California bans gas lawn tools in 2024

[Bitek]

Absolutely they should ban leaf-blowers. Quite aside from the environmental effects, they are just noise-making machines. They make a ridiculous cacaphony. I'm frequently disturbed at home by someone blowing leaves around a nearby car-park (for no useful purpose, as far as I can make out).

Seems they exist purely because people are too lazy to use a broom or a rake.

I have way too many leaves to rake and bag. Blow them, chop them, sweep them and dump into compost pile for garden next year.


How much of the overall emissions footprint is this effecting? I would guess pretty small. Not an issue if you have a small property, but I'm doubtful this is feasible for larger properties.

Will be a long time if ever before you electricity my tractor.

 

[Aikouka]

Related to this, I've been wondering for a while when we will start seeing laws that restrict unnecessary gating of batteries. For example, I've been using Lowes's Kobalt 80V system for the past 6 years, and it has been working fairly well, but the problem is that Lowes seems to be slowly phasing it out by pushing either their 40V system or EGO's 56V system. This outlines a bit of a problem in that I'm seeing a dwindling supply of batteries apart from rebuilding them myself. This is even worse given that these manufacturers don't usually make their own equipment. The Kobalt 80V line is equivalent to the Snapper 80V and Greenworks 80V lines, but they all use slightly different battery housings to ensure that they aren't readily compatible. This isn't only anti-consumer, but it also helps push e-waste as people throw out tools and batteries that they no longer find supported.

I also find it ridiculous that stores like Lowes want me to recycle my batteries there for nothing. Sure, if I'm tossing rechargeable AA's in their bin, that's fine, but there's a lot of value in one of my 80V battery packs given that the charging electronics are still useful; it's the cells that are bad. I feel bad that I went and recycled one given that I've got a "bad" battery that based upon my research simply needs a fuse replaced. To me, that means there's value in those electronics in case they fail in one of my other batteries.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Related to this, I've been wondering for a while when we will start seeing laws that restrict unnecessary gating of batteries. For example, I've been using Lowes's Kobalt 80V system for the past 6 years, and it has been working fairly well, but the problem is that Lowes seems to be slowly phasing it out by pushing either their 40V system or EGO's 56V system. This outlines a bit of a problem in that I'm seeing a dwindling supply of batteries apart from rebuilding them myself. This is even worse given that these manufacturers don't usually make their own equipment. The Kobalt 80V line is equivalent to the Snapper 80V and Greenworks 80V lines, but they all use slightly different battery housings to ensure that they aren't readily compatible. This isn't only anti-consumer, but it also helps push e-waste as people throw out tools and batteries that they no longer find supported.

I also find it ridiculous that stores like Lowes want me to recycle my batteries there for nothing. Sure, if I'm tossing rechargeable AA's in their bin, that's fine, but there's a lot of value in one of my 80V battery packs given that the charging electronics are still useful; it's the cells that are bad. I feel bad that I went and recycled one given that I've got a "bad" battery that based upon my research simply needs a fuse replaced. To me, that means there's value in those electronics in case they fail in one of my other batteries.

For the sake of the environment, universal batteries should be federally regulated. 'Consumer' batteries, 'industrial' batteries, and 'vehicular' batteries. Add a tier for 'heavy machinery' if we ever get to that point. Zero reason we should be manufacturing 8 different battery casings for 8 different companies for the same tool.

 

[mindless1]

The law only bans the sale of new gas-powered equipment, and similar electric equipment is already comparably priced and more or less equally capable.
If I were in the market for a new lawnmower today, I would for sure buy electric. Not because of the environment, but because it's now a better value.

Only if talking about a corded mower, but lots of people need more range than a cord can provide. You can't just keep reducing the wire gauge and increasing the length or you quickly end up with too heavy a cord, in addition to the extra burden.

Similar cordless electric costs over twice as much and even then only seems viable for someone who doesn't use it frequently or have a large area to cover, unless you're trying to contrast some luxury class gas mower.

A 21" gas mower can be had for around $240, while an equivalent cordless is closer to $400+, but can only run about 1 hour, then replacement batteries (you'll need at least 3X to equal the viable lifespan of the gas mower) will run over $500 more. If you have a small lot, you won't exhaust recharge cycles on the cordless mower as fast, but you also wouldn't wear out the gas mower as fast.

 

[Vic]

I have way too many leaves to rake and bag. Blow them, chop them, sweep them and dump into compost pile for garden next year.


How much of the overall emissions footprint is this effecting? I would guess pretty small. Not an issue if you have a small property, but so doubtful this is feasible for larger properties.

Will be a long time if ever before you electricity my tractor.

Seems to me that tractors would be prime for electrification. Better torque output, more flexibility for PTOs. Just need a cost-effective battery that could power 8 hours of use, and ICE tractors will be a thing of the past.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

They should just use the same gas that every vehicle uses in The Walking Dead. That stuff remains perfectly usable after _years_ of sitting in the tank, apparently.

I am no automotive expert however I believe all engines/gas tanks built in the last couple of decades have some negative pressure thing that prevents the gas from going bad during long term storage.

 

[Vic]

Only if talking about a corded mower, but lots of people need more range than a cord can provide. You can't just keep reducing the wire gauge or you quickly end up with too heavy a cord.

Similar cordless electric costs over twice as much and even then only seems viable for someone who doesn't use it frequently or have a large area to cover, unless you're trying to contrast some luxury class gas mower.

A 21" gas mower can be had for around $240, while an equivalent cordless is closer to $400+, but can only run about 1 hour, then replacement batteries (you'll need at least 3X to equal the viable lifespan of the gas mower) will run over $500 more. If you have a small lot, you won't exhaust recharge cycles on the cordless mower as fast, but you also wouldn't wear out the gas mower as fast.

Home Depot has a 20" cordless electric mower with a 48 minute runtime for $249. That's more than adequate for your average lawn.

RYOBI 40V Brushless 20 in. Cordless Battery Walk Behind Push Lawn Mower with 6.0 Ah Battery and Charger RY401110-Y - The Home Depot

Cut down your grass in less time with this Ryobi 40V self-propelled lawn mower. It offers a push-button start and an easy-lift lock-and-release bagger for removing a bag in a single motion. With single-point

www.homedepot.com

 

[Bitek]

Seems to me that tractors would be prime for electrification. Better torque output, more flexibility for PTOs. Just need a cost-effective battery that could power 8 hours of use, and ICE tractors will be a thing of the past.

I am less optimistic for most of the use cases to come up with a better value proposition than diesel engines.

Irregular use in rural areas, need for low maintenance and long lifecycles. Tractors and other heavy equipment often lasts decades.

Use may go from sitting for months, to long workdays. Can't have power drop offs. Compact, easy to work on and robust.

Can an electric motor spin a hydraulic pump? Sure. But what battery tech do we have to replace the flexibility of a diesel at a similar cost and lifespan?

 

[SmCaudata]

Seems to me that tractors would be prime for electrification. Better torque output, more flexibility for PTOs. Just need a cost-effective battery that could power 8 hours of use, and ICE tractors will be a thing of the past.

We are about to see some launch.

World's First Electric Autonomous Tractor | Monarch Tractor

Monarch Tractor, the world's first fully electric tractor, driver-optional, autonomous tractor technology making sustainable farming economically superior.

www.monarchtractor.com

I think in general the diesel engines in tractors provide high torque and high reliability. There hasn't been a need to move. But yes, there is no reason not to go electric eventually

 

[Bitek]

I am no automotive expert however I believe all engines/gas tanks built in the last couple of decades have some negative pressure thing that prevents the gas from going bad during long term storage.

Nah, ethanol fuel will gum up small engines rather easily if left a season without stabilizer.
Cleaning a gummed up carb sucks.

 

[SmCaudata]

For the sake of the environment, universal batteries should be federally regulated. 'Consumer' batteries, 'industrial' batteries, and 'vehicular' batteries. Add a tier for 'heavy machinery' if we ever get to that point. Zero reason we should be manufacturing 8 different battery casings for 8 different companies for the same tool.

Agreed. Packs of off the shelf cells makes the most sense for a lot of applications. The fact that there is so much backlash from industry (Apple) about usb c for phones tells me that we won't see movement here though.

 

[Leeea]

Seems to me that tractors would be prime for electrification. Better torque output, more flexibility for PTOs. Just need a cost-effective battery that could power 8 hours of use, and ICE tractors will be a thing of the past.

I would disagree, farm tractors are about power to weight, running all day long, night, and then being left in the field.

Good soil for plants tends to be softer and not a great fit for heavy electric batteries.

The harvest for example has a moment when yields are best, and then it is rush rush until it is over. And then crash into bed when ever that is.

Other tasks like fertilizing (manure spraying), use lots of power continuous all day.

Same with plowing if the farmer still does that.

However ever unplowed fields are typically dragged, and that just takes torque all day long.

 

[mindless1]

I am no automotive expert however I believe all engines/gas tanks built in the last couple of decades have some negative pressure thing that prevents the gas from going bad during long term storage.

It is a sealed system but the vapors themselves are the more volatile component and leave behind varnish (for lack of a better term) that deposits in the fuel system.

It does happen less with a sealed system, but then we went and switched to gas with ethanol so now gas goes bad in a matter of months, give or take depending on ambient temperature. This is also true of E-blends sitting in a sealed gas can.

 

[darkswordsman17]

The pressure washers and heavy duty compressors (blowing out water lines) seem to be the places where electric is still lacking. I believe this has more to do with perceived consumer needs and development than actual limitations. I mean look at performance of electric VS gas cars. Companies could make high end electric washer, it would just be expensive and likely large/heavy due to battery. The avarage consumer would gravitate to a less capable electric or a cheaper gas powered one.

For people in the maintenance business, gas makes more sense because they run for 8 hours a day. Battery swapping and charging would be a pain.

All they need is a battery pack that sits in the trailer they cart around to carry the clippings, which they can plug their electric stuff into. Have it have a follow function and/or a retractable cord. Electric/hybrid pickups would provide this for them already

Seems to me that tractors would be prime for electrification. Better torque output, more flexibility for PTOs. Just need a cost-effective battery that could power 8 hours of use, and ICE tractors will be a thing of the past.

Actually that'd be pretty easy, just have battery trailers that follow behind, then if they need a new one, have another sitting by, while the previous one goes to charge. Could put a hopper on it so that its catching grain/etc too. The batteries needn't be expensive high density ones either.

The government is already subsidizing the half million dollar tractors anyway, they should make them cleaner.

Hell, subsidize a wind turbine for their farm and they'll be able to stop going and getting diesel. And the battery trailers will double as battery backup for their home for storms/etc.

 

[mindless1]

Home Depot has a 20" cordless electric mower with a 48 minute runtime for $249. That's more than adequate for your average lawn.

RYOBI 40V Brushless 20 in. Cordless Battery Walk Behind Push Lawn Mower with 6.0 Ah Battery and Charger RY401110-Y - The Home Depot

Cut down your grass in less time with this Ryobi 40V self-propelled lawn mower. It offers a push-button start and an easy-lift lock-and-release bagger for removing a bag in a single motion. With single-point

www.homedepot.com

That is flimsy junk, you'll need to replace it at least twice to equal the lifespan of the average gas mower, but at least then you get a new battery too.

 

[darkswordsman17]

Agreed. Packs of off the shelf cells makes the most sense for a lot of applications. The fact that there is so much backlash from industry (Apple) about usb c for phones tells me that we won't see movement here though.

Isn't the iPhone the only non-USB C Apple device now? And I think the only reason it hasn't been made that is Apple is planning on ditching it entirely and relying on a separate method wireless via magsafe. Also, at this point, moving to USB-C will actually cause deprecation of Lightning cables, leading to them being trashed. Lightning was in the market years before USB C. Griping that Apple resisted USB C is silly since they have adopted it other than the iPhone and Apple adopted Lightning years before USB-C, so the entire point of trying to force everyone to USB-C and decreasing the waste of cables is negligible.

Personally I think USB C is awful. Its a worse physical connector than Lightning (which could be upgraded to match the capabilities of USB C as far as data, etc) for phones, has so many different actual protocols that function over it so you actually have to be quite mindful of what you're plugging into what (we've had a bunch of people fry phones at work by plugging in laptop chargers to them, because after all its USB C so there shouldn't be a problem, right?).

 

[imported_tajmahal]

I thought California pushed the incandescent bulb switchover too early and are pushing automobiles and small trucks too fast, but lawn and yard equipment seems to have enough options available to make sense. If legal generators come on market in time.

 

[MrSquished]

Absolutely dumb for apple to be hanging onto lightning for the iPhone this long

 

[Vic]

That is flimsy junk, you'll need to replace it at least twice to equal the lifespan of the average gas mower, but at least then you get a new battery too.

The build quality of that electric mower is comparable to any gas mower at that price point. Anything below $400, you're going to be left with a running engine on a bent and busted platform after 10 years, if you're lucky. Been that way for a while now.

 

[manly]

I have way too many leaves to rake and bag. Blow them, chop them, sweep them and dump into compost pile for garden next year.


How much of the overall emissions footprint is this effecting? I would guess pretty small. Not an issue if you have a small property, but I'm doubtful this is feasible for larger properties.

Will be a long time if ever before you electricity my tractor.

Although I don't know of overall percentage, these small engines are heavy polluters. Here's the lede of the article:

California will soon ban the sale of new gas-powered leaf blowers and lawn mowers, a move aimed at curbing emissions from a category of small engines on pace to produce more pollution each year than passenger vehicles.

 

[Homerboy]

maybe part of the equation is that people don't need acres of beautifully mowed and kept lawns? Waste of water, gas/electricity etc to upkeep that garbage. Not to mention the mountains of poisons used every year. Plant clover or other such plants in place of non-native grasses.

 

[Bitek]

maybe part of the equation is that people don't need acres of beautifully mowed and kept lawns? Waste of water, gas/electricity etc to upkeep that garbage. Not to mention the mountains of poisons used every year. Plant clover or other such plants in place of non-native grasses.

You still have to mow clover. A good amount of my grass is clover and other non-grass plants, but you still have to mow or other stuff just takes over.

I wouldn't try to grow a bunch of grass in the desert SW, but other areas of the country get plenty of rain and stuff grows on its own.

I'm not in CA, so this doesn't apply to me. Don't see this working in my area either any time soon.

Imo, I don't think the goal needs to be complete replacement of IC engines and other carbon fuel uses. The goal should be drastically reduce and replace where sensible.

 

[Greenman]

It's going to be interesting to see the folks fighting forest fires trying to create a fire break with battery operated tools. I wonder if the tanker planes can dump batteries?

 

[Vic]

It's going to be interesting to see the folks fighting forest fires trying to create a fire break with battery operated tools. I wonder if the tanker planes can dump batteries?

You are truly a fucking idiot.

 

[mindless1]

The build quality of that electric mower is comparable to any gas mower at that price point. Anything below $400, you're going to be left with a running engine on a bent and busted platform after 10 years, if you're lucky. Been that way for a while now.

Then get an older used mower for $40, I see them on craigslist fairly often, though I don't see nearly as much plastic on the $250 gas mowers so I'd tend to disagree about similar build quality, and then there is the more universal parts designs for a major brand ICE mower, while a cordless may not have full manufacturer parts support so you're left hoping someone has parted one out on ebay and isn't asking too much for them.

Sure the decks are thinner on modern low end mowers but they are not as flimsy as you suggest, just about any will last 20+ years unless you often put it away wet and it rusts through.