Another terrible progressive idea: government subsidized day care loans

[glenn1]

Don't worry friends, your visionary progressive liberal friends are here to help. Just sign here, and here, and here, and you'll be all set paying for those pesky childcare bills.

Wonder how many more gullible people that progressives will destroy in the name of compassion - welfare has already ruined entire generations, student loan debt is corroding peoples' futures, and now they want to further convert them all into wage slaves.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2013/08/05/government_subsidized_day_care_loans.html

 

[sportage]

WTF?
Progressive? Me thinkest not.
Its the natural ebb and flow.
Lets just call it Newton's third law of motion.
When certain people of a certain political party insists with outlawing abortion, AND terminating assistance like food stamps, AND cutting welfare to the bone, AND killing off every union job leaving only McDonalds and Wal-Mart as your employment opportunities, Well... someone has to watch those kids while mommy dearest and daddy dearest are sitting in the drive thru window asking, "do you want fries with that?"
Think of it this way, if you chop down a tree its going to fall to the ground.
Very few trees remain standing after chopped and hacked away.
Damn... too bad certain members of a certain political party missed the class on logical reasoning 101.
I think this is also known as opening the can of worms...

 

[StrangerGuy]

Just what the world needs even more, encouraging more children born into parents that is financially unable to support them. Well done.

 

[nehalem256]

WTF?
Progressive? Me thinkest not.
Its the natural ebb and flow.
Lets just call it Newton's third law of motion.
When certain people of a certain political party insists with outlawing abortion, AND terminating assistance like food stamps, AND cutting welfare to the bone, AND killing off every union job leaving only McDonalds and Wal-Mart as your employment opportunities, Well... someone has to watch those kids while mommy dearest and daddy dearest are sitting in the drive thru window asking, "do you want fries with that?"
Think of it this way, if you chop down a tree its going to fall to the ground.
Very few trees remain standing after chopped and hacked away.
Damn... too bad certain members of a certain political party missed the class on logical reasoning 101.
I think this is also known as opening the can of worms...

Applicants must have an annual income of $80,000 to $200,000, a credit score of at least 620 and agree to attend a free financial counseling session with a Neighborhood Trust counselor.

I think I need to get me a job at Walmart 😀

 

[fskimospy]

Don't worry friends, your visionary progressive liberal friends are here to help. Just sign here, and here, and here, and you'll be all set paying for those pesky childcare bills.

Wonder how many more gullible people that progressives will destroy in the name of compassion - welfare has already ruined entire generations, student loan debt is corroding peoples' futures, and now they want to further convert them all into wage slaves.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2013/08/05/government_subsidized_day_care_loans.html

/facepalm

You realize that Christine Quinn is basically the most conservative candidate in the NYC mayoral race, right? (at least out of the ones that can win) The actual progressive candidates have a much more sensible way to deal with child care, as mentioned in the very article you cited.

 

[poofyhairguy]

WTF?
Progressive? Me thinkest not.
Its the natural ebb and flow.
Lets just call it Newton's third law of motion.
When certain people of a certain political party insists with outlawing abortion, AND terminating assistance like food stamps, AND cutting welfare to the bone, AND killing off every union job leaving only McDonalds and Wal-Mart as your employment opportunities, Well... someone has to watch those kids while mommy dearest and daddy dearest are sitting in the drive thru window asking, "do you want fries with that?"
Think of it this way, if you chop down a tree its going to fall to the ground.
Very few trees remain standing after chopped and hacked away.
Damn... too bad certain members of a certain political party missed the class on logical reasoning 101.
I think this is also known as opening the can of worms...

Wait, did you just blame globalization on conservatives?

 

[xBiffx]

/facepalm

You realize that Christine Quinn is basically the most conservative candidate in the NYC mayoral race, right? (at least out of the ones that can win) The actual progressive candidates have a much more sensible way to deal with child care, as mentioned in the very article you cited.

/facepalm

You really just tried to pick up a turd from the clean end....

 

[fskimospy]

/facepalm

You really just tried to pick up a turd from the clean end....

lol. Tell me, guy from cornfield in Iowa, about the NYC mayoral race.

I'm pretty sure you guys just think a progressive is anyone running for the mayor on NYC. You probably think Bloomberg is a progressive.

 

[xBiffx]

lol. Tell me, guy from cornfield in Iowa, about the NYC mayoral race.

I'm pretty sure you guys just think a progressive is anyone running for the mayor on NYC. You probably think Bloomberg is a progressive.

Ok. Guy from NY. Do tell.

You're such a condescending prick.

 

[nehalem256]

lol. Tell me, guy from cornfield in Iowa, about the NYC mayoral race.

I'm pretty sure you guys just think a progressive is anyone running for the mayor on NYC. You probably think Bloomberg is a progressive.

Quinn served as chair of the Health Committee, during which she sponsored the Equal Benefits Bill and the Health Care Security Act, which requires that city contractors provide parity in benefits between married spouses and registered domestic partners. This and the Health Care Security Act, which ensures health care for grocery workers, were passed over Mayor Michael Bloomberg's veto.
...

In January 2006, after serving on the council for almost seven years, Quinn was elected Speaker. She is the first woman and the first openly gay speaker to hold this office

...
The New York City Council under her leadership has led efforts to make Greenmarkets around the city accept food stamps.[17] She also opposes requiring applicants for food stamps to be electronically fingerprinted.[18] New York State stopped fingerprinting food-stamp recipients in 2007, however the practice has continued in New York City under the Bloomberg administration.

...
On July 28, 2012 Quinn sent a letter demanding that the president of NYU end the University's relationship with Chick-Fil-A, taking issue with the stance of the company's CEO, Dan Cathy, regarding same-sex marriage.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christine_Quinn

Clearly she is not progressive at all. Also note the references to where she differed from Bloomberg.

 

[fskimospy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christine_Quinn

Clearly she is not progressive at all. Also note the references to where she differed from Bloomberg.

Wow, they different on some things. Shocker.

She is widely known for her closeness in policies to Bloomberg, which is why she is currently being attacked on all sides for it.

 

[nehalem256]

Wow, they different on some things. Shocker.

She is widely known for her closeness in policies to Bloomberg, which is why she is currently being attacked on all sides for it.

Some more progressive beliefs of Quinn:

Passed the living wage law that requires a salary of at least $10 an hour for many workers at city-funded developments.

Passed MWBE legislation, helping minority and women owned businesses win contracts with the City.

Converted unused city owned market space at La Marqueta in East Harlem into Hot Bread Kitchen’s bakery and kitchen incubator programs, which has helped launch 32 diverse food businesses

Expanded full day pre-K by nearly 10,000 seats.

Improve student performance by extending the school day. Dozens of studies over the last decade show the same results: More learning time leads to greater academic achievement, better attendance, and more enthusiastic learners. As Mayor, Chris will keep more of our kids in a structured education program until 6pm, five-days-a-week. Chris will start by targeting schools that face bigger challenges: the 100 schools with the highest percentage of students who qualify for free or reduced price lunch.

Use community schools to meet all of a child’s needs. Just because you have a great teacher, that doesn’t mean we’ve removed all the barriers that can make it harder for you to learn. You need to be able to see a doctor when you’re sick. You need physical activity and healthy meals. You need tutoring and after school programs, internships and summer jobs. The community school model coordinates all these services to better meet the needs of the whole child. They’ve had great results in some targeted neighborhoods here in New York, and in other cities from San Francisco to Cincinnati. Now Chris will bring the community school approach system wide.

Provide comprehensive legal services and resources in schools. Education provides immigrant families with a pathway to the middle class, and for many undocumented immigrants, our public schools are one of the few government run institutions they regularly interact with and trust. Chris will bring comprehensive legal services to schools, helping students and their families get on the path to citizenship or legal residency, and access important benefits. Her Department of Education will partner with a network of legal service providers, law schools, and immigrant advocates to provide resources, education and legal services — starting in ten schools in neighborhoods with the highest percentage of immigrant families.

Stop hunger from interfering with learning in our schools. As a long-time anti-hunger champion, Chris knows that too many children go to sleep hungry every night, even though the federal government provides food programs that allow food insecure children to have regular access to healthy, free meals. As mayor, Chris will expand school meal options so that every child can eat free meals without stigma.

http://www.quinnfornewyork.com/issues

 

[fskimospy]

Some more progressive beliefs of Quinn:


http://www.quinnfornewyork.com/issues

Some not so progressive beliefs of Quinn:

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...rk-liberals-support-christine-quinn-for-mayor

 

[Attic]

Sure, do it.

6% isn't a killer, but high IMO for education related expense. Putting this money specifically into those hands paying for such a limited singular service will have the potential to drive up costs of preschool.

Overall against it. Paying for stuff with money you don't have has hurt a lot of folks. Government can largely get away with it, individuals tend to end up in debt cycles they have difficulty getting out of. Debt also is a power grab by those at the top of the financial structure.

This program would also put preschool further out of reach for the poor who couldn't access the loans in this area if it does have the effect of either keeping costs high or driving costs up.

 

[nehalem256]

Some not so progressive beliefs of Quinn:

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...rk-liberals-support-christine-quinn-for-mayor

So since she doesn't support mandatory sick pay, AT THIS TIME, but does support things like "living wage", she is clearly not a progressive?:hmm:

She may be the least progressive of a host of left-wing candidates but that does not mean she isn't also a progressive.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Just what the world needs even more, encouraging more children born into parents that is financially unable to support them. Well done.

Discouraging sex has literally never worked in human history. There has never been a society that can prevent a specific class of people from screwing, and all that sex is going to end in pregnancy every now and then despite everyone's best efforts to prevent it. So what's your solution? We tried discouraging sex, it has utterly failed, and it will never, ever work. What else can we do? Mandatory abortions? Mandatory sterilization? Mandatory adoption? Killing live babies if the parents aren't making a certain level of income by the time the child is born? Death penalty for repeat offenders? How would you solve this crisis of children born to parents who can't afford to provide proper care?

 

[xBiffx]

Discouraging sex has literally never worked in human history. There has never been a society that can prevent a specific class of people from screwing, and all that sex is going to end in pregnancy every now and then despite everyone's best efforts to prevent it. So what's your solution? We tried discouraging sex, it has utterly failed, and it will never, ever work. What else can we do? Mandatory abortions? Mandatory sterilization? Mandatory adoption? Killing live babies if the parents aren't making a certain level of income by the time the child is born? Death penalty for repeat offenders? How would you solve this crisis of children born to parents who can't afford to provide proper care?

There is a difference between discouraging people to have children and not encouraging them to have children. Once you figure that out, you'll have your answers.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

There is a difference between discouraging people to have children and not encouraging them to have children. Once you figure that out, you'll have your answers.

There are very few people who actually make a conscious decision to have children specifically to take advantage of welfare. Most children who fall under the auspices of welfare programs are the result of accidental pregnancies or other unforeseen consequences to parental earning potential (ie, loss of job, accident, medical expenses, death, etc.). You're painting this as an epidemic of poor people going, "Oooh, free child care, better fart out a baby," which is how literally no one in the world thinks. You can discourage poor people from getting pregnant all you want, but that's not going to stop it from happening even if those poor people aren't trying to get pregnant in the first place.

 

[highland145]

Hell yes. Bring that to S.C.

 

[xBiffx]

There are very few people who actually make a conscious decision to have children specifically to take advantage of welfare. Most children who fall under the auspices of welfare programs are the result of accidental pregnancies or other unforeseen consequences to parental earning potential (ie, loss of job, accident, medical expenses, death, etc.). You're painting this as an epidemic of poor people going, "Oooh, free child care, better fart out a baby," which is how literally no one in the world thinks. You can discourage poor people from getting pregnant all you want, but that's not going to stop it from happening even if those poor people aren't trying to get pregnant in the first place.

When you eliminate, truly eliminate, the safety nets, in place for irresponsible people having children people will have less children. Right now there isn't any worry or fear of not having a child taken care of and that gives people a sense of security which allows them to be somewhat cavalier with their reproductive decisions.

For those that truly need help because of unforeseen circumstances and not bad decisions on their own part, there are always going to be charitable people willing to help out.

 

[fskimospy]

When you eliminate, truly eliminate, the safety nets, in place for irresponsible people having children people will have less children. Right now there isn't any worry or fear of not having a child taken care of and that gives people a sense of security which allows them to be somewhat cavalier with their reproductive decisions.

For those that truly need help because of unforeseen circumstances and not bad decisions on their own part, there are always going to be charitable people willing to help out.

How do you square that with the thousands and thousands of homeless children present during the times where we had no safety nets? To me it seems like what people did in those cases was take those unwanted children and turn them out into the streets.

EDIT: I remember seeing some estimates of 40,000 or more homeless children on the streets of NYC in the 1800's

 

[xBiffx]

How do you square that with the thousands and thousands of homeless children present during the times where we had no safety nets? To me it seems like what people did in those cases was take those unwanted children and turn them out into the streets.

EDIT: I remember seeing some estimates of 40,000 or more homeless children on the streets of NYC in the 1800's

How many homeless people, in general, were running around NYC along with those children as well? In the days when people were flocking to this country in droves and droves to just live off the land, what can you expect.

But I do like how you had to go back two centuries to a rather tumultuous time in this country with worse/non existent sex education to try and counter my argument.

 

[Exterous]

6% isn't a killer, but high IMO for education related expense. Putting this money specifically into those hands paying for such a limited singular service will have the potential to drive up costs of preschool.

Given what we've seen happen to student loan debt and the cost of higher education with a deluge of easy money access I think this program would result in a short term benefit with the potential for a very large long term consequence.

I'd be more in favor of something that addresses the underlying costs, assuming that could be done relatively safely

 

[nehalem256]

Discouraging sex has literally never worked in human history. There has never been a society that can prevent a specific class of people from screwing, and all that sex is going to end in pregnancy every now and then despite everyone's best efforts to prevent it. So what's your solution? We tried discouraging sex, it has utterly failed, and it will never, ever work. What else can we do? Mandatory abortions? Mandatory sterilization? Mandatory adoption? Killing live babies if the parents aren't making a certain level of income by the time the child is born? Death penalty for repeat offenders? How would you solve this crisis of children born to parents who can't afford to provide proper care?

Seems like that would work.

And isn't that basically how society handles other activities that impose significant costs to it because of people's stupidity?

Think business regulations...

But then again business cannot hold children hostage.

EDIT: Or if you don't want to make them mandatory just incentivize it. For example withhold future medicare and SS to people who irresponsibly have children.

 

[bshole]

When you eliminate, truly eliminate, the safety nets, in place for irresponsible people having children people will have less children.

Tell that to Africa. Weird how the place with NO safety nets whatsoever also has the highest teen pregnancy rate (by a country mile) in the world.

Africa also has the lowest abortion rate in the world, but that is ok, starvation takes care of the excess children, just like God intended.