AutoCAD build opinions

[IcePickFreak]

While I never had issue bringing work home and using Autodesk Inventor with a 512mb 8800GTS, if you're building a dedicated CAD station I'd stick with the quadro/fire series cards.

For storage, it's really not going to be a huge factor unless you start working with some huge (10k+ parts) 3D assemblies IMO, and even then I'm not sure how much difference it would make given the amounts of RAM you can have these days. As said above, the swap file access was the bigger issue and being everything was still 32bit just a few years ago you couldn't get massive amounts of RAM. Given the choices though personally I'd stick with a RAID setup over an SSD because you'll be erasing and writing a lot working with different assemblies.

When you get more into 3D, you might also check out a 3D mouse. Some people hate em and some love em. I absolutely love mine for certain things and only paid $50 for the one I linked during a sale 4 or 5 years ago and it's still going strong. You can get some much fancier ones as well if you want to spend teh monies.

 

[KGB]

You're making an assumption there.

From the FAQ:

9. Why is graphics hardware designed for desktop or gaming applications not Certified or Recommended?

While some desktop or gaming level graphics hardware may work with the 3D display features in certain Autodesk products, desktop and gaming level products are not supported by Autodesk or the hardware vendor for use with 3D applications.

Please note: I have support contracts with Autodesk. One of the first questions they ask me is: Which Certified graphics card are you using and which certified driver version?

Exactly!!!

 

[Knavish]

The fundamental question that I've never seen answered is: do low-end Quadro cards outperform mid-range to high-range gamer cards??

Also -- as everyone says, Quadro/FireGL is required if you need support. Can anyone confirm that a student license comes with any support agreement? I thought those support agreements typically cost $1000s per year. This is the reason why a $1500 to $3000 pro graphics card is a no-brainer for the workplace.

 

[mfenn]

The fundamental question that I've never seen answered is: do low-end Quadro cards outperform mid-range to high-range gamer cards??

Disclaimer: I don't have any benchmarks.

I would expect a high-end GeForce card to outperform a low-end Quadro solely on the basis of horsepower. The Quadro 600 has 96 CUDA cores whereas the GTX 560 Ti (for example) has 384.

That being said, I think that sticking to hardware that allows you to use your support contract is a wise move in a business environment.

 

[IcePickFreak]

From what I've read, seems like there's certain applications and circumstances that get a decent boost from a quadro vs a gamer card, at least a couple years ago. At the time though nobody could ever figure out what those circumstances were with follow up testing. Not sure if it's still possible, but you use to be able to softmod certain gamer cards into a quadro that cost several times more and performance was supposedly identical at that point. Not sure if that's still the case.

Personally I still think it comes down to support. There's a big difference between having one computer at home and having 20+ (if not 100+ for larger corps) when it comes to reliability & support.

 

[KGB]

I may be mistaken, but the days of softmods are in the past.

Besides all the support advantages and everything else, where Quadro/FireGL cards really have an advantage over gamer cards in CAD apps is... insane AA capabilities.

 

[Eos]

I was wondering if there's any advantage to building this and leaving it a dedicated ACAD machine. What would you do?

 

[KGB]

I was wondering if there's any advantage to building this and leaving it a dedicated ACAD machine. What would you do?

Yup. A CAD station is a tool... not a toy.

 

[mfenn]

I was wondering if there's any advantage to building this and leaving it a dedicated ACAD machine. What would you do?

Depends. Are you happy with your current machine for all non-CAD tasks?

 

[Eos]

Depends. Are you happy with your current machine for all non-CAD tasks?

It's almost three years old, so it's not super snappy.

ASUS M2N-SLI Deluxe AM2 NVIDIA nForce
AMD Athlon 64 X2 6000+ Windsor 3.0GHz Socket AM2 125W Dual-Core Processor
G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
EVGA 256-P2-N761-AR GeForce 8600 GTS 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI E
Win XP Pro

I think it's difficult to gauge how much ACAD work I'll be doing. The amount of use directly affects the need for a dedicated machine.

In the fall I can always build another workstation for regular browsing and whatnot.

 

[mfenn]

It's almost three years old, so it's not super snappy.

ASUS M2N-SLI Deluxe AM2 NVIDIA nForce
AMD Athlon 64 X2 6000+ Windsor 3.0GHz Socket AM2 125W Dual-Core Processor
G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
EVGA 256-P2-N761-AR GeForce 8600 GTS 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI E
Win XP Pro

I think it's difficult to gauge how much ACAD work I'll be doing. The amount of use directly affects the need for a dedicated machine.

In the fall I can always build another workstation for regular browsing and whatnot.

Since your current machine is fairly old, I don't really see the point of not using the CAD machine for everyday tasks. It's not like installing a web browser is going to make AutoCAD self-destruct or anything. You won't be able to play many games with the AutoCAD-certified Quadro drivers, but then again, you can't play many games with an 8600 GTS anyway.

 

[Eos]

Since your current machine is fairly old, I don't really see the point of not using the CAD machine for everyday tasks. It's not like installing a web browser is going to make AutoCAD self-destruct or anything. You won't be able to play many games with the AutoCAD-certified Quadro drivers, but then again, you can't play many games with an 8600 GTS anyway.

Yeah, I thought about this after you mentioned it. I've been using AutoCAD on my lappy for the last eight months. No explosions...

Not a gamer, so no worries there.

 

[mfenn]

Yeah, I thought about this after you mentioned it. I've been using AutoCAD on my lappy for the last eight months. No explosions...

Not a gamer, so no worries there.

:thumbsup:

 

[tweakboy]

Lots and Lots of RAM and strong GPU OGL . Grab a 460 1GB for 140 or soo, unless you want those 5 thousand dollar video cards built for studio max premiere etc....

 

[Eos]

Looks like the SSD is marked WAY down, so a replacement is likely due very soon. I'm not a "must have the newest model" kind of guy, so this just represents a great deal for me, plus a huge improvement in performance, obviously.

Buying one of the SSDs today before the rebate expires.

 

[mfenn]

Looks like the SSD is marked WAY down, so a replacement is likely due very soon. I'm not a "must have the newest model" kind of guy, so this just represents a great deal for me, plus a huge improvement in performance, obviously.

Buying one of the SSDs today before the rebate expires.

Which SSD were you planning to get? The Vertex 2 isn't worth it because of the firmware issues with 22nm NAND. It's going to be especially poor if you want to RAID them because then you lose TRIM.

 

[Eos]

Which SSD were you planning to get? The Vertex 2 isn't worth it because of the firmware issues with 22nm NAND. It's going to be especially poor if you want to RAID them because then you lose TRIM.

Aww. That info would have been helpful when I first posted.

I'll try and cancel. Is there something you recommend in its place? 64gb is my sweet spot, RAID0 would be awesome.

 

[mfenn]

Aww. That info would have been helpful when I first posted.

I'll try and cancel. Is there something you recommend in its place? 64gb is my sweet spot, RAID0 would be awesome.

I believe that I did recommend the Intel 320 instead in my earlier post.

But in any case, you need to decide if you want ~64GB or ~128GB. I do not recommend doing a RAID0 of any two smaller SSDs when a larger one is available due to the aforementioned TRIM issue.

At 60GB, I like the Mushkin Callisto Deluxe and at 120GB, I like the Intel 320. 120GB is really the sweet spot right now in terms of cost per gig.

 

[Eos]

I believe that I did recommend the Intel 320 instead in my earlier post.

But in any case, you need to decide if you want ~64GB or ~128GB. I do not recommend doing a RAID0 of any two smaller SSDs when a larger one is available due to the aforementioned TRIM issue.

At 60GB, I like the Mushkin Callisto Deluxe and at 120GB, I like the Intel 320. 120GB is really the sweet spot right now in terms of cost per gig.

I took that as a recommendation, not that my option was a bad choice. I understand now.

Also, I understood the loss of trim to be unique to the 22nm NAND SSD I chose, not all SSD models. I get that now, too.

Thanks for the recommendations. Looks like the 120gb Intel is $.33 less per gb, and from what I'm now reading, has better performance than a similarly spec'd smaller SSD. Something about available free space lets the bits flow better. Reading about TRIM now, and it appears to be important.

Overall, it seems like I wouldn't even notice a performance increase from RAID0 SSD vs. a single. The jump from HDD to SSD should be enough to put my jaw on the floor.

I appreciate all of the comments. NE was able to cancel my order. Intel 320 120GB ordered. Yay!

 

[Davidh373]

Lots and Lots of RAM and strong GPU OGL . Grab a 460 1GB for 140 or soo, unless you want those 5 thousand dollar video cards built for studio max premiere etc....

:awe: somebody didn't read...

 

[mfenn]

I took that as a recommendation, not that my option was a bad choice. I understand now.

Also, I understood the loss of trim to be unique to the 22nm NAND SSD I chose, not all SSD models. I get that now, too.

Thanks for the recommendations. Looks like the 120gb Intel is $.33 less per gb, and from what I'm now reading, has better performance than a similarly spec'd smaller SSD. Something about available free space lets the bits flow better. Reading about TRIM now, and it appears to be important.

Overall, it seems like I wouldn't even notice a performance increase from RAID0 SSD vs. a single. The jump from HDD to SSD should be enough to put my jaw on the floor.

I appreciate all of the comments. NE was able to cancel my order. Intel 320 120GB ordered. Yay!

Glad we got that cleared up. I especially agree with the bolded. Enjoy!

 

[Eos]

Ordered 20 May:

MSI P67A-GD65 (B3) LGA 1155 Intel P67 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
Intel Core i7-2600 Sandy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core
2x G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666)
PNY VCQ600-PB Quadro 600 1GB 128-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16
Intel 320 Series SSDSA2CW120G3K5 2.5" 120GB SATA II MLC
CORSAIR Enthusiast Series CMPSU-650TX
Intel PWLA8391GT 10/ 100/ 1000Mbps PCI PRO/1000 GT
ASUS DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS Black SATA 24X DVD Burner
Microsoft Windows 7 Professional SP1 64-bit
Antec Three Hundred
LITE-ON SK-1788/BS 2-Tone PS/2 KB
RAZER DeathAdder
2x ASUS VW246H Glossy Black 24" 2ms monitor

and this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002R9HQLI

I opted in for Shop Runner and their free 2 day shipping. Everything is due the 24th. I'll probably end up keeping the Shop Runner subscription as much as I shop there. We'll see. Amazon and Newegg generally have the same price. amzn orders have tax added, but I get 3% rebates and free 2 day shipping with Prime eligible orders. Without Shop Runner, NE has no tax, but has slower shipping and only 1% rebate using my Chase rewards card.

Like I stated, we'll see if I keep it after the 30 day trial.

Can't wait to get the anti-static wrist strap out and get to work!

 

[Davidh373]

MSI P67A-GD65 (B3) LGA 1155 Intel P67 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
Intel Core i7-2600 Sandy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core
2x G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666)
PNY VCQ600-PB Quadro 600 1GB 128-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16
Intel 320 Series SSDSA2CW120G3K5 2.5" 120GB SATA II MLC
CORSAIR Enthusiast Series CMPSU-650TX
Intel PWLA8391GT 10/ 100/ 1000Mbps PCI PRO/1000 GT
ASUS DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS Black SATA 24X DVD Burner
Microsoft Windows 7 Professional SP1 64-bit
Antec Three Hundred
LITE-ON SK-1788/BS 2-Tone PS/2 KB
RAZER DeathAdder
2x ASUS VW246H Glossy Black 24" 2ms monitor

:thumbsup:

Only thing I would change is the ripjaws to the Value since they are the same DIMMS, but psh, $5-$10 isn't much of a difference.

 

[Eos]

:thumbsup:

Only thing I would change is the ripjaws to the Value since they are the same DIMMS, but psh, $5-$10 isn't much of a difference.

Yeah, I spent a lot of time researching. The Kingston option is $39 per DIMM, but has a lower overall rating. I tend to use that as my main decider. The difference today is ~$14.

I did not know it was the same DIMM, but different name...

 

[Davidh373]

GSkill value RAM is the same as the GSkill Ripjaws. Only difference is the 100% useless heatsinks.