AMD Radeon HD6870/HD6850 Reviews Thread

[Idontcare]

I got to the first benchmark page on the [H] article, and he is comparing each card at completely different settings. Why on Earth would he do that? I can't even imagine reading another review from that site, just seeing that once; since he obviously doesn't understand the scientific method.

EDIT: Nevermind. Now that I read to the end of the page, I understand what he was trying to do. Give the highest playable settings for each card which is useful knowledge. Of course his "apples to apples" test at the end is a little light.

Hey Marty, yeah its one of those "hey, that actually kinda makes sense from an end-user perspective" moments.

We all, save that 1-alpha portion of the 6-sigma distribution, turn up the resolution and eye-candy to whatever max value we can play while keeping those avg/min refresh rates at an acceptable level.

So with that end-user reality in mind the [H] guys seek out what the end-user experience is going to be for any given card and game combo.

Tell me honestly, aren't you the slightest bit happy to see another review out there that isn't just "yet another review"? Yeah diversity! Right?

I've had my similar moments of questionably rash judgement with regards to the team at [H], but they always come back and convince me my judgement was totally misplaced and earn my respect twice-over. One of these days I'm going to learn my lesson and just have a little faith

- Phil

 

[ShadowOfMyself]

The problem is each person has their own definition of "playable"

Their Metro 2033 numbers made me go "WTF", Id much rather get 45+ fps at 1920x1200 than 30 at 2560x1600

Still dont bother reading their reviews because of that... In others sites we get to see how every card performs at EVERY resolution, not just the one the reviewer felt was playable, theres no comparison

They talk about canned benchmarks and whatever, but to me its just them being lazy

 

[Idontcare]

The problem is each person has their own definition of "playable"

Their Metro 2033 numbers made me go "WTF", Id much rather get 45+ fps at 1920x1200 than 30 at 2560x1600

Still dont bother reading their reviews because of that... In others sites we get to see how every card performs at EVERY resolution, not just the one the reviewer felt was playable, theres no comparison

They talk about canned benchmarks and whatever, but to me its just them being lazy

I vacillate wildly between the opinion you just stated and the opinion I stated above it.

So yeah, I totally agree. But come tomorrow I may not.

I'm just saying I think it is only beneficial that in toto across all the reviews we end-users have access to a review such as theirs perchance such a review suits our particular panache.

If it doesn't, then we just disregard it and relegate it to the "irrelevant" bin.

 

[GaiaHunter]

That's what I walked away with too.

Barts is pretty impressive for performance/dollar but absolute performance is still 2009'ish. (sucks for NV that so too is fermi)

I'm waiting for the real 2010 performance bump to stand-up. Caymen has to be it, how could it not?

I'm not sure if I'm disappointed Barts is a Cypress tweak instead of a new gen or if impressed by the engendering tricks pulled to achieve similar performance at a smaller die size and bit lower power consumption.

Bit similar to GF104 compared to GF100, except the power consumption side (GF104 OC at GF100 performance levels has worse power consumption).

 

[bryanW1995]

I think that it's smart for them to do something different like that, and it's nice that they actually test the settings in the game instead of using a canned benchmark.

 

[toyota]

That's what I walked away with too.

Barts is pretty impressive for performance/dollar but absolute performance is still 2009'ish. (sucks for NV that so too is fermi)

I'm waiting for the real 2010 performance bump to stand-up. Caymen has to be it, how could it not?

what is sad is that I paid less for my gtx260 2 years ago then what the 6850 is going for. so 2 years later all I can get is just a 40% bump in performance and even that still costs me more money.

 

[Lonyo]

what is sad is that I paid less for my gtx260 2 years ago then what the 6850 is going for. so 2 years later all I can get is just a 40% bump in performance and even that still costs me more money.

Shens. The HD6850 in the UK is about the price of an HD4850 2 and a bit years ago, and it offers ~90% performance improvement.
According to AT, 23 months ago in the US, the GTX260 (216) was priced at $280, $100 more than the 6850.

Unless you got a 260-192 at an absolute steal/with massive discount/black friday deal, there's almost no way in hell you paid less.

 

[toyota]

Shens. The HD6850 in the UK is about the price of an HD4850 2 and a bit years ago, and it offers ~90% performance improvement.
According to AT, 23 months ago in the US, the GTX260 (216) was priced at $280, $100 more than the 6850.

Unless you got a 260-192 at an absolute steal/with massive discount/black friday deal, there's almost no way in hell you paid less.

165 bucks is what I paid and it was way before Black Friday. it was $185 after $20 rebate and Newegg gave me an additional $20 credit because it did not come with some Tom Clancy game that it was bundled with.

 

[toyota]

I just looked it up and actually I was a bit off. it was $229 with free shipping and then had a rebate for $20. then newegg gave me a $25 credit because it did not come with a game like it was supposed to. bottom line was $184.

 

[krumme]

Hey Marty, yeah its one of those "hey, that actually kinda makes sense from an end-user perspective" moments.

We all, save that 1-alpha portion of the 6-sigma distribution, turn up the resolution and eye-candy to whatever max value we can play while keeping those avg/min refresh rates at an acceptable level.

So with that end-user reality in mind the [H] guys seek out what the end-user experience is going to be for any given card and game combo.

Tell me honestly, aren't you the slightest bit happy to see another review out there that isn't just "yet another review"? Yeah diversity! Right?

I've had my similar moments of questionably rash judgement with regards to the team at [H], but they always come back and convince me my judgement was totally misplaced and earn my respect twice-over. One of these days I'm going to learn my lesson and just have a little faith

- Phil

I had exactly the same experience with hardocp. The first time i saw it i though what on earht is that. For everytime i read it, it makes more and more sense. Today, not only will i visit there first - and hope my favorite games are there - but i am starting to get irritated by the methology used by all other sites H methology should be mandatory. Hope Anand will get there or something similar.

 

[Elfear]

overclock them both and they are even because the 460 has way more headroom.

Really? Seems like the few sites that overclocked their cards had the 6850's at close to 900Mhz with no voltage increase. Wizzard had his 6850 up to 1050Mhz or so with a voltage bump. Seems like it has plenty of headroom but we'll have to wait for more results to come in.

 

[toyota]

Really? Seems like the few sites that overclocked their cards had the 6850's at close to 900Mhz with no voltage increase. Wizzard had his 6850 up to 1050Mhz or so with a voltage bump. Seems like it has plenty of headroom but we'll have to wait for more results to come in.

a typical gtx460 does well over 20% with no voltage adjustment. yeah with voltage adjustments the cards may have about the same headroom though.

 

[crislevin]

OC talk is all rubbish, we should not get tie down to something most users won't ever touch. Whats the point?

 

[toyota]

OC talk is all rubbish, we should not get tie down to something most users won't ever touch. Whats the point?

and "most users" have integrated video so should we continue even talking about video cards? last I looked this forum has lots of enthusiasts so not talking about overclocking is silly. if it doesn't pertain to you then move on and let others discuss it.

 

[crislevin]

and "most users" have integrated video so should we continue even talking about video cards? last I looked this forum has lots of enthusiasts so not talking about overclocking is silly. if it doesn't pertain to you then move on and let others discuss it.

lol, show me any proof that 10% of discrete card users OC their card, I will agree with ya.

To exaggerate a small aspect that are not meaningful to most users, is just biased attempt to distract the discussion.

You didn't see people making post after post about single card eyefinity setup, right? I bet thats as important as OC for most people.

 

[toyota]

lol, show me any proof that 10% of discrete card users OC their card, I will agree with ya.

To exaggerate a small aspect that are not meaningful to most users, is just biased attempt to distract the discussion.

You didn't see people making post after post about single card eyefinity setup, right? I bet thats as important as OC for most people.

wow you are being extremely narrow minded. overclocking is most certainly an important factor for many enthusiasts. its a factor just like power consumption, price, fan noise, and size of the card. of course those factors weigh differently for different users so let them decide. and again if it doesn't matter to you then great but let others discuss it if they want to.

 

[Udgnim]

HardOCP has good review methodology imo

they have their subjective bit with what they consider max playable settings and they still have an apples to apples comparison to compare the cards at the exact same settings

 

[GaiaHunter]

HardwareHeaven (former DriverHeaven)

http://www.hardwareheaven.com/revie...d-6850-graphics-card-review-introduction.html

A bit of eyefinity, little talk about AMD 3D (3rd party stuff makes it not that good for games) and some GPU computing plus the regular stuff.

 

[schneiderguy]

what is sad is that I paid less for my gtx260 2 years ago then what the 6850 is going for. so 2 years later all I can get is just a 40% bump in performance and even that still costs me more money.

I'm in the same situation. Paying $200+ for a card that is only 40% faster is IMO ridiculous.

Maybe I should be happy that I'm getting so much out of my gtx 260? :awe: I've never had a video card for this long before D:

 

[edplayer]

what is sad is that I paid less for my gtx260 2 years ago then what the 6850 is going for. so 2 years later all I can get is just a 40% bump in performance and even that still costs me more money.

I just looked it up and actually I was a bit off. it was $229 with free shipping and then had a rebate for $20. then newegg gave me a $25 credit because it did not come with a game like it was supposed to. bottom line was $184.

but wasn't that card really expensive when it launched, like $400? How about waiting a few months and buying a 6850 on sale w rebate and a bundled game...

 

[toyota]

but wasn't that card really expensive when it launched, like $400? How about waiting a few months and buying a 6850 on sale w rebate and a bundled game...

I understand that but I want a nice upgrade to my 2 year old now without having to get a loud power hungry card. remember people said wait on the 5870/5850 to go down in price and it only went up.

 

[Kenmitch]

OC talk is all rubbish, we should not get tie down to something most users won't ever touch. Whats the point?

Nothing wrong with a mild GPU overclock

Some people don't like to keep the free speed laying on the table.

 

[GaiaHunter]

I understand that but I want a nice upgrade to my 2 year old now without having to get a loud power hungry card. remember people said wait on the 5870/5850 to go down in price and it only went up.

Exactly how can the 6870 and 6850 go up in price?

The only way I see it is NVIDIA EOLing GF104.

Now the 6900 series that should be a compelling upgrade over a GTX 260 probably won't come cheap and I doubt AMD will sacrifice margins to crush GTX 480.

Again, GT200 vs HD4000 was a very special event with special circumstances - AMD/ATi mind share and market share were really low and AMD came with a really competitive product and did all it needed to recapture marker/mind share - that are not likely to occur in the near future, unless someone screws badly and then is able to recover.

At this time both players are well matched. Great products by both will mean better prices but no way close to those crazy GT200 vs HD4000 era prices.

A crushing product from another side could also mean great prices if some of the players aim for a kill (a bit like Intel did with Core 2, even then Intel only wanted to humiliate and not kill) but I seriously doubt either AMD or NVIDIA will sacrifice margins to kill the other with Intel looming around.

Bottom line if we keep comparing price/performance to the GT200-HD4000 era we will keep being disappointed because the bar is raised simply to high.

 

[toyota]

Exactly how can the 6870 and 6850 go up in price?

The only way I see it is NVIDIA EOLing GF104.

Now the 6900 series that should be a compelling upgrade over a GTX 260 probably won't come cheap and I doubt AMD will sacrifice margins to crush GTX 480.

Again, GT200 vs HD4000 was a very special event with special circumstances - AMD/ATi mind share and market share were really low and AMD came with a really competitive product and did all it needed to recapture marker/mind share - that are not likely to occur in the near future, unless someone screws badly and then is able to recover.

At this time both players are well matched. Great products by both will mean better prices but no way close to those crazy GT200 vs HD4000 era prices.

A crushing product from another side could also mean great prices if some of the players aim for a kill (a bit like Intel did with Core 2, even then Intel only wanted to humiliate and not kill) but I seriously doubt either AMD or NVIDIA will sacrifice margins to kill the other with Intel looming around.

Bottom line if we keep comparing price/performance to the GT200-HD4000 era we will keep being disappointed because the bar is raised simply to high.

well yeah but they may not get any lower anytime soon either. if I had something slower than a gtx260 then I would go ahead and get the 6850 or gtx460 and overclock it and be done. as it is now I may just wait a bit longer and see what other cards come out in the next month or so. I still may go ahead and sell the gtx260 now and make due with the 8600gt in less demanding games. I am actually surprised at how well the 8600gt handles even newer games but the 256mb is killing it some titles.

 

[blastingcap]

well yeah but they may not get any lower anytime soon either. if I had something slower than a gtx260 then I would go ahead and get the 6850 or gtx460 and overclock it and be done. as it is now I may just wait a bit longer and see what other cards come out in the next month or so. I still may go ahead and sell the gtx260 now and make due with the 8600gt in less demanding games. I am actually surprised at how well the 8600gt handles even newer games but the 256mb is killing it some titles.

I'm waiting for price gouging to stop and for AT's 6850 roundup to decide, even though my GPU is slower than a GTX260's. If AMD wasn't lying, then the price gouging should be over soon as stockpiles flood North America.