Baptist Sunday school teacher dumped for being female

[Ronstang]

Why don't Baptists screw standing up?



































Someone might think they are dancing!!!!!!!

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: blackangst1
What are you people so excited about? Dont we have freedom of religion in this country? Let them be sheesh. If you dont like it, dont join em. Who are YOU to judge whats right and wrong for other people?

P.s. I disagree with this as well, but it isnt my issue *shrug*

Freedom of Religion should nto be above Discrimination Laws - at least as long as they receive funding from my tax dollars and receive preferrred status for property taxes.

First of all how do they recieve funding from your tax dollar?

That very separation of church and state is what makes it so religious institutions are tax free.
That has nothing to do with your tax dollar or the Government!

You missed out on Bush's faith based funding with tax dollars? Hiding under a rock are yah?

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: LEDominator

Originally posted by: dahunan
to be totally honest.. that sickens me that anyone would follow or believe something like that.. Women are more susceptible to be sinners than men.. that is frustrating

Who suffers the most in this society from spousal abuse and domestic violence.. and from workplace discrimination and from wage discrimination etc..

Who usually gets stuck being the care provider for children after divorces etc..

Well, I don't think it is to be sinners per se because everyone by definition sins. I think it is that they are more susceptible to the devil in the sense of corrupting theology if that makes sense... Either way I would tend to agree with you, that taking it this far is somewhat of an extreme. Like I said I am no theologian(sp?) so I wouldn't take what I say as gospel truth. It is only what I think the reasoning is behind it.

Just read the gosphels preached by christ and not the kibitizer's opinions that came after.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: Todd33
Of course the early days of the church during the time of the Apostles had many women who taught and led. It wasn't until things got organized in the second and third century that they made it men only. But like almost all religions, they exist to give power to men to subjugate women.

Religions exist to give power to men? Wow...

I'm an atheist, and I think that statement is absurd. I'll bet you also think that men and women grow up differently due to sexist parenting...?

Organized Religion has nearly always supported the contemporary power structure.

Men and women wouldn't grow up 'the same' with gender-neutral parenting, but they would certainly grow up more alike than they do now.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
What are you people so excited about? Dont we have freedom of religion in this country? Let them be sheesh. If you dont like it, dont join em. Who are YOU to judge whats right and wrong for other people?

P.s. I disagree with this as well, but it isnt my issue *shrug*

P.P.s All it takes for an Evil to bloom and grow, is for people like you to say "it isnt my issue".

 

[LEDominator]

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: Todd33
Of course the early days of the church during the time of the Apostles had many women who taught and led. It wasn't until things got organized in the second and third century that they made it men only. But like almost all religions, they exist to give power to men to subjugate women.

Religions exist to give power to men? Wow...

I'm an atheist, and I think that statement is absurd. I'll bet you also think that men and women grow up differently due to sexist parenting...?

Organized Religion has nearly always supported the contemporary power structure.

Men and women wouldn't grow up 'the same' with gender-neutral parenting, but they would certainly grow up more alike than they do now.

What makes you so sure Gender Neutral parenting would make them more alike? Just so you know this is a debate in Feminist ideology. One side says women are inherently different (which one doesn't need to be a rocket scientist to see) but deserve equal rights and the other is that women are equals of men and thus deserve equal rights. Women's History FTW!

 

[straightalker]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: blackangst1
What are you people so excited about? Dont we have freedom of religion in this country? Let them be sheesh. If you dont like it, dont join em. Who are YOU to judge whats right and wrong for other people?

P.s. I disagree with this as well, but it isnt my issue *shrug*

Freedom of Religion should nto be above Discrimination Laws - at least as long as they receive funding from my tax dollars and receive preferrred status for property taxes.

The USA Constitution explicitely spells out that Congress (the rightful source of laws in our 3 Branches of Government) has not authorization to create laws that invade the area of religious teaching and faith.

The Baptist Minister who "dumped" the Sunday School teacher in this article is simply placing his belief in the Scripture on this subject higher than anything else.

Some here have compared this article to the Taliban. Women found in positions of leadership in a Bible based Church in the USA are not stoned to death like they would be in an Jihadist Nation in a Mosque.

In many Jihadist Nations, women are classed as being equal to goats and camels.

 

[jackschmittusa]

Well, I think some overly religious people are on a par with goats and camels. Intellectually, that is.

 

[kage69]

i really hate to blow all of you knee jerk reactors out of the water, but the pastor just used scripture as an excuse.

LOL, don't worry, you didn't.

So the actual bit of scripture itself doesn't matter (shocker), it's just being used as an excuse to eject someone troublesome from the congregation. I like how they do that under false pretenses and then go right on to cite "Christian courtesy." Nice.

"We had originally intended to include the various multifaceted reasons for the dismissal in our corresponds however after legal review it was recommended that we refrain from including issues that could be construed as slander..." But we're not above using our own holy book to support our decision, one that we'll apply selectively!

Christians picking and choosing which portions of the bible to consider to suit their agenda isn't a surprise to "reactors," even ones with knees. Of course this guy is miffed that this made the news, people will now see that church politics are often just as slimey as real politics - dear lord what will it do to our vibrant growth?!

So to recap: It's all her fault, the ecumenical rational they gave is BS even in their eyes, and churches can comment on anything in the outside world but it's inappropriate for the world to be informed on the churchs inner workings.

 

[shadow9d9]

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: blackangst1
What are you people so excited about? Dont we have freedom of religion in this country? Let them be sheesh. If you dont like it, dont join em. Who are YOU to judge whats right and wrong for other people?

P.s. I disagree with this as well, but it isnt my issue *shrug*

Freedom of Religion should nto be above Discrimination Laws - at least as long as they receive funding from my tax dollars and receive preferrred status for property taxes.

First of all how do they recieve funding from your tax dollar?

That very separation of church and state is what makes it so religious institutions are tax free.
That has nothing to do with your tax dollar or the Government!

You missed out on Bush's faith based funding with tax dollars? Hiding under a rock are yah?

The guy is pretty clueless all-round... best to just ignore him...

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: kage69

i really hate to blow all of you knee jerk reactors out of the water, but the pastor just used scripture as an excuse.

LOL, don't worry, you didn't.

So the actual bit of scripture itself doesn't matter (shocker), it's just being used as an excuse to eject someone troublesome from the congregation. I like how they do that under false pretenses and then go right on to cite "Christian courtesy." Nice.

Actually, they did it that way to protect themselves from being sued by the lady for slander. Their lawyer actually advised them to terminate her position this way, and not list the specific reasons leading up to her dismissal.

"We had originally intended to include the various multifaceted reasons for the dismissal in our corresponds however after legal review it was recommended that we refrain from including issues that could be construed as slander..." But we're not above using our own holy book to support our decision, one that we'll apply selectively!

Christians picking and choosing which portions of the bible to consider to suit their agenda isn't a surprise to "reactors," even ones with knees. Of course this guy is miffed that this made the news, people will now see that church politics are often just as slimey as real politics - dear lord what will it do to our vibrant growth?!

So to recap: It's all her fault, the ecumenical rational they gave is BS even in their eyes, and churches can comment on anything in the outside world but it's inappropriate for the world to be informed on the churchs inner workings.

Thanks for actually reading my post. Seriously. So many people will read the first post in this thread and then say assinine things in judgment of all Christians or actually believe this Baptist church isn't allowing women to teach or be in a position of decision making. This church in question seems to be way beyond where the Catholic Church is every day in regards to women.

 

[teiresias]

If the church had legitimate issues that they could prove then they wouldn't be liable for slander.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: teiresias
If the church had legitimate issues that they could prove then they wouldn't be liable for slander.

They consulted with their lawyer first and did this on his recommendations. Ms. Lambert has threatened to sue previous to this.

 

[teiresias]

So the lawyer basically said, "Yeah, you'll probably get sued for slander and lose with these reasons, so you'd better pull something out of the bible to justify it."

 

[DealMonkey]

Oh so the church will get sued for gender discrimination instead? What a brilliant f'ing lawyer they've retained. Pffft, I don't believe it for a second.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM

Originally posted by: blackangst1
What are you people so excited about? Dont we have freedom of religion in this country? Let them be sheesh. If you dont like it, dont join em. Who are YOU to judge whats right and wrong for other people?

P.s. I disagree with this as well, but it isnt my issue *shrug*

P.P.s All it takes for an Evil to bloom and grow, is for people like you to say "it isnt my issue".

Oh I see. So if I dont like the way particular religion does things and I dont take a stand againdst it...Im evil? interesting...

Listen pal. I dont tell YOU how to worship or not, so if you dont like MY choices, piss off. We have freedom of religion in this country. It's really none of our business. When is the last time time you stood in front of a mosque crying for women's rights? Never? Thats what I thought.

 

[Moonbeam]

The Goddess was overthrown by the Warrior God. Our God is a man, no? I have never seen a woman with a long white beard. Monotheism is mono-sexism, no? In every duality one is good and one is evil. Women were born to lose, no?

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Oh so the church will get sued for gender discrimination instead? What a brilliant f'ing lawyer they've retained. Pffft, I don't believe it for a second.

they aren't getting sued. there has been NO mention of a lawsuit. there is no gender discrimination at the church. as i've previously posted they have been quoted as saying over 50% of the church's board is comprised of women and over 80% of the sunday school teachers are women.

also in media interviews Ms. Lambert has said she knows there are other reasons for her dismissal. she declined to get into those reasons.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: moshquerade
i really hate to blow all of you knee jerk reactors out of the water, but the pastor just used scripture as an excuse. albeit a poor choice. he and the others in power in the church just wanted the lady out of there because she's been a troublemaker and has gotten the media involved before b/c she is stuck in her ways and resents any change.

here is more info to enlighten you:

the church in question does have women in decision making and religious teaching positions. they have not shunned all women... just this one it would seem.

Currently 55% of the Diaconate Board members of First Baptist Church are women. Additionally, by September, 87% of all Sunday School teaching positions will be filled by female educators.
Taken from the church's press release
http://www.newzjunky.com/record/0820firstbaptist.htm

also, here is the pastor's press release:
http://www.newzjunky.com/record/0820labouf.htm

An island of sanity amidst the sea of christian bashing.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The Goddess was overthrown by the Warrior God. Our God is a man, no? I have never seen a woman with a long white beard. Monotheism is mono-sexism, no? In every duality one is good and one is evil. Women were born to lose, no?

No, no, and no.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The Goddess was overthrown by the Warrior God. Our God is a man, no? I have never seen a woman with a long white beard. Monotheism is mono-sexism, no? In every duality one is good and one is evil. Women were born to lose, no?

No, no, and no.

Do you have an agrument?

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The Goddess was overthrown by the Warrior God. Our God is a man, no? I have never seen a woman with a long white beard. Monotheism is mono-sexism, no? In every duality one is good and one is evil. Women were born to lose, no?

No, no, and no.

Do you have an agrument?

Not without pulling out scripture, which everyone seems to not like, because its shallow and sheep-like :roll: so no.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The Goddess was overthrown by the Warrior God. Our God is a man, no? I have never seen a woman with a long white beard. Monotheism is mono-sexism, no? In every duality one is good and one is evil. Women were born to lose, no?

No, no, and no.

Do you have an agrument?

Not without pulling out scripture, which everyone seems to not like, because its shallow and sheep-like :roll: so no.

What's not shallow and sheep-like about being afraid to quote scripture for fear of being shallow and sheep-like?

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The Goddess was overthrown by the Warrior God. Our God is a man, no? I have never seen a woman with a long white beard. Monotheism is mono-sexism, no? In every duality one is good and one is evil. Women were born to lose, no?

No, no, and no.

Do you have an agrument?

Not without pulling out scripture, which everyone seems to not like, because its shallow and sheep-like :roll: so no.

What's not shallow and sheep-like about being afraid to quote scripture for fear of being shallow and sheep-like?

lol

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Oh so the church will get sued for gender discrimination instead? What a brilliant f'ing lawyer they've retained. Pffft, I don't believe it for a second.

they aren't getting sued. there has been NO mention of a lawsuit. there is no gender discrimination at the church. as i've previously posted they have been quoted as saying over 50% of the church's board is comprised of women and over 80% of the sunday school teachers are women.

also in media interviews Ms. Lambert has said she knows there are other reasons for her dismissal. she declined to get into those reasons.

I didn't say there WAS a lawsuit, merely that they're exposing themselves big time by making the basis for her firing her gender. Which is its own issue regardless of their other hiring/firing practices. But I guess brilliant legal minds like you and the dumbass representing the church think alike? LOL.