America

[Kyteland]

Originally posted by: Gurck
This is ATOT, if you did a poll 'Are you male, female, or other?', I'd guess male would be the #2 choice & female the #3... It's entirely unscientific & inaccurate and shouldn't be the basis for a post like this.. unless of course you're just trolling

See here.

http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=38&threadid=1296028

 

[Gurck]

ok so I was slightly off.. still quite a few hermaphrodites & nullos here though ^_^

 

[GasX]

Originally posted by: oniq
I don't agree I should be killing anyone for any nation.

You think everyone in the military carries a gun?

 

[TMPadmin]

Fighting in a war for your country means more than just killing people. Those who look at it that way have no idea of war or why a country goes to war. My grandfathers fought in WWII. One was on a mission where he volunteer for which had an expected 100% mortality rate, he and another guy were the only survivors of their platoon. When war broke he prayed that he would pass the physical to be allowed in to the army. His devotion to this country makes me proud. He did not enlist to kill people or because he loved the president, he did it for his wife, my mother, me, and you and so on. He put is life aside and fought not for a country but for what our country represents. WWII was a different time yes; this war is about terrorism, about people being treated unfairly by their own government. In recent history Pearl Harbor was a battle on our own soil, which involved a military strike. 9/11 was not about government, it wasn't about foreign policy, it was about intolerance to our way of life. These people would have killed you or your child just as easily. It seems many have forgotten how they felt that day. Many want to just look the other way, "maybe it won't happen again". If we sit back and do nothing it will.

While it kills me to hear of every soldier killed (or civilian) our side or theirs I believe in America, I believe in the ideal we once had as a united nation. These freedoms we have because so many have given their lives (so many have given their fathers, mothers, sons or daughters and now live only with their memories and pictures). I will NOT let them die while so many others drag through the mud what they believed so much about they were willing to die or give their family member to the idea of a free world. You can sit there at your computer and bitch about the war, President Bush, or whatever the topic is today because they gave their lives for you. For your freedom to bitch if you want. But as you are sitting there complaining think about our men and women who believe in what they are doing. Who are willingly living and fighting away from their loved ones. They do this for us. They do it for our Country. They do it for the Love of freedom and the love of humanity. They believe in the cause.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: TMPadmin
Fighting in a war for your country means more than just killing people. Those who look at it that way have no idea of war or why a country goes to war. My grandfathers fought in WWII. One was on a mission where he volunteer for which had an expected 100% mortality rate, he and another guy were the only survivors of their platoon. When war broke he prayed that he would pass the physical to be allowed in to the army. His devotion to this country makes me proud. He did not enlist to kill people or because he loved the president, he did it for his wife, my mother, me, and you and so on. He put is life aside and fought not for a country but for what our country represents. WWII was a different time yes; this war is about terrorism, about people being treated unfairly by their own government. In recent history Pearl Harbor was a battle on our own soil, which involved a military strike. 9/11 was not about government, it wasn't about foreign policy, it was about intolerance to our way of life. These people would have killed you or your child just as easily. It seems many have forgotten how they felt that day. Many want to just look the other way, "maybe it won't happen again". If we sit back and do nothing it will.

While it kills me to hear of every soldier killed (or civilian) our side or theirs I believe in America, I believe in the ideal we once had as a united nation. These freedoms we have because so many have given their lives (so many have given their fathers, mothers, sons or daughters and now live only with their memories and pictures). I will NOT let them die while so many others drag through the mud what they believed so much about they were willing to die or give their family member to the idea of a free world. You can sit there at your computer and bitch about the war, President Bush, or whatever the topic is today because they gave their lives for you. For your freedom to bitch if you want. But as you are sitting there complaining think about our men and women who believe in what they are doing. Who are willingly living and fighting away from their loved ones. They do this for us. They do it for our Country. They do it for the Love of freedom and the love of humanity. They believe in the cause.

iraq wasn't involved in 9-11, so how is that relevant? how is fighting in iraq for our country? i just don't see the connection.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: TMPadmin
Fighting in a war for your country means more than just killing people. Those who look at it that way have no idea of war or why a country goes to war. My grandfathers fought in WWII. One was on a mission where he volunteer for which had an expected 100% mortality rate, he and another guy were the only survivors of their platoon. When war broke he prayed that he would pass the physical to be allowed in to the army. His devotion to this country makes me proud. He did not enlist to kill people or because he loved the president, he did it for his wife, my mother, me, and you and so on. He put is life aside and fought not for a country but for what our country represents. WWII was a different time yes; this war is about terrorism, about people being treated unfairly by their own government. In recent history Pearl Harbor was a battle on our own soil, which involved a military strike. 9/11 was not about government, it wasn't about foreign policy, it was about intolerance to our way of life. These people would have killed you or your child just as easily. It seems many have forgotten how they felt that day. Many want to just look the other way, "maybe it won't happen again". If we sit back and do nothing it will.

While it kills me to hear of every soldier killed (or civilian) our side or theirs I believe in America, I believe in the ideal we once had as a united nation. These freedoms we have because so many have given their lives (so many have given their fathers, mothers, sons or daughters and now live only with their memories and pictures). I will NOT let them die while so many others drag through the mud what they believed so much about they were willing to die or give their family member to the idea of a free world. You can sit there at your computer and bitch about the war, President Bush, or whatever the topic is today because they gave their lives for you. For your freedom to bitch if you want. But as you are sitting there complaining think about our men and women who believe in what they are doing. Who are willingly living and fighting away from their loved ones. They do this for us. They do it for our Country. They do it for the Love of freedom and the love of humanity. They believe in the cause.

You missed the point.

WWII can hardly be considered analogous to the current situation. I would rather die than fight another man's country-conquering war.

Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11. I supported the war in Afghanistan. It was Al-Queda's stronhold, we were just in chasing them out.

Basically, I do not believe in the cause. How can you expect someone to fight wholeheartedly if they do not believe in the cause?

 

[Nanotech]

Originally posted by: Hubris
Funny, cause I thought the thing that made America great was the FREEDOM that was given to us, including the freedom not to serve if we didn't want to. (And before you jump on me, I plan on serving after I graduate from college) And in times of war, there's never been a shortage of people willing to defend this country. Well, I should say in times when the war was JUSTIFIED. Vietnam was never a good idea, and Iraq isn't either. Though Iraq is less of a bad idea than Vietnam, but it's starting to blow up in our faces.

Was this just a figure of speach or were you being serious? :shocked:

 

[DougK62]

I can't believe how many whiny bitches there are in this thread. "Bush is a poopy face and I don't wanna fight his stupid war. Waaahhhh. WAAAHHHHHH"

 

[Jeff7181]

Whatever reason Bush gives for entering this war, it had to be done. Iraq was a haven for terrorists, Saddam supported terrorism, and he terrorized his own people. I like to think of this war as an extension of the war against terrorism. If our troops weren't being shot at in Iraq, they'd be getting shot at in other countries. Do you honestly think Saddam would just sit there and watch us sweep through Afghanistan? Hell no... he might not send his military out, but you can be damn sure he'd provide what he could to the terrorists we're fighting against.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: DougK62
I can't believe how many whiny bitches there are in this thread. "Bush is a poopy face and I don't wanna fight his stupid war. Waaahhhh. WAAAHHHHHH"

Who is whining? We're stating our opinions on the matter.

You're the only one whining.. that we don't accept Bush's war as being justified.

Originally posted by: Jeff7181
Whatever reason Bush gives for entering this war, it had to be done. Iraq was a haven for terrorists, Saddam supported terrorism, and he terrorized his own people. I like to think of this war as an extension of the war against terrorism. If our troops weren't being shot at in Iraq, they'd be getting shot at in other countries. Do you honestly think Saddam would just sit there and watch us sweep through Afghanistan? Hell no... he might not send his military out, but you can be damn sure he'd provide what he could to the terrorists we're fighting against.

We better get busy and finish instilling our vision of life into the rest of the world, then.

Who's next? Brazil.. I think we should take Brazil. Afterall, they probably have WMD - Weapons of Monkey Destruction!!!

 

[tec699]

Originally posted by: Fausto
Draft = go to war, get shot at. Why should I unwillingly fight in a war I believe is unjust? I'm not going to go get my ass shot off in Fallujah just to win a GWB pissing contest, sorry.

Then leave this country.

 

[maziwanka]

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith
2 bucks says this winds up in P&N

thats a sucka bet

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181
Whatever reason Bush gives for entering this war, it had to be done. Iraq was a haven for terrorists, Saddam supported terrorism, and he terrorized his own people. I like to think of this war as an extension of the war against terrorism. If our troops weren't being shot at in Iraq, they'd be getting shot at in other countries. Do you honestly think Saddam would just sit there and watch us sweep through Afghanistan? Hell no... he might not send his military out, but you can be damn sure he'd provide what he could to the terrorists we're fighting against.

everything i've seen indicates that he did not support al qaeda and they were enemies. just about every nation supports terrorism in one form or another, but i don't think his support for terrorism was a threat to anyone other than iraq's neighbors and his political enemies.

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: Hubris

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: oniq
I don't agree I should be killing anyone for any nation.

Would you believe the same if we were invaded?

It's happened before.

:roll: Yeah, in the war of 1812 and kinda sorta in WW2.

Tell the men and women who died and affected in Pearl Harbor that they were kinda sorta invaded. :roll:

 

[gistech1978]

Originally posted by: tec699

Originally posted by: Fausto
Draft = go to war, get shot at. Why should I unwillingly fight in a war I believe is unjust? I'm not going to go get my ass shot off in Fallujah just to win a GWB pissing contest, sorry.

Then leave this country.

okay mr 'patriot'.
you can do the same.
get your butt down to the recruiter, enlist and get over to iraq.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: Hubris

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: oniq
I don't agree I should be killing anyone for any nation.

Would you believe the same if we were invaded?

It's happened before.

:roll: Yeah, in the war of 1812 and kinda sorta in WW2.

Tell the men and women who died and affected in Pearl Harbor that they were kinda sorta invaded. :roll:

does an aerial bombardment and attack count as invasion? i assumed hubris was talking about the incidents up in alaska

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: tec699

Originally posted by: Fausto
Draft = go to war, get shot at. Why should I unwillingly fight in a war I believe is unjust? I'm not going to go get my ass shot off in Fallujah just to win a GWB pissing contest, sorry.

Then leave this country.

What a cheap shot. :|

Why should he have to leave this country because he does not agree with the current government and its tactics and policies?

Being against the current leadership is one of the rights this country grants us.

Asshole.

 

[Wuffsunie]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181
Whatever reason Bush gives for entering this war, it had to be done. Iraq was a haven for terrorists, Saddam supported terrorism, and he terrorized his own people. I like to think of this war as an extension of the war against terrorism. If our troops weren't being shot at in Iraq, they'd be getting shot at in other countries. Do you honestly think Saddam would just sit there and watch us sweep through Afghanistan? Hell no... he might not send his military out, but you can be damn sure he'd provide what he could to the terrorists we're fighting against.

Please say you left off the sarcasm tags, because otherwise that is one of the stupidest things I have ever read on ATOT. It really belongs in P&N. Any argument you even attempt to make along this line can be refuted by simply pointing out one of the myriad of other targets around the world, a number of them US allies.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: Hubris

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: oniq
I don't agree I should be killing anyone for any nation.

Would you believe the same if we were invaded?

It's happened before.

:roll: Yeah, in the war of 1812 and kinda sorta in WW2.

Tell the men and women who died and affected in Pearl Harbor that they were kinda sorta invaded. :roll:

Was Pearl Harbor invaded or not?

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: Hubris

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: oniq
I don't agree I should be killing anyone for any nation.

Would you believe the same if we were invaded?

It's happened before.

:roll: Yeah, in the war of 1812 and kinda sorta in WW2.

Tell the men and women who died and affected in Pearl Harbor that they were kinda sorta invaded. :roll:

does an aerial bombardment and attack count as invasion? i assumed hubris was talking about the incidents up in alaska

I would also count U.S. possessions and protectorates. Though there were the landings in the Aleutians as you said.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: Hubris

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: oniq
I don't agree I should be killing anyone for any nation.

Would you believe the same if we were invaded?

It's happened before.

:roll: Yeah, in the war of 1812 and kinda sorta in WW2.

Tell the men and women who died and affected in Pearl Harbor that they were kinda sorta invaded. :roll:

Was Pearl Harbor invaded or not?

I think one of the midget sub crews made it ashore when their sub was disabled, so technically I guess so.

 

[DougK62]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Jeff7181
Whatever reason Bush gives for entering this war, it had to be done. Iraq was a haven for terrorists, Saddam supported terrorism, and he terrorized his own people. I like to think of this war as an extension of the war against terrorism. If our troops weren't being shot at in Iraq, they'd be getting shot at in other countries. Do you honestly think Saddam would just sit there and watch us sweep through Afghanistan? Hell no... he might not send his military out, but you can be damn sure he'd provide what he could to the terrorists we're fighting against.

everything i've seen indicates that he did not support al qaeda and they were enemies. just about every nation supports terrorism in one form or another, but i don't think his support for terrorism was a threat to anyone other than iraq's neighbors and his political enemies.

You haven't been paying attention too closely if you haven't heard of Iraq-Al Qaeda ties. Here's from Google:

Google Results

Even Clinton has acknowledged that he knew about the Iraq-Al Qaeda ties when he was in office.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: DougK62

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Whatever reason Bush gives for entering this war, it had to be done. Iraq was a haven for terrorists, Saddam supported terrorism, and he terrorized his own people. I like to think of this war as an extension of the war against terrorism. If our troops weren't being shot at in Iraq, they'd be getting shot at in other countries. Do you honestly think Saddam would just sit there and watch us sweep through Afghanistan? Hell no... he might not send his military out, but you can be damn sure he'd provide what he could to the terrorists we're fighting against.

everything i've seen indicates that he did not support al qaeda and they were enemies. just about every nation supports terrorism in one form or another, but i don't think his support for terrorism was a threat to anyone other than iraq's neighbors and his political enemies.

You haven't been paying attention too closely if you haven't heard of Iraq-Al Qaeda ties. Here's from Google:


Google Results


Even Clinton has acknowledged that he knew about the Iraq-Al Qaeda ties when he was in office.

Al-Queda has "ties" to every country.

Regardless, I understand what you're trying to say. That still doesen't make the war in iraq just, IMO.

Even though the people of Iraq will most likely end up better off, it is not fair for us to play World God. Like I said, if this is our new foreign policy, we better get busy, because there sure are a lot of other rogue countries that could use our "help".

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: DougK62

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Whatever reason Bush gives for entering this war, it had to be done. Iraq was a haven for terrorists, Saddam supported terrorism, and he terrorized his own people. I like to think of this war as an extension of the war against terrorism. If our troops weren't being shot at in Iraq, they'd be getting shot at in other countries. Do you honestly think Saddam would just sit there and watch us sweep through Afghanistan? Hell no... he might not send his military out, but you can be damn sure he'd provide what he could to the terrorists we're fighting against.

everything i've seen indicates that he did not support al qaeda and they were enemies. just about every nation supports terrorism in one form or another, but i don't think his support for terrorism was a threat to anyone other than iraq's neighbors and his political enemies.

You haven't been paying attention too closely if you haven't heard of Iraq-Al Qaeda ties. Here's from Google:



Google Results



Even Clinton has acknowledged that he knew about the Iraq-Al Qaeda ties when he was in office.

He also had huge quantities of WMDS. Bush went to war over it. I forget, are they in the Smithsonian now? I figure they must be displayed somewhere. Point us at them.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Modeps
Spawned from "A Few Draft Related Questions..."

Seriously, what the hell is wrong with many of you? It seems like the general concensus is that a Draft was instituted, most of you would dodge it or look for a backdoor to get out. You live in this country and enjoy the freedom it provides. If there is a draft, suck it up, be a man (or woman) and serve your time for this nation.

This nation has turned into a bunch of beached whales that sun themselves with TV waves and are too afraid of their own reflections to step up for a nation you should love. Even if you dont agree with the politics, you should have no qualms about giving a few years for the U S of A if it is asked of you.

Lighten up Francis. I'm sure most of us were kidding around. I know I was.

I'm actually too old now to serve but this was brought up during the first Gulf War in 1991 and I was definitely young enough to serve then. I would have gone if I was drafted but I wasn't and I'm too old now anyway.

I've never served my country but I have the deepest respect and gratitude towards those who do.

My .02