Anti-Gun nutters arrest student for NRA tee shirt

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Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
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If anyone can find the specific dress code of that school it would be awesome.
Ask, and ye shall receive. Bet you wish you'd asked for winning Powerball numbers instead, huh? Or a pony.

Here are the only two points that seem potentially relevant:

  • Clothing and accessories that display profanity, violence, discriminatory messages or sexually suggestive phrases are not to be worn at school or school functions.
  • Clothing that displays advertisements for any alcohol, tobacco, or drug product is not to be worn at school or school functions.

Neither would seem to apply, so it certainly seems the teacher was not acting consistently with school policy. As I mentioned before, that doesn't automatically mean the kid is off the hook. His behavior was also an issue, reportedly.


Speaking of which, here is the most current and complete article I could find tonight: ABC link. Here are a couple of highlights.

As expected, the school says it cannot comment, but:
When contacted by ABCNews.com about the incident, Logan County Schools Superintendent Wilma Zigmond said that she was not at liberty to discuss students with the media, but indicated that more than the shirt led to the arrest.

"I don't think I've ever known of a student being suspended for a shirt," Zigmond said.
The Logan City police chief's take on it:
Logan City Police Chief E.K. Harper told ABCNews.com that Marcum was not arrested for wearing a t-shirt, but for "disrupting the school process."

"His conduct in school almost incited a riot," Harper said.

Marcum was not put in jail, Harper said, and was released to his mother after less than 30 minutes at the police station -- normal procedure for a juvenile arrest.


The family's lawyer, Ben White, offers a different view:
White said that charges being filed against Marcum are pending the prosecutor's office's review of the evidence. But he insisted that it was the teacher who caused the issue by confronting the teen, and that video gathered from the school will prove it.

"I believe the teacher was acting beyond the scope of his employment," he said. "What the video shows is that students did step up on the benches to the tables in the lunchroom when they were escorting Jared out of building. Kids jumped up, clapping. Teachers said to get off and be quiet, and they did."
[ ...]
"There's no evidence that Jared almost caused a riot," he said. "They won't be able to produce any evidence to that fact.
So, time will tell.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,268
126
Thanks! Should have thought of the pony :D

Seems someone messed up. We'll have to see who and how. Interesting responses in this thread. No wonder people are so far apart on this type of issue.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
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Government schools aren't in the business of teaching anything but how to be a good little tax cow who doesn't question anything and is easily controlled.

Then by all means, please educate your kids yourself or pay for private school. My kids don't go to public school and it has NOTHING to do with the teachers. It has everything to do with the behavior of public school students and their parents.

For example, see the video below. My wife always walks away when confronted like this and gets security. This is a COMMON occurrence in MPS. This kid is obviously not a "sheeple". How much learning is occurring in a classroom like this. Without respect for authority, you have anarchy. What parent who cares about their children would put them into a situation like this? What responsible adult would encourage their own children to do this? School is not for personal political statements indoctrinated into by your parents, it is to learn reading, writing, etc... and allowing others to do so as well. It is not a difficult concept to grasp. Apparently more and more parents are failing to grasp it and our public schools have turned into zoos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBg7imfkiKg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6Y-GUgGnjg
 
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umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,816
1,126
126
Ask, and ye shall receive. Bet you wish you'd asked for winning Powerball numbers instead, huh? Or a pony.

Here are the only two points that seem potentially relevant:

  • Clothing and accessories that display profanity, violence, discriminatory messages or sexually suggestive phrases are not to be worn at school or school functions.
  • Clothing that displays advertisements for any alcohol, tobacco, or drug product is not to be worn at school or school functions.

Neither would seem to apply, so it certainly seems the teacher was not acting consistently with school policy.

Bow I would think a t-shirt with a gun on it would easily fall under the "violence" code... That's open for interpretation though...
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,242
14,245
136
I've always supported freedom of political speech in these forums, at schools and in any public setting including the political speech of #Occupy so i'd have no problem with it.

Fair enough. That makes us both consistent. If I were an admin of a middle school, I wouldn't allow the NRA shirt, the #occupy, or the Jihadi shirt. Students are there to learn. Political sloganeering is a distraction. Maybe in high school, but not at that stage of education.
 

Juror No. 8

Banned
Sep 25, 2012
1,108
0
0
Then by all means, please educate your kids yourself or pay for private school.

In other words, you want me to pay for both private and public schooling. I can't stop the government from stealing from me to pay for government schools, so I'm forced to pay for both.

My kids don't go to public school and it has NOTHING to do with the teachers. It has everything to do with the behavior of public school students and their parents.

Nonsense. It has everything to do with the teachers, as well as the compulsory nature of it, the prison-like setting, the arbitrary rules, the conformity, bullying, peer pressure, and the dumbed-down curriculum that teaches to the lowest common denominator.

For example, see the video below. My wife always walks away when confronted like this and gets security. This is a COMMON occurrence in MPS. This kid is obviously not a "sheeple".

What do you expect? When you cage people like animals and try to indoctrinate them with garbage, a few are going to snap and lash out at the world.

I'd be surprised if this didn't happen from time to time.

How much learning is occurring in a classroom like this. Without respect for authority, you have anarchy.

The authority of government teachers in a government indoctrination center isn't legitimate. The children are forced to be there, and most parents can't afford to take them out and put them in a real school since they would then be paying for two educations.

I think it's fantastic that there are a few children in public schools who understand what a scam it is and try to disrupt it as much as possible.

What parent who cares about their children would put them into a situation like this? What responsible adult would encourage their own children to do this? School is not for personal political statements indoctrinated into by your parents, it is to learn reading, writing, etc... and allowing others to do so as well.

Sorry, but you've been misled. Public schools are NOT primarily for learning reading, writing, and arithmetic. Any teaching they do of those subjects is incidental to their primary goal, which is to teach compliance and conformity. The last thing the powers that be want is an educated, critically thinking population.

Read this piece from former school teacher John Taylor Gatto for more details:

http://www.worldtrans.org/whole/schoolteacher.txt

It is not a difficult concept to grasp. Apparently more and more parents are failing to grasp it and our public schools have turned into zoos.

Of course they are zoos. Many of the children in public schools don't want to be there, aren't learning anything, and subconsciously realize that public schools represent an intellectual prison designed to trap their minds in mediocrity. They are a form of torture, and just as any animal would react poorly to be being mistreated and abused, children lash out and rebel against their teachers.

Really, this shouldn't be a surprise.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
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I think it's fantastic that there are a few children in public schools who understand what a scam it is and try to disrupt it as much as possible.

And that is the difference between you and I. These disruptive children end up on welfare for the rest of their lives or in the penal system at extraordinary cost to the taxpayer. They live miserable lives filled with hopelessness. What employer in their right mind would hire an employee who refuses to take instruction and insists on being disruptive?

Gawd, if you think those school rules are bad, try working for a corporation once. Mine makes me wear dress slacks and shirts everyday...... OH THE HORROR! Hell, I can't call girls bimbos, make racist jokes or call my boss an asshole to his face. My "rights" get trampled on everyday at the office.... but you know what? I still love my job and like my boss, imagine that.

If the big bad government is out to get me, so what? I can't do anything about it, I do my best for my family and my kids and don't ruin my life obsessing about things over which I have no control. IMHO, the people who "win" in life are the ones who are happy, have people to love and find something they love to do that puts food on the table. America is not a bad place to live and work, in many ways it is better place to live than alot of other places on the planet. I like to bitch and moan about our horrible government as much as the next guy. At the end of the day however, I would prefer our government to a majority that are out there. We certainly could have it much much worse. Sorry for the off-topic rant, couldn't help myself.

Fair enough. That makes us both consistent. If I were an admin of a middle school, I wouldn't allow the NRA shirt, the #occupy, or the Jihadi shirt. Students are there to learn. Political sloganeering is a distraction

Yep!
 
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Juror No. 8

Banned
Sep 25, 2012
1,108
0
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And that is the difference between you and I. These disruptive children end up on welfare for the rest of their lives or in the penal system at extraordinary cost to the taxpayer. They live miserable lives filled with hopelessness. What employer in their right mind would hire an employee who refuses to take instruction and insists on being disruptive?

Some of those disruptive children also blaze new trails and invent useful products, start successful companies, and create influential art. Some of them will even make more money in a year than you'll ever see in a lifetime and will have even Ivy League grads begging them for a job.

What's your point?

Gawd, if you think those school rules are bad, try working for a corporation once. Mine makes me wear dress slacks and shirts everyday...... OH THE HORROR! Hell, I can't call girls bimbos, make racist jokes or call my boss an asshole to his face. My "rights" get trampled on everyday at the office.... but you know what? I still love my job and like my boss, imagine that.

You're missing one important distinction. You choose to work for your employer, while kids in government indoctrination centers have little to no choice.

If the big bad government is out to get me, so what? I can't do anything about it, I do my best for my family and my kids and don't ruin my life obsessing over thing over which I have no control.

In other words, you've found a way to content yourself with being a tax cow for the government and ruling class. Your life is already ruined, and you'll never meet your greatest possible human potential, but you're happy anyway. Congratulations.

Some people can't live like that and be truly happy with it.

IMHO, the people who "win" in life are the ones who are happy, have people to love and find something they love to do that puts food on the table. America is not a bad place to live and work, in many ways it is better place to live than alot of other places on the planet. I like to bitch and moan about our horrible government as much as the next guy. At the end of the day however, I would prefer our government to a majority that are out there. We certainly could have it much much worse. Sorry for the off-topic rant, couldn't help myself.

This isn't saying much. People who serve long prison sentences can condition themselves to be happy, find people to "love", and have food on the table three times per day.

I wouldn't call them "winners", though.
 

UberNeuman

Lifer
Nov 4, 1999
16,937
3,087
126
Some of those disruptive children also blaze new trails and invent useful products, start successful companies, and create influential art. Some of them will even make more money in a year than you'll ever see in a lifetime and will have even Ivy League grads begging them for a job.

What's your point?



You're missing one important distinction. You choose to work for your employer, while kids in government indoctrination centers have little to no choice.



In other words, you've found a way to content yourself with being a tax cow for the government and ruling class. Your life is already ruined, and you'll never meet your greatest possible human potential, but you're happy anyway. Congratulations.

Some people can't live like that and be truly happy with it.



This isn't saying much. People who serve long prison sentences can condition themselves to be happy, find people to "love", and have food on the table three times per day.

I wouldn't call them "winners", though.

bshole. Why did you bother?
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
Bow I would think a t-shirt with a gun on it would easily fall under the "violence" code... That's open for interpretation though...
I would find that quite a stretch personally; it's just a picture of a gun, not being fired, no threatening text, no big deal. But, I recognize that teacher may have seen it differently. Still too much missing information so far. I am interested in seeing where this goes.

The one thing we do know is the OP is a lie. The kid was not arrested for his T-shirt.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
It precipitated the entire event, so it was what caused his eventual arrest.
Which has nothing to do with the OP's false claim that he was arrested "for NRA tee shirt", but thanks for deflecting. The OP is simply a lie. Funny how you have so much trouble accurately identifying "lies". You seem to think the word means "anything Monovillage dislikes".
 

Juror No. 8

Banned
Sep 25, 2012
1,108
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The OP is simply a lie.

Not really. The cause of the whole incident was the child's wearing of an NRA tee shirt, which he had every right to do. The teacher and police tried to violate his rights, to which he objected, so they arrested him.

This isn't rocket science, sweetie.
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,816
1,126
126
I would really like to see the shirt to see what all the fuss is about... kind of makes me long for my brief stint at Divine Child where we wore uniforms and the nuns were the ones perpetrating all the violence! There was never any BS about t-shirts because there weren't any. Maybe the public schools should reinvent themselves...
 

Abraxas

Golden Member
Oct 26, 2004
1,056
0
0
Not really. The cause of the whole incident was the child's wearing of an NRA tee shirt, which he had every right to do. The teacher and police tried to violate his rights, to which he objected, so they arrested him.

This isn't rocket science, sweetie.

Seems like it may as well be for you. If you get pulled over for speeding, get out of your car, and punch the officer in the face, you aren't going to prison for the speeding. Likewise, if you wear a shirt of questionable permissibility and get called on it by a teacher, pick a fight with the teacher, get sent to the principle's office and act like such a belligerent jackhole that they feel it is necessary to call the police, and then proceed to act like such a belligerent jackhole that they feel it appropriate to not only arrest you for inciting riot but actually file charges, it isn't the shirt you were arrested for. This is pretty basic, low level mental activity that even most small children should understand so it comes as absolutely no surprise the professionally outraged can't grasp it.
 

Juror No. 8

Banned
Sep 25, 2012
1,108
0
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Seems like it may as well be for you. If you get pulled over for speeding, get out of your car, and punch the officer in the face, you aren't going to prison for the speeding. Likewise, if you wear a shirt of questionable permissibility and get called on it by a teacher, pick a fight with the teacher, get sent to the principle's office and act like such a belligerent jackhole that they feel it is necessary to call the police, and then proceed to act like such a belligerent jackhole that they feel it appropriate to not only arrest you for inciting riot but actually file charges, it isn't the shirt you were arrested for. This is pretty basic, low level mental activity that even most small children should understand so it comes as absolutely no surprise the professionally outraged can't grasp it.

LOL, "pick a fight with the teacher". Such ludicrous, backward thinking.

You'd probably call it "picking a fight with a rapist" if a woman being raped tried to fight her attacker off.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
I would really like to see the shirt to see what all the fuss is about... kind of makes me long for my brief stint at Divine Child where we wore uniforms and the nuns were the ones perpetrating all the violence! There was never any BS about t-shirts because there weren't any. Maybe the public schools should reinvent themselves...
I'm assuming the shirt pictured in the ABC link in post #151 is the shirt. Several other articles used photos of that same design.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
39,916
33,571
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Not really. The cause of the whole incident was the child's wearing of an NRA tee shirt, which he had every right to do. The teacher and police tried to violate his rights, to which he objected, so they arrested him.

This isn't rocket science, sweetie.

Last time I checked by law classrooms for 8th graders are not democracies.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
39,916
33,571
136
Actually they are. That's why its legal to have dress codes, arbitraily search student lockers for drugs, etc
 

Juror No. 8

Banned
Sep 25, 2012
1,108
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Actually they are. That's why its legal to have dress codes, arbitraily search student lockers for drugs, etc

Really? So classrooms are authoritarian dictatorships where teachers and police goons can do anything they want to the students, including the violation of their individual rights?
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
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Here is an interesting read regarding supreme court decisions that affect students rights while in school.

http://www.uscourts.gov/Educational...s/LandmarkSupremeCourtCasesAboutStudents.aspx

Regarding speech, there was this decision....
Bethel School District #43 v. Fraser (1987)
Students do not have a First Amendment right to make obscene speeches in school.
Matthew N. Fraser, a student at Bethel High School, was suspended for three days for delivering an obscene and provocative speech to the student body. In this speech, he nominated his fellow classmate for an elected school office. The Supreme Court held that his free speech rights were not violated.
 

xj0hnx

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2007
9,262
3
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Any teaching they do of those subjects is incidental to their primary goal, which is to teach compliance and conformity.

Something you people that drone on about "compliance and conformity" don't quite seem to grasp is that it is needed to be able to teach children from such a wide section of society. It's the same thing in the military, it isn't conformity and compliance for the sake of them, or to train the children to be good little subjects, it's to even the playing field across a wide cut of society.