California proposal to require condoms in porn

[actuarial]

I dont make blanket arguments like getting rid of all safety regulations because there is one I think is pointless and overbearing.

That said it is a voluntary action by both actors who understand the risks. If we are going to play this out logically. Why should actors be granted these protections by the state and not the rest of society? The porn industry has tight self imposed regulations about STD testing. Far higher than anything we see in the wild.

But the only argument you give for being against it is easily applied to any safety standard.

And once again in your post you use 'voluntary action'. The fact that it's voluntary, or that people know the risks, is IRRELEVANT when it comes to workplace safety. That's what people are trying to show you. It doesn't hold water because it's easily testable against other safety standards which I imagine you agree with.

The only people who can legally be paid to have sex are porn actors. If prostitution was legalized I'm sure that they would require the use of protection as well.

Now if your argument is that the current testing is enough to ensure the safety of actors, then say that. Don't try to imply this is some kind of authoritarian issue about not allowing individuals to have consensual sex. Any of the actors mentioned are allowed to have unprotected sex with each other, and allowed to do it on camera. They're just not allowed to be paid to do it.

 

[Fear No Evil]

I suppose we could pretty much regulate everything under the guise of workplace safety? Want to eat red meat for lunch? Sorry... its for your own safety. Want to drive an SUV to work? Sorry, you are putty the Prius owners lives are risk.

 

[Genx87]

No one is saying they have to wear condoms when they screw their partner at home. It is only an issue when they are working. At which point in time they have to obey workplace safety regulations.

That is not confusing is it?

Nothing is confusing about this. I just think it is an overbearing regulation that serves little purpose. The industry as a whole self regulates pretty damn well. Required monthly STD screenings with signed paperwork. And they allow condom use if the actors desire it.

 

[sdifox]

I suppose we could pretty much regulate everything under the guise of workplace safety? Want to eat red meat for lunch? Sorry... its for your own safety. Want to drive an SUV to work? Sorry, you are putty the Prius owners lives are risk.

you are kidding right? USA doesn't even mandate nutritious lunches for kids in school.

 

[actuarial]

Of course it is their job. However nobody is putting a gun to their head and telling them to perform. Do you consider your job forced labor?

Again, this argument would apply to ANY safety standard. No one puts a gun to people's head in China to work, does that mean the US should have their workplace safety standards?

Once we can get past the fact that once you're paying someone to do something, you must ensure their safety while doing that thing, then we can discuss whether or not this goes too far to ensure their safety.

 

[kathi b]

I'm not worried about the porn industry. I'm sure they'll figure out a way to deal with this.

 

[actuarial]

I suppose we could pretty much regulate everything under the guise of workplace safety? Want to eat red meat for lunch? Sorry... its for your own safety. Want to drive an SUV to work? Sorry, you are putty the Prius owners lives are risk.

How do either of those things involve the job that you are paid to do? You're not paid to eat red meat, nor paid to drive an SUV to work. Neither of those are in your job responsibilities. Having sex IS a job responsibility for a porn actor.

Guess what, people who drive trucks for a living (as in that is in their job responsibilities) have requirements of how long they're allowed to drive every 24 hours. Do we scream about the authoritarians not allowing people to drive when and how they please?

 

[sdifox]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7PlahuBYnE

I guess USA should allow this.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Nothing is confusing about this. I just think it is an overbearing regulation that serves little purpose. The industry as a whole self regulates pretty damn well. Required monthly STD screenings with signed paperwork. And they allow condom use if the actors desire it.

Well, then what's the issue here? There must not be any porn actors who have contracted any STDs then right? How many is too many? 1 person dies? 2 people die? 10 people die?

 

[Genx87]

But the only argument you give for being against it is easily applied to any safety standard.

Hardly.

And once again in your post you use 'voluntary action'. The fact that it's voluntary, or that people know the risks, is IRRELEVANT when it comes to workplace safety. That's what people are trying to show you. It doesn't hold water because it's easily testable against other safety standards which I imagine you agree with.

I think it being voluntary has a lot to do with it. Workplace safety is a front for these people to regulate an industry in a manner that literally serves no purpose.

Now if your argument is that the current testing is enough to ensure the safety of actors, then say that. Don't try to imply this is some kind of authoritarian issue about not allowing individuals to have consensual sex. Any of the actors mentioned are allowed to have unprotected sex with each other, and allowed to do it on camera. They're just not allowed to be paid to do it.

So it really isnt about safety then is it? Monetary exchange requires the use of protection. But the lack of monetary exchange allows for unprotected sex. Seems like a dubious line in the sand for regulating this act does it not?

 

[Genx87]

Well, then what's the issue here? There must not be any porn actors who have contracted any STDs then right? How many is too many? 1 person dies? 2 people die? 10 people die?

Are we concerned about preventing STDs? Why stop with porn actors?

 

[Genx87]

Again, this argument would apply to ANY safety standard. No one puts a gun to people's head in China to work, does that mean the US should have their workplace safety standards?

Once we can get past the fact that once you're paying someone to do something, you must ensure their safety while doing that thing, then we can discuss whether or not this goes too far to ensure their safety.

China is a poor example to use for putting guns to peoples head to work 😀

 

[sdifox]

Nothing is confusing about this. I just think it is an overbearing regulation that serves little purpose. The industry as a whole self regulates pretty damn well. Required monthly STD screenings with signed paperwork. And they allow condom use if the actors desire it.

http://gawker.com/5288582/porn-industry-hiv-scare-causes-non+fun-facts-to-come-out
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...HIV-scare-adult-performer-tests-positive.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/4135473.stm

I imagine these type of incidents prompted the government to consider legislation.

 

[AstroManLuca]

Dunno about stats, but look up "Marc Wallice."

I don't know of a similar incident recently, but it's not exactly something I keep tabs on.

Darren James, but it wasn't on nearly the same scale. He went to Brazil, got HIV, then came back to the US and filmed a couple scenes before he got tested. Ended up infecting three girls. But unlike Marc Wallice, he didn't try to hide his infection.

A law requiring porn performers to get tested upon re-entering the US before filming any more scenes would be good. They already get tested every 30 days but other countries may not have the same strict rules.

This will just lead to porn producers moving to other locales. Hopefully it doesn't lead to more incidents like the one involving Darren James.

 

[actuarial]

So it really isnt about safety then is it? Monetary exchange requires the use of protection. But the lack of monetary exchange allows for unprotected sex. Seems like a dubious line in the sand for regulating this act does it not?

It is about safety. You're allowed to do whatever stupid stuff you want on your own, but you're not allowed to pay other people to do it.

It is not illegal for me to drive for 24 hours straight (assuming I'm awake at the wheel). It is illegal for my to get paid to drive for 24 hours straight. Is paying someone a dubious line here?

 

[actuarial]

A law requiring porn performers to get tested upon re-entering the US before filming any more scenes would be good. They already get tested every 30 days but other countries may not have the same strict rules.

This will just lead to porn producers moving to other locales. Hopefully it doesn't lead to more incidents like the one involving Darren James.

I didn't think there were any tests that could detect it immediately, which is the biggest problem with the current testing system.

I may be wrong on that though.

 

[Platypus]

I hate produced porn so this doesn't affect me at all thankfully.

 

[Gibsons]

I didn't think there were any tests that could detect it immediately, which is the biggest problem with the current testing system.

I may be wrong on that though.

They should test positive for the virus within ~1-2 weeks of being infected, maybe shorter with some luck. If they test for anti-HIV antibodies, that would be longer, say a month or two.

 

[lupi]

As I said in the last thread on this subject, if they go by letter of the law on employee protection, without an exemption I can easily see how something like this could be considered required given current rules. One could even stretch it to the point that regular movies with enhanced kissing scenes could be subjected to prohibition.

 

[ViviTheMage]

waste of legislation.

 

[Duder1no]

Police State USA well underway

 

[JulesMaximus]

Are we concerned about preventing STDs? Why stop with porn actors?

In the porn industry I guess we are.

HIV scare

Condoms became an issue in the San Fernando Valley eight months ago when one of the industry's major stars, Darren James, tested positive for HIV.

Four women he had worked with were subsequently diagnosed, prompting a scare which brought the entire industry to a standstill for two months.

It was the first such outbreak for many years, and the publicity it generated spurred state authorities into action.

Officials from the Californian Health and Safety at Work division imposed 30,000 dollar fines on the two production companies at the centre of the outbreak.

And there was even talk of enshrining condom use in law.

Yet for all the brouhaha, it is estimated that fewer than 20% of porn stars currently engage in safe sex.

The performers blame the producers, maintaining they would not get work if they insist on using condoms.

The producers blame the performers, and cannot believe they have not banded together to demand that condoms be used.

Do you use condoms when you have sex with strangers? You're an idiot if you don't. That's a seperate issue though and one I'm not for legislating because it would be impossible to enforce.

 

[Exterous]

nah they will block all non-child making sex in general

Just go full in vitro only - no worries of STDs, awkward conversations with children about where babies come from or uncomfortable mornings after

Honey you need to remove those wool shorts too....

What do you mean they aren't wool shorts?

If the outsourcing starts remind me to buy stock in Nair

 

[Blackjack200]

If the outsourcing starts remind me to buy stock in Nair

http://www.amazon.com/Corona-Clipper...dp/B000GIO0NY/

 

[ShawnD1]

With all due respect, the risks of unprotected sex are well known to everyone. Where is the personal responsibility? Why does the government need to be involved? There are many things as dangerous or more dangerous to an individual (like free climbing in Yosemite -- read that article in NatGeo a couple of months ago!) that aren't regulated/outlawed. Should they be?

Workplace safety laws are to protect people when job options are limited. If the only job available is at a construction site and I need to put food on the table, thank god laws require things like safety hats and reflective jackets otherwise I might be fucked.

Porn is a job like any other. People in that industry deserve the same standards as you and me. Right now there aren't many safety standards in porn, so the actors are totally getting screwed.