Anyone else think ATOT is much improved since about 2 weeks ago?

[ProfJohn]

I am not trying to pick a fight with you mods.

99% of the time you guys do the right thing.

I am just pointing out the fact that you guys are asked to police yourselves and that is nearly impossible for anyone to do no matter how hard they try.

Then on top of that difficulty we have the fact that you guys have been doing this for a long time and have worked side by side for years. Which makes you even less inclined to call one of your fellow mods to table when they behave poorly.

Read up on the 'blue code of silence' and you will exactly what I mean.
http://www.informaworld.com/sm...ent~content=a713729144

This article analyzes evidence from a survey of police officers who were asked about their attitudes towards police corruption, unethical behaviour and minor infringements of police rules. It reveals that most of the officers who took part in the study regard certain actions, such as those involving the acquisition of goods or money, as much worse than behaviour involving illegal brutality or bending of the rules in order to protect colleagues from criminal proceedings. It also reveals that officers who responded to the survey are relatively unwilling to report unethical behaviour by colleagues unless there is some sort of acquisitive motive or outcome predicted.

http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=869
A VERY good article about breaking the code.
One of the keys to breaking the wall is get officers to have loyalty to principles instead of to each other.

 

[DivideBYZero]

dp

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: esquared

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: esquared
Yep, mods ( at least the seniors) all have clean records.

They do, but they don't? :laugh:

I haven't had cause to look at the category mods so there possibly might be a minor offense or two. A spotless record wasn't mandatory when category mods were elected.

Senior mods were all elite first and AFAIK a spotless record would also be a requirement.


edit:
I really don't think you want your record shown. It really is documented very well, regardless of what you just said

None of my events will be for the same thing, they never are, because you make it up as you go along.

None of what is written are for rules made up "as we go along" Many are for the same offenses. I will say that.

As I said, I have no secrets. Put it out there. Let the public decide. If people think I'm an ass based upon it's contents, so be it, I'm a little beyond caring if someone tuts at their screen with regard to me.

Please post it, for me and for everyone else.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
I am not trying to pick a fight with you mods.

99% of the time you guys do the right thing.

I am just pointing out the fact that you guys are asked to police yourselves and that is nearly impossible for anyone to do no matter how hard they try.

Then on top of that difficulty we have the fact that you guys have been doing this for a long time and have worked side by side for years. Which makes you even less inclined to call one of your fellow mods to table when they behave poorly.

Read up on the 'blue code of silence' and you will exactly what I mean.
http://www.informaworld.com/sm...ent~content=a713729144

This article analyzes evidence from a survey of police officers who were asked about their attitudes towards police corruption, unethical behavior and minor infringements of police rules. It reveals that most of the officers who took part in the study regard certain actions, such as those involving the acquisition of goods or money, as much worse than behavior involving illegal brutality or bending of the rules in order to protect colleagues from criminal proceedings. It also reveals that officers who responded to the survey are relatively unwilling to report unethical behavior by colleagues unless there is some sort of acquisitive motive or outcome predicted.

http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=869
A VERY good article about breaking the code.
One of the keys to breaking the wall is get officers to have loyalty to principles instead of to each other.

When a Moderator wanders into a grey area, other Moderators have and do advise him of such.
This is the same when a members gets a polite warning from a Moderator that they are crossing the line and to think before posting.

Regretfully, some members ignore the Moderator warnings.
Here, if a Moderator crosses the line, they do not get a second chance. As you know, some Moderators (Senior and elected) have been expelled for conduct unbecoming.

While some Moderators may not like being advised to tread lightly, we also are mature enough to realize that we need to listen to our fellow Moderators for input and advice that is not emotionally clouded.

And we do have a civilian IAD. Derek and Anand.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy
...

And we do have a civilian IAD. Derek and Anand.

Anand has asked me to take over for Derek.
As my first act, I plan to ban all whiners. The internet is big enough to find another place for their school girl acts.

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: esquared

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: esquared
Yep, mods ( at least the seniors) all have clean records.

They do, but they don't? :laugh:

I haven't had cause to look at the category mods so there possibly might be a minor offense or two. A spotless record wasn't mandatory when category mods were elected.

Senior mods were all elite first and AFAIK a spotless record would also be a requirement.


edit:
I really don't think you want your record shown. It really is documented very well, regardless of what you just said

None of my events will be for the same thing, they never are, because you make it up as you go along.

None of what is written are for rules made up "as we go along" Many are for the same offenses. I will say that.

As I said, I have no secrets. Put it out there. Let the public decide. If people think I'm an ass based upon it's contents, so be it, I'm a little beyond caring if someone tuts at their screen with regard to me.

Please post it, for me and for everyone else.

FYI, many successful large forums including The Something Awful Forums do exactly this. Perhaps implement this feature as part of the move to vBulletin?

 

[Steve]

Oldsy, you quit the modship, why do you care?


I for one would also like to see DBZ's record.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Steve
Oldsy, you quit the modship, why do you care?


I for one would also like to see DBZ's record.

I like to bitch about things.

 

[Steve]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Steve
Oldsy, you quit the modship, why do you care?


I for one would also like to see DBZ's record.

I like to bitch about things.

You may NOT nef in this thread now that it is in PFI. Doing so again may leave you open to sanction.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: Steve
Oldsy, you quit the modship, why do you care?


I for one would also like to see DBZ's record.

Track records are of the User's history.

They are not your history.

If you desire to rebuild the actual infractions, you can search through all of his posts and come up with the same vacation scenario that we have. They are well documented in the offending post/thread

 

[Steve]

So in other words, he could ask for a copy of all his notes via PM, and then post it here?

 

[esquared]

Originally posted by: Steve
So in other words, he could ask for a copy of all his notes via PM, and then post it here?

Nope. PMs are privileged communication, unless both parties agree that it would be OK to be made public. Mods would not agree, so they couldn't be posted for the membership to see.

The notes, if a member did receive them would be for his eyes only.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: esquared

Originally posted by: Steve
So in other words, he could ask for a copy of all his notes via PM, and then post it here?

Nope. PMs are privileged communication, unless both parties agree that it would be OK to be made public. Mods would not agree, so they couldn't be posted for the membership to see.

The notes, if a member did receive them would be for his eyes only.

lulwat? If I receive a message and I deem it postable I'll do it. There are no rules on here regarding that. Nice try though. Jeez...

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: esquared

Originally posted by: Steve
So in other words, he could ask for a copy of all his notes via PM, and then post it here?

Nope. PMs are privileged communication, unless both parties agree that it would be OK to be made public. Mods would not agree, so they couldn't be posted for the membership to see.

The notes, if a member did receive them would be for his eyes only.

lulwat? If I receive a message and I deem it postable I'll do it. There are no rules on here regarding that. Nice try though. Jeez...

And you then wonder why you do not get a copy of your history record!

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: esquared

Originally posted by: Steve
So in other words, he could ask for a copy of all his notes via PM, and then post it here?

Nope. PMs are privileged communication, unless both parties agree that it would be OK to be made public. Mods would not agree, so they couldn't be posted for the membership to see.

The notes, if a member did receive them would be for his eyes only.

lulwat? If I receive a message and I deem it postable I'll do it. There are no rules on here regarding that. Nice try though. Jeez...

And you then wonder why you do not get a copy of your history record!

What are you on about? I asked for it straight up, no messing. Now you and eSquared are making up new rules to keep it under wraps, right after stating a user can have it.

Can you not see why members just roll their eyes at this behavior?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy

Originally posted by: Pulsar
I never even asked to see my notes / record. Are we allowed to?
Yes, one can ask - it is up to the Moderator(s) to decide if they should be released to you
Does it reset over time? No. However, the length of time from an infraction does have bearing when being evaluated
Am I being lazy and this is all answered the FAQ? No

Yours will NOT be released because you do not understand the privacy of Private Messages.

As also stated above; one can dig through previous threads to find out why/when/how long they have been vacationed - in other words, build up their own history for reference. That information is public for anyone to review.

Common Courtesy

 

[esquared]

You really need to read the guidelines and the TOS before you spout stuff.

I do not make up rules as I go. :roll:

What are you on about? I asked for it straight up, no messing. Now you and eSquared are making up new rules to keep it under wraps, right after stating a user can have it.

Can you not see why members just roll their eyes at this behavior?

Right from the guidelines:


9) Respect other users' privacy and do not post personal or private information of any other user without their express permission. Also, please be respectful of what other members share via Private Message.


This means if both parties don't agree, you don't post PMs. Now, extrapolate that to the mod PMs. We wouldn't give you permission to post them.

In the first place, not all, if any mods, would even give you a copy of your notes. If one of us did do that, it would be a courtesy to you, that's all.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Anyone have a salt shaker for DBZ?:roll:

Also, take away his shovel.

 

[Dualist]

ATOT to me has been just the same, I've noticed in the past some new members starting to have doubts on whether ATOT or the forums as a whole, are a forum-friendly/trusted place to hang out.

The mods can't monitor every incoming message that's posted on the forums everyday, but do the best they can to remove unwanted forum content to make things comfortable for everyone.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: esquared
You really need to read the guidelines and the TOS before you spout stuff.

I do not make up rules as I go. :roll:

What are you on about? I asked for it straight up, no messing. Now you and eSquared are making up new rules to keep it under wraps, right after stating a user can have it.

Can you not see why members just roll their eyes at this behavior?

Right from the guidelines:


9) Respect other users' privacy and do not post personal or private information of any other user without their express permission. Also, please be respectful of what other members share via Private Message.


This means if both parties don't agree, you don't post PMs. Now, extrapolate that to the mod PMs. We wouldn't give you permission to post them.

In the first place, not all, if any mods, would even give you a copy of your notes. If one of us did do that, it would be a courtesy to you, that's all.

Heh, yeah, I totally don't read 'respectful' as 'don't post'. The information is about me, not the mod sending me the information. If the mod sent me his home phone number, address of pics of his wife you can be sure that is not going to go any further, but info on me, that's not even close to anything to do with said Mod. It MY information.

Again, nice try. Not buying.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
...

Heh, yeah, I totally don't read 'respectful' as 'don't post'. The information is about me, not the mod sending me the information. If the mod sent me his home phone number, address of pics of his wife you can be sure that is not going to go any further, but info on me, that's not even close to anything to do with said Mod. It MY information.

Again, nice try. Not buying.

And as such, we are not offering.

Your information is public record if you or others wish to dig for it.

 

[esquared]

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero

Originally posted by: esquared
You really need to read the guidelines and the TOS before you spout stuff.

I do not make up rules as I go. :roll:

What are you on about? I asked for it straight up, no messing. Now you and eSquared are making up new rules to keep it under wraps, right after stating a user can have it.

Can you not see why members just roll their eyes at this behavior?

Right from the guidelines:


9) Respect other users' privacy and do not post personal or private information of any other user without their express permission. Also, please be respectful of what other members share via Private Message.


This means if both parties don't agree, you don't post PMs. Now, extrapolate that to the mod PMs. We wouldn't give you permission to post them.

In the first place, not all, if any mods, would even give you a copy of your notes. If one of us did do that, it would be a courtesy to you, that's all.

Heh, yeah, I totally don't read 'respectful' as 'don't post'. The information is about me, not the mod sending me the information. If the mod sent me his home phone number, address of pics of his wife you can be sure that is not going to go any further, but info on me, that's not even close to anything to do with said Mod. It MY information.

Again, nice try. Not buying.

I am explaining the rules, doesn't matter that you don't buy it. That's what the rule means.

See, that's why you wouldn't never get the info.

BTW, It's not your information. It's our information on you. We created it, it's ours. As I said if some mod let you see it, it would be a courtesy on our part to you.

 

[DivideBYZero]

You're modifying your interpretation to fit the situation, but whatever you need. If it's too embarrassing for you to post my record, I'll just stop asking you to make it public, but it really says volumes about the whole process.

 

[esquared]

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
You're modifying your interpretation to fit the situation, but whatever you need. If it's too embarrassing for you to post my record, I'll just stop asking you to make it public, but it really says volumes about the whole process.

It's not embarrassing to us. Why would that be? It's your record. Again, there is no process for this. I have already said that some mods might give it to you if you asked. We do not have an SOP for releasing notes. It's generally just not done.

I are not going to set a precedent by doing what you want to end doing. Which is posting it for others to see. If you can't see how this would turn into even more of a circus than this already has, I am not going to bother to explain.

 

[SickBeast]

IMO it's only fair that we can see our "mod notes". What I find strange is that many people here seem to only have notes in their file only since about 4 years ago, and over the past year things have gotten out of hand with way too much discipline being handed down.

I will say that the mods here are pretty good overall. I think that by seeing the notes, we could maybe get rid of the mods that are handing down discipline in an unfair way, or handing out too much punishment. :light:

 

[MotF Bane]

Originally posted by: SickBeast
IMO it's only fair that we can see our "mod notes". What I find strange is that many people here seem to only have notes in their file only since about 4 years ago, and over the past year things have gotten out of hand with way too much discipline being handed down.

I will say that the mods here are pretty good overall. I think that by seeing the notes, we could maybe get rid of the mods that are handing down discipline in an unfair way, or handing out too much punishment. :light:

The only people who can get rid of mods are Derek or probably themselves, and they can already see the notes.