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Are people who oppose death penalty naive?
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blackangst1
Lifer
Check your battery, sir. Your meter appears to be broken.
Since my comments went WHOOSH I will explain in plain english.
Phokus said :Still waiting for Obama to enact re-education camps for conservatives like tinfoil hat wearing righties were complaining about
I asked who these righties were.
He replied with the story from Rep. Michele Bachmann.
To which I commented its not the right, nor is it a group of rightys, but rather ONE person who made the comment, therefore blowing shit way out of proportion (as the left usually does...you know, taking one comment from one person and announcing it is the stand of the entire right)
I then started with sarcasm, stating: Good thing for the left no single person has made outlandish comments! (at which point your meter failed you. You see, there are crazy fucks on BOTH sides of the aisle, in case you have forgotten).
And then it went downhill from there. Chill out man.
blackangst1
Lifer
Of course there is. There's crazy fucks on the left too. Or are you denying that? Really? And you honestly think the majority of the right believes this? Really? Or are you going to take the stance of "yes but not as many?" The comments werent about how many are on the right or the left. The comments were about Rep. Michele Bachmann. Try to stay focused.
No, the comments weren't about Michele Bachmann, they were about 'righties' making those insane comments. The one he happened to link to was Michele Bachmann, but there are others and they command a considerable audience.
Who cares if there are crazy fucks on the left? Right now there is a deluge of insanity coming from the right on a host of important issues, explicitly or implicitly endorsed by prominent conservative figures. This is undeniable.
DrPizza
Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
This one is for Harvey (and a little off-topic)
Hypothetically, it's December 2012. GWB has been convicted of a pile of crime committed during his Presidency. All of his appeals have been fast-tracked and exhausted. He's set to be hung at midnight on Dec 29. Obama has lost the re-election, and the president-elect, a Republican, has stated that if GWB's case survives until his term, he'll give him a full pardon.
What then?
/opening a can of worms. 😛
Hypothetically, it's December 2012. GWB has been convicted of a pile of crime committed during his Presidency. All of his appeals have been fast-tracked and exhausted. He's set to be hung at midnight on Dec 29. Obama has lost the re-election, and the president-elect, a Republican, has stated that if GWB's case survives until his term, he'll give him a full pardon.
What then?
/opening a can of worms. 😛
Vic
Elite Member
A few reasons:
- some people just can't be reasoned with and if they insist on harming others, they have to be stopped from being able to do so permanently,
- the death penalty is arguably more humane than life in prison. The practice of imprisonment is hardly civilized, even compared to corporal or capital punishments.
OTOH the best argument against the death penalty IMO is that it is irreversible, that you can't undo the damage done if the convicted is later found to be innocent, and it is for this reason we assuage our guilt with prisons. So it's not like the naivete is entirely one-sided. But when there is little to no doubt of guilt, then IMO the death penalty is the best option.
Isn't the inhumanity of imprisonment purely the result of our intention to do more than separate dangerous people from the rest of us. Are we not out, not only just to blockade the unreasonable from being able to freely perpetrate acts of violence, but to punish them for that attitude?
No, here, I think it is you who has become the nanny state in wishing to put to death, for their own good, of course, to save them from our inhumanity, rather that see that the inhumanity and unreasonable violence from which we want to spare them is our own, the way we intentionally construct prisons. Why are prisons not places where we humanely separate the criminally insane from the rest of us, but attempt, as we do, to show them what reasonableness looks like and to attempt to cure them. We are the Jew and the law abiders who believe that salvation lies in obedience in letter and not spirit. We are the certain of guilt who have been forgiven and will not believe.
Ozoned: Why on earth would you need to show someone what reasonableness looks like when they are already aware of it BEFORE they make a CHOICE of following or disregarding the rules of society?
M: There is nothing that can answer this for you because you live in the dark cave of self flattery. You have established your self importance on a castle of sand and will defend it to the death. You believe that you are who you are as a function of your own self determination and are incapable of seeing that you are a total accident, that there but for the Grace of God, it is you who isn't unreasonable. In this dark cruel self hating corner of the universe, almost empty of spiritual understanding, those who fall into unreasonableness through no fault of their own, but because their world is sick, are legion.
You were raised to compete and to imagine that when you win at the sick game it makes you a somebody. You need those unreasonable folk to look down on and to punish in order for you to feel your win. Punishment of evil is all about making you feel better. Because you don't see how you were conditioned you are blind. Sadly it is you who is in prison.
M: There is nothing that can answer this for you because you live in the dark cave of self flattery. You have established your self importance on a castle of sand and will defend it to the death. You believe that you are who you are as a function of your own self determination and are incapable of seeing that you are a total accident, that there but for the Grace of God, it is you who isn't unreasonable. In this dark cruel self hating corner of the universe, almost empty of spiritual understanding, those who fall into unreasonableness through no fault of their own, but because their world is sick, are legion.
You were raised to compete and to imagine that when you win at the sick game it makes you a somebody. You need those unreasonable folk to look down on and to punish in order for you to feel your win. Punishment of evil is all about making you feel better. Because you don't see how you were conditioned you are blind. Sadly it is you who is in prison.
Ozoned
Diamond Member
Before man became civilized and knew what reasonableness looked like, death was a simple act of nature. Mans attempt to understand death, and make it more than what it is, is what led man to use it as an act of aggression, a tool of protection and retaliation, and the basic foundation of civility.
The illusion in all of this is to think that you understand it.
The OP suggests that Death of a loved one incites a paticular raw human emotion, but I am not so sure that the rage within us that demands an eye for an eye is raw, but rather something we learned when we became civilized.
Naive indeed.....
The illusion in all of this is to think that you understand it.
The OP suggests that Death of a loved one incites a paticular raw human emotion, but I am not so sure that the rage within us that demands an eye for an eye is raw, but rather something we learned when we became civilized.
Naive indeed.....
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