotus driver will just change lanes and weave in and out of traffic, wanting to flex it's agility and handling despite there being nothing around but 2 or 3 straight lanes running North to South or East to West, separated by intersections...

And when that Lotus gets stopped by a yellow light, he's not going to be feeling too good when the minivan in front of that SRT-8 Charger he cut off and pretended to dust in the next lane decides to jump in the left turn lane leaving that Challenger rolling up next to the Lotus as the light changes to red... or better yet when the Challenger is at the line and the car 'protecting' the Lotus makes a right turn at the last minute, forcing the Lotus to step up.

There may be a twisty up after the merge half a mile past the light, but what does it matter, the Lotus is going to be stuck behind the Challenger and have no choice but to get behind it long before that twisty comes up, at which point he may choose to flash his brights or honk or ride the ass of the challenger in a show of defiance of not getting his way and being in front. Nothing says 'owned' like someone who starts it and floors their engine past red line in vain, only to have to swallow their pride and merge behind you because they couldn't muster the power to get around you before the 2 to 1 merge.

Straight line acceleration is FAR more useful in day to day driving than handling. Every single "challenge" I have ever had has been someone trying to blow by me on a straight freeway or revving at me at a light, or pulling up next to me, matching my speed, and egging me on in a contest of acceleration. I have never EVER had someone blow past me going 100 mph in the left hand turn lane... and never will.

Not that I don't like the Lotus, I'm merely using the examples of real cars discussed here to illustrate why handling is overrated and why straight line power is almost always more important in a daily driver street car. I admire better handling cars in my rear view mirror, if only they could catch up to me by the time I have to slow down for the twisty.

Even still my car (03 Cobra) doesn't handle half bad either, though it's no Lotus or Porsche. It's quite fun merging onto the freeway going 75 on the banked 90 degree onramp that has a yellow sign suggesting 35, while hugging the inside guardrail and feeling the seat belt dig into my collar bone. Not bad for a 3700 lb 'straight line only' car if I do say so myself.

Come drive around in the mountains and foothills in SoCal. Your examples sound more like typical traffic in a flat semi-rural area. Yeah, driving across Texas in a Lotus is probably going to be kind of boring...and tiring (which is probably why Buicks were made in the first place). But around here there are thousands and thousands of miles of twisty scenic roads with lots of change in elevation.

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: zoiks

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/car/501056591.html

The sad thing is I know they'll get it. Sticker on the SRT-8 was what, $36K or so?

This is going to end up nothing but a nostalgia mobile for middle aged men, the only ones who will care enough to pay double sticker price for one.

Viper GTS

Was there ever any doubt that this would happen? This car isn't worth any markup...hell, it's not really even worth the MSRP they're asking.

In two years they'll be selling for MSRP or less...if they're still making them by then.

It's pretty much worth the 36k.

Is that the starting price for the top of the line SRT-8? I'm betting that those things sticker for over $40k easily when you add a couple commonly equipped options and include the gas guzzler tax. Hell, you could buy a nicely equipped brand new Corvette for $44k.

I maintain that the Challenger is a bit overpriced. Certainly not worth any markup.

i would honestly expect them to MSRP around $40k. the 300-SRT8 is $42k, the charger SRT8 is $36k.

they're pretty badass cars, believe it or not - and they're full size sedans, to boot.

Yep all of them are still selling for around msrp except for the srt-6's which arn't made any more, that you can get used for in the low 20's.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: dgevert
There's a twisty mountain road not 30 minutes away from where I live. I go up there on weekends to let off some steam. No amount of pure acceleration will ever match the level of excitement that comes from letting a fast car do its thing on a twisty backroad.

But either way, the Lotus isn't a car that's meant to show off on public streets - it's a purebred track car.

Oh and when that Challenger ends up next to the Lotus at a stoplight, the Elise's 0-60 time of 5.8 seconds - stock - will hardly embarass it. And if it's an Exige, well, it'll be the Challenger who slinks away embarassed.

But hey, I guess when a dumbass musclehead like yourself decides he wants to be an asshole on public streets, I guess a Lotus might not be as fast in some of those situations.

the SRT8's do 0-60 in 5 seconds. not bad for 2ton cars

 

[dgevert]

Oh and speaking of Cobras and on-ramps...this funny story from a friend of mine comes to mind. He drives an '05 STi (stock - he has coilovers now but didn't when this happened.) He's leaving base (Air Force) and the whole time some asshat in a Cobra is riding his tail, revving on him, etc. He's like, whatever. So he leaves base and goes to head home, and the Cobra follows him. So when it's time to get on a highway on-ramp, he lets loose, and the STi's brilliant handling and AWD carries him onto the highway very quickly. Then, he hears it. He looks in his rear view mirror...oops...dumbass Cobra driver tried to keep up...and starts sliding towards the edge of the road. He manages to barely save it...good thing too, because it's a 30 foot embankment where the road ends.

 

[dgevert]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: dgevert
There's a twisty mountain road not 30 minutes away from where I live. I go up there on weekends to let off some steam. No amount of pure acceleration will ever match the level of excitement that comes from letting a fast car do its thing on a twisty backroad.

But either way, the Lotus isn't a car that's meant to show off on public streets - it's a purebred track car.

Oh and when that Challenger ends up next to the Lotus at a stoplight, the Elise's 0-60 time of 5.8 seconds - stock - will hardly embarass it. And if it's an Exige, well, it'll be the Challenger who slinks away embarassed.

But hey, I guess when a dumbass musclehead like yourself decides he wants to be an asshole on public streets, I guess a Lotus might not be as fast in some of those situations.

the SRT8's do 0-60 in 5 seconds. not bad for 2ton cars

Notice how the above musclehead ignores the entire length of my post only to reply with one thing: a 0-60 time. That's because for said musclehead, any measure of performance of his favorite car that doesn't involve straight-line acceleration is just embarassing.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: dgevert
There's a twisty mountain road not 30 minutes away from where I live. I go up there on weekends to let off some steam. No amount of pure acceleration will ever match the level of excitement that comes from letting a fast car do its thing on a twisty backroad.

But either way, the Lotus isn't a car that's meant to show off on public streets - it's a purebred track car.

Oh and when that Challenger ends up next to the Lotus at a stoplight, the Elise's 0-60 time of 5.8 seconds - stock - will hardly embarass it. And if it's an Exige, well, it'll be the Challenger who slinks away embarassed.

But hey, I guess when a dumbass musclehead like yourself decides he wants to be an asshole on public streets, I guess a Lotus might not be as fast in some of those situations.

Try 0-60 in 4.8 seconds - stock. The Exige S will do 0-60 in 4 seconds flat.

And the Elise is plenty fun to drive sedately around town in with the top off.

 

[dgevert]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Try 0-60 in 4.8 seconds - stock. The Exige S will do 0-60 in 4 seconds flat.

And the Elise is plenty fun to drive sedately around town in with the top off.

Woops! I was looking at Wikipedia and it was quoting numbers from an older Elise model. You're right, the current Elise runs 0-60 in less than 5 seconds. I think the Exige S is like 3.9 seconds.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: dgevert
There's a twisty mountain road not 30 minutes away from where I live. I go up there on weekends to let off some steam. No amount of pure acceleration will ever match the level of excitement that comes from letting a fast car do its thing on a twisty backroad.

But either way, the Lotus isn't a car that's meant to show off on public streets - it's a purebred track car.

Oh and when that Challenger ends up next to the Lotus at a stoplight, the Elise's 0-60 time of 5.8 seconds - stock - will hardly embarass it. And if it's an Exige, well, it'll be the Challenger who slinks away embarassed.

But hey, I guess when a dumbass musclehead like yourself decides he wants to be an asshole on public streets, I guess a Lotus might not be as fast in some of those situations.

the SRT8's do 0-60 in 5 seconds. not bad for 2ton cars

Elise is faster and gets 28 mpg around town.

Oh, and FTR I wasn't the one who brought the Lotus Elise into this discussion. :laugh:

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: dgevert
There's a twisty mountain road not 30 minutes away from where I live. I go up there on weekends to let off some steam. No amount of pure acceleration will ever match the level of excitement that comes from letting a fast car do its thing on a twisty backroad.

But either way, the Lotus isn't a car that's meant to show off on public streets - it's a purebred track car.

Oh and when that Challenger ends up next to the Lotus at a stoplight, the Elise's 0-60 time of 5.8 seconds - stock - will hardly embarass it. And if it's an Exige, well, it'll be the Challenger who slinks away embarassed.

But hey, I guess when a dumbass musclehead like yourself decides he wants to be an asshole on public streets, I guess a Lotus might not be as fast in some of those situations.

the SRT8's do 0-60 in 5 seconds. not bad for 2ton cars

Elise is faster and gets 28 mpg around town.

Oh, and FTR I wasn't the one who brought the Lotus Elise into this discussion. :laugh:

Well I don't know if it's just me but the Elise didn't seem as comfortable to me and not enough room to haul around bags and such. I love the car and the performance but it's like comparing the last get evo/sti to the last gen m3, yes you get performance that is better for cheaper but you get the comfort in the more expensive car. Any car Lotus makes cannot compare to most manufactures in the world. In a totally different class than the challenger.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: dgevert
There's a twisty mountain road not 30 minutes away from where I live. I go up there on weekends to let off some steam. No amount of pure acceleration will ever match the level of excitement that comes from letting a fast car do its thing on a twisty backroad.

But either way, the Lotus isn't a car that's meant to show off on public streets - it's a purebred track car.

Oh and when that Challenger ends up next to the Lotus at a stoplight, the Elise's 0-60 time of 5.8 seconds - stock - will hardly embarass it. And if it's an Exige, well, it'll be the Challenger who slinks away embarassed.

But hey, I guess when a dumbass musclehead like yourself decides he wants to be an asshole on public streets, I guess a Lotus might not be as fast in some of those situations.

the SRT8's do 0-60 in 5 seconds. not bad for 2ton cars

Elise is faster and gets 28 mpg around town.

Oh, and FTR I wasn't the one who brought the Lotus Elise into this discussion. :laugh:

Well I don't know if it's just me but the Elise didn't seem as comfortable to me and not enough room to haul around bags and such. I love the car and the performance but it's like comparing the last get evo/sti to the last gen m3, yes you get performance that is better for cheaper but you get the comfort in the more expensive car. Any car Lotus makes cannot compare to most manufactures in the world. In a totally different class than the challenger.

Agreed. Which is why I was hesitant to even respond to the person who brought up the Lotus. My earlier posts were exclusively about the Challenger and similar cars. Although the Challenger does have a small backseat and trunk it is cavernous compared to the tiny Elise.

Edit-The Elise with the Touring pack is actually fairly comfortable. It's just hard to get in and out of if you're over 5'9" tall when the roof is on the car. I've heard that the sport package makes the ride much stiffer though and doesn't really add that much performance for a car that is daily driven. However, if you only plan on tracking the car it is worthwhile to get this option.

I now return this thread to the discussion of the Dodge Challenger.