Question are video card prices headed down yet?

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Aapje

Golden Member
Mar 21, 2022
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I don't disagree with the sentiment. But I feel like HWUB has kinda went whirlpooling down the drain over the years. Do not like to give them views.

You don't have to, because I just told you what they found. :p

Also, care to share why you are down on them? I think that they generally do quite well, regularly discovering or pointing out things that other reviewers ignore, like some games having texture issues on low VRAM systems, where they keep decent FPS, but don't actually provide the visual quality that you request from it with the settings.

They also very publicly talk about the pros and cons of the reviewer choices that they make and why they make them.
 
Feb 11, 2024
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Oh today I see a email 6750xt for 300 even. Now my 6700rx for 240 looks bad but the 6750xt uses like 100 more watts to give 10 more fps :/

What is the leather jacket reference to? Linux guy ?
 

DaaQ

Golden Member
Dec 8, 2018
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Aapje

Golden Member
Mar 21, 2022
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All true here. Should net be supporting this company cheating out on using consumer gpus. They should be told to pound sand or but Pro versions.
It's actually bad for society if the GPU makers get away with price segmentation better. It means that they get more money, which we either pay directly or by having companies that use the GPUs increase their prices.
 

DaaQ

Golden Member
Dec 8, 2018
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Ed
It's actually bad for society if the GPU makers get away with price segmentation better. It means that they get more money, which we either pay directly or by having companies that use the GPUs increase their prices.
Edited for spelling errors.

What are you trying to say? That a small startup selling AI servers using consumer GPUs that they have not even made a delivery on, trying to force a manufacturer to open up it's firmware for them, selling 6x GPUS that cost maybe 7500k for 15k is a good thing for regular consumers?

Or should the manufacturer of the consumer GPUs tell the startup company that if they want that kind of access they should be using the proper accelerator for their server boxes?

Because Tinybox sounds like they want to get access to gpu firmware that should not be open source. Now I am not talking the software to run the AI code, but the actual GPU FIRMWARE that would give access to memory interfaces and such.
And we ALL know they are trying this with AMD because Nvidia would tell them to pound sand. NO.

Let them goto Intel and threaten them.

This whole thing is a no win for us regular people that want to have a GPU in their personal computer.

This guy behind Tinybox should have been denied from the start. Lisa Su made a large mistake by even replying to this guy, which looks like a pyramid scheme to begin with.

So are you for using gaming class cards as AI accelerators or Professional class cards used as AI accelerators?
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
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All true here. Should ne\ot be supporting this company cheating out on using consumer gpus. They should be told to pound sand or buy Pro versions.

EDIT: net to not and but to buy.
If the cards are officially supported then it would send a worse message if AMD refused to do anything about obvious problems with the product.
 

Bigos

Member
Jun 2, 2019
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Because Tinybox sounds like they want to get access to gpu firmware that should not be open source. Now I am not talking the software to run the AI code, but the actual GPU FIRMWARE that would give access to memory interfaces and such.
Why should it not be open source? The more open the firmware is the better the understanding of how the GPU works is. Right now game developers often look into AMD open source drivers to see what happens inside but cannot see what the firmware does which might hinder optimization. This also includes the open source driver devs (radv developed by Valve).

Also, there is no one single "GPU firmware". There are several binary blobs, each responsible for different hardware blocks. IIRC they were asking for the part that deals with scheduling asynchronous compute tasks. It has no relation to memory controller programming.
 

Aapje

Golden Member
Mar 21, 2022
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So are you for using gaming class cards as AI accelerators or Professional class cards used as AI accelerators?

I'm in favor of 'gaming' cards being used for AI and such. because it brings down the cost of AI. This both indirectly reduces costs for us consumers, but also means that smaller companies can do things with it, so we get less dependent on Google, Meta and Microsoft.

The partially artificial segmentation between gaming and professional cards also makes it harder for regular people to play with the technology.

Frankly, I think you are still traumatized from the mining boom days and think "they are taking our cards." However, there doesn't seem to be a shortage of 5N capacity. In reality, this is probably good for gamers, since if AMD's gamer cards earn more money, they have more reason to invest in those. And in general, it is good for AMD to earn more money, rather than have that money go to Nvidia.
 

DaaQ

Golden Member
Dec 8, 2018
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I'm in favor of 'gaming' cards being used for AI and such. because it brings down the cost of AI. This both indirectly reduces costs for us consumers, but also means that smaller companies can do things with it, so we get less dependent on Google, Meta and Microsoft.

The partially artificial segmentation between gaming and professional cards also makes it harder for regular people to play with the technology.

Frankly, I think you are still traumatized from the mining boom days and think "they are taking our cards." However, there doesn't seem to be a shortage of 5N capacity. In reality, this is probably good for gamers, since if AMD's gamer cards earn more money, they have more reason to invest in those. And in general, it is good for AMD to earn more money, rather than have that money go to Nvidia.
Thank you for the more clear explanation. Makes sense.

Lisa Su should not have got involved personally though imo. Especially with the way this particular startup founder is acting publicly.

The last card I bought before this 7900xtx (hopefully legit) was a GTX 780 new. Then a OG Titan used.
 

DaaQ

Golden Member
Dec 8, 2018
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Why should it not be open source? The more open the firmware is the better the understanding of how the GPU works is. Right now game developers often look into AMD open source drivers to see what happens inside but cannot see what the firmware does which might hinder optimization. This also includes the open source driver devs (radv developed by Valve).

Also, there is no one single "GPU firmware". There are several binary blobs, each responsible for different hardware blocks. IIRC they were asking for the part that deals with scheduling asynchronous compute tasks. It has no relation to memory controller programming.
I was referring to this comment by the founder of tiny box. In the TH article.

After the meeting, Tiny Corp. said it was 70% confident that AMD would at least make the scheduler and memory hierarchy management portions of the firmware open source, which is what the AI startup specifically wants. "We aren't open source purists... But we need the scheduler and the memory hierarchy management to be open.
 

Aapje

Golden Member
Mar 21, 2022
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Lisa Su should not have got involved personally though imo. Especially with the way this particular startup founder is acting publicly.

I don't think that it's a bad thing for her to show that she is receptive to the needs of AI people. AMD needs all the mindshare among the AI crowd that it can get with how much of a head start Nvidia has got.
 

Bigos

Member
Jun 2, 2019
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I was referring to this comment by the founder of tiny box. In the TH article.
I don't think "memory hierarchy management" has anything to do with the memory controller. I would wager a guess they want more control over the cache levels, maybe only the MALL (Infinity Cache).
 

DaaQ

Golden Member
Dec 8, 2018
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I get individuals wanting to work with AI and ML/LLM but to try and start a company to supply, consumer GPU servers, ala instead of A100 or H100 systems, that is ok?
 
Jul 27, 2020
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May wanna grab that before the tiny box shmuck makes a deal with Newegg!
 

manly

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
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I get individuals wanting to work with AI and ML/LLM but to try and start a company to supply, consumer GPU servers, ala instead of A100 or H100 systems, that is ok?
Nothing wrong with that.


May wanna grab that before the tiny box shmuck makes a deal with Newegg!
There's a discount on Newegg when people pay with Zip ($6 finance charge applies). Goes well with mid-range graphics cards: