Best Handling Car for Under 30K

[FiLeZz]

Looks like I'm gonna have to test drive the STi 4D. The 5D looks kinda ugly.

My for is for STI

 

[RavenSEAL]

Looks like I'm gonna have to test drive the STi 4D. The 5D looks kinda ugly.

Hehe, I beg to differ. The WRX STi is, in my opinion, the only car that doesn't look ugly as a hatchback.

 

[MagickMan]

Seriously, go test drive a used Elise. OMFG handling and huge chick magnet.

 

[j&j]

hands down corvette will beat them all, easy to find a 2005-2007 LS2 based corvette with z51 handling package, 6spd manual, average miles 30-50K for under 30K.

also easy to do basic mods (intake/headers/tuner) will net you very good gains.

 

[LOL_Wut_Axel]

If you're looking for the best handling and a real enthusiast's car forget the STI and get a Honda S2000 instead.

Also, even if the STI was that great when it comes to handling (it's not), the Evolution handles better still so I don't know how it hasn't been mentioned.

 

[RavenSEAL]

Seriously, go test drive a used Elise. OMFG handling and huge chick magnet.

Yeah, make sure you at least under 5'6 though. Otherwise, you're in for too much fun.

 

[MagickMan]

Meh, I'm a shade over 5'10" and I fit well enough. Now, if you're Clarkson's height, that's another story. He could drive them fine, he just couldn't quite get in and out very gracefully.

 

[PhoKingGuy]

Seriously, go test drive a used Elise. OMFG handling and huge chick magnet.

That's the dumbest thing I've heard. Have you tried driving one of those things on a daily basis?

You get searing back pain after like an hour in one.

 

[JCH13]

Not much except the usual Miata, Honda Civic SI, Genesis Coupe, Mazdaspeed3.

Out of those from a practical point of a view I would take a 4 door Honda Civic SI. Reliability, Resale, Excellent handling, Above Average Speed and Acceleration, No fussy turbo, Room for 4/5 peeps. I would buy a year old model tho or a new 11 if you can find one.

The Civic SI is a reasonably fun ride, but it's handling pales in comparison to any of the other cars you listed. MS3 also gives you the practicality of a hatch.

Speed3...brand new, $23K out of the dealer price - a drivers car with plenty of torque and terrific road manners.

:thumbsup:

It's FWD

Doesn't matter AT ALL for street driving. MS3, especially the 2nd generation, is consistently a top performer of the sub-30k segment. Suspension/steering/chassis puts the WRX to shame. FWD won't win any drag races against AWD cars, but they can definitely out-handle them.

OP: I'd suggest a MS3 or GTI, depending on exactly what you want. The MS3 will be the better performer and be less expensive (way more fun to drive IMHO), the GTI will be a bit more refined and have a better interior. Neither will disappoint.

 

[HybridSquirrel]

If you're looking for the best handling and a real enthusiast's car forget the STI and get a Honda S2000 instead.

Also, even if the STI was that great when it comes to handling (it's not), the Evolution handles better still so I don't know how it hasn't been mentioned.

The 04 STI beats the Evo 9MR around the Nurburgring by 12 seconds. The Evo wins the drag races, the STi wins track days.

 

[MistaFreeze]

I am agreeing with the Elise. That thing is amazing.

 

[JCH13]

'ring times mean exactly squat.

Sounds like OP wants a car to replace his current DD. Something with four seats and some real cargo room seems like the best option, is that right Baked?

 

[Arkaign]

The 04 STI beats the Evo 9MR around the Nurburgring by 12 seconds. The Evo wins the drag races, the STi wins track days.

The Evo is also a Mitsubishi, which means often more expensive and hard to find parts, and they're definitely less reliable. I see tons of WRX with as many as 200k miles on original motor and tranny (though 2nd gear can be a problem if people mod and still do hard shifts from 1st), I can't see that being too likely with Evo. I'm a former DSM double victim, so I doubt I'll ever not have doubts about them being long-term cars.

This thread has devolved into lots of (both good and poor) suggestions for used vehicles, but OP said new. There are also suggestions for things which definitely cost more than 30k new.

 

[LOL_Wut_Axel]

The 04 STI beats the Evo 9MR around the Nurburgring by 12 seconds. The Evo wins the drag races, the STi wins track days.

Yeah... not really representative of much, as these cars weren't developed in the Nurburgring and weren't made to take any records. To settle this, here are some figures for the '04 WRX STI and '03 EVO 8 GSR from MotorTrend:

0-60MPH
WRX STI: 4.87s
EVO GSR: 4.59s

1/4 mile
WRX STI:13.23@104.6MPH
EVO GSR: 13.08@105.1MPH

Braking 60-0MPH
WRX STI:111ft
EVO GSR: 106ft

600ft Slalom
WRX STI: 69.1MPH
EVO GSR: 71.4MPH

Basically, the Evo 8 GSR is faster in every metric. The Evo 9 MR would just widen those gaps because of the better gearing, more horsepower and torque and other niceties.

Regardless, this was just to people recommending the slower STI over the Evo. I retain my original recommendation for a Honda S2000 as it's decently comfortable and is a much, much better enthusiast's car than any of these two.

 

[JCH13]

600ft Slalom
WRX STI: 69.1MPH
EVO GSR: 71.4MPH

.

2nd gen MS3 is rocking a 72.4mph slalom. :biggrin:

 

[Ferzerp]

Doh! my car is only ~67 MPH

 

[vshah]

2007 si sedan, 68.2 mph

 

[Arkaign]

2nd gen MS3 is rocking a 72.4mph slalom. :biggrin:

It's interesting how this plays out. I understand you have owners goggles on, and I do like the Speed3 (my favorite FF car, even above the faster but crappy to drive Cobalt SS).

http://www.caranddriver.com/feature...plete-lightning-lap-times-2006-to-2011-page-8

On the track, for the pure performance test (only choosing some related cars from this thread and some interesting other tidbits) :

3:26 Civic Si ('06 model)
3:24 Civic Si Mugen ('08)
3:20 Old Mustang GT ('06)
3:20 Old Cobalt SS ('06)
3:19 VW GTI
3:19 RX-8
3:19 Old WRX
3:16.7 RX-8 R3
3:16.5 New WRX
3:16.0 Speed3 (old model tested slightly faster, so put that here)
3:15 S2000 CR
3:14 Lexus ISF
3:13.8 New STI
3:13.3 '08 Evo MR
3:13 Turbo Cobalt SS (!!)
3:12.5 New Mustang V6
3:09.5 New Camaro SS
3:09.2 Lotus Elise
3:08.6 New Mustang GT
3:05.8 Cayman S
3:04.5 Lotus Exige S
3:03.8 Boxster Spyder S ('11) (!!!)
2:58.5 Vette GS
2:55.6 GT-R
2:53.5 Z06 (Z07 '11)

Interesting stuff. Certainly the Mustang V6 and GT are hellacious value, even the SS deserves some credit. Funny to see how crazy fast the Cobalt SS was for a cheap econobox. The new Boxster is nuts, and of course the Vette is smoking good. The Lotus cars do well for being so down on power.

FF is not my idea of a good high performance car though, I think a modded WRX or STI running in the mid 300s is basically untouchable in most situations from any FF setup. I've driven extreme power FF vehicles, including a 400+FWHP SRT-4, and it's just nasty when you up the power. You get great boosts to rolling runs, but nothing fixes understeer and that float to the outside feeling when you put any power down on a curve, not to mention torque steer, wheel hop, and the physical limitations of trying to grip from a launch while the weight shifts to the back wheels.

 

[overst33r]

I never liked slaloms as a performance metric, especially in this day and age. They favor narrow cars.

i.e. The Honda Fit beats the Corvette Z06 in the slalom. 72.9mph vs 65.4mph

http://www.insideline.com/mazda/2/2...zda-2-and-2010-honda-fit-b-spec-racecars.html

http://www.insideline.com/chevrolet/corvette/2006/full-test-2006-chevrolet-corvette-z06.html

 

[KIAman]

If buying used, get a used Vette or M3. Vette is better handling but M3 will be better DD.

If buying new, can't beat the Mustang V6 with track package for handling.

Sorry to all the FWD supporters. They don't make good handling cars although their numbers might look good on paper.

 

[JCH13]

It's interesting how this plays out. I understand you have owners goggles on, and I do like the Speed3 (my favorite FF car, even above the faster but crappy to drive Cobalt SS).

http://www.caranddriver.com/feature...plete-lightning-lap-times-2006-to-2011-page-8

On the track, for the pure performance test (only choosing some related cars from this thread and some interesting other tidbits) :

3:26 Civic Si ('06 model)
3:24 Civic Si Mugen ('08)
3:20 Old Mustang GT ('06)
3:20 Old Cobalt SS ('06)
3:19 VW GTI
3:19 RX-8
3:19 Old WRX
3:16.7 RX-8 R3
3:16.5 New WRX
3:16.0 Speed3 (old model tested slightly faster, so put that here)
3:15 S2000 CR
3:14 Lexus ISF
3:13.8 New STI
3:13.3 '08 Evo MR
3:13 Turbo Cobalt SS (!!)
3:12.5 New Mustang V6
3:09.5 New Camaro SS
3:09.2 Lotus Elise
3:08.6 New Mustang GT
3:05.8 Cayman S
3:04.5 Lotus Exige S
3:03.8 Boxster Spyder S ('11) (!!!)
2:58.5 Vette GS
2:55.6 GT-R
2:53.5 Z06 (Z07 '11)

Interesting stuff. Certainly the Mustang V6 and GT are hellacious value, even the SS deserves some credit. Funny to see how crazy fast the Cobalt SS was for a cheap econobox. The new Boxster is nuts, and of course the Vette is smoking good. The Lotus cars do well for being so down on power.

FF is not my idea of a good high performance car though, I think a modded WRX or STI running in the mid 300s is basically untouchable in most situations from any FF setup. I've driven extreme power FF vehicles, including a 400+FWHP SRT-4, and it's just nasty when you up the power. You get great boosts to rolling runs, but nothing fixes understeer and that float to the outside feeling when you put any power down on a curve, not to mention torque steer, wheel hop, and the physical limitations of trying to grip from a launch while the weight shifts to the back wheels.

I agree that FF has inherent platform limitations, but what should be appreciated is that these limitations should NEVER be a factor in ANY street driving, even 'spirited curvy road driving'. It sounds like the OP simply wants a sporty DD with some good handling chops and a bit of punch on the throttle, which a FF will do just fine.

I'd like to think I have a reasonably rounded view: I DD a FF (MS3) I weekend-drive and do a little racing with a somewhat powerful FR (Turbo Miata) and I've done/do my more serious racing in MR cars (FSAE and MR2s). I can understand the mentality of "I want race car" but the fact of the matter is that unless you're honestly going to try and be competitive in some SCCA class on a national level with your DD, your car's setup doesn't make much difference if you're just looking for some fun driving on the street.

 

[Throckmorton]

I agree that FF has inherent platform limitations, but what should be appreciated is that these limitations should NEVER be a factor in ANY street driving, even 'spirited curvy road driving'. It sounds like the OP simply wants a sporty DD with some good handling chops and a bit of punch on the throttle, which a FF will do just fine.

I'd like to think I have a reasonably rounded view: I DD a FF (MS3) I weekend-drive and do a little racing with a somewhat powerful FR (Turbo Miata) and I've done/do my more serious racing in MR cars (FSAE and MR2s). I can understand the mentality of "I want race car" but the fact of the matter is that unless you're honestly going to try and be competitive in some SCCA class on a national level with your DD, your car's setup doesn't make much difference if you're just looking for some fun driving on the street.

What? Have you ever driven a RWD car? Handling is what we're talking about, not track times. I had a Mazda 3 rental car and it handled well for a FWD car but I could easily feel the difference from my Miata. If you don't appreciate the feel of RWD, fine, but don't say the limitations of FF aren't a factor in street driving. If that were true, no street cars would be RWD.

 

[alkemyst]

Any of the late 1980's 944's, preferably a 1988 or 1989 Turbo...

 

[JCH13]

What? Have you ever driven a RWD car? Handling is what we're talking about, not track times. If you don't appreciate the feel of RWD, fine, but don't say the limitations of FF aren't a factor in street driving.

I'd like to think I have a reasonably rounded view: I DD a FF (MS3) I weekend-drive and do a little racing with a somewhat powerful FR (Turbo Miata) and I've done/do my more serious racing in MR cars (FSAE and MR2s).

I have quite an appreciation for every platform, even AWD.

FF is not a real limitation on the street. If you're routinely driving your car 9/10ths or 10/10ths on the street you're going to wreck and/or die very soon. An MS3 is a ton of fun on the street because of it's awesome suspension, great steering feel, and great brakes, with enough power to get you into trouble real quick.

 

[LOL_Wut_Axel]

2nd gen MS3 is rocking a 72.4mph slalom. :biggrin:

Your point? The EVO 9 MR probably does better. That's an old 2003 EVO 8 GSR.

And FWD SUCKS if you want an Enthusiast-level driving experience. No matter how good you try to make FWD, it's still like polishing a turd.