Announcement by Bush of troop withdrawal

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
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Unbelievable. We all know troop reduction was inevitable, but now bushie makes an announcement as though it's some great idea of his? PLEASE! Thats all he can do is continue to fail and claim victory that isnt his.

Bush to Announce Troop cuts

WASHINGTON - President Bush will tell the nation Thursday evening that he plans to reduce the American troop presence in Iraq by as many as 30,000 by next summer but will condition those and further cuts on continued progress, The Associated Press has learned.

In a 15-minute address from the White House at 9 p.m. EDT, Bush will endorse the recommendations of his top general and top diplomat in Iraq, following their appearance at two days of hearings in Congress, administration officials said. The White House plans to issue a written status report on the troop buildup on Friday, they said.

The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because Bush's speech is not yet final. Bush was rehearsing and polishing his remarks even as the U.S. commander in Iraq, Gen. David Petraeus, and U.S. Ambassador Ryan Crocker were presenting their arguments for a second day on Capitol Hill.

In the speech, the president will say he understands Americans' deep concerns about U.S. involvement in Iraq and their desire to bring the troops home, they said. Bush will say that, after hearing from Petraeus and Crocker, he has decided on a way forward that will reduce the U.S. military presence but not abandon Iraq to chaos, according to the officials.

The address will stake out a conciliatory tone toward Congress. But while mirroring Petraeus' strategy, Bush will place more conditions on reductions than his general did, insisting that conditions on the ground must warrant cuts and that now-unforeseen events could change the plan.

Petraeus recommended that a 2,000-member Marine unit return home this month without replacement. That would be followed in mid-December with the departure of an Army brigade numbering 3,500 to 4,000 soldiers. Under the general's plan, another four combat brigades would be withdrawn by July 2008.

That could leave the U.S. with as few as 130,000-135,000 troops in Iraq, down from about 168,000 now, although Petraeus was not precise about whether all the about 8,000 support troops sent with those extra combat forces would be withdrawn by July.

Petraeus said he foresaw even deeper troop cuts beyond July, but he recommended that Bush wait until at least March to decide when to go below 130,000 ? and at what pace.

At the White House, Bush met with House and Senate lawmakers of both parties and he publicly pledged to consider their views. Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., said the president didn't talk about the nationwide address.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., said Bush appears poised merely to bring the country back to where it was before the election that put Democrats in control of Congress ? with 130,000 troops in Iraq.

"Please. It's an insult to the intelligence of the American people that that is a new direction in Iraq," she said. "We're as disappointed as the public is that the president has a tin ear to their opinion on this war."

In his speech, Bush will adopt Petraeus' call for more time to determine the pace and scale of future withdrawals and offer to report to Congress in March, one official said.

As Petraeus and Crocker have, Bush will acknowledge difficulties, and the fact that few of the benchmarks set by Congress to measure progress of the buildup have been met, the official said. Yet, he will stress that a precipitous U.S. withdrawal would be a catastrophe for Iraq and U.S. interests.

The president will discuss "bottom up" security improvements, notably in Anbar Province, which he visited on Labor Day and where Sunni leaders have allied themselves with U.S. forces to fight insurgents. And, he will note incremental progress on the political front despite unhelpful roles played by Iran and Syria, the official said.

Crocker was particularly keen on detailing diplomatic developments, including Saudi Arabia's move to open an embassy in Baghdad and a third conference of Iraqi neighbors to be hosted by Turkey in Istanbul at the end of October.

In Congress, cracks in Republican support for the Iraq war remained, as epitomized by heated questioning Tuesday of Petraeus.

"Is this a mission shift?" asked Sen. Lisa Murkowski, R-Alaska. "Are we continuing down the same path that we have laid out before, entirely reliant on the ability of the Iraqis to come together to achieve that political reconciliation?"

Sen. Norm Coleman said he wants a longer-term vision other than suggestions that Petraeus and Crocker return to Capitol Hill in mid-March to give another assessment. "Americans want to see light at the end of the tunnel," said Coleman, R-Minn.

Many rank-and-file Republicans say they are deeply uneasy about keeping troops in Iraq through next summer, but they also remain reluctant to embrace legislation ordering troops home by next spring. Democrats, under substantial pressure by voters and politically influential anti-war groups, had anticipated that a larger number of Republicans by now would have turned against Bush on the war because of grim poll numbers and the upcoming 2008 elections.

Indeed, Petraeus' testimony helped to solidify support elsewhere in the GOP, keeping Democrats far from the 60 votes they needed to pass legislation ordering troops home.

"Americans should be happy that we can begin to reduce troop levels months ahead of schedule," said Sen. Pete Domenici, R-N.M.

"I'm optimistic that when the votes are counted, they'll be roughly the same as they have been all year," said McConnell, the Senate Republican leader. "As you know, we've lost some, but not a lot and I think that's a likely outcome again."

Echoing testimony given to the House on Monday, Petraeus and Crocker acknowledged that Iraq remains largely dysfunctional but said violence had decreased since the influx of added U.S. troops.

Crocker said he fears that announcing troop withdrawals, as Democrats want, would focus Iraqi attention on "building the walls, stocking ammunition and getting ready for a big nasty street fight" rather than working toward reconciliation. "It will take longer than we initially anticipated" for Iraq's leaders to address the country's problems, he said.

The two days of testimony seemed to turn the debate away from the list of 18 benchmarks by which the White House and Iraq's government had said earlier this year that they preferred to measure progress. The administration has protested more recently that the benchmarks offer an unrealistic or incomplete look at the situation.

The hearing fell on the anniversary of the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

In an unusual admission, Petraeus said he was not sure whether his proposal on Iraq would make America safer.

A visibly heated Sen. John Warner, R-Va., asked the question to which Petraeus said: "Sir, I don't know, actually. I have not sat down and sorted that out in my mind. What I have focused on and riveted on is how to accomplish the mission of the multinational force Iraq."

 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
348
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I hereby pledge to give all current Anandtech P&N members $10,000 this month, on condition that I win $50 million or more in a lottery this month.

Ted Kennedy hereby pledges to end social security and medicare this month, on condition that a secure, perpetual source of income for the care of those programs' constituents is found.

News reports say that Bush simply wants to continue the war until the end of his term so that his successor has to be the one to face the 'defeat'. The announcement today fits well within that claim, by giving Bush some breathing room. 'See, he's planning to cut the troop levels, so get off his back'.

Blackangst, one answer to your question, who says the president doesn't listen, is the Speaker of the House in the article you posted:

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., said Bush appears poised merely to bring the country back to where it was before the election that put Democrats in control of Congress ? with 130,000 troops in Iraq.

"Please. It's an insult to the intelligence of the American people that that is a new direction in Iraq," she said. "We're as disappointed as the public is that the president has a tin ear to their opinion on this war."
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
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Sorry, but Nansy Pelosi isnt very credible. She's like the National Enquirer of the senate.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
35,903
27,560
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Hate to burst bubbles but because of troop deployment constraints the 30K reduction was going to happen anyway.
 

SViscusi

Golden Member
Apr 12, 2000
1,200
8
81
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Sorry, but Nansy Pelosi isnt very credible. She's like the National Enquirer of the senate.

That analogy makes absolutely no sense.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
348
126
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Sorry, but Nansy Pelosi isnt very credible. She's like the National Enquirer of the senate.

What the hell do you mean, she is not credible? Can you link some articles to her saying space aliens are behind Al Queda or something, or are you just mouthing propaganda fed to you?

Why do so many people have such blurry foundations for these attacking opinions of leaders they disagree with? It's like when I talk with right-wingers who have never seen a second of a Michal Moore film who have all kinds of opinions about just how terrible they are. I could even go with that if they had some solid info from other sources, but they almost never do, it's just they were told he's 'the enemy' and they then parrot it. Doesn't matter who it is, any liberal leader gets the same treatment.

And you say *she's* not credible similar to the National Enquirer? Who is the one who sounds like the National Enquirer, as you make claims with as little reason as they do?
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
2,359
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Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Sorry, but Nansy Pelosi isnt very credible. She's like the National Enquirer of the senate.

What the hell do you mean, she is not credible? Can you link some articles to her saying space aliens are behind Al Queda or something, or are you just mouthing propaganda fed to you?

Why do so many people have such blurry foundations for these attacking opinions of leaders they disagree with? It's like when I talk with right-wingers who have never seen a second of a Michal Moore film who have all kinds of opinions about just how terrible they are. I could even go with that if they had some solid info from other sources, but they almost never do, it's just they were told he's 'the enemy' and they then parrot it. Doesn't matter who it is, any liberal leader gets the same treatment.

And you say *she's* not credible similar to the National Enquirer? Who is the one who sounds like the National Enquirer, as you make claims with as little reason as they do?

Given her track record of voting, I wouldnt believe a word out of her mouth. I posted about this very thing a few months ago when I was discrediting Pelosi so not going to do it again (sorry, not intentionally pulling a Dave), but throughout her career she is the posterchild of say one thing vote another. Sure there are exceptions, but it happens so frequently it's the rule, not the exception. Anyway.

I love this:
Why do so many people have such blurry foundations for these attacking opinions of leaders they disagree with
Isnt the premise of almost every disagreement on this board? lol
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
First we get the surge, on the basis that it's temporary- that was the word when it began. It was supposed to get us over the hump, remember? Now, of course, it's subject to re-evaluation... even as they promise to withdraw the surge troops, they equivocate...

Shucks, guys, if the surge was working as advertised, there wouldn't be any need for the current song and dance...

Per Crocker-

"It will take longer than we initially anticipated" for Iraq's leaders to address the country's problems, he said.

How much longer? Well, uhh, err, yeh, that is, well, uhh, maybe someday...

There's still no real exit strategy, just a strategy to feed pablum to the faithful and hold on as long as possible...

Attacking Pelosi's credibility is a neat trick, blackangst1, particularly when your own is non-existent after identifying her as the "National Enquirer of the Senate"- She's the Speaker of the House...

 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,234
701
126
Uh, what jhhnn said. The "temporary" surge is now being touted as a troop withdrawl. Technically, it is a troop withdrawl but that was the intention all along. LOL @ the OP for playing games with the "temporary" surge! :laugh:
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
348
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Blackangst, if you want to say Pelosi is not credible because in your view her statements and votes have differed, you have some proof to come up with, especially to show that she is much worse about it than other politicians.

BTW, on your sig, why don't you use the original from Thomas Jefferson instead of the apparent plagiarism from a movie?

When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.
Thomas Jefferson
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,834
1
0
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Sorry, but Nansy Pelosi isnt very credible. She's like the National Enquirer of the senate.

Damn man, you post a BS thread like this and then bash Pelosi???

LOL, ok. The President listens.... to who we have no idea, but he must listen to somebody??
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,285
6,026
126
If the troops can only be deployed for the promised 15 months they well need to be withdrawals by summer.
 

CaptnKirk

Lifer
Jul 25, 2002
10,053
0
71
Returning the troop presence to it's pre-surge level, 'maybe' by next summer,
or allowing those presently there to return on schedule without extending their tour length is no gain.

We've had 5 of these 'surges' now, and each return to the prior level hasn't been touted as anything of intrest before.
It was done quietly so as to not attrach attention, but now it's a chest pounding event.

When do the helicopters start bringing them out of the Green Zone in droves?

When the Iraqis stand up we can stand down used to be called 'Vietnamization'.

History repeats, only the names have been changed.
 

First

Lifer
Jun 3, 2002
10,518
271
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Let me know when 90%+ of the troops are gone. This is nothing and is the same level of troops in November 06 when the U.S. voted the Republican party out of a majority because of the war.
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
2,359
126
Originally posted by: Jhhnn
First we get the surge, on the basis that it's temporary- that was the word when it began. It was supposed to get us over the hump, remember? Now, of course, it's subject to re-evaluation... even as they promise to withdraw the surge troops, they equivocate...

Shucks, guys, if the surge was working as advertised, there wouldn't be any need for the current song and dance...

Per Crocker-

"It will take longer than we initially anticipated" for Iraq's leaders to address the country's problems, he said.

How much longer? Well, uhh, err, yeh, that is, well, uhh, maybe someday...

There's still no real exit strategy, just a strategy to feed pablum to the faithful and hold on as long as possible...

Attacking Pelosi's credibility is a neat trick, blackangst1, particularly when your own is non-existent after identifying her as the "National Enquirer of the Senate"- She's the Speaker of the House...


Sorry, when I said Senate I meant all inclusive. Thats fine.

As far as the nat'l enq...my parallel is that 99% of what is written is bullshit, inflated, and void of substance. But we all have our opinions right?
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
2,359
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Unbelievable. Any good news whatsoever and you all gotta shit on it. Unbelievable. What a sad world you must live in...
 

First

Lifer
Jun 3, 2002
10,518
271
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Originally posted by: blackangst1
Unbelievable. Any good news whatsoever and you all gotta shit on it. Unbelievable. What a sad world you must live in...

Troop withdrawal has been well known for a while, as they've hit max capacity and can't afford to keep men past their tours of duty.

What else can be said, I guess you just don't read much.
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
2,359
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Originally posted by: Craig234
Blackangst, if you want to say Pelosi is not credible because in your view her statements and votes have differed, you have some proof to come up with, especially to show that she is much worse about it than other politicians.

BTW, on your sig, why don't you use the original from Thomas Jefferson instead of the apparent plagiarism from a movie?
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.
Thomas Jefferson

Apperant to whom? Two different statements. Arguing and nit picking for the sake of doing so? lol Poor you...
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
2,359
126
Originally posted by: Evan Lieb
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Unbelievable. Any good news whatsoever and you all gotta shit on it. Unbelievable. What a sad world you must live in...

Troop withdrawal has been well known for a while, as they've hit max capacity and can't afford to keep men past their tours of duty.

What else can be said, I guess you just don't read much.

I guess not. Title and commentary changed to be more....accurate.
 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,234
701
126
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Unbelievable. Any good news whatsoever and you all gotta shit on it. Unbelievable. What a sad world you must live in...

Shit on it? Hell, it's good news but not groundbreaking. It was "PLANNED" as a temporary surge from the beginning. We're just going back to the pre surge levels (good) but nothing worth shouting "hooray" about. LOL @ the OP again! :laugh:
 

First

Lifer
Jun 3, 2002
10,518
271
136
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Originally posted by: Evan Lieb
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Unbelievable. Any good news whatsoever and you all gotta shit on it. Unbelievable. What a sad world you must live in...

Troop withdrawal has been well known for a while, as they've hit max capacity and can't afford to keep men past their tours of duty.

What else can be said, I guess you just don't read much.

I guess not. Title and commentary changed to be more....accurate.

Well done sir!
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
2,359
126
Originally posted by: Engineer
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Unbelievable. Any good news whatsoever and you all gotta shit on it. Unbelievable. What a sad world you must live in...

Shit on it? Hell, it's good news but not groundbreaking. It was "PLANNED" as a temporary surge from the beginning. We're just going back to the pre surge levels (good) but nothing worth shouting "hooray" about. LOL @ the OP again! :laugh:

Re-read it. It has been corrected to reflect the TRUTH!
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
28,223
19,718
146
Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Returning the troop presence to it's pre-surge level, 'maybe' by next summer,
or allowing those presently there to return on schedule without extending their tour length is no gain.

We've had 5 of these 'surges' now, and each return to the prior level hasn't been touted as anything of intrest before.
It was done quietly so as to not attrach attention, but now it's a chest pounding event.

When do the helicopters start bringing them out of the Green Zone in droves?

When the Iraqis stand up we can stand down used to be called 'Vietnamization'.

History repeats, only the names have been changed.
Yeah, I mean what the hell? There are conditional conditions :roll: The real horror, is that they bank on people being to stupid and short of memory to recognize the spin they put on the draw down, and they are almost certainly correct.

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Unbelievable. Any good news whatsoever and you all gotta shit on it. Unbelievable. What a sad world you must live in...
Well, it seems that in your's, they blow sunshine up everyones' butt.

 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,819
1,126
126
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Unbelievable. Any good news whatsoever and you all gotta shit on it. Unbelievable. What a sad world you must live in...

You made the OP, got called on its content and you have the nerve to profess indignation. Funny how the world spins. :confused: