AMD FX 4350 or 6300 for Gaming?

[Sonikku]

I've seen Fry's promo code emails sometime have a haswell 3.6ghz i3 for $79 with code. Doubt they lasted long at that price though. I'd have bought it but I opted to get a used i5 quad sandy and keep my motherboard.

 

[john5220]

You are limited to 4c/8t with socket 1150, I believe.

Your top chip would be the 4790K.

hmm well 4790K i7 in 6 years will be a beast.

when games really take a huge proper advantage of 8 or more threads I think we really are a long way off till see truly see proper 8 threaded use.

I suspect it will take 15 years before we see that a i7 4790K is minimum requirements to run a game.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

hmm well 4790K i7 in 6 years will be a beast.

when games really take a huge proper advantage of 8 or more threads I think we really are a long way off till see truly see proper 8 threaded use.

I suspect it will take 15 years before we see that a i7 4790K is minimum requirements to run a game.

Yeah.... Okay, George. If that total bull**** were actually true, we could install a modern game on a Pentium III 450 Mhz CPU today (a 15 year old chip).
Moore's law may have slowed down -- but it hasn't stopped.

 

[john5220]

Yeah.... Okay, George. If that total bull**** were actually true, we could install a modern game on a Pentium III 450 Mhz CPU today (a 15 year old chip).
Moore's law may have slowed down -- but it hasn't stopped.

Considering a Intel Q9950 or whatever was the 4GHZ OC intel quad core CPU has yet to reach minimum requirements, approaching 8 years since its release.

Then yes I am pretty sure a 4790K will take 15 years to become minimum requirement for a game.

To this day a Phenom II 980 has yet to reach minimum requirements for games. It will take another 6 years before 6 core CPUs are minimum requirements.

I estimate and I am pretty sure I am accurate on this prediction that it will take 6 years before the QX9950 / Phenom II 980 is no longer capable of running games on minimum settings.

That leaves 9 years left for a 8 Threaded 4790K to become so outdated that it no longer meets minimum requirements.

So yes we are 15 years away before we see 8 threaded 4 core intel CPU is the "MINIMUM" requirement for a game.

If the ultra slow pace of games in the last few years are anything to go by and efforts to move processing onto the GPU side, then yes 15 years before a 4790K is no longer able to achieve minimum requirements.

I am also certain that G3258 will go onto existing for the next 3 years. That gives us a 15 year lifespan for dual core CPU gaming. I expect a 15 year lifespan for 8 threaded gaming also.

I will be amazed when the day reach and a game says "Error application failed minimum requirements to start are 12 cores"

 

[LTC8K6]

Gamers probably don't shoot for minimum, though.

The Witcher 3 System Requirements – Windows

Minimum requirements:
OS: 64-bit Windows 7 or 64-bit Windows 8 (8.1). DirectX 11 is necessary to run the game.
Processor: Intel CPU Core i5-2500K 3.3GHz, AMD CPU Phenom II X4 940
Finding a Gaming CPUs performance chart and comparing one’s CPU with our minimum is suggested.
Graphics: Nvidia GPU GeForce GTX 660 or AMD GPU Radeon HD 7870
Please mind that we only officially support full-size desktop graphics cards. Finding a graphics card performance hierarchy chart online and comparing one’s video card with our minimum is suggested.
RAM: 6GB
Disk space: 40 GB
.

Recommended requirements:
OS: 64-bit Windows 7 or 64-bit Windows 8 (8.1). DirectX 11 is necessary to run the game.
Processor: Intel CPU Core i7 3770 3,4 GHz, AMD CPU AMD FX-8350 4 GHz
Graphics: Nvidia GPU GeForce GTX 770 or AMD GPU Radeon R9 290
RAM: 6GB
Disk space: 40 GB

 

[john5220]

^ and isn't it amazing how the G3258 dual core still runs Witcher 3 just fine?

And to think its way below minimum requirements

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHeqrQsPYs0

 

[escrow4]

^ and isn't it amazing how the G3258 dual core still runs Witcher 3 just fine?

And to think its way below minimum requirements

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHeqrQsPYs0

It doesn't:

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-the-best-pc-hardware-for-the-witcher-3

Minimums crater. Same with your other post. Core 2 and Phenom's in 2013 and onwards AAA games are rubbish for the same reason. Those dips you can feel/see. They can't sustain a solid FPS - 60/60 minimum/average (with some dips to 50ish depending on loading areas and bits of the engine).

 

[StrangerGuy]

It doesn't:

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-the-best-pc-hardware-for-the-witcher-3

Minimums crater. Same with your other post. Core 2 and Phenom's in 2013 and onwards AAA games are rubbish for the same reason. Those dips you can feel/see. They can't sustain a solid FPS - 60/60 minimum/average (with some dips to 50ish depending on loading areas and bits of the engine).

It's funny just how G3258 buyers think they are very smart with their money for a gaming rig when it gets massacred to bits even by a stock $110 i3.

 

[john5220]

It doesn't:

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-the-best-pc-hardware-for-the-witcher-3

Minimums crater. Same with your other post. Core 2 and Phenom's in 2013 and onwards AAA games are rubbish for the same reason. Those dips you can feel/see. They can't sustain a solid FPS - 60/60 minimum/average (with some dips to 50ish depending on loading areas and bits of the engine).

You don't need 60FPS to play a video game at an acceptable level.

Majority of PS3 and PS4 console games run at 30 FPS and it works just fine for every sane person.

Likewise the G3258 will run at 30FPS and will continue to for the next 3 years giving it a solid 15 year lifespan for dual core CPUs, admittedly G3258 is a huge upgrade from a Athlon X2 5600+ and a pentium D

 

[escrow4]

You don't need 60FPS to play a video game at an acceptable level.

Majority of PS3 and PS4 console games run at 30 FPS and it works just fine for every sane person.

Likewise the G3258 will run at 30FPS and will continue to for the next 3 years giving it a solid 15 year lifespan for dual core CPUs, admittedly G3258 is a huge upgrade from a Athlon X2 5600+ and a pentium D

Majority of console games dip into the 20s. Look at the same site for Witcher III and V. They can't even sustain 30FPS which is a rubbish target anyway. The whole point of PC is to push it. If all you can afford is a Pentium buy a console.

 

[LTC8K6]

^ and isn't it amazing how the G3258 dual core still runs Witcher 3 just fine?

And to think its way below minimum requirements

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHeqrQsPYs0

Witcher 3 - G3258 @4.4GHz

Game requirements are not based on massive overclocks.

 

[john5220]

^Yeah I admit G3258 4.4GHZ on aftermarket cooler isn't exactly your everyday dual core CPU.

Nevertheless I am proud of my purchase of the MSI ECO B85 board that is TUV German certified for 25 year life expectancy.

I can finally now build my 20 year dream PC. Yes I have been for some time now trying to put the funds together to build a PC that will last me 20 years. With my current CPU I ordered being the i3 4170, and my next CPU I am ordering in 7 years from now being the 4790K which will run at max 4ghz since this board don't support auto boost clock thingy to 4.4ghz.

I expect close to 20 years out of this system.

I am not your everyday gamer, I play games like Fighting Games, MOBA, RTS, Valve FPS like CS GO and TF2. All of which are targeted at very low end PC and last over a decade.

I don't buy new games just like that, I stick with one game for over 5000 hours. So this new PC will last me as long as the mainboard holds out. If its 25 years as they claim then so be it. I don't need upgrades like you guys. The main reason I picked intel was because of an upgrade path I am pretty sure 7 to 8 years from now I will get a 4790K to buy used at a much cheaper price.

If I still had my old Athlon 64 bit CPU from 10 years ago I would be running CS GO, TF2 and DOTA 2 just fine and dandy. Games that are targeted for 20 years.

I can guarantee you all, Valve and Blizzard isn't going to require a 4790K until the next 30 years. Their games still run on single core CPU just fine.

I just had to get this intel system because I really like DayZ which I would be playing for a couple decades to come aswell and any game made by Bohemia just flat out DOES NOT run on AMD systems when you are talking online with big servers lots of people.

My 760K Athlon AMD CPU 4.1GHZ and HD 7850 xfx black OC GPU used to get 10 FPS in Arma 3, DayZ etc on lowest settings. While my friend's G3220 pentium gets 30 fps, the best games out there are always intel favored games for some odd reason.

 

[VirtualLarry]

^Yeah I admit G3258 4.4GHZ on aftermarket cooler isn't exactly your everyday dual core CPU.

Nevertheless I am proud of my purchase of the MSI ECO B85 board that is TUV German certified for 25 year life expectancy.

I can finally now build my 20 year dream PC. Yes I have been for some time now trying to put the funds together to build a PC that will last me 20 years.

And I thought my two threads on a "10 year PC" were kind of "out there". 20 years? Are you predicting the death of Moore's Law?

There are some very real problems, sourcing boot / storage media, and working, supported OSes, at that point.

 

[john5220]

I am pretty sure moore's law is just fine.

Your 10 year PC is just fine depending on the games you play do you play for Graphics or do you play for Gameplay? Games designed for graphics alone are really just bad IMO like Battlefield 3 and 4 really horrible games but looks good.

I can't finish 99% of my steam backlog that I bought due to impulse buy all have 0.2 hours played on them.

But I am pretty sure aswell that DOTA 2 is going to be around for a minimum of 20 years before we see a DOTA 3. To add to the mix I am awaiting Killer Instinct, Street Fighter 5, Left 4 Dead 3, Warcraft 4, Diablo 4. All of which are going to last over 10 years before we see another iteration.

Games now are going based on the Microtransaction Model, instead of releasing newer games with better graphics, they are aiming for releasing characters and cosmetics.

We are also at the point where games look "almost like real life" so you don't really care about better graphics at this point because its really that good. Kinda like how intel says hey lets just get a iGPU thats "good enough" to run League of Legends and CS GO and DOTA 2 etc and we won't have any complaints.

You know very well larry that this isn't the age of Atari, SNES and PS1. You know that we are in the age of "good enough graphics" where the game with one of the oldest graphics and can run on a tablet CPU "league of legends" has 20 million players daily.

I think its so stupid to say if you don't have the best PC you should be gaming on consoles this is really retarded. Because the true gems in PC gaming are RTS and MOBA both genre which cannot be played on consoles and most at all cost require a PC.

http://store.steampowered.com/stats/

^ steam stats most played games on steam, you may be tempted to say yeah the top played games are low level graphics games so it runs on nearly any PC so thats why its played the most but you would be WRONG!!!

DOTA 2 and CS GO are the 2 top played because of Gameplay and flat out fun. GTA 5 had over 300,000 players and was the 3rd most played game on steam but now its down to 30K a tiny percentage of what it was while DOTA 2 and CS GO continues to remain ontop.

Infact my current most played game is Heroes of Newerth which is still single core. You can't beat fun sir!!

 

[john5220]

Just want to also point out something, Killer Instinct and Street Fighter 5 both of which will run just fine on Dual Cores are 2 of the biggest things to happen to PC Gaming. Why is that?

Because these 2 games will feature cross platform multi player with xbox one and PS4 respectively. (which means for the first time the PC will be treated with respect for fighting games, it will feature the best netcode there is for lagfree online play regardless on where you are in the world)
This is the 2 biggest thing to happen to PC Gaming within the last 2 decades and few people even understand this.

And because of micro transaction model, we will NOT see another iteration until PS5 and Future XBOX, and even then they will run fine on 8 threaded CPU. CPU improvements have really slowed down within the last 7 years. i7 sandy bridge and i7 sky lake is a huge JOKE considering the years in difference and TINY performance increase,.

This is NOT like the days of going from Pentium 3 to Core 2 Duo.

I dunno what games you all are playing but I can tell you that you DO NOT fit into the vast majority of PC Gamers

http://www.statista.com/statistics/251222/most-played-pc-games/

According to the stats.

 

[frozentundra123456]

It doesn't:

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-the-best-pc-hardware-for-the-witcher-3

Minimums crater. Same with your other post. Core 2 and Phenom's in 2013 and onwards AAA games are rubbish for the same reason. Those dips you can feel/see. They can't sustain a solid FPS - 60/60 minimum/average (with some dips to 50ish depending on loading areas and bits of the engine).

Wow, your minimums dip into the fifties?? Talk about a first world problem.

Seriously Escrow, your requirements for PC gaming are *extremely* high. That is fine for you if that is what you want and you can afford to buy the hardware. Others, myself included, are willing and/or financially constrained to settle for much less stringent requirements.

 

[john5220]

^ I could probablly buy a i7 and GTX 980ti and shit.

But I really don't want to waste my life's savings in the event something happens to me medically or something to that extent.
It would be foolish to buy all this ridiculous high end hardware when I really don't need it.

So I settle for an i3 and used GTX 660 Ti which is going to play all that I actually play for the next 10 years. And keep my savings to maybe do something more useful with.

I think saving money is an important thing, I always feel excessive unnecessary money spending is an American thing. Because over there you really don't pay taxes on these parts

 

[TeknoBug]

John5220, you have a pretty strange view of PC gaming.

And no you don't need to spend a fortune to even have a decent system.

 

[frozentundra123456]

John5220, you have a pretty strange view of PC gaming.

And no you don't need to spend a fortune to even have a decent system.

What is strange about it? My gaming system is a 3ghz Sandy Bridge i5 and a HD7770. Only game that I want to play that it cant handle very well is Witcher 3. Even if it is less powerful gpu wise than a console, there are still plenty of reasons to game on the PC, like a wider variety of games, mouse and keyboard controls, and a plethora of free to play and cheap Steam games.

We PC gamers need to make the hobby as accessible as possible and give the devs at least some reason to devote effort to it. I just dont get the elitist attitude (not necessarily from you) that you have to be able to run the lastest greatest games at 60fps min at ultra high settings to enjoy PC games. Hell, two of the games I have played and enjoyed the most recently are Galactic Battlegrounds and the Steam HD version of Rise of Nations. Dont demand a powerful system at all, but you cant play them on a console.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

^ and isn't it amazing how the G3258 dual core still runs Witcher 3 just fine?

And to think its way below minimum requirements

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHeqrQsPYs0

What you consider "fine" -- probably looks like absolute garbage to most people. It certainly does to me...... And I own a G3258, but I'd never game on such a low end chip. Lowly HD Flash Video can bring my G3258 to a screeching halt -- much less The Witcher 3.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

What is strange about it? My gaming system is a 3ghz Sandy Bridge i5 and a HD7770.

That is vastly newer than the 15 year claim John is making. 15 years ago was Pentium III 450 material -- nobody is playing GTA 5 and The Witcher III with the AGP cards those desktops came with. An HD 7770 is a DirectX 11.1 card -- that's still a pretty solid card by today's standards.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

^ I could probablly buy a i7 and GTX 980ti and shit.

But I really don't want to waste my life's savings in the event something happens to me medically or something to that extent.
It would be foolish to buy all this ridiculous high end hardware when I really don't need it.

So I settle for an i3 and used GTX 660 Ti which is going to play all that I actually play for the next 10 years. And keep my savings to maybe do something more useful with.

I think saving money is an important thing, I always feel excessive unnecessary money spending is an American thing. Because over there you really don't pay taxes on these parts

Good luck milking that system for 10 years, because it is fairly likely that 4 GB video cards will be the minimum requirement for AAA video games within 5 years time. Plus, you'll likely be burning up a ton of money in electricity running an inefficient 15 year old computer -- While I will likely get much better performance upgrading to more efficient video cards and CPU's. Pennywise, and very pound foolish. I'm actually a little shocked.... Because electricity in America is relatively cheap, it's probably way more expensive where you live.

The 660 Ti is actually pretty damn power hungry:

 

[TeknoBug]

Good luck milking that system for 10 years, because it is fairly likely that 4 GB will be the minimum requirement for AAA video games within 5 years time.

Most likely 8GB, just four years ago 1GB cards were still the norm and we're just getting into 3-4GB now.

 

[Yuriman]

IMO, the biggest issue for a "20 year computer" is drivers. Seems to me AMD and NV are only really supporting cards back 4-5 years.

That, and as MiddleOfTheRoad said, power consumption. I got rid of my wife's Q6600 system in large part because it used a (relatively) large amount of electricity and dumped a ton of heat into our computer area. In 5-8 years, today's computers will be equally huge, inefficient and power hungry relative to what's out there.

 

[TheProgrammer]

^ I could probablly buy a i7 and GTX 980ti and shit.

But I really don't want to waste my life's savings in the event something happens to me medically or something to that extent.
It would be foolish to buy all this ridiculous high end hardware when I really don't need it.

So I settle for an i3 and used GTX 660 Ti which is going to play all that I actually play for the next 10 years. And keep my savings to maybe do something more useful with.

I think saving money is an important thing, I always feel excessive unnecessary money spending is an American thing. Because over there you really don't pay taxes on these parts

You are on the money on so many things you've said.
I have an old Q9550 in the den that is 8 years old, not too far off your 15 year prediction.
It plays games well to this day.

And you're right, but no one is hearing you on the point about 15 years and I do think that's a bit of a stretch.. from 2015 to 2000 is a dramatically different scenario than 2008-2023. Things have changed.

But I know you weren't breaking this down scientifically... 10 years is a fair number. Back in 2000, the machine wouldn't realistically last 5 years.

The fact one of my machines has been running (gaming) for 8 years is amazing. It was a higher end chip at the time though, and not cheap.

The only snag in your plan is that I wonder how many Devil's Canyon chips you'll find out in the wild when you want to upgrade to one. I think you'll make it 10 years without a doubt, and we're seeing these cycles lengthen over time.

You won't have any problems with your i3 and it's clear you've done your research.