CA state worker retired and cashed out with 810k in unused comp and vacation time!

[spidey07]

he worked INSTEAD of taking time off!!

how is that considered "entitlement" ?? His compensation package ensured he would be compensated for time he was unable to take off.

If you think he worked the system to his advantage you are crazy. It was more like the system worked his ass to the BONE and now the system has to retire him probably because he is too old to continue to work. OTHERWISE you can bet the SYSTEM would still be working his ass to the bone!

No one wants to do that job... Working in the State Prison system is treacherous.

My Uncle actually does exactly that (he's like the head physician or something, goes to different prisons). I could never do what he does and yet he still maintains a great happy outlook on life - here's to you Uncle Spencer.

My point is the guy was contractually obligated to that benefit, so good for him or his union that negotiated it. The downside is (and if I'm understanding that backwards state, it's state law) as a controller you can't plan for or budget this. But in the private sector it is overwhelmingly a "use it or lose it" policy for the very budget and planning reasons I've mentioned.

 

[OrByte]

My Uncle actually does exactly that (he's like the head physician or something, goes to different prisons). I could never do what he does and yet he still maintains a great happy outlook on life - here's to you Uncle Spencer.

My point is the guy was contractually obligated to that benefit, so good for him or his union that negotiated it. The downside is (and if I'm understanding that backwards state, it's state law) as a controller you can't plan for or budget this. But in the private sector it is overwhelmingly a "use it or lose it" policy for the very budget and planning reasons I've mentioned.

good for uncle Spencer. You should ask him what its like to work at a prison facility, I bet he has some AMAZING stories.

I understand the rest of your point. I can't argue that other than to say that I am sure there are budgetary formulas that agencies can employ.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

As far as the "budgetary woes of the State" you people ought to be looking at the larger problems this state is facing. The costs of the State workforce is a drop in the bucket to the program costs.

Of course but the costs for those programs also has a direct relation to the state employees ( including their pension plans, comp times and vacations days, etc.. ) that run these very programs you are mentioning. The entire thing is tied together with why the state is screwed unless it can get costs under control.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

But in the private sector it is overwhelmingly a "use it or lose it" policy for the very budget and planning reasons I've mentioned.

Which is what some cities have adopted for city workers due to the overwhelming abuse of the comp and vacation hours. In SF a while back ago the practice of SF school janitors abusing the overtime system was very rampant.

I remember reading about SF school janitors banking a shit load of overtime until the practice was stopped. Some of janitors earned so much overtime that they were paid twice as much as the principals at their respective schools when all the hours were totaled up. The most chronic individual totaled up 1,100 of OT in a 1 year (edit: correction, not month)!

I'll see if I can dig up the article as it was several years ago. Anyways the state should move to a use it or lose it system to the easy potential for rampant abuse as highlighted in the article.

Edit: Found it.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/e/a/2000/07/09/NEWS5798.dtl

 

[OrByte]

Of course but the costs for those programs also has direct relation to the state employees ( including their pension plans, comp times and vacations hours, etc.. ) that run these very programs you are mentioning. The entire thing is tied together with why the state is screwed unless it can get costs under control.

I dont disagree with that.

But when the State voters keep voting in things like high speed rail, or other programs, then someone has to do that job. So don't blame State workers for doing that job.

In particular don't blame State workers (Prison workers, Psych Techs, Mental Health Professionals, etc etc) for doing the jobs that NO one else wants to do. Because us tax payers pay good money to keep those criminals locked up, and those mental health clients institutionalized! Someone has to run and work in those facilities.

its like the flip side of all of those Corporate millionaires that people love to defend. The Corporate Millionaires get paid MILLIONS of dollars to do jobs that no one else can do, that few are qualified to do.

I can tell you, few are qualified to work as a Psych Tech in a Mental Hospital. Even less than that are qualified and WILLING to work as a Physician in a Mental Hospital or Prison.

 

[Brovane]

California's constitution mandates a balanced budget. Worst case scenario, California defaults and some of its creditors gets wiped out. For everyone else here, life goes on.

Actually I believe that California's constitution also mandates that it cannot default on its default. I live in CA and I fully expect at somepoint that taxes are going up.

 

[dainthomas]

Why are so many people upset that a state worker was actually working? Say he uses all his vacation every year, then the state would be paying him to not work as well as paying someone else to cover for him. This way, they just pay him for his time off and hire someone else they would have to hire anyway. Wouldn't that actually save money over the years?

Or are people just jealous that he took hardly any vacation for decades and earned a nice reward for it? If California wasn't hosed for a variety of more significant reasons, then no one would care.

 

[JSt0rm]

How do you know he didn't surf Facebook and ATOT for 10 hours a day?

Yah mean like 90% of our community?

no doubt half these fools here dont do shit at work but jump around anandtech.

 

[Mursilis]

Although Tudor, the fired State Fund president, took home slightly less - $550,000 - nearly all of his payment was for unused vacation time. Fund spokeswoman Jennifer Vargen said Tudor, whose salary was $273,000, cashed out 488 days of unused annual leave time, compared with 38 days of holidays and personal leave.

Wow, so that guy made more than every federal official but the president! Not a bad gig at all!

 

[Sinsear]

Where I work the system is very similar. However there is a cap on how many vacation days and comp hours you can bank. And recently they instituted a system that limited the "payout" of this time to no more than 2x your last year of salary. So not only did it reel in some exorbitant separation checks, but it created a slew of retirements before the deadline, and budgetary savings by attrition.

 

[Zebo]

LOL. Get it while the gitin store is open. All this is unsustainable.

Soon California's retirees will cost more than active employees. I give Ca 2 years max before it implodes. Either onerous taxes will chase everyone out and there will be no money and retirement and state workers collapse or voters will change const to nix their benefits and luxury payroll and benefits. Either way like I told my mom who's a retired professor, don't count on it.

 

[her209]

But when the State voters keep voting in things like high speed rail, or other programs, then someone has to do that job. So don't blame State workers for doing that job.

In particular don't blame State workers (Prison workers, Psych Techs, Mental Health Professionals, etc etc) for doing the jobs that NO one else wants to do. Because us tax payers pay good money to keep those criminals locked up, and those mental health clients institutionalized! Someone has to run and work in those facilities.

In California, we want to lock up criminals for life but we don't want to pay to adequately house them or hire staff to watch them.

 

[nobodyknows]

How are you calling me a troll?

Because he's ENTITILED too?

 

[soulcougher73]

Good for him. If he didnt use it and the policy states you get a cash buyout when you retire i dont see a problem. Poor guy worked his ass apparently never taking much time off, he probably deserves it.

 

[soulcougher73]

How do you know he didn't surf Facebook and ATOT for 10 hours a day?

LOL so do all the private sector people on this forum. point?

 

[her209]

How do you know he didn't surf Facebook and ATOT for 10 hours a day?

Maybe he was out on the golf course with his other prison physician buddies.

 

[JS80]

ROFL :awe:

It doesn't happen in private companies. There are hard caps in the system so that when someone reaches it, vacation time stops accumulating.

 

[her209]

It doesn't happen in private companies. There are hard caps in the system so that when someone reaches it, vacation time stops accumulating.

Do the same employees have the option to cash out their unused vacation and/or convert sick time to vacation time as opposed to just losing it?

 

[highland145]

Poor working stiffs. Shame they had to put in 20 or 25 years to collect. They should have become congressmen. Then after only 6 years....Ca-Ching for life.

 

[JS80]

ROFL :awe:

Do the same employees have the option to cash out their unused vacation and/or convert sick time to vacation time as opposed to just losing it?

I have heard of some companies allowing that during times where it's impossible to take vacation (e.g. during a merger, audit, etc.) but most of the time if it reaches your cap you must use or lose. I currently have 31 days accrued with a cap of 37.5 days. As I reach the cap I will prob start taking a few days off a month. I work in CA.

In some states, it's straight up use or lose with NO carryover.

 

[thraashman]

My previous company allowed accrual up to 240 hours before you stopped accruing. When I quit the company I was paid out for about 70 hours of unused vacation time. My current company has a use it or lose it policy. Problem is my current company also dictates that we're not allowed to use it between November 1 and about Jan 14. In addition due to a business ramp up in October we're almost never allowed to use it in October either. Due to these policies and my boss's tendency to not approve vacations on time, many people have lost a lot of vacation. Most everyone on my team didn't realize it's a use it or lose it policy because none know of any companies anymore that do that. Private sector jobs actually overwhelmingly don't have a use it or lose it policy, they have an accrual cap.

Due to the crap of losing vacation that has happened here, my team has gone over our management's head and we've been allowed to take vacations that we lost.

 

[StageLeft]

Per above most private corporations have a max on carrying over vacation. That's common sense. That California doesn't is silly. if you're accruing all those vacation days and not using them you obviously don't care about them, so too bad so sad.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Why are so many people upset that a state worker was actually working? Say he uses all his vacation every year, then the state would be paying him to not work as well as paying someone else to cover for him. This way, they just pay him for his time off and hire someone else they would have to hire anyway. Wouldn't that actually save money over the years?

Or are people just jealous that he took hardly any vacation for decades and earned a nice reward for it? If California wasn't hosed for a variety of more significant reasons, then no one would care.

If I read the article correctly he worked for only 10 years with the state...

Lets say this person made $125k a year.. about $60/hour. If I am doing my math correctly.. Over the 10 years they said he worked for the state, he would have accrued about 340 weeks of vacation and comp time. Assuming he took ZERO vacation time, and lets assume he had an insane 8 weeks of vacation every year... (Which is probably high).. He had 260 weeks of comp time. So he averaged 26 weeks of comp time every year. 26 weeks x 40 hours in a week is 1,040 hours. Divide that by 52 weeks in the year (Since he took ZERO vacation) and he averaged 20 hours of overtime/comp time EVERY week for 10 YEARS.

Really? Who the hell could do that for 10 years straight. Especially if the job is as stressful as everyone says. Something just doesn't add up here. Maybe my math is wrong.

 

[child of wonder]

Looks like the managers F'ed up by allowing them to over accrue vacation time.

The managers should be fired, train to ensure the 80 day limit is adhered to, and move on.

 

[WHAMPOM]

How are you calling me a troll? If what you say is true then no wonder that state is failing. ENTITLEMENT MENTALITY.

In the rest of the world you use it or you lose it. I'm sitting on like 4 weeks of paid time off right now, if I don't use it, I lose it.





So if you get screwed, everyone should get screwed? Explains your mind set.