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Black man taken to jail for sitting in public area

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Moonbeam said:
I'm fine with that. Hope you don't mind me pointing out a wider issue, that the business, while it has that right, may have sought to apply it out of bigotry thus turning it from a legal right into a moral wrong.
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If the guy was sitting in the lobby, maybe so.

But if the guy was back in an employees' area - No. Banks, nor other businesses, allow people to wonder back there for obvious reasons. Do people leave valuables on their desks? Employees are entitled to a reasonable level of security etc. How many times have we seen guys show up at the wife's workplace and cause trouble. I think the security guards acted appropriately by merely asking him to leave. They then called the po-po when he refused. That also seems reasonable. They didn't beat him up and toss him out etc.

Fern
 
s0me0nesmind1 said:
Regardless, failing to comply with an officer is not a way to resolve any dispute heh. Something tells me it will only escalate a dispute. But feel free to find a MN law that says otherwise to that one.
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What law is that? Perhaps you should back up your claims with links.

If no Minnesota statute states you must give your name to a peace officer when stopped, refusal to give your name to a peace officer is not unreasonable nor unlawful nor is it escalation.
 
Londo_Jowo said:
The person in the story in the OP of this thread did not experience any of this growing up, in fact anyone under the age of 50 didn't experience riding in the back of the bus, black only restaurants/water fountains, or segregated schools.
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Ah shit. I'm not going to respond to this with the obvious.
 
Fern said:
If the guy was sitting in the lobby, maybe so.

But if the guy was back in an employees' area - No. Banks, nor other businesses, allow people to wonder back there for obvious reasons. Do people leave valuables on their desks? Employees are entitled to a reasonable level of security etc. How many times have we seen guys show up at the wife's workplace and cause trouble. I think the security guards acted appropriately by merely asking him to leave. They then called the po-po when he refused. That also seems reasonable. They didn't beat him up and toss him out etc.

Fern
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I already acknowledged that.
 
why couldn't i have been born a black man? i'd have been harassed by now and sitting on a gold mine. alas, it was not meant to be. 🙁
 
Thebobo said:
http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/..._lawyers_question_aggressive_use_of_force.php

Asked why the charges were dropped, Lollie says one of his daughter's teachers saw the entire incident and corroborated his version of events. Lollie says another woman who works near the First National Bank Building told investigators she would often sit and have lunch in the stretch of skyway where Lollie was arrested and had never been badgered by security guards or police.
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Glad to see you peek out on this one. 🙂
 
Thebobo said:
http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/..._lawyers_question_aggressive_use_of_force.php

Asked why the charges were dropped, Lollie says one of his daughter's teachers saw the entire incident and corroborated his version of events. Lollie says another woman who works near the First National Bank Building told investigators she would often sit and have lunch in the stretch of skyway where Lollie was arrested and had never been badgered by security guards or police.
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So why didn't the teacher intervene/speak with the police when the incident was taking place?
 
Thebobo said:
another woman who works near the First National Bank Building told investigators she would often sit and have lunch in the stretch of skyway where Lollie was arrested and had never been badgered by security guards or police.
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Abwx said:
If he was a white, preferably a cute woman, the guards, seeing that he (she) was doing nothing and seeming lost, would had asked him (her) if they could help in any manner and would had been answered that he was waiting for a child, you can be sure that there would had been no one calling the police and nothing would had happened, now it would be interesting to know how often thoses so called guards called the police because there was an apparently static and unknown person hanging there, be assured that it was the first time that it did happen...
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.........
 
Moonbeam said:
I'm fine with that. Hope you don't mind me pointing out a wider issue, that the business, while it has that right, may have sought to apply it out of bigotry thus turning it from a legal right into a moral wrong.
Click to expand...

I have no problem with that, just try to refrain from (needlessly) calling me an idiot, please.






In the case of actual idiocy, however, feel free. 😀
 
MrPickins said:
I have no problem with that, just try to refrain from (needlessly) calling me an idiot, please.
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It's sometimes hard to tell, when one has a strong feeling as to which way a conversation should go, and when alternate points are introduced, no matter how valid, if that is done for the sake of information, or to distract and deflect the conversation elsewhere. Thus I felt it was idiotic to focus on your point, the rights of business owners, when the conversation was full of denial that blacks face bigotry that whites know little about. Folk often call others idiots to make them reconsider, but that only makes them idiots for doing so since, as we have just seen, it seldom works.
 
Moonbeam said:
It's sometimes hard to tell, when one has a strong feeling as to which way a conversation should go, and when alternate points are introduced, no matter how valid, if that is done for the sake of information, or to distract and deflect the conversation elsewhere. Thus I felt it was idiotic to focus on your point, the rights of business owners, when the conversation was full of denial that blacks face bigotry that whites know little about.
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I'll comment on whatever aspects of an issue I choose, thank you very much.

Folk often call others idiots to make them reconsider, but that only makes them idiots for doing so since, as we have just seen, it seldom works.
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Exactly. Ad hominem don't cause people to change their mind, so why did you utilize one?

Self hate? 😉
 
Fern said:
If the guy was sitting in the lobby, maybe so.

But if the guy was back in an employees' area - No. Banks, nor other businesses, allow people to wonder back there for obvious reasons. Do people leave valuables on their desks? Employees are entitled to a reasonable level of security etc. How many times have we seen guys show up at the wife's workplace and cause trouble. I think the security guards acted appropriately by merely asking him to leave. They then called the po-po when he refused. That also seems reasonable. They didn't beat him up and toss him out etc.

Fern
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Jesus.. Fern has stooped all the way to defending racist activity. Not surprising that you stoop this low. Pathetic.

I guess getting arrested is OK with you, since the cops didn't tase him or shoot him. Very "reasonable" to you I guess. you concern for others is amazing, I must say.

I bet if it was a white woman, you would totally be defending her and saying how wrong this is.
 
SOFTengCOMPelec said:
The police are around to help everything move smoothly, and to take appropriate action if there is criminal activities. So if for some reason they have decided to arrest you, then you should calmly let them do it.

If instead, you ignore their "you are under arrest", and you start swearing, kicking, ignoring/refusing/annoying the police, it will usually not go down well.

E.g. I think there is a thread about an 18 year old boy, who got shot dead, for resisting arrest, and acting aggressively to the officers. When he charged at the police officer, he got shot.

Yes, there may be issues, of the police harassing innocent people, but badly resisting arrest is NOT a good solution to this problem, if it exists.
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Gee I wonder why we left your wonderful country and started a new one where the people are supposed to be in charge.
 
pauldun170 said:
In this case, what law was actually broken?

Anyone familiar with the building and the layout?
Was the area "private" and not "public space"?
Was it clearly marked as private?
Was the Security Guard contractually responsible for the area in question?
Are other non-employees using that area and are they asked to leave?
If the officer witnessed the trespassing, why were the charges dropped?
Anyone familiar with Minnesota Trespassing laws?
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/?id=609.605 (Don't have time to dig)

If he entered the building legally and was asked was asked to leave but didn't until a police officer escorted him how SHOULD the law be applied?
Shouldn't the officer have clearly stated that he is being charged with trespassing and will be issued a summons (for a misdemeanor charge)?

Why is the officer asking "what was the problem back there"?

Its a simple trespass and the subject is leaving the area
Either
A. Escort off the property
B. Escort off the property and issue summons
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looks like somebodies asking too many questions.

JUST SHUT UP AND COMPLY!
 
stlc8tr said:
This is supposedly the skyway that he was arrested in.

https://www.facebook.com/1619058301...496.161905830198/165363885198/?type=3&theater

"Need a quick five? Enjoy a seat on the skyway."

I guess Lollie's problem was that he sat there for 10 minutes instead of 5 minutes.
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For the lazy -
1935411_165363885198_4360722_n.jpg
 
Londo_Jowo said:
Wow, people are still trying to make this about race when there's no evidence to prove such.
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Seems to me its race driven since other white people have sat there with no problems. Sure likes a comfortable and public place to sit. And according to the law it is.
 
hal2kilo said:
Gee I wonder why we left your wonderful country and started a new one where the people are supposed to be in charge.
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If you are a criminal and/or suspected of criminal activities, then the police (of most countries) have the right/power/authority/permission to question/arrest and take you to the police station.

If you happen to be the person, who is the criminal, or suspected of being one, then you really need to comply with the police request to arrest you, otherwise it can end badly.
 
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Thebobo said:
http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/..._lawyers_question_aggressive_use_of_force.php

Asked why the charges were dropped, Lollie says one of his daughter's teachers saw the entire incident and corroborated his version of events. Lollie says another woman who works near the First National Bank Building told investigators she would often sit and have lunch in the stretch of skyway where Lollie was arrested and had never been badgered by security guards or police.
Click to expand...

....and she is a white woman.. figures...🙄

The St. Paul Police Department took to Facebook in an attempt to justify officers' conduct.

First, here's the entirety of the statement the St. Paul PD posted to Facebook yesterday:

Thank you for the discussion regarding the video that was has been circulated from a January 31, 2014 arrest.

As is often the case, the video does not show the totality of the circumstances.

Our officers were called by private security guards on a man who was trespassing in a private area. The guards reported that the man had on repeated occasions refused to leave a private "employees only" area in the First National Bank Building.

With no information on who the man was, what he might be doing or why he refused to leave the area, responding Saint Paul police officers tried to talk to him, asking him who he was. He refused to tell them or cooperate.

Our officers are called upon and required to respond to calls for assistance and to investigate the calls. At one point, the officers believed he might either run or fight with them. It was then that officers took steps to take him into custody. He pulled away and resisted officers' lawful orders. They then used the force necessary to safely take him into custody.

The man was charged with trespassing, disorderly conduct and obstruction of the legal process. Those charges were dismissed in July.

We have had a discussion with the man in the video and he was given information on how to file a formal complaint if that was his desire. At this time, no formal complaint has been filed.

We hope this helps to clear up some of the information our communities have been seeking.


Lollie says he was in a public area skyway:

Lollie says he was sitting in a chair in the skyway's hallway when a security guard approached him, told him he was in a private area. There were no signs that said employees only or private area. He had sat and waited in this area many times before along with other people.
 
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There is more to this story than is being told as there's no law suit by the person against the police and the DOJ is not investigating any civil rights violations.
 
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