This is an interesting development. I would have to say that this looks very suspicious - not least because (if the article is accurate) the vats were seemingly carefully cleaned to remove all trace of their contents. However, a suspicion does not make a fact. There *could* have been another use for this other than for the initial stages of creating WMD - so calling it "a bio-weapons lab" is a little premature IMHO. I would imagine it extremely difficult (with the advanced foresnsic techniques available) to remove all traces of the previous contents of this vehicle.
So, hopefully time will tell. The question over whether this is some sort of justification for the war is rather deabteable. It could be that even if this was used for WMD - it may have been inactive for a long while. It does not prove that WMD were indeed present in Iraq - especially in the large quantities that were implied and used for the reasoning of an almost immediate war.
Cheers,
Andy
So, hopefully time will tell. The question over whether this is some sort of justification for the war is rather deabteable. It could be that even if this was used for WMD - it may have been inactive for a long while. It does not prove that WMD were indeed present in Iraq - especially in the large quantities that were implied and used for the reasoning of an almost immediate war.
Cheers,
Andy
Already dismissed stuff Andy...
Sorry to break up the party, but nothing at all was found.. except stuff that you would expect to find in a van...
Some moron wanted to add the hydralic fluid to the list as it can be mixed with sulfuric acid to create sulfuric gas... fortunantly they shut him up before he were able to make a fool out of himself and the US...
Sorry to break up the party, but nothing at all was found.. except stuff that you would expect to find in a van...
Some moron wanted to add the hydralic fluid to the list as it can be mixed with sulfuric acid to create sulfuric gas... fortunantly they shut him up before he were able to make a fool out of himself and the US...
to be used for what... RoundUp?
No proof... no nothing, showing metal in the ground that could be made into swords mean nothing... you KNOW that, i am surprised you even respnded...
At least one of the people on the other side didn't make a fool out of himself...
the proof that their wmd program continued is to be found in statements made by various iraqi officials through
the long sordid history of this affair. google it, not hard to locate. their denials are pathetic and, needless to say,
they never provided any substantiation to the statements they were making nor providing an accounting
to the u.n./u.s./e.u. inquiries.
only in your own mind, but then it never had a chance to begin with. still rooting for saddam, are we ?
CADsortaGUY
Lifer
Originally posted by: cpumaster
seemed like we inadvertly trained the Iraqis top biological weapon scientist, oh well, as long as they pay their tuition
So do you suggest that we:
A - not let foreigners to attend our universities?
B - track, follow, detain foreigners who have attended US Universities?
C - realize that foreigners will use our universities and some of them will be "bad" but there is little more we can do without resorting to A or B.
CkG
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: cpumaster
seemed like we inadvertly trained the Iraqis top biological weapon scientist, oh well, as long as they pay their tuition
So do you suggest that we:
A - not let foreigners to attend our universities?
B - track, follow, detain foreigners who have attended US Universities?
C - realize that foreigners will use our universities and some of them will be "bad" but there is little more we can do without resorting to A or B.
CkG
I think he was just trying to point out the irony of it.
LunarRay
Diamond Member
- Mar 2, 2003
- 9,993
- 1
- 76
Ya know.... I've been assuming that the WMD would be munitions (shells) for chemicals and Bio stuff... but, maybe just maybe I've been wrong all along... consider.... Iraq may not have had the typical devices to issue the payload... perhaps they intended to have suicide drivers pilot the vehicles we have found into an area of dense population considering that would be where the troops would probably be as well and deliver the package that way... so maybe we have found the WMD sans the payload that is probably in the Euphrates.. anyhow... we just didn't know what make vehicle to look for...
CaptnKirk
Lifer
- Jul 25, 2002
- 10,053
- 0
- 71
More alarmist B/S. Mix just enough truth mised into a lie to make it seem plausible.
Today a wooden spoon was found in a truck in the dessert south of Baghdad.
Even though the spoon was most likely used by a farmer to eat his lunch,
it technically could have been used as an advanced mixing device for blending
a toxic cocktail of poisons and other dangerous materials for use in a huge
terrorist attack on the City of Cinncinnati, if they could have developed a
functional delivery system - in about 10 years.
Today a wooden spoon was found in a truck in the dessert south of Baghdad.
Even though the spoon was most likely used by a farmer to eat his lunch,
it technically could have been used as an advanced mixing device for blending
a toxic cocktail of poisons and other dangerous materials for use in a huge
terrorist attack on the City of Cinncinnati, if they could have developed a
functional delivery system - in about 10 years.
CaptnKirk
Lifer
- Jul 25, 2002
- 10,053
- 0
- 71
So I take it you have personally been to Iraq and examined the truck, and are not relying on a speculative news report ?
The retractions are rarely made, but there have been a few. Usually some other news source like Reuters comes
along and clarifies what was actually found.
If you were to go to the State of Illinois and go into a processing facility and find <a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.silverspringgardens.com/800600/HrProcessing.htm">huge stainless steel blades and blenders
that were partialy eaten away by corrosion</a> what do you think you had found, and would you be alarmed ?
The plants in Collinsville have to replace the blending equipment every 90 days or so because of the chemical attacks on the metal.
Speculation from 10,000 miles away dosen't cut it in my book, they're just trying to hype their sales,
and there are enough gullible people who think it is gospel.
Where did 500,000 tons of this stuff go overnight ? into an enema ?
The retractions are rarely made, but there have been a few. Usually some other news source like Reuters comes
along and clarifies what was actually found.
If you were to go to the State of Illinois and go into a processing facility and find <a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.silverspringgardens.com/800600/HrProcessing.htm">huge stainless steel blades and blenders
that were partialy eaten away by corrosion</a> what do you think you had found, and would you be alarmed ?
The plants in Collinsville have to replace the blending equipment every 90 days or so because of the chemical attacks on the metal.
Speculation from 10,000 miles away dosen't cut it in my book, they're just trying to hype their sales,
and there are enough gullible people who think it is gospel.
Where did 500,000 tons of this stuff go overnight ? into an enema ?
It's a mobile beer processing plant.
You know how much of a kill-joy Saddam is, so the people must subversively produce their own "good stuff".
Unfortunately, since it IS a backyard operation, combined with the sanctions on Iraq, the Iraqis can only manage to make beer which is similar to caustic cleaner. What a pity. You can't fault them for trying though.
:beer::beer:
You know how much of a kill-joy Saddam is, so the people must subversively produce their own "good stuff".
Unfortunately, since it IS a backyard operation, combined with the sanctions on Iraq, the Iraqis can only manage to make beer which is similar to caustic cleaner. What a pity. You can't fault them for trying though.
:beer:
:beer:
CaptnKirk
Lifer
- Jul 25, 2002
- 10,053
- 0
- 71
The Grand Prize goes to Andy Hui for correctly identifing the Mobile 'Iraqi Girls Gone Wild' entertainment Kiosk.
Who'd a thunk that those Baath Parties were so much fun, anyhoo.
My references were to responsiblie reporting of the news and facts.
Al la, Reuters or BBC - where the anouncement is simply 'Suspect vehicle inspected and found clean.'
not a Foxtacular 'Oh my God look at this ! Here's the Deadly Killer Bio-Murder Machine that Colin Powell said they would kill us with !'
Responsible reporters state their facts without speculating and fabricating a sensational story. The truth is enough to stand on it's own.
The suspect vehicle had been stolen and delivered by agents unknown 2 weeks ago, and had been gone over to examine what it was for.
1) It was stolen ? By who for what purpose ? So they could thouroughly clean it up before delivering it to us ?
2) We don't know what is was made to be used for, we can guess or make things up, but we really don't know.
3) Could have been an industrial strength Roach-Coach, can't imagine many things much more biologically dangerous than those.
4) Last one of these that was found was used by an agricultural facillity - but we don't know what for there either.
My point on the horseradish blender is that benign products and their associated facilities and equipment can appear to be
very dangerous to a person who is not trained, or has learned about the product being processed.
The horseradish plants even has to provide gas masks and chemical suits for those in the blending tank rooms.
(There was a big article about the whole horseradish thing in the St. Louis paper some years back)
In the same way an outsider looking at a computer chip manufacturing facillity and seeing all the workers that are in the
clean-room environment working on the silicon waffers could conclude that they had discovered a SARS factory.
HDJ1 - How about 'Blinkey' the 3-eyed fish from the Simpsons ? An omen of what's to come out of the rivers of Iraq ?
Who'd a thunk that those Baath Parties were so much fun, anyhoo.
My references were to responsiblie reporting of the news and facts.
Al la, Reuters or BBC - where the anouncement is simply 'Suspect vehicle inspected and found clean.'
not a Foxtacular 'Oh my God look at this ! Here's the Deadly Killer Bio-Murder Machine that Colin Powell said they would kill us with !'
Responsible reporters state their facts without speculating and fabricating a sensational story. The truth is enough to stand on it's own.
The suspect vehicle had been stolen and delivered by agents unknown 2 weeks ago, and had been gone over to examine what it was for.
1) It was stolen ? By who for what purpose ? So they could thouroughly clean it up before delivering it to us ?
2) We don't know what is was made to be used for, we can guess or make things up, but we really don't know.
3) Could have been an industrial strength Roach-Coach, can't imagine many things much more biologically dangerous than those.
4) Last one of these that was found was used by an agricultural facillity - but we don't know what for there either.
My point on the horseradish blender is that benign products and their associated facilities and equipment can appear to be
very dangerous to a person who is not trained, or has learned about the product being processed.
The horseradish plants even has to provide gas masks and chemical suits for those in the blending tank rooms.
(There was a big article about the whole horseradish thing in the St. Louis paper some years back)
In the same way an outsider looking at a computer chip manufacturing facillity and seeing all the workers that are in the
clean-room environment working on the silicon waffers could conclude that they had discovered a SARS factory.
HDJ1 - How about 'Blinkey' the 3-eyed fish from the Simpsons ? An omen of what's to come out of the rivers of Iraq ?
Yeah, i know, the reasons for this war shifted as the days went by...
BUT, this war was about the WMD that the US had proof that Irak had...
YOU know where they were, YOU knew everything, yet you find NADA...
THAT is the proof you got? well... great, this war was certainly a necessity...
If ANYONE truly believes that this war was justified, i will label him a sick individual...
phillyTIM
Golden Member
- Jan 12, 2001
- 1,942
- 10
- 81
for cryin' out loud
another "possible" or "confident" or "probable" find
just like all the others in the past two months
have any of those panned out to something concrete? no.
will this? based upon the track record, probably not.
it's almost 2 months now, and no WMD's have been found.
time to call of this witch hunt sham.
another "possible" or "confident" or "probable" find
just like all the others in the past two months
have any of those panned out to something concrete? no.
will this? based upon the track record, probably not.
it's almost 2 months now, and no WMD's have been found.
time to call of this witch hunt sham.
phillyTIM
Golden Member
- Jan 12, 2001
- 1,942
- 10
- 81
no, i don't
but read above, and what i said again
overwhelmingly, people are sick of these reports, and they always have turned out to be negative (unfounded).
when people/news quits reporting their "possibilities" and "probabilities" and "could be"'s, the world here would be a much better place
report concrete evidence or report nothing
which is what the bush regime should have done in their handling of this sham months ago.
don't chastise me for lambasting all these stupid reports
but read above, and what i said again
overwhelmingly, people are sick of these reports, and they always have turned out to be negative (unfounded).
when people/news quits reporting their "possibilities" and "probabilities" and "could be"'s, the world here would be a much better place
report concrete evidence or report nothing
which is what the bush regime should have done in their handling of this sham months ago.
don't chastise me for lambasting all these stupid reports
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