Boycotting the new GM.

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: halik
Because your premise is that the company will inherently make inferior products now that it's socialized. If you boycot it, you basically don't believe what you preach. Do you boycott USPS because you believe that Fedex can do a better job? No, if fedex does actually do a better job then you use it instead of USPS. What they're arguing here is "well if we're not right, we'll make it so we're right".

If you're making an argument for free market, let the free market work.

USPS is a bad example. They are, by law, a monopoly on non-priority mail. I don't think we want GM going down that road.

That said, it almost seems like the left is threatening the American public. "You'd better buy GM or you'll be subsidizing them forever." We're starting to the see the cracks in the system that intelligent people saw long ago. The problems with state run companies is coming to light. How is Ford going to compete with veiled threats from the federal government toward car buyers?

 

[LTC8K6]

That's what I feel. A "buy GM and Chrysler or else" attitude, which I naturally rebel against.

Somehow I am unpatriotic if I don't support these new entities.

Screw 'em...

Ford will probably get sucked in eventually from trying to compete with the government and the UAW to sell cars.

 

[woodie1]

Picking up on the buy Government Motors theme, how many Chevy buyers can afford a $40K Volt? Will Uncle Sugar subsidize the price so John Q. Public can buy one?

 

[LOUISSSSS]

Originally posted by: woodie1
Picking up on the buy Government Motors theme, how many Chevy buyers can afford a $40K Volt? Will Uncle Sugar subsidize the price so John Q. Public can buy one?

nope, they're going to take your money for the bailout (via tax) and give you NO discounts on their cars.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

I'm going to buy the best car for the money that meets my personal taste and needs. I would prefer if it's domestic, but it doesn't need to be. My first car was a Mazda. My current is a Ford. If my next car happens to be a GM then so be it, boycott be damned.

Originally posted by: woodie1
Picking up on the buy Government Motors theme, how many Chevy buyers can afford a $40K Volt? Will Uncle Sugar subsidize the price so John Q. Public can buy one?

I'm sure GM will have no problem finding the 10-15,000 Volts a home in 2011. If nothing else people will buy them as a gadget, like an expensive phone or high-end stereo.

 

[woodie1]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: woodie1
Picking up on the buy Government Motors theme, how many Chevy buyers can afford a $40K Volt? Will Uncle Sugar subsidize the price so John Q. Public can buy one?

I'm sure GM will have no problem finding the 10-15,000 Volts a home in 2011. If nothing else people will buy them as a gadget, like an expensive phone or high-end stereo.

Thanks, that puts my mind at ease.
Everyone should have a $40K gadget in their garage.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: LTC8K6
That's what I feel. A "buy GM and Chrysler or else" attitude, which I naturally rebel against.

Somehow I am unpatriotic if I don't support these new entities.

Screw 'em...

Ford will probably get sucked in eventually from trying to compete with the government and the UAW to sell cars.

I agree with this, it falls into the same BS category as "Buy American!".

Buy the best product for your money and let the free market work. If Gubmit Motors starts making crap, don't buy and they'll flop. It's as simple as that.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: woodie1

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: woodie1
Picking up on the buy Government Motors theme, how many Chevy buyers can afford a $40K Volt? Will Uncle Sugar subsidize the price so John Q. Public can buy one?

I'm sure GM will have no problem finding the 10-15,000 Volts a home in 2011. If nothing else people will buy them as a gadget, like an expensive phone or high-end stereo.

Thanks, that puts my mind at ease.
Everyone should have a $40K gadget in their garage.

Then I don't see your point. I don't see the problem with somebody buying a cool toy if they can afford it. The production numbers will be small the first couple years, which will make it pretty easy for GM to sell through.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: LTC8K6
That's what I feel. A "buy GM and Chrysler or else" attitude, which I naturally rebel against.

Somehow I am unpatriotic if I don't support these new entities.

Screw 'em...

Ford will probably get sucked in eventually from trying to compete with the government and the UAW to sell cars.

I agree with this, it falls into the same BS category as "Buy American!".

Buy the best product for your money and let the free market work. If Gubmit Motors starts making crap, don't buy and they'll flop. It's as simple as that.

The problem is that they won't flop. Every American now owns a GM car, they just won't have the luxury of driving it until they pay the $20K delivery fee at their local dealer.

Like I said "Buy GM or else."

 

[Squisher]

Originally posted by: JJ650

Originally posted by: LOUISSSSS
............

You know, you would garner a little more respect if you actually make a valid statement and note of all of the facts and not just use the ones that suit your arguements.

Hahahahahahahahaha.

JJ650 you'd have better luck telling this to the nearest wall.

 

[JJ650]

Originally posted by: Squisher

Originally posted by: JJ650

Originally posted by: LOUISSSSS
............

You know, you would garner a little more respect if you actually make a valid statement and note of all of the facts and not just use the ones that suit your arguements.

Hahahahahahahahaha.

JJ650 you'd have better luck telling this to the nearest wall.

It was worth a shot. What can I say?

 

[JDub02]

I haven't read alot of the above posts, but when the bailouts first went out, I decided to personally boycott GM and Chrysler. This posiition was cemented when the government and the UAW took ownership of both companies. GM and Chrysler are not too big to fail.

My next truck will be a Ford unless they jump on the handout wagon.

 

[JDub02]

Originally posted by: iFX
I think it's a little silly to try and label this a Democrat issue or a Republican issue. The real issue is that Washington blew a ton of cash and then blew a ton more buying into a failed automaker and will undoubtedly blow a ton more before this is all said and done - and the average American tax paying isn't getting anything for it.

yep.

 

[LTC8K6]

Congress is already starting the micromanagement of the companies. They have already twisted arms to keep plants open that were intended to be closed. They are already meddling.

 

[StageLeft]

Give me a big tax break and I will buy a Camaro. I promise.

 

[LTC8K6]

If you bought a gas guzzler Congress may reward you with a big old voucher...

Where all this money is coming from is anyone's guess.

Say maybe you can a $4500 voucher for a clunker and a $7500 tax credit for a Volt...

Yeah, let's subsidise the heck out of the auto industry. That'll fix it right up. No need to make the cars better, just pay people to buy them...

Maybe we can get a bunch of people to take out car loans they really can't afford and then they can apply for bailouts.

I wonder how long this debt can keep getting recycled?

Nationalize the auto industry, give it to the unions to wreck, pour tens of billions of federal money into a money pit and then pay people with more tax dollars to buy cars they don't want or can't afford the payments on.

Sounds like a plan.

 

[FeuerFrei]

Sounds like a great idea. I think the entire country should be boycotting GM products.

You want the government's efforts to resuscitate GM to fail, to discourage further takeovers of private business and discourage other businesses from shamelessly asking for government money.

Yes, we've spent public money on GM already, but we shouldn't have, and adherence to proven principle is WAY more important than failing to recoup financial losses.

I think the liberals will seize the opportunity to force GM to produce what they think the public should drive, and then GM will be up shit creek when nobody wants it. Then they'll pile on government incentives so taxpayers will be paying in triplicate for each GM car sold. Once for manufacture, again for incentives, and again for ownership of the product. Plus they'll put a ceiling on executive salaries, thus guaranteeing labor shortages and incompetence.

Personally, given the money, I'd be tempted to buy a new Ford just to make a point and support a company smart enough to avoid the ball & chain of government 'assistance.' And that's saying something cuz I'm really only interested in Toyotas.

 

[Bignate603]

I'll buy whatever vehicle meets my needs and my price range. End of story. I don't care who owns it, if they can produce the car that best suits what I want I'll buy it. When I need to buy another vehicle it may be GM, it may be Ford, it may be Toyota or even Honda. I could care less about the name on it as long as its what I want.

 

[LTC8K6]

Well, no one is talking just about the name on the vehicle...

 

[bozack]

Speaking for myself their bankruptcy makes me want to avoid their products and if I were to consider American I would rather support the likes of Ford instead.

 

[SammyJr]

Originally posted by: FeuerFrei
I think the liberals will seize the opportunity to force GM to produce what they think the public should drive, and then GM will be up shit creek when nobody wants it.

LOL. Prior to bankruptcy, GM was doing an awesome job making cars that people wanted. Oh wait.

Plus they'll put a ceiling on executive salaries, thus guaranteeing labor shortages and incompetence.

GM's execs were paid handsomely prior to the bankruptcy, yet they were incompetent. Executive pay is tied to who you know on the board, not on any ability.

 

[angry hampster]

Originally posted by: LTC8K6
If you bought a gas guzzler Congress may reward you with a big old voucher...

Where all this money is coming from is anyone's guess.

Say maybe you can a $4500 voucher for a clunker and a $7500 tax credit for a Volt...

Yeah, let's subsidise the heck out of the auto industry. That'll fix it right up. No need to make the cars better, just pay people to buy them...

Maybe we can get a bunch of people to take out car loans they really can't afford and then they can apply for bailouts.

I wonder how long this debt can keep getting recycled?

Nationalize the auto industry, give it to the unions to wreck, pour tens of billions of federal money into a money pit and then pay people with more tax dollars to buy cars they don't want or can't afford the payments on.

Sounds like a plan.

When will the cash for clunkers thing start? ..or has it been made official even? I'd love to get $4500 for my '97 Jeep.

 

[JDub02]

Originally posted by: SammyJr

Originally posted by: FeuerFrei
I think the liberals will seize the opportunity to force GM to produce what they think the public should drive, and then GM will be up shit creek when nobody wants it.

LOL. Prior to bankruptcy, GM was doing an awesome job making cars that people wanted. Oh wait.

their trucks and suv's sold very well, so they were making popular products. but even when product was moving, high labor and legacy costs cut way into the bottom line.

then gas prices spiked and they lost the only market keeping them afloat. that's when they started getting their cars up to industry standards. too little, too late, unfortunately.

feuerfrei is right, though. most people don't want little electric cars, regardless of how popular the notion is in washington. heck, even the politicians pushing for it don't want little electric cars. they're rolling around in big government-purchased suv's.

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: SammyJr

Originally posted by: FeuerFrei
I think the liberals will seize the opportunity to force GM to produce what they think the public should drive, and then GM will be up shit creek when nobody wants it.

LOL. Prior to bankruptcy, GM was doing an awesome job making cars that people wanted. Oh wait.

I dont understand what you mean by "oh wait". They built exactly what the people wanted. Their sales figures showed that. Or do you mean "what the people wanted" according to what the media and the government wanted the people to want? It's not their fault that trucks and suv's outsold everything, it's what the people wanted.

 

[SammyJr]

Originally posted by: Ktulu

Originally posted by: SammyJr

Originally posted by: FeuerFrei
I think the liberals will seize the opportunity to force GM to produce what they think the public should drive, and then GM will be up shit creek when nobody wants it.

LOL. Prior to bankruptcy, GM was doing an awesome job making cars that people wanted. Oh wait.

I dont understand what you mean by "oh wait". They built exactly what the people wanted. Their sales figures showed that. Or do you mean "what the people wanted" according to what the media and the government wanted the people to want? It's not their fault that trucks and suv's outsold everything, it's what the people wanted.

If they were building what people wanted, they would not have gone bankrupt. Yeah, they made great SUVs, but completely ignored the fact that high gas prices always leads to demand for smaller, more efficient vehicles. They made that mistake in the early '80s and again now. GM's smaller vehicles (at least for the American market) are shit.