Another "George Wallace moment" in AL

[MovingTarget]

...this time over the issue of marriage. :sigh:

http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/02/alabama_chief_justice_roy_moor_4.html#incart_river

So, here in AL, we were all set for the first marriage licenses to be issued to homosexual couples due to a federal district court ruling. Just an hour or so ago, on the night before the ruling was to take effect, Judge Roy Moore, the chief justice of our state supreme court, issued an order to probate judges that they are not to comply in open defiance to the federal judge's ruling.

Now, some of you may be familiar with this judge from his prior shenanigans. He is known as the "Ten Commandments Judge" for sneaking in a religious-themed monument in the middle of the night to a state courthouse in defiance of a federal court order. He had even been removed from office due to those shenanigans, and we reelected him back to the bench.

So, tomorrow morning, the shit hits the fan. Keep an eye on the news. I hope that our probate judges realize that Moore is out of line and do the right thing.

Edit: It seems that the New York Times has picked up on this issue as well. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/09/u...alabama-amid-protest.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

 

[shira]

...this time over the issue of marriage. :sigh:

http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/02/alabama_chief_justice_roy_moor_4.html#incart_river

So, here in AL, we were all set for the first marriage licenses to be issued to homosexual couples due to a federal district court ruling. Just an hour or so ago, on the night before the ruling was to take effect, Judge Roy Moore, the chief justice of our state supreme court, issued an order to probate judges that they are not to comply in open defiance to the federal judge's ruling.

Now, some of you may be familiar with this judge from his prior shenanigans. He is known as the "Ten Commandments Judge" for sneaking in a religious-themed monument in the middle of the night to a state courthouse in defiance of a federal court order. He had even been removed from office due to those shenanigans, and we reelected him back to the bench.

So, tomorrow morning, the shit hits the fan. Keep an eye on the news. I hope that our probate judges realize that Moore is out of line and do the right thing.

Edit: It seems that the New York Times has picked up on this issue as well. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/09/u...alabama-amid-protest.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

The Washington Post had an op-ed piece on this issue:

Chief Justice Roy Moore has been urging officials, including state court judges, to flout a federal court order holding unconstitutional a provision of the Alabama constitution that bans the recognition of same-sex marriages. Moore has denounced the ruling of U.S. District Judge Callie V.S. “Ginny” Granade as an example of “judicial tyranny” and promises that he “will continue to recognize the Alabama Constitution and the will of the people overwhelmingly expressed in the Sanctity of Marriage Amendment.” In his view, “lower federal courts are without authority to impose their own interpretation of federal constitutional law upon the state courts,” and “there’s nothing in the Constitution that allows the United States Supreme Court or federal district courts to redefine marriage.”

Moore’s constitutional logic is deeply flawed. Simply put, under the Constitution, federal law is supreme. It necessarily follows that an order from a federal court that enjoins state officers from enforcing an unconstitutional provision of state law binds all officers of the state. To its credit, the Alabama Probate Judges Association has recognized that it must comply with Granade’s order. Probate Judge Greg Norris, president of the association, said that it is “clear” that Granade’s injunction binds all state officers.

Fortunately, as the article also describes, Alabama has also produced some truly wonderful judges. But Moore is an abberation, a disgrace to the practice of jurisprudence. I mean, is there any other American judge - at ANY level - who doesn't understand something as simple and basic as the primacy of federal court rulings?

 

[nickqt]

...this time over the issue of marriage. :sigh:

http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/02/alabama_chief_justice_roy_moor_4.html#incart_river

So, here in AL, we were all set for the first marriage licenses to be issued to homosexual couples due to a federal district court ruling. Just an hour or so ago, on the night before the ruling was to take effect, Judge Roy Moore, the chief justice of our state supreme court, issued an order to probate judges that they are not to comply in open defiance to the federal judge's ruling.

Now, some of you may be familiar with this judge from his prior shenanigans. He is known as the "Ten Commandments Judge" for sneaking in a religious-themed monument in the middle of the night to a state courthouse in defiance of a federal court order. He had even been removed from office due to those shenanigans, and we reelected him back to the bench.

So, tomorrow morning, the shit hits the fan. Keep an eye on the news. I hope that our probate judges realize that Moore is out of line and do the right thing.

Edit: It seems that the New York Times has picked up on this issue as well. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/09/u...alabama-amid-protest.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

Homophobia today, homophobia tomorrow, homophobia forever!

 

[DrDoug]

From what he is saying I would guess that ol' Roy has aspirations for the office of governor and wants to put the governor in a spot over this. That an asshole like this could ever be elected as judge is beyond me. You have to be a stupid motherfucker to vote for an asshole like this.

I mean really fucking stupid.

 

[Meghan54]

From what he is saying I would guess that ol' Roy has aspirations for the office of governor and wants to put the governor in a spot over this. That an asshole like this could ever be elected as judge is beyond me. You have to be a stupid motherfucker to vote for an asshole like this.

I mean really fucking stupid.

You have to remember the entire region is ultra conservative and ultra Christian with a wide proliferation of fundamentalist sects....and has a deep rooted cultural hatred for a strong central federal govt.

So anyone espousing those values can be elected, no matter the label attached to his/her party. Remember, when people mention that Democrats voted in the Jim Crow laws in the South, those Democrats were red-blooded conservatives, each and every one. And that's because Repubs. couldn't get elected anywhere in the South....something to do with carpetbaggers, Reconstruction, Republican reformers (the Repubs. of the time were much more progressive vs. Southern Democrats)....all that.

 

[DrDoug]

You have to remember the entire region is ultra conservative and ultra Christian with a wide proliferation of fundamentalist sects....and has a deep rooted cultural hatred for a strong central federal govt.

So anyone espousing those values can be elected, no matter the label attached to his/her party. Remember, when people mention that Democrats voted in the Jim Crow laws in the South, those Democrats were red-blooded conservatives, each and every one. And that's because Repubs. couldn't get elected anywhere in the South....something to do with carpetbaggers, Reconstruction, Republican reformers (the Repubs. of the time were much more progressive vs. Southern Democrats)....all that.

Oh I'm more than aware of the political situation and how it has evolved over the years. For example, it's funny how the party that is dominant in the south and has lots of problems with race is the now party of Lincoln...lol!

Still, it takes some special level of stupid to put idiots like that bible-thumpin' judge in power.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

The SCOTUS needs to end all this BS and make a ruling on same sex marriage, once it's the law of the land overzealous state and/or local judges will have no say in the matter.

 

[Fingolfin269]

But Moore is an abberation, a disgrace to the practice of jurisprudence. I mean, is there any other American judge - at ANY level - who doesn't understand something as simple and basic as the primacy of federal court rulings?

I'm sure this guy fully understands where his state Constitution sits relative to a federal ruling. He just doesn't care.

 

[schmuckley]

Did the people vote for natural marriage in your state? If so,the judge that ruled sodomy-based marriage was OK was wrong.
1 judge vs a state full of people.
He should be impeached.
immediately

 

[MovingTarget]

I'm sure this guy fully understands where his state Constitution sits relative to a federal ruling. He just doesn't care.

Seriously, what will the courts do here to punish him or further dissuade him from violating the supremacy of federal over state courts? Have him removed from the bench? That worked so well the last time. Alas, that would probably just increase the chances of him being elected back to the same spot during the next election cycle. He's apparently coated in Teflon. I really wish that my state could be rid of him asap.

 

[fskimospy]

Seriously, what will the courts do here to punish him or further dissuade him from violating the supremacy of federal over state courts? Have him removed from the bench? That worked so well the last time. Alas, that would probably just increase the chances of him being elected back to the same spot during the next election cycle. He's apparently coated in Teflon. I really wish that my state could be rid of him asap.

What really sucks is the poor probate judge who listens to this idiot. If a probate judge defies a federal court order they are opening themselves up to individual liability and sanction.

Let's hope the rest of the judges in Alabama have more sense than this clown.

 

[SunnyD]

^^^ It's clickable. So sayeth the SCOTUS. (Cliffs version: 7-2 ruling tells Judge Moore to screw off.)

 

[Jaskalas]

Wait... SCOTUS ruled on something and didn't take a decade to do it?

 

[fskimospy]

Wait... SCOTUS ruled on something and didn't take a decade to do it?

Haha, well this is a legal principle that's so obvious that there's no real need to deliberate. (although of course Scalia and Thomas dissented).

More than anything they are simply saying "yes, the supremacy clause is still valid".

 

[LevelSea]

Looks like some couples have gotten married in a few counties. Despite the expected weeping and gnashing of teeth, there seems to be a lot of support including a Baptist preacher, at least here in Huntsville. They are volunteers at the park downtown to officiate weddings and have cupcakes. I may cruise down there at lunch and check it out.

LOL: https://twitter.com/MadisonU/status/564805289615319041/photo/1

Live updates: http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/02/alabama_gay_marriage_starts_to.html#incart_std

 

[brycejones]

Looks like some couples have gotten married in a few counties. Despite the expected weeping and gnashing of teeth, there seems to be a lot of support including a Baptist preacher, at least here in Huntsville. They are volunteers at the park downtown to officiate weddings and have cupcakes. I may cruise down there at lunch and check it out.

LOL: https://twitter.com/MadisonU/status/564805289615319041/photo/1

Live updates: http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/02/alabama_gay_marriage_starts_to.html#incart_std

Isn't Huntsville like the commie enclave in the state?

 

[LevelSea]

Isn't Huntsville like the commie enclave in the state?

It's probably one of the most "liberal" cities in the state. Lots of scientists and engineers with NASA and the military.

 

[brycejones]

It's probably one of the most "liberal" cities in the state. Lots of scientists and engineers with NASA and the military.

Yeah, commie.

Seriously though how anyone in statewide public office in Alabama could be so tone deaf as to basically sound like George Wallace from 50 years ago is beyond me.

 

[LevelSea]

Yeah, commie.

Seriously though how anyone in statewide public office in Alabama could be so tone deaf as to basically sound like George Wallace from 50 years ago is beyond me.

The guy is a walking demagogue. These issues are his schtick. At least Wallace recanted (whether or not he actually believed it or not), but Moore is going to ride this until his death.

 

[werepossum]

Haha, well this is a legal principle that's so obvious that there's no real need to deliberate. (although of course Scalia and Thomas dissented).

More than anything they are simply saying "yes, the supremacy clause is still valid".

I agree with the dissent to the extent that SCOTUS had no business leaving the issue unsettled in 2013. I disagree with the dissent to the extent that everyone knows how SCOTUS is going to rule, so there's no point in preserving the status quo until that happens. (And rightly so - SCOTUS should be leading making our rights uniform nationally, and there is absolutely nothing that supports denying equal marriage rights or denying equal protection to give the issue to the states.)

What's sad for the right is that this is a pure limited government argument. No government which has a veto over one's choice of spouse for no better reason that "ick" can be considered limited. The right claims to be in favor of limited government, but in actuality we are little less enamored of using the government to enforce our preferred behavior on others than are those on the left.

 

[fskimospy]

I agree with the dissent to the extent that SCOTUS had no business leaving the issue unsettled in 2013. I disagree with the dissent to the extent that everyone knows how SCOTUS is going to rule, so there's no point in preserving the status quo until that happens. (And rightly so - SCOTUS should be leading making our rights uniform nationally, and there is absolutely nothing that supports denying equal marriage rights or denying equal protection to give the issue to the states.)

What's sad for the right is that this is a pure limited government argument. No government which has a veto over one's choice of spouse for no better reason that "ick" can be considered limited. The right claims to be in favor of limited government, but in actuality we are little less enamored of using the government to enforce our preferred behavior on others than are those on the left.

Well there's an old famous political science study called 'The Nature of Belief Systems in Mass Publics' where they basically found that very few average people actually had coherent political philosophies. Much like the liberals who mock conservative anti-science in regards to climate change and yet ignore the science on GMOs, many conservatives are willing to abandon the principles of limited government when it comes to gay people.

 

[shira]

Did the people vote for natural marriage in your state? If so,the judge that ruled sodomy-based marriage was OK was wrong.
1 judge vs a state full of people.
He should be impeached.
immediately

So if the people vote to make all gun ownership illegal in a state, any judge who rules that gun ownership is nevertheless OK should be impeached? You know, one judge versus a state full of people.

Or is it only Constitutional rights you happen to like that should be protected?

Unprincipled idiot.

 

[CitizenKain]

I was looking forward to National Guard troops holding judges at gunpoint issuing certificates.

 

[brycejones]

Did the people vote for natural marriage in your state? If so,the judge that ruled sodomy-based marriage was OK was wrong.
1 judge vs a state full of people.
He should be impeached.
immediately

A bit early for drinking isn't it?

 

[Phokus]

Do they still burn crosses and shit down there and Bama?