Best rig for hardcore video encoding? 400mhz+ FSB?

[lameaway]

If you want to look at something cheaper on the dedicated hardware side, btw, see the Canopus MPEGpro MVR for about $500. It looks like it will do MPEG2 just as well as the Matrox card, without all the editing and FX features.

 

[Spicedaddy]

Abit IS7
P4 2.4C
2x512MB of HyperX PC3500

Overclock to 3.2GHz+ and you'll have a nice encoding rig without breaking the bank.


It would help to know what source you're encoding from and what format you're encoding to. Are you capturing analog video, digital video, ripping DVDs? Are you encoding to AVI or MPEG1/2?

 

[Dug]

BTW Matrox recommends:
Pentium 4 at 2.2 GHz, AMD Athlon XP 2000+, or faster

Why? As they put it:
"The Power of X" takes full advantage of your CPU and harnesses the power of dedicated hardware to give you the extra edge to enhance your editing experience

Which means, its not doing it on its own. It may use features on the graphics card, but the software packages (which you can buy yourself) and the cpu are needed.

 

[cow123]

hardcore videos? :Q

 

[BillStuck]

Originally posted by: Spicedaddy
Abit IS7
P4 2.4C
2x512MB of HyperX PC3500

Overclock to 3.2GHz+ and you'll have a nice encoding rig without breaking the bank.


It would help to know what source you're encoding from and what format you're encoding to. Are you capturing analog video, digital video, ripping DVDs? Are you encoding to AVI or MPEG1/2?

Hey Spice Daddy. I rip DVDs so VOB files and encode XVCDs. Which is MPEG1 with a resolution of 528x480 or 704x480. Does that help?

 

[BillStuck]

Originally posted by: cow123
hardcore videos? :Q

:-D

 

[benjamit]

Originally posted by: wacki
Ok this is for all of you people who are recommending a 3.2Ghz Pentium 4 to this poor soul.

Check out what the University of Southern California recommended for "LIVE" and offline video encoding

http://www.usc.edu/uscweb/authoring/RealMedia/hardware.html

The processor
200 Mhz pentium MMX

Memory
32 MB


BillStuck - I'm still a big fan of high end systems. My top rig is an Athlon XP 2700+ with a Maze3 water block, gig of Micron RAM, ASUS A7N8X mobo, ATI Radeon 9800, Terratec sound card, and much more. So I like my toys, but recommending a 3.2Ghz pentium just to do video encoding is rediculous, not to mention ignorant. Video encoding on CPU's is a way to do benchmarking because CPU's suck at it. Don't listen to bad advice, unless you want to of course. Upgrade your system if you want, but I would save on the CPU and get a VIVO card. Using your PC as a VCR can be sooo nice. Pause a live superbowl game, burn DVD's from home video's in DVD quality, and so much more! Let's see if a 3.2 Ghz Pentium can do that, no way! In my opinion it's either hype or logic. I always like to go the logical route, its less painfull.

eh that SC link dates back to '98
i.e. its not current

Draft v. 0.51 1/7/98 2:30 PM

 

[charlie21]

Video encoding != video capture. Those are 2 totally different things. Video encoding is totally CPU dependent, and the P4 whoops the Athlon. The new 400 FSB Athlons perform better, but they're still not quite up to par with the P4. The video card is totally irrelevant for encoding purposes. You wouldn't notice the difference between a Radeon 9800 and a TNT 128. Now if you're going to do video capture or realtime editing, then the Matrox card mentioned above would come in handy.

 

[MikeMike]

Originally posted by: wacki

Originally posted by: nourdmrolNMT1

um you have a retard certificate now. He isnt looking to do live video shows, or anything like that. he is looking to take some video he has saved on his computer, mess with it, and encode the stuff so he can then put it out onto a dvd or something. and that requires power. hell im just sittin here wanting to smack ur ignorant little face in. truthfully the ideal system for this would be a dual proc computer, but on a budget, i would recommend a 2.4c w/ 1gb pc3500, and some mobo, and o/c the hell out of it, and get up around 3.2ghz. VIVO is used to save files, not edit them and then reencode them. all encoding has to do is take the file from one format to another. also, a faster HD would be nice, but i will leave that out, since your on a budget.
MIKE

If you hadn't noticed, I said University of Southern California recommended the Osprey 1000 at http://www.viewcast.com/products/osprey/osprey1000.html
for video encoding.

And incase he wanted to do video editing, I recommended the Matrox RT.X100, and if it was just video encoding all he needed was VIVO. Or maybe not even VIVO but just a video capture card which is even cheaper.

So no matter what he wants to do I think I've covered all the bases, that is the professional way to give advice. Read all my comments before you attack me!

I've never gone on a personal level, thats not professional. I've only attacked the advice. However I don't appreciate being called a retard especially from someone giving advice as to scrap a 1.8Ghz Pentium just to do a little Video Encoding, when all he (might) need is a little hardware.

And BIllStuck said his computer took "4-5 hours to encode 90 minutes of video" what do you think VIVO does? And your comment of "take some video he has saved on his computer, mess with it, and encode the stuff so he can then put it out onto a dvd or something" what do you think any of the cards I've mentioned do? Ever heard of hardware acceleration?

VIVO cards will encode video from a VCR or camcorder and save it into MPEG format. All you need is a 133 Mhz Pentium to cut and splice digital media. I've personally done video editing and special effects with a 700 Mhz Duron so I know that was fast enough 5-6 years ago for software that was $800 back then. And as for your advice of a dual processor board. They are nice, and he can build a dual Athlon XP cheaper than a 2.4Ghz Pentium with a good mobo. That will be handy for him, but only if he can afford multi-threaded applications, which are more expensive than the average computer.

As for references I have given multiple url's of specific websites describing many options he can take, what url's have you given him? What articles have you mentioned? How many brand names have you mentioned? The only thing you've said is buy a new computer! Wow, not even professionals do that, they just upgrade individual parts. One of my friends uses a 8 chip radeon video card for his video editing. He has a dual 1400+ Athlon powering that machine, not all that much horsepower is it? Then again he probably doesn't know what he's talking about, he's only lives on a lake, has a boat, and a pool, and drives a mercedes. All paid for by that computer. He is the one that taught me what I know about video editing and computer graphics, that and my Masters Degree. But that might not mean much.

And Wallysaurus, no that is no a dumb question. And yes you can use it to change formats. The card has to decompress the Mpeg1 to edit it so it can easily save it in Mpeg 2. Although I've never done it so when I get home I will try it just to make sure. So don't take my word on it as of yet, but I'm pretty sure you can.

If I seemed crass before I apologize, I just have a low tollerance for media hype, and bad advice. This thread seems more like a Intel billboard than an advice board. Don't get me wrong, Intel is a great chip, and they do wonderfull things, but he doesn't need a faster chip to get the job he wants done done. Any advice other than that to me sounds more like salesmanship. I've only mentioned that since he is on a budget that he might want to stick with AMD. Hell I'm not on a budget and AMD suits all my needs, well not all of them. IBM and SUN equiped processors do alot of my computing at work. Yes Intel has the Performance crown right now, but AMD has the Performance per dollar crown right now. And he is on a budget so. But he doesn't need a faster CPU!!!!! So before this gets into an childish loyalty of brands war, give him the advice that fits his needs. NOT YOURS!! And as for this OC thing, common. Nobody in the professional business does that. Even supercomputers are underclocked not OVER but UNDER to insure stability. I can tell you horror stories about companies (not mentioning any names) that have caused some of my friends major headaches by doing otherwise.

Anyway BillStuck why don't you specifically, and carefully describe to all of us exactly what you are trying to do so that you can get the best advice. But honestly I think you have everything you need.

Sorry about any mispellings, but I have to meeting to goto, and I'm to tired to review what I just wrote. I have gotten good advice/help on these boards before and I was just trying to repay the favor. If I got angry its because I can't stand bad advice, brand loyalty wars, or advice to spend way much more money than is needed.

o no, i forgot to link stuff, cuz i dont need to!!! your talking about supercomputers, hes talking about encoding videos, not for a job. um, replacing the mobo, memory, and cpu is just an UPGRADE NOT A NEW COMPUTER!!!! he keeps his current, vid card, sound card, nic, case, dvd, cdrw, dvdrw, whatever else he has!!! a new computer encompases everything there.

for the job he wants i believe intel will be best. go look at the graphs for media encoding, intel has dominated that segment, and will even though they cost a little more. and if he o/c's intel will o/c like a mofo. yes, i own intel, i dont like them, but its what i have, after i fvckered up my first amd comp, i went intel to o/c.

... and now that i have read about the matrox card!!

ARE YOU JOKING ME!! 1200$$ for the card, that still uses your cpu, but allows for faster changes, i mean a new mobo + proc+ ram, would only cost him 500$ (maybe a lil more) and he will get more band for his buck.

the card still utilizes your cpu power, and is ment for professional uses, not his use (atleast i dont believe he is a professional)

you can edit on anything, but you can only edit easily, and quickly on a faster machine.

MIKE

 

[Spicedaddy]

Originally posted by: BillStuck

Originally posted by: Spicedaddy
Abit IS7
P4 2.4C
2x512MB of HyperX PC3500

Overclock to 3.2GHz+ and you'll have a nice encoding rig without breaking the bank.


It would help to know what source you're encoding from and what format you're encoding to. Are you capturing analog video, digital video, ripping DVDs? Are you encoding to AVI or MPEG1/2?

Hey Spice Daddy. I rip DVDs so VOB files and encode XVCDs. Which is MPEG1 with a resolution of 528x480 or 704x480. Does that help?

Then you definitely don't need a VIVO video card or editing hardware like a Matrox RT.X100.

First thing is to make sure you can rip quickly (ie not a Toshiba DVD-Rom that's stuck at 2X). For the encoding, you can either upgrade to a faster CPU/mobo/ram and use a software encoder (TMPGEnc is the best IMO) or keep your current system and add a hardware encoder. The cheapest would be something like a Happauge WinTV PVR, or if you want something better, a Canopus MPEG PRO mvr like someone else mentioned.

Personally, I'd go for the faster system and software encoding since you'll be able to enjoy the speed for other tasks. A P4 in the 3.2GHz range with HT and a 1GHz+ FSB will be very fast in TMPGEnc.

 

[charlie21]

Originally posted by: BillStuck

Hey Spice Daddy. I rip DVDs so VOB files and encode XVCDs. Which is MPEG1 with a resolution of 528x480 or 704x480. Does that help?

Yes, now we're talking. You don't need a high end video card. That rig that Spice Daddy outlined would be perfect.

 

[BillStuck]

Originally posted by: charlie21

Originally posted by: BillStuck

Hey Spice Daddy. I rip DVDs so VOB files and encode XVCDs. Which is MPEG1 with a resolution of 528x480 or 704x480. Does that help?

Yes, now we're talking. You don't need a high end video card. That rig that Spice Daddy outlined would be perfect.

Thanks guys. Yea I allready use TMPGEnc with some AVISynth scripts and filters I don't need all that vivo card business just some serious CPU and memory bandwidth.

One last question. Is Kingston HyperX PC3200 and PC3500 the same just one is overclocked a bit. They are the same price and it seems the 3500 just runs with a little looser timings. It seems to me they are the same memory with different CAS timings.???

 

[Spicedaddy]

Originally posted by: BillStuck

Originally posted by: charlie21

Originally posted by: BillStuck

Hey Spice Daddy. I rip DVDs so VOB files and encode XVCDs. Which is MPEG1 with a resolution of 528x480 or 704x480. Does that help?

Yes, now we're talking. You don't need a high end video card. That rig that Spice Daddy outlined would be perfect.

Thanks guys. Yea I allready use TMPGEnc with some AVISynth scripts and filters I don't need all that vivo card business just some serious CPU and memory bandwidth.

One last question. Is Kingston HyperX PC3200 and PC3500 the same just one is overclocked a bit. They are the same price and it seems the 3500 just runs with a little looser timings. It seems to me they are the same memory with different CAS timings.???

I think they use the same chips... I'd go for the PC3500 since it's guaranteed to do 217MHz and would let you go higher using the 5:4 mem ratio when OCing a "C" chip.

 

[BillStuck]

Thanks for the help everyone. I just ordered a Abit IS7, P4 2.4c with HT, and 512MB of HyperX PC3500. **all giddy inside**

 

[Dug]

Originally posted by: BillStuck
Thanks for the help everyone. I just ordered a Abit IS7, P4 2.4c with HT, and 512MB of HyperX PC3500. **all giddy inside**

I would be too. 3Ghz, HT, dual channel ddr machine should make anyone happy.

You did get 2 256MB stick of ram didn't you?

 

[BillStuck]

You did get 2 256MB stick of ram didn't you?

Yup :-D

 

[videoguy]

if u want the fastest encoding times possible u must use rdram it is much more effective then ddr when you deal with vidoe in any wqay shape or form

 

[Budman]

Originally posted by: videoguy
if u want the fastest encoding times possible u must use rdram it is much more effective then ddr when you deal with vidoe in any wqay shape or form

Not compared to Dual channel DDR400

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Budman

Originally posted by: videoguy
if u want the fastest encoding times possible u must use rdram it is much more effective then ddr when you deal with vidoe in any wqay shape or form

Not compared to Dual channel DDR400

Dual DDR400 with a P4C is faster, Dual DDR400 on a B chip is slower than RDRAM.

 

[rbV5]

This thread re-enforces the need for a more comprehensive video FAQ.

Hardware encoder cards can help encoding faster if you are encoding to a supported format for the harware encoder. An example using a P3 750 with 512 MB RAM running Win2k showed TMPGEnc software encoder getting slaughtered by Hauppage WinTV PVR 250 hardware encoder (3 FPS vs 25FPS) encoding uncompressed AVI Link

However, the weakness of hardware encoders is 3 fold at least.
#1: Encoding Quality. The hardware algorithms are generally "fixed". While TMPGEnc and other software gets updated (or can anyway) WinTV PVR barely gets driver updates and never gets hardware updates. While it is fast at what it does, it gets beat for encoding quality by most quality software encoders. A good software encoder beats a poor hardware encoder everytime.
#2: Scalability. The hardware encoder will only encode so fast..it doesn't scale at all. Sure the crappy hardware encoder blows away TMPGEnc using a single p3 750, it gets much closer when you start talking multi-GHz CPU's and duallies.
3#: One trick pony syndrome. Hardware encoders have fixed encoding algorithms, what you got..is what you get. What if you want to encode WM9 instead of MPEG-2 with your hardware MPEG encoder...sorry, different resolution than NTSC/PAL....sorry, Xvid.....sorry,Divx...sorry, WM9 instead of WM7....sorry. on and on. New format = new hardware card.

Generally, unless you have a specific use for a specific hardware solution (realtime broadcasting, multicasting, webcasting)...software is the way to go. Even future hardware encoders will be hardware at the colorspace level, but use optimised software encoders for encoding and format coversion. (The AIW R3xx do have a hardware assist encoding MPEG-2, but its very slight <10%, but scalable..helps most encoding realtime)

In this case, its all about power, CPU power...the more, the merrier.

 

[AnImuS]

Originally posted by: BillStuck
Thanks for the help everyone. I just ordered a Abit IS7, P4 2.4c with HT, and 512MB of HyperX PC3500. **all giddy inside**

Good Choice! TMPGEnc is a very good software probram i use it all the time aswell!