ANOTHER Republican politician caught in gay sex public restroom scandal

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: jjzelinski

Originally posted by: Uhtrinity

Originally posted by: jjzelinski
*gasp!* Not a flip flopper!

Well, a certain party made a big issue of that term not so long ago ....

Yeah I know...

Swift Boat Veterans for truth... only the right wing can come up with something as obscure as that... and to think people gave deference to GB's military service credentials over a guy who was incontestably IN vietnam and under FIRE rather than under the INFLUENCE is simply mind boggling.


Anyhow, back on topic. Hopefully in an effort to circle the wagons around this puritanical, anti-homosexual homosexual the GOP will bring gayness into the living rooms of all the god fearing WASP's of our great country and attenuate their frothing hatred a bit.

Remember, elections were WON based on the GOP being the party of ethics (aka, anti-gay "agenda"). If they keep this guy around then they encourage acceptance of homosexuality and lose one of their biggest political leverages of the simple minded in our society.

I really hate to see what Lie & Smear campaign the Repubs come up with this time.

Their Lies & deception have worked when it counts sadly.

 

[Lemon law]

In some ways there could be some silver linings in this escalation of the Craig incident. Even though there will be all kinds of divisive political spin polluting any national debate, the Craig case may force this nation to engage in a more rational national debate about the rather shameful and hypocritical way this nation treats a sub set of of its own sons and daughters who, for what ever reason, just fails to pass puberty with the politically correct sexual orientation. Ironically, the national debate is unlikely to hinge on the sexual orientation of Craig himself, I have reviewed the evidence, and in MHO, its not very definitive either way, and the real evidence of what happened in the actual stall in question is not subject to actual replay.

I may be over optimistic, but I hope some good things come of it, and that we can all learn somethings that make this nation a better and more humane nation.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Genx87
He pleaded out like an idiot. But judging from the reaction he got over this, he made a calculated risk that came up short.

I really dont give a damn about the whole gay saga story. What makes me wonder is how the police can now apparently arrest you for putting your feet and hands in the wrong area at an airport bathroom.

IMO the taped interview doesnt damn the man, it makes the police officer sound desperate as he knows his case is paper thin. I am in no way defending this guy as I dont know anything about him. But I think this opinion piece says it pretty well.

http://www.startribune.com/357/story/1401853.html

This guy is a lefty btw.

I too initially thought the charge was very weak, but my mother (a former defense attorney and longtime judge in Hennepin County, the very county in which Craig pled guilty) disagrees. She actually had a few similar cases tried before her, and in each the conduct was as seemingly benign as Craig's. The prosecution brought in an expert on restroom shenanigans like Craig's, and was able to get a conviction in each case.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Genx87
What makes me wonder is how the police can now apparently arrest you for putting your feet and hands in the wrong area at an airport bathroom.

Police can set up stings for whatever they want for revenue.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Genx87
He pleaded out like an idiot. But judging from the reaction he got over this, he made a calculated risk that came up short.

I really dont give a damn about the whole gay saga story. What makes me wonder is how the police can now apparently arrest you for putting your feet and hands in the wrong area at an airport bathroom.

IMO the taped interview doesnt damn the man, it makes the police officer sound desperate as he knows his case is paper thin. I am in no way defending this guy as I dont know anything about him. But I think this opinion piece says it pretty well.

http://www.startribune.com/357/story/1401853.html

This guy is a lefty btw.

To tell you the truth the audio tape did sound iffy at best. According to CNN there is more to the story as the officers wrote in their report that he was "lurking" about the bathroom and was "making eye contact". Of course that's hardly a "Hey how much f0r t3h butts3x??? /drops pants." I was expecting. Frankly a good lawyer could make mince meat out of this case from all that I know of it right now.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: Genx87
He pleaded out like an idiot. But judging from the reaction he got over this, he made a calculated risk that came up short.

I really dont give a damn about the whole gay saga story. What makes me wonder is how the police can now apparently arrest you for putting your feet and hands in the wrong area at an airport bathroom.

IMO the taped interview doesnt damn the man, it makes the police officer sound desperate as he knows his case is paper thin. I am in no way defending this guy as I dont know anything about him. But I think this opinion piece says it pretty well.

http://www.startribune.com/357/story/1401853.html

This guy is a lefty btw.

I too initially thought the charge was very weak, but my mother (a former defense attorney and longtime judge in Hennepin County, the very county in which Craig pled guilty) disagrees. She actually had a few similar cases tried before her, and in each the conduct was as seemingly benign as Craig's. The prosecution brought in an expert on restroom shenanigans like Craig's, and was able to get a conviction in each case.

Did all the defendants have public pretenders.....I mean public defenders working their case?

 

[1EZduzit]

The defendant is a public pretender.

Given his public record against gay rights I can see no logic in him pleading to a lesser charge. He's a US Senator for crying out loud, he doesn't have to take that kind of shit.... unless he was feeling guilty about something and in a moment of weakness did the right thing?

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: DonVito

I too initially thought the charge was very weak, but my mother (a former defense attorney and longtime judge in Hennepin County, the very county in which Craig pled guilty) disagrees. She actually had a few similar cases tried before her, and in each the conduct was as seemingly benign as Craig's. The prosecution brought in an expert on restroom shenanigans like Craig's, and was able to get a conviction in each case.

Did all the defendants have public pretenders.....I mean public defenders working their case?

No, and in my observation most public defenders are quite good. They tend to try a lot of cases and are frequently more experienced then their private counterparts. Obviously this varies from attorney to attorney, but I think the preconception that PDs are bad is unfair and inaccurate.

 

[Lemon law]

For all the debate about the merits of public defenders, its somewhat irrelevant to this case because Craig is going to and is already exploring hiring the best private attorneys money can buy.

The only possible relevance will lie in reviewing the arrest record of the arresting officer himself. Since that is not in evidence yet, its speculating way past the known facts. But in a resulting national circus, everyone ever arrested by the arresting officer will probably get dragged back through the mud as we likely learn little productive in that mud mine.

My last comment is that I very much doubt public revenue through fines will be found to be a any motivating factor for employing the potty police. That particular airport bathroom was listed on a gay website, there have been a record of heterosexual males complaining about being solicited for unwanted sex by homosexual males, and their rights to shit in peace in a public place counterbalance and hence do justify some police action. But again that issue will be sensationalized and spun to the point little productive is learned.

 

[imported_Shivetya]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Genx87
What makes me wonder is how the police can now apparently arrest you for putting your feet and hands in the wrong area at an airport bathroom.

Police can set up stings for whatever they want for revenue.

and catching people in situations like this make it for easy money, after all most of those caught are probably more than willing to cough up some dough instead of jail time or contesting the charge.



Still, I wonder if Senator Craig's has stalled because of this

 

[ebaycj]

Originally posted by: UberNeuman
It's a witch hunt! It's a mis-understanding! It's a smear campaign!

CLINTON!!!!!

\I think we've covered all the bases...

Sen. Craig: "I did NOT have sexual relations with that man!"

 

[BoomerD]

Originally posted by: Lemon law
That particular airport bathroom was listed on a gay website, there have been a record of heterosexual males complaining about being solicited for unwanted sex by homosexual males, and their rights to shit in peace

"Hi big boy...would you like to push up my stool?"

 

[Thump553]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: DonVito

I too initially thought the charge was very weak, but my mother (a former defense attorney and longtime judge in Hennepin County, the very county in which Craig pled guilty) disagrees. She actually had a few similar cases tried before her, and in each the conduct was as seemingly benign as Craig's. The prosecution brought in an expert on restroom shenanigans like Craig's, and was able to get a conviction in each case.

Did all the defendants have public pretenders.....I mean public defenders working their case?

No, and in my observation most public defenders are quite good. They tend to try a lot of cases and are frequently more experienced then their private counterparts. Obviously this varies from attorney to attorney, but I think the preconception that PDs are bad is unfair and inaccurate.

I practice in a different region from DonVito, but I totally agree with his opinion of public defenders. I've practiced in two areas of the country, and in each area the fast track to becoming a judge is through either the prosecutor's or public defender's office.

I must admit I did get a chuckle out of your mom's story. An expert in restroom shenanigans? How would you like that on your resume? How does one get the qualifications? (Strike that, on second thought I don't want to know).

 

[Lemon law]

For what its worth, I heard on the afternoon news that Craig is now having third thoughts and is now saying he probably will resign as originally stated.

And strongly implied, to fight the issue he would (a) Have to get an overturning of his guilty plea by September 30. (b) Get better backing from the GOP leadership.

So things are very much up in the air, partly up to Craig and various other parties concerned, and we will simply have to wait and let Craig make his own decision.

So its a maybe and maybe not.

 

[jjzelinski]

I hope he stays. It would be good for America in so many ways...

 

[imported_Lothar]

Originally posted by: Genx87
I am not defending him but the uproar, especially from left, is amusing.

The only "uproar" present is coming from the Republican base.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

If I were Craig, I'd say "F-you guys, I'm stayin'!"

It doesn't really matter whether he wins a criminal trial or not, most Americans probably believe or want to believe that he is a homosexual and that he does cruise men's rooms in search of blow jobs. His political career is almost certainly over after the next election and the Republicans have been deliciously embarrassed yet again.

If people now think of the Republican Party as the part of men's room perverts and closet homosexuals, I think that's great. After the destruction that Bush and his Administration have wrought on this nation's economy, they deserve it. Now if only we could get rid of both the Republicans and the Democrats and replace them with political parties that focus on pursuing the best interests of ordinary Americans.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: BoomerD

Originally posted by: Salvador
This is friggin' hilarious if you haven't seen it.

ROFL! If Idahoans thought Bill Clinton was a "nasty, bad, naughty boy," WTF will they think of Senator Larry Craig? Last time I lived there, Idaho was a pretty conservative state, and I suspect that getting a blow-job from a woman other than your wife would be MUCH more acceptable than trying to pick up random gay lovers in an airport bathroom...

Does this make Sen. Craig a "dirty-nasty, bad, naughty boy?"

That video was F'in hillarious! He really did sound like he was gay in it. I bet Senator Larry Craig is a "bottom" who enjoys getting it up the butt!

I wonder how his wife has coped with this for all of these years. She probably liked being taken care of and being financially well off. I wouldn't be at all surprised if she was fully aware of it the whole time.

 

[ProfJohn]

The latest according to Drudge is that his arrest while on official business was a violation of the constitution.

I wonder if he could use this as a legal excuse to get out of his plea bargain.

 

[Lemon law]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The latest according to Drudge is that his arrest while on official business was a violation of the constitution.

I wonder if he could use this as a legal excuse to get out of his plea bargain.

I can confirm that PJ is telling the truth about the drudge report. So this implies that not only is the President above the law, but so are all the Congressmen and Senators. Or at least they are not subject to arrest for any all violations of the law if we are to believe the argument.

But as a practical matter, not only did Craig fail to resort to the argument at arrest, I suspect it will go over like a lead balloon now.

But good find PJ.

 

[alien42]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: BoomerD

Originally posted by: Salvador
This is friggin' hilarious if you haven't seen it.

ROFL! If Idahoans thought Bill Clinton was a "nasty, bad, naughty boy," WTF will they think of Senator Larry Craig? Last time I lived there, Idaho was a pretty conservative state, and I suspect that getting a blow-job from a woman other than your wife would be MUCH more acceptable than trying to pick up random gay lovers in an airport bathroom...

Does this make Sen. Craig a "dirty-nasty, bad, naughty boy?"

That video was F'in hillarious! He really did sound like he was gay in it. I bet Senator Larry Craig is a "bottom" who enjoys getting it up the butt!

I wonder how his wife has coped with this for all of these years. She probably liked being taken care of and being financially well off. I wouldn't be at all surprised if she was fully aware of it the whole time.

absolutely priceless. sounds like craig had a man crush on 'bad boy' clinton. i would bet any amount of money that is his exact bedroom talk with men, lol.

 

[dmcowen674]

Unbelievable

Now he has filed to reverse the Guilty plea:


9-10-2007 Craig files to withdraw guilty plea

MINNEAPOLIS - Sen. Larry Craig filed court papers Monday seeking to withdraw his guilty plea in an airport sex sting, arguing that he entered the plea under stress caused by media inquiries into his sexuality.

In a "state of intense anxiety" following his arrest, Craig "felt compelled to grasp the lifeline offered to him by the police officer" and pleaded guilty to the disorderly conduct charge in hopes the matter would not be made public, said the court papers filed in Hennepin County District Court.

The filing said Craig panicked and accepted the plea rather than seeking the advice of an attorney. As a result, Craig's guilty plea was not "knowingly and understandingly made," and the evidence against him insufficient to support the plea, the papers said.

Craig's attorney, William Martin, cited pressure from Craig's hometown newspaper, the Idaho Statesman, which spent months investigating whether Craig engaged in homosexual encounters. Craig has denied such suggestions and accused the newspaper of conducting a "witch hunt."

Patrick Hogan, a spokesman for the Metropolitan Airports Commission, which runs the airport and handled the prosecution of the case, said the prosecutor will oppose Craig's motion.

"We do feel we have a strong case, and he's already made his plea, and it's been accepted by the court," Hogan said. "From our standpoint, this is already a done deal. Mr. Craig was arrested and signed a guilty plea, and from our standpoint, this case is already over."

To reverse his guilty plea Craig would have to convince a judge that there was a "manifest injustice" in case. Often that includes sentences that were harsher than the one anticipated in the plea bargain, but that didn't happen in Craig's case. Legal experts have said such motions are rarely brought, and when they are they are rarely successful.

Motions to withdraw a guilty plea are usually heard by the same judge who heard the original case, usually at least two weeks after they're requested, court officials have said.

In exchange for Craig's plea, the prosecutor dropped a gross misdemeanor charge of interference to privacy. If he is allowed to withdraw his guilty plea, the prosecutor would have the option to refile the dropped gross misdemeanor interference with privacy charge, which stemmed from an allegation that Craig peered into the bathroom stall occupied by the undercover police officer.

A conviction on that gross misdemeanor charge could bring a jail sentence of up to a year, although it would be unusual for a defendant to receive the maximum sentence.

 

[BoomerD]

FLIP-FLOP!!

I'm guilty...No I'm not..
I'm stepping down...No I'm not...
I'm gay...No I'm not...

FLIP-FLOP!

 

[rpanic]

If he wants to keep his job fine, he is free to do whatever he wants. But it would be nice if he just came out and said the truth. He is going to look even more gay fighting it.

 

[Uhtrinity]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Unbelievable

Now he has filed to reverse the Guilty plea:


9-10-2007 Craig files to withdraw guilty plea

MINNEAPOLIS - Sen. Larry Craig filed court papers Monday seeking to withdraw his guilty plea in an airport sex sting, arguing that he entered the plea under stress caused by media inquiries into his sexuality.

In a "state of intense anxiety" following his arrest, Craig "felt compelled to grasp the lifeline offered to him by the police officer" and pleaded guilty to the disorderly conduct charge in hopes the matter would not be made public, said the court papers filed in Hennepin County District Court.

The filing said Craig panicked and accepted the plea rather than seeking the advice of an attorney. As a result, Craig's guilty plea was not "knowingly and understandingly made," and the evidence against him insufficient to support the plea, the papers said.

Craig's attorney, William Martin, cited pressure from Craig's hometown newspaper, the Idaho Statesman, which spent months investigating whether Craig engaged in homosexual encounters. Craig has denied such suggestions and accused the newspaper of conducting a "witch hunt."

Patrick Hogan, a spokesman for the Metropolitan Airports Commission, which runs the airport and handled the prosecution of the case, said the prosecutor will oppose Craig's motion.

"We do feel we have a strong case, and he's already made his plea, and it's been accepted by the court," Hogan said. "From our standpoint, this is already a done deal. Mr. Craig was arrested and signed a guilty plea, and from our standpoint, this case is already over."

To reverse his guilty plea Craig would have to convince a judge that there was a "manifest injustice" in case. Often that includes sentences that were harsher than the one anticipated in the plea bargain, but that didn't happen in Craig's case. Legal experts have said such motions are rarely brought, and when they are they are rarely successful.

Motions to withdraw a guilty plea are usually heard by the same judge who heard the original case, usually at least two weeks after they're requested, court officials have said.

In exchange for Craig's plea, the prosecutor dropped a gross misdemeanor charge of interference to privacy. If he is allowed to withdraw his guilty plea, the prosecutor would have the option to refile the dropped gross misdemeanor interference with privacy charge, which stemmed from an allegation that Craig peered into the bathroom stall occupied by the undercover police officer.

A conviction on that gross misdemeanor charge could bring a jail sentence of up to a year, although it would be unusual for a defendant to receive the maximum sentence.

I hope the judge allows the guilty plea to be dropped so Craig can go on trial. Sounds like he is asking for it, so give it to him.