Are Macs *THAT* much better for editing over the PC?

[halfadder]

Originally posted by: kwshaw1
Apple's processor design may help make up some of the difference in some situations, but not enough to overcome the full generational gap between Apple laptop processors and PC laptop processors. This doesn't mean you can't do good video editing on Apple laptops, but at least for now you can do certain things better on PC laptops. We'll get a better sense soon just how the two platforms compare for portable HDV editing, and that'll be about as good a test as we can get whether Apple can hold its own in practical terms without a G5 laptop.

One of the main problems is that Apple doesn't make CPUs, they only make their northbridge and southbridge chipsets. IBM and Motorola/Freescale make the CPUs.

The next problem is that PowerPC 7400 "G4" is old. It's crusty. It stinks. I love my PowerBook G4 and I just ordered a Mac Mini, but I really wish it had something better than a G4 in it even though the performance is already good enough for me. Keep in mind that the G4 came out at 350 and 400 MHz. Now Freescale has it up to 1.72 GHz. In the same period of time the G4's FSB has only increased from 100 MHz to 167 MHz SDR. That's the huge problem. Freescale could make a 5 GHz G4 if they wanted to, but until the FSB is increased, it's still going to have a huge bottleneck.

PowerPC 970 "G5" is where it's at. The G5 is based on IBM's big iron Power line of CPUs. Apple has been selling desktop computers with the G5 for 18 months now but because of yield problems with the 90nm version and delays in putting strained silicon into production it's going to be awhile before the G5 is cheap and cool enough to be in all Apple models. The G5 has a lot of power and a monster FSB that runs at half the clockspeed (1.25 GHz FSB on the 2.5 GHz model) and the dual CPU motherboards have an independant FSB for each CPU like the dual Opterons, unlike the shared FSB on a dual or quad Xeon. There are some software issues with the G5, though, it won't be until Mac OS X 10.4 Tiger that Apple has full OS performance for the G5 and application developers have to decide between opimizing their code for G4 or G5 as there are major architectural differences between the two.

If IBM can keep ramping up the G5, we'll see all Macs be competitive once again, not just the dual processor desktops. But it's going to take some time, and IBM had better get the 3 GHz chips to Apple by April or May or Apple is going to fall behind the Opterons for raw Photoshop performance again.

 

[imported_Lucifer]

Originally posted by: kwshaw1

All of your other posts consisted of thinking clock speed was everything.

For what it's worth, it honestly wasn't my intention to imply that clock speed is everything, so if I gave that impression then I wasn't writing my posts clearly. But it is definitely true that clock speed is one important factor in computer performance, and you must surely know that.

This is particularly an issue right now for laptops, which is why I kept mentioning them as one area where PCs have an advantage over Macs for video editing. It's not just because PC laptops have more than twice the clock rate of Apple laptops that they have a performance advantage, but it is a big part of the reason. Apple's processor design may help make up some of the difference in some situations, but not enough to overcome the full generational gap between Apple laptop processors and PC laptop processors. This doesn't mean you can't do good video editing on Apple laptops, but at least for now you can do certain things better on PC laptops. We'll get a better sense soon just how the two platforms compare for portable HDV editing, and that'll be about as good a test as we can get whether Apple can hold its own in practical terms without a G5 laptop.

kwshaw,

Of course I know that clock speed is an important factor. I was just telling you that you were saying, well sounded like, that clock speed was the most important factor. I was just trying to point that out to you so we can clear this up.

 

[imported_Lucifer]

I still like my G4 though. Its ok for 1GHz and a measly 133mhz FSB.

 

[hopejr]

I'm hanging out for a eMac G5, but if there isn't one, I'll settle for a 1.42GHz Mac Mini. Maybe I could play around with iMovie HD on it with my parents 3CCD Camera

My 1GHz G4 with 133MHz FSB is ok, but I'm gonna add more memory coz it starts to chug after more than 10 programs are running at time (still has only the original 256MB in it).

 

[imported_Lucifer]

More memory with your iBook will work very well. I have 640mb of RAM in my emac and it runs very smoothly!

 

[hopejr]

I think it will also cool down too, because it get really hot around the HDD, but nowhere else. If I put more memory in and it stops swapping so much, I think it will be much cooler.

 

[digitalsm]

Ill sum up this whole thread correctly.

For certain things Macs are better, for certain things PCs are better. Overall high end PC workstation are more powerful for most things, but in some cases the PC solutions are thousands of dollars more expensive for the same results you can get on a mac and mac software. But all this is really at the professional level, not the consumer level. At the consumer level there is very little difference between platforms.

Everything I stated is wholly true. But did I really say anything?

 

[Neptune3000]

Originally posted by: digitalsm
Ill sum up this whole thread correctly.

For certain things Macs are better, for certain things PCs are better. Overall high end PC workstation are more powerful for most things, but in some cases the PC solutions are thousands of dollars more expensive for the same results you can get on a mac and mac software. But all this is really at the professional level, not the consumer level. At the consumer level there is very little difference between platforms.

Everything I stated is wholly true. But did I really say anything?

LOL

no you did not

 

[halfadder]

Originally posted by: digitalsm
Ill sum up this whole thread correctly.

For certain things Macs are better, for certain things PCs are better. Overall high end PC workstation are more powerful for most things, but in some cases the PC solutions are thousands of dollars more expensive for the same results you can get on a mac and mac software. But all this is really at the professional level, not the consumer level. At the consumer level there is very little difference between platforms.

Everything I stated is wholly true. But did I really say anything?

There is also the whole issue of personal preference.

 

[Koing]

Of course your 1GHz G4 is fine. My old PIII 650 with 768mb is fine also. Just chuck something 'intensive' at it and it will crawl also. Just like your system BUT it isn't exactly anywhere near cutting edge. But it holds it's own with multi tasking etc though.

Clock speed is NEVER everything. Just look at the A64 kicking the P4 to pieces at lower clock speeds. A64 3000+ only 3fps slower then a P4 3.8GHz in HL2 anyone?!

Still can't believe you said Benchmarks were BS. That is seriously the most ridiculous thing I have heard in a while. Yes you can make one faster by handicaping it etc. BUT I trust AT to be honest and all their reviews are top notch for comparisons. It shows CPU A is faster then CPU B by 10-25% and they cost this much. Intel faster for encoding then AMD but AMD basically win everything else. Both about the same price, AMD a bit cheaper. You take your pic and you will be happy with either system.

If the benchmarks are done by an independent company they are as true as you can get. Countless sites have shown A64 to be faster but I can almost gurantee the A64 system WILL BE MORE NOISY then the G5 system. How much is silence worth? . I have to seriously buy some new quieter fans and a better HSF setup. The constant humming is really taking the p!ss.

The speed differences don't matter 'that' much unless it is a fat 40% + etc but it still has to be a 'big' enough job to make it realistic. 40% faster and only 4seconds faster is nothing imo.

I'd love to get a PB but the dam 1 button mouse is a RIGHT KICKER. SERIOUSLY why?! I so need at least 2 buttons and a scroll. Most pc laptops don't have a scroll but some do. My Sony does and I love it and use it A LOT. Can't believe the newer Sony's don't have it...

The Apple PB laptops are GREAT THOUGH. No PC laptop in the 15" arena that is ONLY 1INCH THICK. They are all bigger in the pc department but the pc subnote books etc are much better then the 12" PB like for like though. Both are kind of pricey but that is because you pay for the nice form factor. 12" PB are too heavy imo though but I'm a picky mofo

I hope Apple get some nice 12", 13" or 14" widescreen laptops. If they don't go that way I would be VERY disappointed with their decision. And OH MAN the dam iPod remote is PANTS. Anyone seen or used a Sony MD stick remote? Best design ever for a remote imo. Great design. Flick up to play. Press the end to stop. Hold up or down to fwd or bwd, flick up or down to select the next track or previous one. Wish my iPod had that . I'd get the Sony but the NW HD3 looks a bit flaky so I'll wait until next gen or the one after it...

Koing

 

[ribbon13]

When we will see dual-core dual-cpu G5 blades?

 

[hopejr]

why was this rotten thread resurrected? I wanted to forget it!

BTW, koing, the new PB's have scrolling on the track pad. If you're so dead against 1 button (lol, I didn't like it much at first )l, just get an external notebook mouse or something (I got a Microsoft Notebook Optical). I happen to have the source code for the scrolling driver, and am planning to mod it so that a right-click can be done by tapping (or clicking the button). I doubt I'll get it done though - classes start again soon.

I didn't mention in this thread, I added the extra 256MB RAM to my iBook G4 (so a total of 512MB) and it runs really smooth - no more chugging.