California Bans a Large-Caliber Gun

[K1052]

California Bans a Large-Caliber Gun, and the Battle Is On
By CAROLYN MARSHALL

Published: January 4, 2005


AN FRANCISCO, Jan. 3 - California has become the first state to ban a powerful .50-caliber long-range rifle that gun control advocates portray as a military firearm that could easily fall into the hands of terrorists bent on assassination or shooting down an airplane.

Under the ban, which was signed into law by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger in September and took effect on Jan. 1, it is now illegal to manufacture, sell, distribute or import a weapon known as the .50-caliber BMG, or Browning machine gun rifle, a single-shot weapon widely used not only by law enforcement officers and the military but, more recently, by civilian sport shooters as well.


The new law limits possession to those who already own the rifle; they have until April 30, 2006, to register it or face a misdemeanor charge.

Gun rights advocates fear that the California legislation will prompt other states to follow - similar efforts have been undertaken in New York, Connecticut, Illinois, Massachusetts and Virginia, but have failed - and enthusiasts are already devising ways to alter the gun and so circumvent the law without breaking it.

Another result of the law is that in the weeks before it took effect, people rushing to buy the limited supplies of .50 BMG's descended on gun shops throughout California. Now that it is in force, some of the gun's out-of-state makers and distributors have threatened not to sell any of their firearms or services here.

"We all think it's the first step toward banning sniper rifles," said Michael Fournier, owner of the Gun Exchange, a shop in San Jose. "They keep chipping away a little at a time. Eventually they'll try to get them all."

A lawyer for the California Rifle and Pistol Association, a lobby that fought the legislation, said that for the first time gun control advocates had managed "to demonize" a firearm that gun proponents and lawmaker allies say has never been used to commit a crime in the United States.

The lawyer, Chuck Michel, said the .50 BMG, which weighs 30 pounds and can cost $2,000 to $8,000, was typically bought by collectors, shooting range enthusiasts and skilled competitors.

"Criminals don't carry around very pricey, very heavy rifles," Mr. Michel said. "They want handguns they can conceal."

The .50 BMG rifle, patented in 1987 by Barrett Firearms Manufacturing of Murfreesboro, Tenn., was designed as a sniper weapon for law enforcement and the military; it was widely used by American troops during the Persian Gulf war of 1991.

Manufacturers say the rifle is accurate at a range of up to 2,000 yards, more than a mile. It fires bullets five and a half inches long described as powerful enough to rip through armor, much less the thin aluminum skin that covers commercial airliners.

"They can pierce the skin of an aircraft," said Daniel R. Vice, a lawyer with the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, a central supporter of the law. "It could be used to shoot down an airplane. And we certainly don't want to wait until a terrorist buys one before we ban it."

The legislation's author, Assemblyman Paul Koretz, a Democrat from West Hollywood, concedes that street criminals would most likely view the .50 BMG as too much gun for the typical robbery or drive-by shooting. Rather, the law is intended to help keep the weapon out of the hands of "terrorists, general nut cases and survivalists," Mr. Koretz said, citing government reports suggesting that it had been used in assassinations overseas and that at least 25 had been bought by Osama bin Laden.

Mr. Michel, the lawyer for the gun rights group, said that adopting the ban in the name of fighting terrorism was without merit.

"The terrorist can get a nuclear dirty bomb or a shoulder-mounted rocket launcher," he said. "The .50-caliber is just a peashooter in comparison."

But while there is no conclusive evidence that the .50 BMG rifle has ever been used in the United States to commit a felony, it has nonetheless been seized from American criminals' arsenals. A 1999 briefing paper from the General Accounting Office, predecessor of the Government Accountability Office, Congress's investigative arm, said, "We have established a nexus to terrorist groups, outlaw motorcycle gangs, international drug cartels, domestic drug dealers, religious cults, militia groups, potential assassins and violent criminals."

A side effect of the new law is the ill will it has instilled toward Mr. Schwarzenegger among gun rights advocates. Many of them supported him for governor, and maintain that his signing the legislation was an act of betrayal.

"You know what we call him?" said Jerry Sloan, assistant manager of Precision Arms, a shop in Escondido. "Benedict Arnold."

Terri Carbaugh, a spokeswoman for the governor, said Mr. Schwarzenegger, a Republican, had made his position clear during his campaign.

"It's a military-type weapon," Ms. Carbaugh said of the .50 BMG, "and he believes the gun presents a clear and present danger to the general public."

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/04/national/04guns.html

 

[MercenaryForHire]

*middle finger (Edit - at the ban)*

Oh Teh Noes, it's a TERRORIST THREAT now. :roll:

- M4H

 

[yhelothar]

WRONG FORUM!

 

[piasabird]

A nice 22-250 can kill from long range. Winchester probably makes a nice .300 Winmag. That is a pretty large Rifle Shell.

With a Gun that expensive, you would think they could track the sell of them. I use to work for winchester Western and we mad teflon bullets for .50 Caliber.

I can not really see the need for such a weapon. In Illinois you cant even hunt deer with anything but a shotgun or black powder. I think there may be a handgun option too.

If I was a gun manufacturer I would make a version in .49 Caliber.

 

[EyeMWing]

Ahnuld is a traitor among men.

A .50BMG is going to do just as well as a 30-06 in any realistic assassination, and it SURE AS FVCKING HELL isn't going to shoot down an airplane. You don't shoot down an airplane with a ground-based MACHINE GUN. And don't get me started on the assassination potential of guns that were virtually MADE FOR IT (winmag comes to mind)

"They can pierce the skin of an aircraft," said Daniel R. Vice, a lawyer with the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, a central supporter of the law. "It could be used to shoot down an airplane. And we certainly don't want to wait until a terrorist buys one before we ban it."

Uhhhh right. My .22 can pierce the skin of an airliner, too.


Then again, California gun laws have always been lame.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: piasabird
A nice 22-250 can kill from long range. Winchester probably makes a nice .300 Winmag. That is a pretty large Rifle Shell.

With a Gun that expensive, you would think they could track the sell of them. I use to work for winchester Western and we mad teflon bullets for .50 Caliber.

Likely machinegun ammo for a military contract.

 

[SP33Demon]

CA = Soviet Russia

 

[TheNinja]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
CA = Soviet Russia

In Soviet California, the gun bans you! (wait....that doesn't make much sense, oh well).

 

[virtuamike]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
CA = Soviet Russia

But we have boobies

 

[bradruth]

This is pretty much the same "cosmetic" ban as the AWB. The reason the .50 is getting banned is all the hype around it. People perceive it as this uber weapon and so without thinking rationally sign the ban.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Nice, another law that does nothing good.

An example of gun laws in action, lets count the felonies:
Two felons bought automatic (1) firearms (2), and got some body armor and went into a Bank of America and proceeded to rob (3) them at gunpoint (4), in the process proceeded to shoot at the cops (5 and 6). Cops eventually killed one, while another shot himself (7).

Looks like the gun laws really helped out on that one, yet the anti-gun crowd uses that as an example of why they need MORE laws.

#1: automatic firearms are already banned
#2: felons are not allowed to possess firearms
#3: robbing a bank is illegal (duh)
#4: armed makes it worse
#5: resisting arrest
#6: attempted murder (add one for each person they shot at?)
#6.5: ...of a cop.
#7: suicide (yep, there's laws against it. Who's going to jail?)

So what happened? They added laws restricting who can get the body armor. GREAT! They would've just added one more to the list.

 

[MySoS]

California has also banned Airsoft guns in public, I think it is the only state to ban a toy gun in public.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: TheNinja

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
CA = Soviet Russia

In Soviet California, the gun bans you! (wait....that doesn't make much sense, oh well).

LoL! Soon they will ban samurai swords too

 

[jjones]

It's a stupid law. Arnold should know better.

 

[Garet Jax]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheNinja

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
CA = Soviet Russia

In Soviet California, the gun bans you! (wait....that doesn't make much sense, oh well).

LoL! Soon they will ban samurai swords too

Hope not. If I time it right, I can bring a plane down with my sword.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Great, more feel good legislation about guns:thumbsdown:

 

[TheNinja]

Originally posted by: Garet Jax

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheNinja

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
CA = Soviet Russia

In Soviet California, the gun bans you! (wait....that doesn't make much sense, oh well).

LoL! Soon they will ban samurai swords too

Hope not. If I time it right, I can bring a plane down with my sword.

I usually use my ninja stars for that kind of work, but I'm sure a properly times sword slash (or toss) would also do the trick. Peace Homey!

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Actually, most states DO have laws against swords.

 

[KK]

Maybe if california started actually executing people on death row, we wouldn't need to worry too much about these stupid laws.

 

[Kaervak]

Hmmm, banning a weapon solely on the fact of what caliber shell it uses. By that logic (or extreme lack there of) they should be banning cannons. After all the projectile a cannon fires is huge and can cause a hell of a lot of damage.

Edit:

"They can pierce the skin of an aircraft," said Daniel R. Vice, a lawyer with the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, a central supporter of the law. "It could be used to shoot down an airplane. And we certainly don't want to wait until a terrorist buys one before we ban it."

While I don't doubt a well placed shot (extremely well placed) could cause severe damage to an aircraft, just hitting it with a .50 cal shell won't cause explosive decompression. These people need to stop thinking movies are fact. It takes a ton of damage to cause explosive decompression, much more than a .50 cal could probably ever do. But then again making these people think could be extremely dangerous.

 

[kage69]

While I think there is no need for civilians to own .50s at all...

"They can pierce the skin of an aircraft,"

Yeah, so can just about everything else beefier than a .22 Mag, oh noes!!!

 

[GuinnessExtraStout]

They infringe a little more. Then a little more. Then a little more. Not too much at once but eventually all guns will be banned.

 

[desy]

One of the mistruths the gun lobby always claims 'and don't get me wrong I'm all for guns '
Is that all guns are created equal, they aren't, a semi auto with a large cap mag can cause a lot more damage than a bolt action 'see Vang' likewise a 50 BMG is multiples of times more powerfull than say a 300 win Mag.

Now in the interest of National security? the gun lobby guy says well they can just make a dirty bomb or buy an RPG, hhmmmm ,now can you get one of those for a couple grand? or legally be in possesion of one if your pulled over? I think not. . . I dunno, other than collector interest or mischief I don't see much use for a 50, maybe they have a point. .

 

[Demon-Xanth]

"Los Angeles and a few other SoCal cities have a town ordinance banning the carry of knives over 3"."

http://www.equalccw.com/knifelaw.html

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: GuinnessExtraStout
They infringe a little more. Then a little more. Then a little more. Not too much at once but eventually all guns will be banned.

I challenge them to ban all guns - and then wonder "WTF?" when murders don't stop.