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Canadians don't respect the 2nd Amendment

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The Canadian article: http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/0...nadian-border-enrages-u-s-firearms-community/

It has some gems in it:

Given the gun culture south of the border, “it’s not beyond the realm of possibility that someone would forget a gun in their car,” Engel said. It’s no different than leaving a pair of hockey skates in your car up here.
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“Screw Canada.”

“Another reason not to venture to the dark north.”
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After eight or nine hours on the road listening to Gospel music and having a good time, the couple wound up on the Thousand Islands Bridge for Canada.

“My GPS didn’t say, ‘you’re entering another country,’” DiNatale said.
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rommelrommel said:
How the fuck is informing people in the US about Canadian politics "meddling in Canadian gun law?"
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Are you saying you don't think the NRA wants looser controls in Canada? Their goal is to arm as many as possible as a favor to gun manufacturers. They lobby and hold gun trade shows, highlighting the makers.

http://canadanewsnetwork.wordpress....anadian-citizens-and-reverse-gunless-society/

Nope, no meddling:

“While we are cautiously optimistic with our victory here in the United States, we firmly believe that Canada’s strict gun-control laws are a worrisome ‘import threat’,” explained Wayne LaPierre, executive vice-president of the NRA. ”Gun-control advocates in the United States frequently cite statistical evidence about lower levels of Canadian gun violence, and extensively quote Canadian political figures and journalists. Canadian urban elites, particularly in Ontario and Quebec, do not share our core American values of freedom and individual responsibility and look down upon law-abiding citizens who responsibly use firearms.”


“We consider this ‘anti-gun’ culture a foreign threat because we have already seen elements of this culture seep into our country, particularly in urban areas in the Northeast. The best strategy for us is to fix the problem at the source, so to speak, by expanding our organization into Canada and fighting them over there rather than fighting them here.”
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And what was with Heston's remark [re: Canada] that gun rights are god given. There may be an interpreted right here in the U.S., but I'm not sure it came from God
 
rudeguy said:
Correct. This man should be charged with a felony in New York once he gets out of Canadian prison.

Follow the damn law. If you don't, you make it much harder for us responsible gun owners.
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Wonder if he will at least lose his gun permit.
 
JTsyo said:
Wonder if he will at least lose his gun permit.
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He'll lose his 'welcome to Canada' permit, that's for sure. I've saw the related article of a similar case where a guy had a gun while crossing and said 'No.' He was waived over to a second border patrol agent, had a change of heart and said 'Yes.' That was too late. He spent a week in jail and four months detained in Canada. Fines and lost wages came out to around $30,000 but he is also now persona non grata in Canada for the rest of his life.

I suppose the good news is that this guy didn't want to be in Canada in the first place. Two problems solved.

Londo_Jowo said:
What gun permit?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_by_state#Kentucky
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His Kentucky concealed carry permit.
 
It'd be a hail Mary, but I wonder if he was authorized to carry under LEOSA? It says retired military but doesn't list MOS.

That wouldn't help with the weapons charge in Canada, but it would if there were a charge to occur in NY.
 
Londo_Jowo said:
Who needs a concealed carry permit in Kentucky? Kentucky has open carry.

http://www.gunlawguide.com/Kentucky.htm
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It's stated pretty clearly in the article that he has a CC permit.

Regardless, many gun owners (I would call them 'them sane ones') feel that concealed carry is superior to open.

1. It is not naturally provocative.
2. If you need to use your weapon, you do not clue your target in that you have a weapon until necessary
3. It is easier to control the weapon from unexpected grabs

There really aren't many practical advantages to open carry. Some commonly listed ones are, 'psychological deterrent,' 'faster access,' and 'law enforcement awareness.' In my mind, each of these fall apart. The psychological deterrent works both ways. Many unarmed people find open carry to be explicitly threatening, which means that an open carry individual has immediately escalated any situation. Faster access may be true for LEO or highly trained gun owners, but for a typical gun owner, they will not have the amount of training required to make open carry a faster access option than concealed. And finally, the law enforcement awareness issue is probably the weakest. Whereas a LEO may feel concerned that you might be a concealed carry, a LEO will definitely be concerned if you are open carry. I think your chances of getting shot by a jittery LEO is greater if he sees you have a gun than if he does not see you have a gun. A responsible CC owner would know the correct way to inform a LEO and de-escelate as needed regardless.

And regarding LEOSA, it would only apply to ex-military if they were military police. An MP would have law enforcement training that a Delta Operator, despite probably being handier with a gun, would not.
 
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Daverino said:
It's stated pretty clearly in the article that he has a CC permit.

Regardless, many gun owners (I would call them 'them sane ones') feel that concealed carry is superior to open.

1. It is not naturally provocative.
2. If you need to use your weapon, you do not clue your target in that you have a weapon until necessary
3. It is easier to control the weapon from unexpected grabs

There really aren't many practical advantages to open carry. Some commonly listed ones are, 'psychological deterrent,' 'faster access,' and 'law enforcement awareness.' In my mind, each of these fall apart. The psychological deterrent works both ways. Many unarmed people find open carry to be explicitly threatening, which means that an open carry individual has immediately escalated any situation. Faster access may be true for LEO or highly trained gun owners, but for a typical gun owner, they will not have the amount of training required to make open carry a faster access option than concealed. And finally, the law enforcement awareness issue is probably the weakest. Whereas a LEO may feel concerned that you might be a concealed carry, a LEO will definitely be concerned if you are open carry. I think your chances of getting shot by a jittery LEO is greater if he sees you have a gun than if he does not see you have a gun. A responsible CC owner would know the correct way to inform a LEO and de-escelate as needed regardless.

And regarding LEOSA, it would only apply to ex-military if they were military police. An MP would have law enforcement training that a Delta Operator, despite probably being handier with a gun, would not.
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I have CCW from two different states and am fully aware of what to do in any state I happen to be traveling. In a state such as Texas it's more important to have a CCW as open carry of handguns is not allowed. Whether a person is carrying concealed or openly it's always prudent to inform an officer as soon as possible so it's not a surprise.

As for this person, unless he convicted of a felony in the US I seriously doubt he will lose his right to own a gun much less his CCW permit. The fact that Kentucky is a open carry state and a person can legally place a loaded gun in the glove box or center console it really doesn't matter.
 
rudeguy said:
which has nothing to do with the case in question

Open carry is openly displaying a firearm carried on your person in public. This person had a firearm concealed in his car.
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Obviously you're not familiar with Kentucky law as it's legal for anyone to do such not just CCW permit holders.

http://www.gunlawguide.com/Kentucky.htm

Vehicle carry by non-permittees: loaded firearms may be carried in plain view or stowed in any factory-installed vehicle compartment
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Daverino said:
And regarding LEOSA, it would only apply to ex-military if they were military police. An MP would have law enforcement training that a Delta Operator, despite probably being handier with a gun, would not.
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I'm well aware of that. Did you not see where I said his MOS wasn't listed, or did you not understand what that meant?
 
Londo_Jowo said:
Obviously you're not familiar with Kentucky law as it's legal for anyone to do such not just CCW permit holders.

http://www.gunlawguide.com/Kentucky.htm
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That is not open carry. Even in that link, its separate from open carry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_carry_in_the_United_States

In the United States, open carry is shorthand terminology for "openly carrying a firearm in public", as distinguished from concealed carry, where firearms cannot be seen by the casual observer.
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Regardless Kentucky does not border Canada so he should have as a responsible firearms owner be cognizant of the laws of the border states at the very least.
Its this type of recklessness that makes all gun owners looking like slack jawed mouth breathers.
 
Londo_Jowo said:
I have CCW from two different states and am fully aware of what to do in any state I happen to be traveling. In a state such as Texas it's more important to have a CCW as open carry of handguns is not allowed. Whether a person is carrying concealed or openly it's always prudent to inform an officer as soon as possible so it's not a surprise.

As for this person, unless he convicted of a felony in the US I seriously doubt he will lose his right to own a gun much less his CCW permit. The fact that Kentucky is a open carry state and a person can legally place a loaded gun in the glove box or center console it really doesn't matter.
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I don't know whether Kentucky would strip him of his CCW permit over this. Traveling through NYS in violation of NYS law at the felony level. If he traveled through Ohio, he would have violated their laws as well. I'm not clear on Pennsylvania, though. I do not know if the gun in the console was loaded. If it was, then I think he violated Pennsylvania law, but don't hold me to that. But reading Kentucky law, he would need to be convicted of a felony first before they could revoke the permit. In NYS it would definitely have been a felony but he didn't get arrested in NYS. I doubt he will get out of his mess in Canada without at least a plea to a felony, but it would be up to Kentucky to determine whether an international felony applies.

Either way, his chances of getting that gun back are absolutely zero.
 
TerryMathews said:
I'm well aware of that. Did you not see where I said his MOS wasn't listed, or did you not understand what that meant?
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I understood it. I'm just telling you that the law would require his MOS to be military police for it to apply. I'm not disagreeing, just adding more information.
 
TerryMathews said:
It'd be a hail Mary, but I wonder if he was authorized to carry under LEOSA? It says retired military but doesn't list MOS.

That wouldn't help with the weapons charge in Canada, but it would if there were a charge to occur in NY.
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He was an Army sergeant major. No one in the Army is covered under LEOSA, not even military police (since no PMO has or will ever issue ID meeting the LEOSA requirements.)
 
Daverino said:
I understood it. I'm just telling you that the law would require his MOS to be military police for it to apply. I'm not disagreeing, just adding more information.
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Actually the law requires a form of identification that shows an individual is part of a law enforcement organization. Last I checked (last year) the Navy & Marine Corps were issuing LE IDs to their Military Police, but the Army MPs and Air Force Security Forces were not. A CAC card on it's own does not meet the standards outlined under LEOSA.
 
Nebor said:
He was an Army sergeant major. No one in the Army is covered under LEOSA, not even military police (since no PMO has or will ever issue ID meeting the LEOSA requirements.)
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Case law disagrees. There's a Coastie who was able to assert a right to carry under LEOSA without a LEID. The standard in that case was simply having an ID that identified him as a CG member.

Again not saying that its applicable and it probably isnt because its highly unlikely an MP attained the rank of E-9 while in that MOS.
 
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TerryMathews said:
Case law disagrees. There's a Coastie who was able to assert a right to carry under LEOSA without a LEID.

Again not saying that its applicable and it probably isnt because its highly unlikely an MP attained the rank of E-9 while in that MOS.
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Since I carry an LE ID and a CAC on a daily basis, I'm going to guess that I probably have more of an interest in this than you. But I'll humor you with one long sentence.

The Coast Guard officer who managed to avoid jail while carrying a handgun argued that since the Coast Guard, as a subdivision of the Department of Homeland Security, is in it's entirety a law enforcement organization (this backed up by the wide ranging arrest powers of Coast Guard personnel in territorial waters,) that he was properly (and statutorily) identified as a member of a law enforcement organization based on the fact that a CAC card states one's branch of service on the front.
 
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