Bit-Tech does an X1900 roundup: AIW vs. XT vs. XTX vs. 512 GTX

[Dethfrumbelo]

Hmm, I guess no one else is entitled to an opinion.

For those who are scared to install their own aftermarket cooler, I'm sure that several manufacturers will come out with X1900XTs with AC silencers slapped on them.

 

[DeathReborn]

Wow, look at those fanboys go at it. Kinda amusing how one group is now doing what it kept getting annoyed about another group doing, suck it up ladies and stop being jerks 24/7.

Everyone should read this before drawimng conclusions from this rather well done review:

Gameplay Evaluations - How We Tested:
Please be aware that the way we test our video cards is not a like-for-like comparison, and it is not meant to be. We decided to concentrate on finding the "Best Playable" settings - this means that we're finding the best possible gaming experience delivered on each different configuration. There are no timedemos used in our evaluations - we're focusing on the real-world gaming experience, which is, ultimately what should determine your next video card purchase.

Get it, NOT like for like. Both cards offer people an enjoyable gaming experience.

Yes the X1900 stock cooler is rather loud as my mates PC proved to me, but then he's not had the best choices (Radeon 7000 to FX5800 to X1900XT). If you spend $500 on a video card you're most likely going to replace the stock cooler anyway but you'll probably wait for the Accellero things or use a Zalman or Water.

In my view the 7800GTX 512 has always been overpriced but disregarding it's price or availability it's performance isn't that far off a newer card. Maybe nVidia can take the performance crown with G71, maybe ATI will keep it or release something to get it back, who knows.


ps: We really need a Mod here that can stop the bitching that goes on between you lot.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

didn't you get rid of your faster 6800Ultra for a slower but quiet x800xl?

Yes, a passively cooled X800XL.

so, IF ATi were to make a passively cooled xT, you'd consider it?

and what is wrong with aftermarket coolers?

 

[BFG10K]

so, IF ATi were to make a passively cooled xT, you'd consider it?

I'd do more than consider it, I'd buy it.

and what is wrong with aftermarket coolers?

I don't want to spend $600 on a card only to tinker with it and have it blow up in my face while not being covered by a warranty.

I'm not a manufacturing assembly plant, I'm an end-user. To that end I expect boxed products to be in a usable state straight off the shelf.

If a vendor can't design acceptable cooling solutions for their cards they don't get my money, regardless of whether it's ATi or nVidia.

 

[Elfear]

Nice find Joker. Good read too. I like the fact that they talk about image quality between the two cards.

 

[M0RPH]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

BFG, I think the truth is you're just angry that you bought a GT and regret not waiting for an XT

As long as ATi keeps pushing out those noisy cooling solutions I'll have absolutely no regrets with sticking to passively cooled video cards.

If you're that overly sensitive to noise, then you should probably invest in water cooling, and then for safe measure you can put your case into a soundproof box. Believe it or not though, the majority of people out there are not so sensitive to a little fan noise as you are. Most people are used to the fact that computers are not silent.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

so, IF ATi were to make a passively cooled xT, you'd consider it?

I'd do more than consider it, I'd buy it.

and what is wrong with aftermarket coolers?

I don't want to spend $600 on a card only to tinker with it and have it blow up in my face while not being covered by a warranty.

I'm not a manufacturing assembly plant, I'm an end-user. To that end I expect boxed products to be in a usable state straight off the shelf.

If a vendor can't design acceptable cooling solutions for their cards they don't get my money, regardless of whether it's ATi or nVidia.

that makes sense if you don't like to tinker.

actually, the aftermarket makers should be able to guarantee that their parts won't affect the Card's warranty. . . . OEM car parts do.

and perhaps when ATi gets their yields up and their temps down - perhaps on the die shrink - you may get your wish.

looks like i never will for AGP

 

[RussianSensation]

Originally posted by: M0RPH

If you're that overly sensitive to noise, then you should probably invest in water cooling, and then for safe measure you can put your case into a soundproof box. Believe it or not though, the majority of people out there are not so sensitive to a little fan noise as you are. Most people are used to the fact that computers are not silent.

I think the point being made here is that why should additional costs be passed on to the consumer when the final product isnt "adequate" enough to meet basic requirements - such as a graphics card that doesn't impede the quality of the experience by being overly loud. Same logic can be applied to overclocking -- Why sell 7800GTX at 450mhz? Sell it at 350mhz for same price. The user should buy phase-change cooling and overclock it if they aren't happy with its performance. Of course things don't work like this in reality. You have to consider consumer preferences. And when you design a high-end graphics card, consumers are probably more inclined to be more demanding as they are outlaying a greater amount of their disposable income on a product purchase. So why should a top of the line graphics card be louder (ie. less "user friendly" than a cheaper $200 one?) Surely they could have invested into better cooling -- you are selling the experience of gaming if you want to gain consumer loyalty - ie. stability of drivers, image quality, and you dont want to lose hearing either . With that in mind, I have never heard X1800/1900 series, but I understand the argument BFG is making.

 

[yacoub]

BFG: Thanks for the mention of the noisy cooler. I was considering an X1900XT but I think I'll wait and hope that some of the manufacturers come out with better cooling solutions. I -HATE- noisy GPU fans. I have a passively cooled motherboard (A8N-SLI Premium), a TruePowerII 480w PSU (120mm fan that runs at well under 1k rpm), a P150 Antec case with its single 120mm case fan on the lowest setting which is essentially silent as well, and the only two other fan sources are the stock AMD cooler on my 3200+ Venice and the Zalman cooler that came stock on my Sapphire X800XL. It's a ball-bearing fan and it makes noise even when ramped down via ATI Tool. Ugh.

Looking into either the passively cooled Asus 7800GT (but $400 is ridiculous for an otherwise $300 card) or hoping for a Zalman/AC cooled and quieted X1900XT.

 

[BFG10K]

If you're that overly sensitive to noise, then you should probably invest in water cooling

That's not an option for reasons detailed earlier.

and perhaps when ATi gets their yields up and their temps down - perhaps on the die shrink - you may get your wish.

No doubt. As it stands right now the 7800GT I have is the fastest passively cooled card available off the shelf so I got it.

Looking into either the passively cooled Asus 7800GT (but $400 is ridiculous for an otherwise $300 card)

The extra cost is worth it IMO. You get a passively cooled card that is factory overclocked to 7800GTX clocks and runs games very well.

I'm currently playing through Doom 3 at 1920x1400 with 4xAA and it absolutely flies on the card.

 

[tuteja1986]

Spend $40 and enjoy
Arctic Cooling Accelero X2 for x1900xt http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/ArcticCooling/AcceleroX2/6

Its quiter than ATI sliencer 5 Rev.2 which is quiet beats the stock 7800GTX 512MB cooler :!

 

[theHate]

Originally posted by: 5150Joker
Bit-tech has a pretty good review up pitting various X1900s (XT/XTX/AIW) against each other and the Geforce 512 GTX as well. Worth checking out, give it a look: http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2006/02/10/radeon_x1900_series_roundup/1.html

I like this websites reviews because it's one of the few out there that actually uses Adaptive AA/TRSSAA and HQ AF for their testing.


Edit: Just caught something interesting when reading the review:

There are often times where the GeForce 7800 GTX 512 can suffer from what is known as 'texture shimmering'. The problem isn't apparent in Call of Duty 2, but the detail in the distance looks appreciably better on the Radeon X1900-series cards when high quality anisotropic filtering is enabled.

Also IQ comments when testing Need For Speed: Most Wanted:

The GeForce 7800 GTX 512 was as fast as the Radeon X1900XTX and we found that we were able to turn on high quality driver settings to disable all filtering optimisations. This gave us a higher filtering quality, but it wasn't quite enough to match the high quality anisotropic filtering that is possible on the Radeon X1900-series cards. It performed well and we were more than happy with the gaming experience if it was singled out, but wasn't quite as good as the image quality delivered by the X1900XTX.

The main negative thing they had to say about the ATi cards was about Crossfire:

The one reason not to get a Radeon X1900XTX at the moment would be ATI's CrossFire technology. It seems a little strange that ATI chose to use the Radeon X1900XT clock speeds on the CrossFire Edition card, as it means that the Radeon X1900XTX will be clocked down to the same 625/1450MHz, rendering the additional cost for an XTX a little pointless if you've got the vision of moving towards CrossFire later down the line.

HARDOCP SUCKS at reviewing cards they don't have the balls to do apples to apple reviews THEY SUCK

 

[Cookie Monster]

And we hate AT for doing apples to apples reviews?

I find hardocp's review good, because it shows you the best possible settings at playable framerates. I just use there results as a guide.
I wouldnt mind having a X1900XT with a 7800GTX 512mb cooler

The fact is, you have to buy an aftermarket cooler for a $500~600 card.

I agree with what xknight said to joker.

" It sounds more like "you can't stand your favorite card being criticized" than anything else. "

 

[tuteja1986]

mmy junior member theHate :! something tells me you have some anger/rage in you :! So which forum do you come from ?

 

[nib95]

Originally posted by: BFG10K
It's a damn shame ATi cards are so noisy.

Accelero X2 FTW! I'm getting one with my X1900 XTX upon purchase!
Who knows, maybe I can get better OC's with it as a result?

 

[nib95]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

so, IF ATi were to make a passively cooled xT, you'd consider it?

I'd do more than consider it, I'd buy it.

and what is wrong with aftermarket coolers?

I don't want to spend $600 on a card only to tinker with it and have it blow up in my face while not being covered by a warranty.

I'm not a manufacturing assembly plant, I'm an end-user. To that end I expect boxed products to be in a usable state straight off the shelf.

If a vendor can't design acceptable cooling solutions for their cards they don't get my money, regardless of whether it's ATi or nVidia.

Chances are to get that 'passively' cooled X1800 you probably had to pay a premium on the initial price anyway. Here the Accelero X2 is a meagre £18. That's peanuts considering you've just put in £400 on a new GPU. £20 is nitpicking.
I admit, ATI should have re-designed the stock HSF on the X1900, but what can you do?
I guess thats what aftermarket GPU coolers are for.

 

[Painman]

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
Spend $40 and enjoy
Arctic Cooling Accelero X2 for x1900xt http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/ArcticCooling/AcceleroX2/6

Its quiter than ATI sliencer 5 Rev.2 which is quiet beats the stock 7800GTX 512MB cooler :!

Unfortunately, that cooler blows all of its exhaust to the inside of the case. Preheating air that will eventually make its way to the CPU/PWMIC/RAM in most PC cases. I seriously do wonder what AC was thinking when they designed that thing. Hold your hand to the exhaust port of an X1900 while it's doing some work - the air coming out is so hot, keeping your hand there is bordering on the uncomfortable. I can't take a measurement, as my card is on its way back from RMA, but my guesstimate is that the exhaust air is heated up to around 120º F.

Imagine that air being distributed around the insides of your case filled with OCed CPU, mobo and RAM for an hour or two.

No, I don't want that.

Again. What the hell was AC thinking?

Not to mention roasting hot air blowing right onto my NF4 chipset...

XS user review of Accelero - here - and not too positive

 

[theHate]

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
mmy junior member theHate :! something tells me you have some anger/rage in you :! So which forum do you come from ?

the ones that got noobed

 

[tuteja1986]

I remember when gamespot forum were noobed now its the laughing stock of Biggest Noobed forum in the gaming online community. Beats even the GameFQA forum

 

[5150Joker]

Originally posted by: Painman

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
Spend $40 and enjoy
Arctic Cooling Accelero X2 for x1900xt http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/ArcticCooling/AcceleroX2/6

Its quiter than ATI sliencer 5 Rev.2 which is quiet beats the stock 7800GTX 512MB cooler :!

Unfortunately, that cooler blows all of its exhaust to the inside of the case. Preheating air that will eventually make its way to the CPU/PWMIC/RAM in most PC cases. I seriously do wonder what AC was thinking when they designed that thing. Hold your hand to the exhaust port of an X1900 while it's doing some work - the air coming out is so hot, keeping your hand there is bordering on the uncomfortable. I can't take a measurement, as my card is on its way back from RMA, but my guesstimate is that the exhaust air is heated up to around 120º F.

Imagine that air being distributed around the insides of your case filled with OCed CPU, mobo and RAM for an hour or two.

No, I don't want that.

Again. What the hell was AC thinking?

Yeah that is pretty stupid. You know the X1800/X1900 heatsink has a really good design. The only real flaw is that they chose to use a crappy fan. If they added a bigger fan that was quieter nobody would bitch about it.

 

[tuteja1986]

I learn something new every day :*( thanks for destroying my dreams :! Now i will just go with path of Watercooling :! even if i am scared of water leak :! its time

 

[5150Joker]

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
I learn something new every day :*( thanks for destroying my dreams :! Now i will just go with path of Watercooling :! even if i am scared of water leak :! its time

Message me on MSN and I'll walk you through it. Setting up water cooling is easy.

 

[nib95]

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
I learn something new every day :*( thanks for destroying my dreams :! Now i will just go with path of Watercooling :! even if i am scared of water leak :! its time

Me too man, maybe I'm not gonna go for the Accelero X2 in the end

Originally posted by: 5150Joker

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
I learn something new every day :*( thanks for destroying my dreams :! Now i will just go with path of Watercooling :! even if i am scared of water leak :! its time

Message me on MSN and I'll walk you through it. Setting up water cooling is easy.

Can you do the same for me?

How much are GPU water cooling kits these days?

 

[Painman]

Hell, I've even been looking at WC stuff the last couple days. Not TOO seriously, since my 2005 bonus and tax refund are pretty well spent at this point. But $250 at Danger Den would get you a nice basic CPU/GPU kit...

 

[n7]

I don't get what all the loud cooler complaints are about.

Maybe i just have too many case fans, but my X1800XT's fan doesn't bother me much, even when it speeds up under heavy load in games like FEAR.

Now let me make one thing clear:
For me, it doesn't speed up all that much (using the auto fan speed).

If i manually turn it up though, holy crap it does get insanely loud.

However, it never seems to even speed up to more than half its speed for me...so i dunno.

Are you guys all running yours @ max RPM for some reason?