I still think they are slow... I have never ever been in a situation where I was like "OMG KILLER! This thing is so fast, it could whoop my P4 system anyday". There is nothing special about a mac since you can do everything on a PC now. I mean you could always do video editing on a PC but then agian I have never been able to confirm the "advantage" apple had in the early days for editing. It just seems like PCs have so much more than a mac.
I still think they are slow... I have never ever been in a situation where I was like "OMG KILLER! This thing is so fast, it could whoop my P4 system anyday". There is nothing special about a mac since you can do everything on a PC now. I mean you could always do video editing on a PC but then agian I have never been able to confirm the "advantage" apple had in the early days for editing. It just seems like PCs have so much more than a mac.
I notice how you say you bought an Ibook and think it's great. I have also noticed that other people some who are pc users say its so much better than anything out there probably because of a wide variety of ports and long battery life. And probably they have never used an IBM thinkpad as well. They probably assume since they have had 1-3 laptops that are PC based and haven't served too well that this Ibook is the only thing good from apple, well in reality there are better. Just think of the Thinkpad as the Ibook but professional looking and windows compatible.
Sure my particular model doesn't have firewire but there are some models that do and thats where it ends for apple. Their battery life is pretty good when compairing to compaq garbage and HP machines but the IBM thinkpad series really kicks ass when it comes to battery life, even on one battery! Add two and some people have gotten up to 10 hours! I know what Ibooks are like because one time I met a very nice elderly woman who was with her husband and she was using one at the airport. It was very interesting to see her use the machine so proficiently, she even had above average general computer knowledge. As usuall I gave her my tips as I observed her having some trouble in outlook and she was very thankful but as I was watching her I noticed how she had to conserve the battery life on her 12" Ibook, it was as though it was her last meal and wouldn't be able to eat for a month! So I asked, "So, how much actual battery life do you get out of that machine". She said, "from 1 1/2 hours to 3". I was very surprised and gave her some battery saving tips but it looked like she was using every single one I could think of. And so that was my story with an apple Ibook, I may have not been using it but I could see how much she was limited in what she could do. She only spent 30 minutes checking e-mail stored on the computer and the battery was at 10% before she turned it off. (Though I don't know of the battery life when she first turned it on)
It may have been simple and sleek but for me, if a 12" notebook can't get very decent battery life (relatively) then I can't expect much from apple because a 12" notebook should be fairly easy to get good battery life. Here is one thing I would like to note which could change a lot of things, she was attempting to use Wifi at the time, though I never did get ask her how long her battery life was had she not been using wifi/attempting to.
jsLFIPADSFSADOGLKJSGDHALHIHREG!
Malak
Lifer
- Dec 4, 2004
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It's a matter of taste, if that's what you are getting at. The Delorean's may suck but they are classics that people get excited just to see. I personally would rather have a Lexus over a Benz, but that doesn't stop the rich from getting a Benz. It's all in the name when it comes to cars. The stereo-type of a Benz is that it's luxury of the highest. The stereo-type of the Mac is that it's a cult.
HUH?
It's been a long time since Apple shipped machines with GF4 Ti. The G5 towers have been out for 15 months already and they've never had GF4. G5s have only shipped with FX5200U, 9600 Pro, 9600 XT, 9800 Pro, and 6800 Ultra DDL. The latter is a bargain in the Mac world... you can get the 256 MB 6800 Ultra Dual Display Link DVI card for $475 - $500. As far as I understand there are no DDL cards in the PC world for that price. You need DDL for the big monitors like Apple's 30" beast.
BTW, did you know that Apple was the first company to ship a GF3 card? John Carmack even did the first public tech demo of Doom3 on an Apple G4 minitower with the first GF3 card.
iBook and eMac use Radeon 9200, which is pretty weak, but it's a hell of a lot better than onboard chipset graphics that suck up CPU cycles and RAM bandwidth.
PowerBook 12" is stuck at Mobile FX5200, which sucks. PowerBooks 15" and 17" are stuck at 9700 Mobility, which is outdated by todays standards -- Apple needs to update it to the 9800 Mobility.
I haven't experienced "OMG KILLER!" since about 1997 or 1998. (Which happened to be a 350 MHz PPC 604e in a PowerMac 9500 or 9600... significantly faster than the Pentium Pro and Pentium II systems we had, and was damned close to the $25,000 Sun Ultra 2 workstations we also used.
These days the tech is going thru a slow evolution. All we care about today is everything happening instantly. That and how snazzy your desktop icons and wallpaper are. We rarely have to wait for our machines anymore. Websites load instantly with out fast internet connections and fast CPUs. System crashes are rare. The hardware is getting reallyl stable. Photoshop filters happen instantly when working with web-resolution images. Even most transitions and effects in home video DV editing occur in real-time. The graphics cards are also going thru a steady upgrade cycle, and so are the games that run on them.
I haven't said "OMG KILLER!" about desktop computers in a long time. In fact, it's only been a few times in recent years that I've said or thought that:
Second generation Pocket PCs.... "killer, I want one!"
2 Mpixel camera phones.... "this is all I need, I want one!"
MiniDV camcorders that weigh less than a pound.... "this is the right size, I want one!"
Watching a Silicon Graphics Inc. demo around 2000 or 2001 in which they had very high resolution satellite images of the globe and even higher resolution aerial photos of certain metro areas. The data was kept in a full rack of RAID gear while we got to fly and "bungie jump" to and from earth from space on the huge curved screen in front of us. Three projectors gave a seamless 4800x1200 widescreen wraparound view powered by two more racks of SGI graphics hardware. I forget the MB/sec figures they said the system was pumping from disk to feed the graphics pipelines, it was nearly 1 GB/sec. It was sort of like Keyhole, but taken to the 10th power, squared again, and with a cherry on top.
I thought... "if I had my own evil empire... I'd want one!"
So the stereo type of the Mac is a cult then right? Well, I can sure as hell say the same thing about the PC. The PC is like a cult too. Most PC users act just like Mac users.
I think it's really hard to stereotype the PC world. Especially when there are people like me who use both XP and OS X.
It used to be that Mac users bought their machines for music/video/photo performance or because they didn't want to deal with DOS or Windows 3.0/3.1. There were plenty of computer newbies that used Macs for that reason. But as a friend of mine says "A $400 Dell is the new Macintosh". Far more newbie users buy what they use at school or use at work... PC's.
But at the same time there are the power users like us. We want the most performance for our dollar. Or for our one thousand dollars. We want a huge screen and we want a fast hard drive. We don't really need all of those specs, we could live with a few less FPS or a few more seconds encoding time, but we want the most for the money. Plus it's fun to see how much we can get out of our machines.
Then there are those that only care that their machine works. They don't care how fast or how pretty, just as long as they can do their work and move on.
There are sooo many different types of PC users. My younger brother is a far different PC user than, say, my dentist's secretary.
The only part of the PC world that scares me in any way are those who think there's nothing wrong with the current virus/worm/spyware mess or the fact that we live in a 32-bit and 64-bit world, yet the registry key names and the files in \SYSTEM32\ still have cryptic 8-bit DOS style names. I think those closed eye peope are drinking too much of the Redmond Kool-Aid.
It used to be that Mac users bought their machines for music/video/photo performance or because they didn't want to deal with DOS or Windows 3.0/3.1. There were plenty of computer newbies that used Macs for that reason. But as a friend of mine says "A $400 Dell is the new Macintosh". Far more newbie users buy what they use at school or use at work... PC's.
But at the same time there are the power users like us. We want the most performance for our dollar. Or for our one thousand dollars. We want a huge screen and we want a fast hard drive. We don't really need all of those specs, we could live with a few less FPS or a few more seconds encoding time, but we want the most for the money. Plus it's fun to see how much we can get out of our machines.
Then there are those that only care that their machine works. They don't care how fast or how pretty, just as long as they can do their work and move on.
There are sooo many different types of PC users. My younger brother is a far different PC user than, say, my dentist's secretary.
The only part of the PC world that scares me in any way are those who think there's nothing wrong with the current virus/worm/spyware mess or the fact that we live in a 32-bit and 64-bit world, yet the registry key names and the files in \SYSTEM32\ still have cryptic 8-bit DOS style names. I think those closed eye peope are drinking too much of the Redmond Kool-Aid.
What I meant to say is those Hardcore PC users can act like the Hardcore Mac users, so you really cant say the Mac is like a cult.
Originally posted by: saltedeggman
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: saltedeggman
but you can't deny the style of Mac's....
i just love how they look, especially the iBook
I sure as hell can. Give me a custom-built case any day.
- M4H
we have contrasting taste then...
It's funny how artsy people use macs that can't compete with the creative cnotrol you have when modding a PC case.
Macs are somewhere in the middle of the road for design (hardware only - mac software is very fluffy compared to windows):
Walmart PC's < Dells < Sony < Apple < Falcon/Alienware/etc. < Unique mods
Homo? Nah, you're not thinking about Macintosh, you're thinking about RISC OS...
http://www.riscos.org/riscos/index.html
http://www.riscstation.co.uk/html/products.html
http://www.iyonix.com/
That's true, but PC designs are often somewhat aggressive and pimped out, with no apparent elegance to the overall design, and whenever someone tries to approach it in a Mac like way of simplicity, they get branded as Map ripoffs. Case in point - the Lian-Li PC-V1000. Alienware/Falcon systems, while attractive, aren't as elegant or simple as Macs, who use sleek lines or simple colors and curves to attract. It's like comparing an Evo to an Elise. They both make you go "Woah!", but just in different ways.Originally posted by: crimson117
Originally posted by: saltedeggman
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: saltedeggman
but you can't deny the style of Mac's....
i just love how they look, especially the iBook
I sure as hell can. Give me a custom-built case any day.
- M4H
we have contrasting taste then...
It's funny how artsy people use macs that can't compete with the creative cnotrol you have when modding a PC case.
Macs are somewhere in the middle of the road for design (hardware only - mac software is very fluffy compared to windows):
Walmart PC's < Dells < Sony < Apple < Falcon/Alienware/etc. < Unique mods
You assume too much. You don't even know me, or the time I spent deciding a good laptop to get! I researched like hell, looking at IBMs (which didn't seem to be what I wanted, esp seeing most have that stupid eraser mouse), Dells (cheap enough, tempting), Compaq/HP (I know ppl who've had these and regretted it because of the useless support, and stuff like that), and more. I even looked at Apple. I tried them all out, and none of them really appealed to me (including the Apples that were in my price range - they were the iBook G3's at the time with Jaguar, which I didn't find too attractive, too much pin-stripe). I was then told about a Clevo M400S 15" notebook with lots of cool features. I decided to get that. I was happy with it for about a week, and then it got too heavy, hot, and Windows was being its usual pain (I've been using Windows for years - in fact, I've used ever single version from 1.03 upwards, for extended lengths of time - so i'm not new to it, and I can do all sorts of tweaking to it with my eyes shut, I know the ins and outs of Windows and it's back end. I'm just covering myself here incase someone says "you noob, you could do this, or that....").
After about 8 months, I was sick of it, and wanted to try something different. I'd been playing around with Linux for a while, and it really didn't cut it in terms of ease of use (although I'm quite confident with it) esp. in configuring things. I was considering getting another lighter PC notebook and putting Linux on it. But then I saw the improvements Apple made to OS X in Panther, and I thought that I my as well try it out, seeing the iBook G4's now had decent hardware for their price. I bought one and have never regretted it. So Philippine Mango, don't assume things.
hmm, this is unusual. I know lots of people with 12" iBooks that get decent life out of them. I take mine to classes, never turn it of all day (although I sleep it between lectures). This past semester, I had 5 hours worth of lectures in a row, in which I didn't turn off or sleep my iBook. I didn't even plug it into the AC. And it still had time left to spare (IIRC, about 2 hours). All I did differently was dim the screen. I even had my USB mouse plugged in.
I like OS X. If I can only get it on an Apple, I'll buy an Apple, If I can only get it on x86 then thats what I'll buy. I work on Windows computers everyday (I'm going to take my first MCSE exam tomorrow, wish me luck), but in the end I love to come home to my Mac. This is coming from someone who just built a A64 system (with a gaudy window even). To me using OS X makes me feel like Windows XP was just thrown together quickly. OS X is consistent, useful, and yes... even pretty. I think when Tiger comes out in 2005 it will start to be really apparent, even to PC users, just how far ahead OS X is compared to Windows (and Linux). Specifically look at Automator and Spotlight. And Core Image promises to really make the OS stand out for Image and Video editing. Add to this the fact that viruses are a non-issue (don't start that security through obscurity stuff, all that matters is it's true) and you have a system you can spend more time working with, than on. Don't get me wrong, PCs are great for gaming (consoles don't cut it for FPSs), but for everyday work I prefer OS X. But don't take my word for it, try both operating systems... heck, download Linux too (I like SuSE). Find out which you prefer.
Apple didn't have much goign for them before the iPod and in terms of the computer industry they didn't have much going for them before the G5. G3s were decent at FIRST keeping up with the P3 but Apple was way too slow at updating hardware speed. Right now I'd say they are about on par in terms of hardware prowess, a dual 2.5GHz G5 system is quite a beast, the only problem is that you're stuck with their hardware that is somewhat priced fairly, except for the small details such as the fact that if a part goes bad you're most likely screwed unless you're still under warranty, so you need to fork over for that. Then you have a warranty that protects you from out right hardware failer, but not performance failure, i.e. you cannot do much to upgrade the system, of which the few parts you can choose from to upgrade with are usually rare and rather expensive (9800Pros are still going for $350-400...)
Apple OSX is decent, no better than 2000/XP or Linux, but it really only caters to two extremes of users - completely inept or very advanced (in a wierd way where they want to us OSX over Linux).
Unless you want a "pretty" computer and OS, then there isn't much reason to go with Apple. Its really a shame that they are so anal about developing software for their own hardware, especially consdering they have no hope of catching up in terms of over all performance, especially price/performance. If Apple would only pull their heads out of their asses they'd start to develop their OS and all software (not just iTunes) for x86 (and other future PC) platforms, Windows would finally have some real competition. Linux's open source may be the reason why there are any distributions at all, but its also the reason why it hasn't taken off.
Apple OSX is decent, no better than 2000/XP or Linux, but it really only caters to two extremes of users - completely inept or very advanced (in a wierd way where they want to us OSX over Linux).
Unless you want a "pretty" computer and OS, then there isn't much reason to go with Apple. Its really a shame that they are so anal about developing software for their own hardware, especially consdering they have no hope of catching up in terms of over all performance, especially price/performance. If Apple would only pull their heads out of their asses they'd start to develop their OS and all software (not just iTunes) for x86 (and other future PC) platforms, Windows would finally have some real competition. Linux's open source may be the reason why there are any distributions at all, but its also the reason why it hasn't taken off.
For a short period of time I used NeXT systems (http://www.429bauhaus.no-ip.com/NeXT/NeXTCube.html). These were the the original classy looking computers. Even before Silicon Graphics Inc started to use funky colors and shapes for their 3D workstations. The NeXT systems were cool in every way. Even the mouse and keyboard had a rubber bumber to hush any plastic-on-plastic clack noise in a busy office. The hardware circuitry was just as ingenious as the physical hardware design.
ANYWAY... the OS these things ran was NeXTSTEP. It was eventually ported to PC hardware, as well as Sun SPARC hardware and HP PA-RISC hardware and later renamed OPENSTEP. Because of the wide range of hardware it ran on, NeXT maintained a hardware compatibilty list. They only guaranteed that their OS would run on certain CPUs, certain motherboard chipsets, and certain video/sound/network cards. The other really cool thing about NeXT? When you compiled your application for the NeXT OS, you could opt to make a "quad fat binary" which meant that the program could run on any of the hardware! That is to say that the exact same program would run on the Motorola 68040 chip in the original black NeXT hardware, the SPARC chip on Sun hardware, Pentium chip on PC hardware, etc!!
Oh, and one more thing... Mac OS X ("ten") is not based on Mac OS 9. It's based on OPENSTEP. Hmmmmmmm...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NeXTSTEP
http://www.objectfarm.org/Acti...Merger/UserInterfaces/
I was a Mac and PC user between 1995 and 1997. The high end Macs back then where significantly faster than the high end PCs of the same era (Pentium, Pentium Pro, Pentium II). Mac OS 7 thru Mac OS 9 were not as good as Win NT 4, but we made due, at least "classic" Mac OS was insanely simple. The peak was the Power Mac 9600 with a 350 MHz PowerPC 604e, the same CPU IBM used in some of its monster supercomputers. That was an amazing machine, as all of the 604 based Macs were.
When the PowerPC G3 came out it was no faster than the 604e that we were already used to. Over time the G3 got faster, and was finally replaced by the G4. But the upgrade cycle was so very slow. Apple/IBM/Motorola really dropped the ball with the PowerPC G3 and G4.
I lost track of Macs in 1998 until December 2003 when I started following the G5 and bought a PowerBook G4.
Thankfully their price for the 6800 Ultra DDL isn't too bad. $599 list isn't too bad for dual display link DVI.
All of my multimedia professors at school have both macs and pcs. They all do or have done professional work as well and recommend to all of us that both have their pros and cons. I guess anybody that is really serious would understand that each platform has good and bad things about it.
I could understand switching to a mac if my pc didn't allow me to do something, or if there was a program on mac i couldn't use, but I would let those be my deciding factors, not a bunch of people spitting numbers and personal bias at each other.
Every time i read these threads about mac or pc, all i wonder is why not both. And nowadays technology has come far enough that you really cant buy a new computer that just sucks so bad you can't check your email, browse the web, or type a document on.
If you use a computer for professional work, and that is your main source of income, it doen't seem like such a big investment to buy a mac and a pc. If you just do things for fun, why not be happy with what you have and not worry about other people telling you how stupid and "gay" you are for having a white laptop instead of a black one.
You can hate on the guy with the dual 2.5's and 30 inch display but you know you just jelous
I could understand switching to a mac if my pc didn't allow me to do something, or if there was a program on mac i couldn't use, but I would let those be my deciding factors, not a bunch of people spitting numbers and personal bias at each other.
Every time i read these threads about mac or pc, all i wonder is why not both. And nowadays technology has come far enough that you really cant buy a new computer that just sucks so bad you can't check your email, browse the web, or type a document on.
If you use a computer for professional work, and that is your main source of income, it doen't seem like such a big investment to buy a mac and a pc. If you just do things for fun, why not be happy with what you have and not worry about other people telling you how stupid and "gay" you are for having a white laptop instead of a black one.
You can hate on the guy with the dual 2.5's and 30 inch display but you know you just jelous
OSUBeaver: I like your approach to it: Why not both. No one else (including myself) has had the sense to say that. I use both, but i seem to rather my Mac.
Just today, I did a test on the performance of my iBook and it's battery life. It was amazing. And the more programs I ran didn't make any difference to performance. All the eye-candy animations worked smoothly and perfectly, and none of the programs really slowed down. This is something I've never experienced in all my years of using Windows. They slow down and then start complaining about virtual memory. That happened to me even with 512MB RAM (not so bad when you have more than that). In my iBook, I only have 256MB. The hardware might have crap performance, but OS X is the most efficient OS I've ever used.
BTW, here's a post I made in the SFF, Notebooks forum:
Just today, I did a test on the performance of my iBook and it's battery life. It was amazing. And the more programs I ran didn't make any difference to performance. All the eye-candy animations worked smoothly and perfectly, and none of the programs really slowed down. This is something I've never experienced in all my years of using Windows. They slow down and then start complaining about virtual memory. That happened to me even with 512MB RAM (not so bad when you have more than that). In my iBook, I only have 256MB. The hardware might have crap performance, but OS X is the most efficient OS I've ever used.
BTW, here's a post I made in the SFF, Notebooks forum:
Since my last post, I decided to do a test to see how long my battery really lasts (not how long it seemed to last, which is what I was going by before). I timed it to 4 hours 59 minutes before the message at 3% saying "Plug in your AC now or it will go to sleep in a few minutes". It had 9 minutes left on the clock (which seems to underestimate at low percentages). I'm quite impressed, considering what I was doing with it while it was on battery. I had at least 10 programs running the whole time: Finder, Safari, Mail, iCal, Terminal, Word, Excel, Entourage (which is a real hog, like Outlook is), MSN Messenger, Activity Monitor, Cisco VPN, Dreamweaver MX 2004. I had multiple windows and documents open in every program (except Mail, Activity Monitor and Cisco VPN). Was accessing the drive almost constantly (opening and closing files in dreamweaver, etc, and saving changes I made). I was accessing the internet a lot to test what I was doing, and Entourage and Mail were checking email every 10 minutes (with sounds turned on). For quite a while I also had Opera, firefox and internet explorer open and running. I also had very little performance drop (even when I minimised windows and using expose). Man I'm impressed with this thing!
no reason to ditch your system. it runs fine, why throw the whole thing away just to get a negligible performance increase? when i say negligible, i mean under 200%. just ditching computer systems like that isn't very frugal :\. wait until your system is noticeably showing its age, then feel free to shop around and pick out something you like, knowing you are making a good decision regardless of whether you pick mac or pc, because you are getting a huge performance increase either way.
:thumbsup: Only get something different if you current system isn't doing what you want. Why spend extra money if you don't need to?
If you're happy with what you've got then it wouldn't make sense to get rid of that, so a better question is whether it would be worth it to you to also invest in the Mac platform for some reason. Apple apparently has some great video editing tools, but in general it doesn't offer anything you can't do faster and cheaper on PCs with a much wider range of options. As far as hardware is concerned, the new G5s are nice but have a limiting case design for video work and are slower than the best PCs in independent video-related tests. Plus the Apple laptop line is much slower than PC laptops with higher prices and fewer configuration options. As far as software is concerned, Apple is lagging badly on offering any useful support for the HDV format, which is possibly the most significant current development in the world of video editing. By comparison, your current Adobe Premiere setup can be upgraded to one of the best HDV editing solutions available, offering useful real-time editing if you have a reasonably fast single-processor or dual-processor PC.
So no, it would make no sense to switch outright at this time. Personally, I switched from Macs to PCs about the time I got interested in video editing a few years ago, and I haven't seen any compelling reason to buy another Mac since. The best thing I've heard about for Macs is their DVD authoring software, and I don't feel like buying a Mac just to run that.
I've gotta throw my 4 cents in here as to why I won't buy a Mac.
That said, I have used Dual G5 2.0Ghz (loaded with ram and Radeon 9800's) machines here at the college I work for and my experience is mostly good for what I was doing with them. I used Maya 5 and 6, and also Final Cut Pro 3 and 4. However, on the other hand, my PC at home which is just a lowly Athlon XP-M at 2.5Ghz with a Gig of ram seems to handle Maya just as well as the Dual G5 Mac in both rendering and model editing. I gotta give them credit for their display's. Those 23 inch LCD's are beautiful.
- 1. Game support is still very low.
- 2. They are way too overpriced compared to PC's.
- 3. What the heck is with the stupid 1 button mouse? I mean really. (Yes I know you can replace it, but for the kinda money you are going to pay for a mac, personally I expect a high quality two button scroll mouse at least)
- 4. I enjoy upgrading my machine, and again, it is harder to upgrade macs than it is PC's. (Although I think they have shown some improvement in this area with the G5's.)
That said, I have used Dual G5 2.0Ghz (loaded with ram and Radeon 9800's) machines here at the college I work for and my experience is mostly good for what I was doing with them. I used Maya 5 and 6, and also Final Cut Pro 3 and 4. However, on the other hand, my PC at home which is just a lowly Athlon XP-M at 2.5Ghz with a Gig of ram seems to handle Maya just as well as the Dual G5 Mac in both rendering and model editing. I gotta give them credit for their display's. Those 23 inch LCD's are beautiful.
kwshaw1: I disagree with a couple of things you said in your post. Final Cut Pro HD supports High Definition formats (assuming that's what you meant) and don't forget that Avid runs on Macs too and they support HD too. As to their notebooks, I think the iBook G4 is the best value laptop in its price range and they have just as many configuration options as many PC notebooks.
I do agree that the desktops are way too expensive for what they come with, and that the majority of macs are slow as hell (it doesn't help that they cripple their processors with useless FSB, esp on the notebooks). However, I do rather the efficiency of OS X, and the lack of performance drop that I've experienced between running 1 app and 10 memory intensive apps. I do it all the time, and wouldn't dare do it on a current PC running Windows (Linux maybe, but definitely not Windows). I should say that I've tried it, and regretted it. BTW, the mac I use that I do it on all the time only has 256MB RAM and a 1GHz G4 in it. That's my 2 cents worth.
I do agree that the desktops are way too expensive for what they come with, and that the majority of macs are slow as hell (it doesn't help that they cripple their processors with useless FSB, esp on the notebooks). However, I do rather the efficiency of OS X, and the lack of performance drop that I've experienced between running 1 app and 10 memory intensive apps. I do it all the time, and wouldn't dare do it on a current PC running Windows (Linux maybe, but definitely not Windows). I should say that I've tried it, and regretted it. BTW, the mac I use that I do it on all the time only has 256MB RAM and a 1GHz G4 in it. That's my 2 cents worth.
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