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Are gays born gay or do they realize it later in life?

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mar·riage (mrj)
n.

The legal union of a man and woman as husband and wife.
Webster's dictionary.



luv2chill I think that whole post is just pathetic. See this is what I mean just because you think its "okay" doesn't make it okay. And to even insinuate that minoritys and gays are the same in any way is a joke. There ain't nothing unnatural about being a different color or having a different look. But it is very "unnatural" to see Timmy running around looking and acting like Tina, begging Tom for some love! Please, its wrong.
 


<< See this is what I mean just because you think its &quot;okay&quot; doesn't make it okay >>



And you thinking that it's wrong makes it wrong?
 
BTW - many Greeks only had heterosexual sex for procreation purposes. Any other sexual relations were homosexual.

Think it's a new thing? Think again.
 


<< If homosexuality were genetic, wouldn?t there be fewer homosexuals every generation. Since they can?t reproduce naturally how would the genes get passed on? >>




that basically is what it boils down to. gays are not born gay. if they were, they would have been weeded out of the gene pool.

however, the number of gays isn't declining, therefore it means that more people decide to be gay.
 


<< The same way you know you were born straight >>



you know you are born straight because about 12 years old you start checking out the teachers hooter's and notice a weird bulge in your pants
 
luv2chill explained it at least once perfectly. If you're currently heterosexual, in your wildest dreams can you imagine &quot;choosing&quot; to be homosexual? No? Then how can you think anyone else could &quot;choose&quot; to be gay?

I'll agree it's abnormal. But then, being left handed is abnormal too!

Craze and ATLien247 did bring up an awesome point about pedophilia etc. I'm sure those people are also born with that tendency, and didn't &quot;choose&quot; to be that way. And that too is abnormal. It's wrong because of the dealing with minors issue, but even heterosexuals cross that line as you well know.

Bottom line is, they're born that way. Anybody that disagrees hasn't given it enough thought. Think about it!
 
Ornery - but if you think about it, if it was a genetic thing, then it would be weeded out of the gene pool, because last time I checked, a dude screwing another dude's hairy butt doesn't produce offspring
 
Valhalla1, your argument is ONLY true if there was some sort of &quot;gay&quot; gene that was ONLY passed down from one parent or another.

Also, there are many gay men that have children. I happen to know at least 3 gay men that have multiple children.

I don't think that there is a person in this thread that denies that is a choice to PERSUE a homosexual relationship. But - there are several of us who believe that there is no *choice* involved in ones sexual PREFERENCE. Simply put, you are born with a predisposition to like a certain race/gender/part of anatomy. That is something that you CAN NOT change. You are born with those preferences. Whether or not someone chooses to persue those desires is a totally different topic.

Some people's favorite color is blue, others is red. Some people will be obese no matter how hard they try. Others will always be slim. A lot of men like blondes. Many also like red heads. Many people are attracted to the opposite sex, others are attracted to the same or sometimes either sex. These are all things that you cannot explain or change. You are simply born that way.
 


<< << If homosexuality were genetic, wouldn?t there be fewer homosexuals every generation. Since they can?t reproduce naturally how would the genes get passed on? >>

that basically is what it boils down to. gays are not born gay. if they were, they would have been weeded out of the gene pool.

however, the number of gays isn't declining, therefore it means that more people decide to be gay. >>

Not necessarily. The evolution argument is certainly an interesting one, but you can NOT conclude that being homosexual is a choice using that logic alone.

I'm not an expert, but it seems the only thing that could dissprove is the existence of a 'gay' gene. That's ok, because a 'gay gene' doesn't have to exist to support the argument that homosexuals are born that way. Suppose being gay was determined by a certain balance of both hormonal and genetic characteristics (i.e., homosexuality depends on several genetic factors and varies in magnitude -- meaning some are 'more gay' than others). If this were the case, evolution couldn't weed out the homosexual population due to the complexity of the factors that determine it.

Edit: I notice vi_edit made a similar response now
 
Valhalla1, assuming that there even IS a &quot;gay gene&quot;, there's a little thing called dominant and recessive traits. Just cause you don't have blond hair doesn't necessarily mean your kids wont.

And enough about nature!!! It's ludicrous to assume homosexuality is wrong not because of moral reasons, but because it's just not natural. Why should you care if it fits your definition of natural or not? Will the balance of nature and therefore life itself crumble before our very eyes because two guys or two girls are having sex? How does this unnatural act affect you in any way and why does it bother you so?
 
you guys are saying that being born gay means that genetics had to be involved. Like being born gay was like being born with green eyes or blue. What we're trying to state is that being born gay is more like being born blind or deaf, it doesn't have to have anything to do with the parents, it's in how the brain develops during the fetal stage.

Now some of you say stuff like you can be born with a predisposition to being gay, but have to choose to pursue those urges. If you were born loving chocolate flavor, but hating strawberry, why the hell would you eat strawberry flavor when what you really want is chocolate. If strawberry is disgusting to you, but chocolate makes you happy, eat chocolate. I hope you guys weren't too stupid to get that analogy.
 
I don't think homosexuality is wrong. It's weird, but people can do whatever the hell the want, I don't care. Now, when people try to spread the idea that being gay is a perfectly natural alternative to being straight I'm going to argue against that because it defies reason.
 
EngineNr9, religion defines any logical form of reason, but about a billion people pursue it.

thraashman, we can try to make analogies (I sure did), but it really isn't that simple. People aren't killed for likeing one particular type of ice cream. People aren't denied jobs because of one's preference of a particular flavor of ice cream. People aren't denied health insurance coverage because of liking a certain flavor of ice cream.



 
Frankly I don't know and it really dosen't matter to me.

I would like to think that it's more environmental than genetic Perhaps there is a genetic predisposition to develop the preference. On other words some are more likely to develop the preference, given certain circumstances.
 
I see the points on both sides. Evolution does argue against a gay gene. However, saying the your thoughts and feelings are pre-determined solely by your genes would be far-fetched. Just because it's not in your genes doesn't mean that a person can't be born with it. Some of you would agree that human beings are born with a soul. But is the soul encoded by your genes? If not, then could it influence your feelings and emotions?

One more thing, errors can occur in embryo development. An embryo's development of male and female organs doesn't start until certain hormonal signals kicks in. It is well documented that these signals can in some cases be missing leading a male embryo to differentiate into a female.


Genetics is a lot more complicated than originally thought. In a recent review of Gregor Mendle's notebooks, there's evidence that he fudged the numbers to look better than it really was.

 
Even the evolution argument is bogus in practice. There's no telling how many gay people, out of confusion or repression by society, instead pursue a heterosexual relationship and have children.

That said, I don't think it's necessarily genetic. If it were, you would definitely be able to see a detectable pattern when looking at family lineage. I am merely trying to refute the evolution argument as evidence that it's a choice and not involuntary. Could there be a genetic element? Of course. But the lack of any conclusive evidence in any one direction points to the probability that it is probably a combination of subtle factors that determine sexual orientation.

Many people seem to be justifying the &quot;choice&quot; side by drawing unnecessary distinctions between gay feelings and acting on those gay feelings, as if there's a difference. Setting aside morality issues, it's completely illogical to go against one's sexual feelings. Like I've said repeatedly, it would be like you going against your straight instincts to have same-sex relations. It doesn't make any more sense for you than it does for them. Of course it's their choice to go along with their feelings, but why shouldn't they? They aren't hurting anyone and they are allowed to get their jollies like the rest of the world.

I think it will be a long time before any sort of consensus is reached, but despite your personal views on it, you should respect other people and acknowledge that you don't walk in their shoes. It's the first step to making the world a better place for all of us.

l2c
 
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