AMD Ryzen 5 2400G and Ryzen 3 2200G APUs performance unveiled

[neblogai]

Even if it was feasible for AMD to have a RR 2c/4t desktop APU available, how many of us would actually buy it? Given that folks, including us, are keeping computers longer it makes more sense to spend an extra $30 to $40 upfront due to this.

Dual cores are perfectly viable for mobile market (even for gaming), NUCs and similar media consumption devices, even for low cost enterprise mobile and desktop. It could also work for lowest end gaming for emerging gaming markets in third world countries, and internet caffees. If AMD has production capacity- I want them to make 'Banded Kestrel' as soon as possible for all those previously mentioned devices- even when established desktop gaming market is mostly past dual-core.

Selling something doesn't mean you are making a profit. They can still offer Bristol ridge in sub $100 space. A 2-core raven ridge would either mean disabling most of the hardware in current die or make a new one. The later is of the table because it's against the modular design of Zen that comes in 4-core blocks. There won't be a 2-core design.

CCX'es work just fine with some cores disabled in them- that already proves dual-core CCX can be made.

 

[prtskg]

Production capacity of GF and budget of AMD are major reasons why 2 core 4 thread Raven Ridge desktop parts haven't been released yet. These are just temporary problems which will go with time.

 

[beginner99]

Production capacity of GF and budget of AMD are major reasons why 2 core 4 thread Raven Ridge desktop parts haven't been released yet. These are just temporary problems which will go with time.

But then you will probably also have to disable some CUs and in the end you are disabling half the die. Is that really worth it? What if your foundry is running at 100% and you can sell every quad-core RR? Makes no sene to offer a cheaper one with functional-disabled cores.

 

[prtskg]

But then you will probably also have to disable some CUs and in the end you are disabling half the die. Is that really worth it? What if your foundry is running at 100% and you can sell every quad-core RR? Makes no sene to offer a cheaper one with functional-disabled cores.

If 100% perfection is there in RR production, such a product makes no sense. But since 100% perfect dies are impossible, such a product is a possibility as we have seen AMD announce 2 core 4 thread RR in laptop market.

 

[moinmoin]

AMD still participates in the race to the bottom relative price wise, but Zen scales up to servers and HEDT so obviously they focus there instead having to bottom the bottom as they had to with the construction cores. One thing to keep in mind is, that while AMD has delivered a lot of products these past 10 months, they are still based on so far only two distinct dies (Zeppelin and Raven), with a new die (Pinnacle) to launch in three months. Banded Kestrel, the optimized bottom of the bottom 2c4t 3CU APU die that should be a profit at its small die size, is still a distinct die that may not be worth the focus and effort now apparently needed for high margin markets that AMD could only dream of participating in during the construction core days.

That said unlike Intel AMD seems to be happy to drop the price of their gradually outdated generations instead keeping it stable so we may see Raven APUs significantly drop the price while Matisse CPUs/Picasso APUs are prepared for launch next year.

 

[Shivansps]

Something tells me that a lot of budget gamers will be buying the 2200G and 2400G in droves if this mining bubble doesn't pop anytime soon. They will simply get by with the iGPU until it pops.

And you can be sure that 2200G and 2400G are not to be brought by miners? 2400G could be a miner APU,if it worth it perf/energy they are going to buy it for mining rigs.

In order for budget gamers to turn over an APU, especially something expensive like the 2400G, GTX1050 and RX560 prices prices needs to go up, thats is not happening for now. We have been over this.
Saying this we just got a shipment of the G4560 at almost the old price. Pentiums+1050 is what budget gamers choose.

 

[The Stilt]

And you can be sure that 2200G and 2400G are not to be brought by miners?

I'll guarantee these won't be used for mining.
The performance won't be good and you need a motherboard and a set of RAM for each of your "miners".

No ROI what so ever.

 

[Shivansps]

I'll guarantee these won't be used for mining.
The performance won't be good and you need a motherboard and a set of RAM for each of your "miners".

No ROI what so ever.

mmm well, last time i mined and had mining rigs was with the bitcoin back in 2011, im not mining nor im following this now.

BUT, if i need to build a mining rig, it could be a Celeron with 6 RX580 or a 2200/2400G with 6 RX580... if it mines well enoght i dont see why not.

 

[PeterScott]

mmm well, last time i mined and had mining rigs was with the bitcoin back in 2011, im not mining nor im following this now.

BUT, if i need to build a mining rig, it could be a Celeron with 6 RX580 or a 2200/2400G with 6 RX580... if it mines well enoght i dont see why not.

That looks like you are moving the goalposts.

Mining is about GPU, and your previous post was talking about using the APU for mining, thus implying the onboard GPU would be of interest in mining. It isn't, as was pointed out.

Now you are talking about using the CPU with a bunch of GPU cards.

It really doesn't matter what CPU is used and mining has no real effect on the CPU market.

It has massive effect on the GPU market because normally only a minorty of PCs have a GPU card, making GPU cards kind of a niche item and then suddenly miners are attaching 6 GPUs to PC, which can easily strain supplies of what was a niche product before.

 

[Shivansps]

That looks like you are moving the goalposts.

Mining is about GPU, and your previous post was talking about using the APU for mining, thus implying the onboard GPU would be of interest in mining. It isn't, as was pointed out.

Now you are talking about using the CPU with a bunch of GPU cards.

It really doesn't matter what CPU is used and mining has no real effect on the CPU market.

It has massive effect on the GPU market because normally only a minorty of PCs have a GPU card, making GPU cards kind of a niche item and then suddenly miners are attaching 6 GPUs to PC, which can easily strain supplies of what was a niche product before.

No, who on earth thinks its valid to mine with APU only? I really needed to clarify that?

What im talking is about using the APU IGP + the 6 dGPUs.
Back on my mining days that was contemplated, but the APU were really bad at mining and it had a negative perf/W- So people just stuck to Semprons 140.

Mining is another thing than normal use, if a 2200G and 2400G has a positive perf/W to mine they are going to use it for the mining rigs, even if they have to expend extra on then. Ill guess the one its on risk is the 2200G, $40-$50 extra for a miner is not much.

 

[PeterScott]

No, who on earth thinks its valid to mine with APU only? I really needed to clarify that?

What im talking is about using the APU IGP + the 6 dGPUs..

The APU IGP is irrelevant for mining, and discussing the APU for mining at all is nothing but a red herring.

 

[whm1974]

And you can be sure that 2200G and 2400G are not to be brought by miners? 2400G could be a miner APU,if it worth it perf/energy they are going to buy it for mining rigs.

In order for budget gamers to turn over an APU, especially something expensive like the 2400G, GTX1050 and RX560 prices prices needs to go up, thats is not happening for now. We have been over this.
Saying this we just got a shipment of the G4560 at almost the old price. Pentiums+1050 is what budget gamers choose.

Checking Newegg for the Rx560, PowerColor is in stock at $140 and the Sapphire is in at $280. The 1050 is at the same price the 1050Ti was going for. Mean while the 1050Ti is close to $200. So it wouldn't surprise me if gamers brought RR APUs to tide them over until GPU prices come down.

 

[Topweasel]

The APU IGP is irrelevant for mining, and discussing the APU for mining at all is nothing but a red herring.

Maybe I missed something, Mining isn't really my forte. But I get what he is asking. Take the 2200G for example. ~$100, is it possible to use the GPU along with other GPU's and get your money worth, not for the CPU but the difference between that CPU and lets say a Celeron that people were picking up for ~$50?

I mean I would lean to no because AM4 APU's lose 8 PCIe lanes. Which means PCIe 16x #2 won't work (normally 8/8 but with APU it's 8/0). But I don't think it's a blatant as don't bring it up.

 

[Excessi0n]

I'll guarantee these won't be used for mining.
The performance won't be good and you need a motherboard and a set of RAM for each of your "miners".

No ROI what so ever.

While mining using the APU on its own is definitely a nonstarter, I could see miners using these as the CPUs that they're running all their GPUs off of. It'd definitely be more expensive than the bargain basement Celerons that are typically used, but it would also be able pull in some revenue instead of just doing nothing.

Assuming that it provides a decent hashrate for the power, anyways.

I mean I would lean to no because AM4 APU's lose 8 PCIe lanes. Which means PCIe 16x #2 won't work (normally 8/8 but with APU it's 8/0). But I don't think it's a blatant as don't bring it up.

You can mine off a single PCIe lane. That's why you have silly stuff like this.

 

[Topweasel]

While mining using the APU on its own is definitely a nonstarter, I could see miners using these as the CPUs that they're running all their GPUs off of. It'd definitely be more expensive than the bargain basement Celerons that are typically used, but it would also be able pull in some revenue instead of just doing nothing.

Assuming that it provides a decent hashrate for the power, anyways.



You can mine off a single PCIe lane.

That's not the issue, I guess the rack guys could get away with it and manage, but an APU will disable the second "16x PCIe" slot on motherboards meaning one less connection for video cards.

As for hashrate for power. You only really need to include the extra power against the power usage of the CPU that you would be getting if not for this APU.

 

[Shivansps]

Ill say it again, the only reason llano and trinity APUs was not used back in 2011-2013 for bitcoin mining rigs, was the igp was way too much power hungry for the minimal hashrate it provided.
The same is true today for the BR APUs. IF RR uses less power and has higher hashrate things may change.

That's not the issue, I guess the rack guys could get away with it and manage, but an APU will disable the second "16x PCIe" slot on motherboards meaning one less connection for video cards.

As for hashrate for power. You only really need to include the extra power against the power usage of the CPU that you would be getting if not for this APU.

That is only for BR APUs, i think it will not happen on RR. And not in every motherboard, the secondary x4 pci-e was meant to connect the M2 slot, not the x4 slot.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

That is only for BR APUs, i think it will not happen on RR. And not in every motherboard, the secondary x4 pci-e was meant to connect the M2 slot, not the x4 slot.

I'm not sure about how many lanes RR has, but you could always use the GFX x16 slot for an SSD, if you use the IGP. RR should provide the same separate x4 slot as Ryzen. That way, RR would actually provide enough lanes to RAID a couple of x4 drives directly from the CPU. If someone needs plenty of I/O on the cheap, and doesn't care about graphics.

Depending on how the bifucation is setup, it might even be possible to run 3x x4 PCIe drives from the CPU. That's pretty cool for a "budget" platform.

 

[The Stilt]

I'm not sure about how many lanes RR has.

Sixteen in total.

 

[whm1974]

Sixteen in total.

What??? AMD couldn't put the whole 24 in?

 

[LTC8K6]

Well, we can't buy video cards anymore, so we're going to have to buy APUs to get AMD video cards.

 

[whm1974]

Well, we can't buy video cards anymore, so we're going to have to buy APUs to get AMD video cards.

Yeah I'm wondering about that. Hell even the 1050Ti is getting close to $200 and/or sometimes out of stock. The 2400G might end up being highly successful due to this damn bubble.

 

[The Stilt]

What??? AMD couldn't put the whole 24 in?

Zeppelin has 32 total in the die, Raven has half that.
32 would have been excess as Raven is a mobile part after all.

 

[whm1974]

Zeppelin has 32 total in the die, Raven has half that.
32 would have been excess as Raven is a mobile part after all.

For the mobile part for sure, but what about the desktop RR? That wouldn't be a waste.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Sixteen in total.

Total, or just for graphics?

Anyway, AM4 needs 4 of those lanes for the FCH. So you'd be left with 12 lanes, plus those coming off the FCH. That'd still be enough for an x8 slot for graphics, and an x4 slot for an SSD. Again, if you use the IGP, you can commandeer the graphics slot for an SSD with an adaptor. So it still looks pretty good overall.

 

[vinhom]

So, maximum 8 lanes for dGPU using Raven Ridge dies?